Our bigs going forward

[Celtics2021]

the Jazz are trying to copy the Thunder...

It is interesting that the last 5 champions, all got their best player in the draft, except OKC.  They got their best player via a trade, but he was the 11th pick.  BOS got Tatum and Brown at #3 picks.  Jokic was the 41st pick.  GSW got Curry at #7.  And MIL got Giannis at #15.

I guess my point is that copying OKC may not be as easy as it seems.  I am sure that UTA sees it as Ainge drafted the key players for a championship in BOS so he can do it again in UTA.  And maybe he can.  But a lot of teams fail at this approach.

OKC got SGA in as trade after his rookie season, as well as a bunch of picks, for Paul George.  Utah would like a bunch of picks and a young player two for Markkanen, which is partly what I meant.  But mostly what I meant is that Utah wants to find the young franchise player first and then add guys around him.  They have not found that player yet (maybe it is Bailey but they would like another shot this next draft).   Kessler is not that player either, but will already be off his rookie deal by the time they do find their franchise guy, and accordingly he is tradeable.

[Vermont Green]

the Jazz are trying to copy the Thunder...

It is interesting that the last 5 champions, all got their best player in the draft, except OKC.  They got their best player via a trade, but he was the 11th pick.  BOS got Tatum and Brown at #3 picks.  Jokic was the 41st pick.  GSW got Curry at #7.  And MIL got Giannis at #15.

I guess my point is that copying OKC may not be as easy as it seems.  I am sure that UTA sees it as Ainge drafted the key players for a championship in BOS so he can do it again in UTA.  And maybe he can.  But a lot of teams fail at this approach.

OKC got SGA in as trade after his rookie season, as well as a bunch of picks, for Paul George.  Utah would like a bunch of picks and a young player two for Markkanen, which is partly what I meant.  But mostly what I meant is that Utah wants to find the young franchise player first and then add guys around him.  They have not found that player yet (maybe it is Bailey but they would like another shot this next draft).   Kessler is not that player either, but will already be off his rookie deal by the time they do find their franchise guy, and accordingly he is tradeable.

Don't disagree with any of this, I was just pointing out that trying to build through the draft can work for you in mysterious ways.  Just ask PHI.  I think you are right regarding how UTA is looking at this and I believe UTA thinks Ainge is the guy to do the drafting.

Kessler would be a nice piece for BOS.  We get him on the cheap for 2025-26 but then have to pay him for 2026-27 and beyond, when there will be some "apron space" to pay him with.  I had proposed:

Niang, 2026 first, Future first (or maybe a future swap option)
for
Kessler

I think I could talk myself into that trade.  Niang helps with UTA tanking and they get a pick or two.  The 2026 pick has pretty good value for UTA.  UTA may feel they could get more, I don't know.

[slamtheking]

the Jazz are trying to copy the Thunder...

It is interesting that the last 5 champions, all got their best player in the draft, except OKC.  They got their best player via a trade, but he was the 11th pick.  BOS got Tatum and Brown at #3 picks.  Jokic was the 41st pick.  GSW got Curry at #7.  And MIL got Giannis at #15.

I guess my point is that copying OKC may not be as easy as it seems.  I am sure that UTA sees it as Ainge drafted the key players for a championship in BOS so he can do it again in UTA.  And maybe he can.  But a lot of teams fail at this approach.

OKC got SGA in as trade after his rookie season, as well as a bunch of picks, for Paul George.  Utah would like a bunch of picks and a young player two for Markkanen, which is partly what I meant.  But mostly what I meant is that Utah wants to find the young franchise player first and then add guys around him.  They have not found that player yet (maybe it is Bailey but they would like another shot this next draft).   Kessler is not that player either, but will already be off his rookie deal by the time they do find their franchise guy, and accordingly he is tradeable.

Don't disagree with any of this, I was just pointing out that trying to build through the draft can work for you in mysterious way.  Just ask PHI.  I think you are right regarding how UTA is looking at this and I believe UTA thinks Ainge is the guy to do the drafting.

Kessler would be a nice piece for BOS.  We get him on the cheap for 2025-26 but then have to pay him for 2026-27 and beyond, when there will be some "apron space" to pay him with.  I had proposed:

Niang, 2026 first, Future first (or maybe a future swap option)
for
Kessler

I think I could talk myself into that trade.  Niang helps with UTA tanking and they get a pick or two.  The 2026 pick has pretty good value for UTA.  UTA may feel they could get more, I don't know.

it's probably just me but I don't get the fascination with Kessler.  he seems like a decent big but not nearly as great as he's made out to be here.  I wouldn't give up future picks for him (certainly no more than 1) unless perhaps we had something very late in the first round.  with Tatum's injury, I wouldn't give up any future picks until we see how he's recovered on the court.

