If Jrue is to be traded...ideas

[Who]

This trade makes a lot of sense for both SA and Boston:

Out: Jrue Holiday

In: Barnes(exp $19M), Wesley(exp $4.7M), Champagnie $3M.

Celtics: White, Brown, Hauser, Tatum, KP.
Bench: Pritchard, Schieriman, Champagnie, Kornet, Queta,  FA, FA

Spurs: Fox, Holiday, Vassell, Sochan, Wemby
Bench: Castle, Johnson, Mamu, Biyombo.

Trading Hauser would be crazy, IMO. He?s 27 and on a very team friendly deal. Sam is also a solid two way player. Has good chemistry with the J?s.

I?d be fine getting rid of Tillman, Davison, Walsh if they need to trim additional salary next year. KP is a wild card, but he?s still in his prime so I?d keep him and roll the dice. If healthy, that?s a very competitive team for Boston.

You trade for Barnes and Wesley but you don't include them on the Celts roster.
Where'd they go? 

Hauser is gone.  Saves way too much salary/tax to replace him with a minimum contract player.  Kornet is a free agent and won't be back as it will cost too much to resign him.  Tillman, Davison and Walsh make the minimum.  Getting rid of them doesn't trim salary because they'd be replaced with other minimum players.

H Barnes would be a good injury replacement for Tatum next year.

I thought he was disappointing last year for San Antonio. He has lost quickness & athleticism. He is starting to look old. Old, heavy, and slow. He didn't contribute as much to San Antonio as I expected him to. He shot the ball but everything else was unimpressive.

I don't think H Barnes would be as much of a difference maker as a 6th man for the Celtics (once Tatum returns). Certainly not what I thought he would've done in the past years when we have talked about him as a trade target. The Celtics would probably let H Barnes walk when his contract expires.

I am not sure H Barnes brings more, or much more, than Hauser at this point.

[Goldstar88]

This trade makes a lot of sense for both SA and Boston:

Out: Jrue Holiday

In: Barnes(exp $19M), Wesley(exp $4.7M), Champagnie $3M.

Celtics: White, Brown, Hauser, Tatum, KP.
Bench: Pritchard, Schieriman, Champagnie, Kornet, Queta,  FA, FA

Spurs: Fox, Holiday, Vassell, Sochan, Wemby
Bench: Castle, Johnson, Mamu, Biyombo.

Trading Hauser would be crazy, IMO. He?s 27 and on a very team friendly deal. Sam is also a solid two way player. Has good chemistry with the J?s.

I?d be fine getting rid of Tillman, Davison, Walsh if they need to trim additional salary next year. KP is a wild card, but he?s still in his prime so I?d keep him and roll the dice. If healthy, that?s a very competitive team for Boston.

You trade for Barnes and Wesley but you don't include them on the Celts roster.
Where'd they go? 

Hauser is gone.  Saves way too much salary/tax to replace him with a minimum contract player.  Kornet is a free agent and won't be back as it will cost too much to resign him.  Tillman, Davison and Walsh make the minimum.  Getting rid of them doesn't trim salary because they'd be replaced with other minimum players.

Expirings=Salary dump.

[Goldstar88]

Does the Spurs getting the #2 pick make them less interested in a win-now move like Jrue Holiday? Particularly a win-now move involving such an old player (short term window).

It looked like they were moving into win-now territory with D Fox and Wemby. But now with S Castle's late season growth & the probable addition of Dylan Harper with the #2 pick, are they still in win-now territory? Or they in a wait-and-see hold?

It doesn't look like either S Castle or D Harper will be ready to play a leading role on a contender in the near future. They need time to grow. If they were to acquire a Jrue Holiday, they would be wasting Jrue's best years on their worst years as they learn on the job.

Jrue isn't going to move the needle for them.  They finished 13th in the West with 34 wins.  They'd need to gain at least 14 wins to even be competitive.  They need Giannis to do that.

You do realize that Fox was traded to SA in Feb. Same month Wemby was shut down for the year. They went tank mode after that. Using last year as an indication as to what they will be next year is very odd.