[Phantom255x]

If the Bulls are shopping Vucevic I would consider him. Simons + picks for him works. Technically saves us more money this season, but gives us a legit center option too. I know he's gonna turn 35 but like short term I don't hate him, even if for the next 2-3 years here along with Tatum/Brown/White/PP. Unless someone here has a better idea for long term PF/C soon, but they still need a stopgap

[jambr380]

If the Bulls are shopping Vucevic I would consider him. Simons + picks for him works. Technically saves us more money this season, but gives us a legit center option too. I know he's gonna turn 35 but like short term I don't hate him, even if for the next 2-3 years here along with Tatum/Brown/White/PP. Unless someone here has a better idea for long term PF/C soon, but they still need a stopgap

Vucevic would fit pretty well, but as you mentioned, he is in his twilight years. Simons is a better asset than Vuc, not sure why we would be the ones giving up picks. So I guess if they sent a pick or two, I would consider it, but I am sticking with the 26 year old 20ppg scorer unless we can get a clear upgrade.

[SparzWizard]

If the Bulls are shopping Vucevic I would consider him. Simons + picks for him works. Technically saves us more money this season, but gives us a legit center option too. I know he's gonna turn 35 but like short term I don't hate him, even if for the next 2-3 years here along with Tatum/Brown/White/PP. Unless someone here has a better idea for long term PF/C soon, but they still need a stopgap

The moves would have to be win-now moves and not in 7-10 years, so I'm onboard with Vucevic if he can still produce solid numbers. And I hear some stuff about Trae Young to the Celtics, would also be nice to see that happen for the right package

[Csfan1984]

I'm not throwing in picks for the lesser player even though he plays a position of need and is cheaper. Vuc is old and could be at the wall this season.

 A straight swap for Simmons is something to consider but again I worry about how much Vuc has left. If Bulls were throwing in a few seconds to replace the ones Cs lost in Niang deal then I'd do it.

[Neurotic Guy]

I'm not throwing in picks for the lesser player even though he plays a position of need and is cheaper. Vuc is old and could be at the wall this season.

 A straight swap for Simmons is something to consider but again I worry about how much Vuc has left. If Bulls were throwing in a few seconds to replace the ones Cs lost in Niang deal then I'd do it.

If Vuc were a little better defensively, it would be a no-brainer to get him.  But he isn't.  He'd be a plus offensively for the C's next year and 2026-27 in all likelihood, but I'd love a rim protector at the 5.  KP proved better in the defensive role than I expected - but of course he missed too many games. Vuc replaces KPs offense, but we lose a ton defensively (in general) without KP, Al, and Jrue.  Need to make up some of that.   I have hope for Q to show improvement with PT - but not sure if he's already close to his ceiling. 

[blink]

I'm not throwing in picks for the lesser player even though he plays a position of need and is cheaper. Vuc is old and could be at the wall this season.

 A straight swap for Simmons is something to consider but again I worry about how much Vuc has left. If Bulls were throwing in a few seconds to replace the ones Cs lost in Niang deal then I'd do it.

If Vuc were a little better defensively, it would be a no-brainer to get him.  But he isn't.  He'd be a plus offensively for the C's next year and 2026-27 in all likelihood, but I'd love a rim protector at the 5.  KP proved better in the defensive role than I expected - but of course he missed too many games. Vuc replaces KPs offense, but we lose a ton defensively (in general) without KP, Al, and Jrue.  Need to make up some of that.   I have hope for Q to show improvement with PT - but not sure if he's already close to his ceiling.

Yeah we have no rim protectors at all anymore except D White and JB on chase down blocks, and maybe Q.   interior size on def feels like the #1 issue going into this season.  Hopefully Brad can figure that out by the time Tatum gets back.

[Goldstar88]

I'm not throwing in picks for the lesser player even though he plays a position of need and is cheaper. Vuc is old and could be at the wall this season.

 A straight swap for Simmons is something to consider but again I worry about how much Vuc has left. If Bulls were throwing in a few seconds to replace the ones Cs lost in Niang deal then I'd do it.

If Vuc were a little better defensively, it would be a no-brainer to get him.  But he isn't.  He'd be a plus offensively for the C's next year and 2026-27 in all likelihood, but I'd love a rim protector at the 5.  KP proved better in the defensive role than I expected - but of course he missed too many games. Vuc replaces KPs offense, but we lose a ton defensively (in general) without KP, Al, and Jrue.  Need to make up some of that.   I have hope for Q to show improvement with PT - but not sure if he's already close to his ceiling.

Yeah we have no rim protectors at all anymore except D White and JB on chase down blocks, and maybe Q.   interior size on def feels like the #1 issue going into this season.  Hopefully Brad can figure that out by the time Tatum gets back.

Queta isn?t a rim protector?

[Vermont Green]

I don't think this is the season to bring in Vucevic.  He is a decent player, and if we had Tatum and were actually a legitimate title contender, it would be a different story.  His contract isn't horrible, $21.5M, expiring.  He will be 36 for the start of the 2025-26 season.  I would rather have a look at Simons.

To me, "going forward" isn't about 2025-26, it is about 2026 and beyond.  Of the current group, Queta, Garza, Minott, Boucher, Williams, Tillman, it is very possible that none of these are in the plan for the 2026-27 season.  2025-26 is just about getting a look at these guys.  Garza and Queta are under contract for 2026-27 (Queta only partially guaranteed).  Williams is a prospect, my guess he is still a prospect in 2026.  Minott is young also, but may not even be a "big".  Boucher could very well carve out a role for himself.