[tazzmaniac]

More I look at potential Jrue and KP deals the more depressed I get.

I just see no path to saving significant money in these trades without giving up really valuable draft compensation.

Brooklyn's the only team with space and they have zero interest in additional picks this season. So they'll only play ball if we give them either future firsts or players they view as long term pieces.

The Holiday and KP trades themselves seem like they won't save us much or any money. Maybe Detroit decides they love KP but other than that we seem pretty screwed.

The guys we have a realistic chance at getting back in those deals are guys like Fontechio, Stewart, Hachimura, Vanderbilt, Klay Thompson, Gafford, PJ Washington, Bogdanovich, Dunn, Eubanks

Now a few of these guys like Dunn might be easily flippable, but guys like Hachimura, Stewart, Klay, Gafford, Washington and Bogdanovich are all above MLE money so we'll either need to take money back or find someone willing to take them into a TPE. That leaves the Hawks, Nets(not interested), Heat and Kings as the only possible suitors. That leaves me pessimistic about our chances.

You haven't been paying attention.  There have been quite a few posts of potential moves that could save a bunch of cap space.  For example

Celtics in:  Valaciunas, Ellis, Jones, 2nd (2)
Celtics out:  Jrue, Hauser

Kings in: Jrue
Kings out: Valaciunas, Ellis, Jones, Murray

Pels in:  Murray
Pels out:  2nd

Hawks in:  Hauser
Hawks out:  2nd

Of the half a dozen teams I tried besides the Nets, Pels/Hawks/Pistons were all able to absorb Murray or Hauser.  So send those two out in return for 2nd round picks. 

That trade which sends out Jrue and Hauser shouldn't require giving up any picks would save 27.7M which would be well under the 2nd apron.  Personally I'd want to keep Valanciunas but he could be rerouted to another team too which would bump the savings to 38.1M and just be over the tax line.  That's without moving KP. 

[Ilikesports17]

More I look at potential Jrue and KP deals the more depressed I get.

I just see no path to saving significant money in these trades without giving up really valuable draft compensation.

Brooklyn's the only team with space and they have zero interest in additional picks this season. So they'll only play ball if we give them either future firsts or players they view as long term pieces.

The Holiday and KP trades themselves seem like they won't save us much or any money. Maybe Detroit decides they love KP but other than that we seem pretty screwed.

The guys we have a realistic chance at getting back in those deals are guys like Fontechio, Stewart, Hachimura, Vanderbilt, Klay Thompson, Gafford, PJ Washington, Bogdanovich, Dunn, Eubanks

Now a few of these guys like Dunn might be easily flippable, but guys like Hachimura, Stewart, Klay, Gafford, Washington and Bogdanovich are all above MLE money so we'll either need to take money back or find someone willing to take them into a TPE. That leaves the Hawks, Nets(not interested), Heat and Kings as the only possible suitors. That leaves me pessimistic about our chances.

You haven't been paying attention.  There have been quite a few posts of potential moves that could save a bunch of cap space.  For example

Celtics in:  Valaciunas, Ellis, Jones, 2nd (2)
Celtics out:  Jrue, Hauser

Kings in: Jrue
Kings out: Valaciunas, Ellis, Jones, Murray

Pels in:  Murray
Pels out:  2nd

Hawks in:  Hauser
Hawks out:  2nd

Of the half a dozen teams I tried besides the Nets, Pels/Hawks/Pistons were all able to absorb Murray or Hauser.  So send those two out in return for 2nd round picks. 

That trade which sends out Jrue and Hauser shouldn't require giving up any picks would save 27.7M which would be well under the 2nd apron.  Personally I'd want to keep Valanciunas but he could be rerouted to another team too which would bump the savings to 38.1M and just be over the tax line.  That's without moving KP.

Yeah I think I might just be overly down on Holiday, or maybe I'm overly high on Murray and Ellis, but I just don't see the Kings as being interested. I read there was rumored interest, but it just doesn't make much sense in my opinion.

If Sacramento was down to do this swap I'd be delighted. Hopefully I'll be pleasantly surprised.

[Who]

More I look at potential Jrue and KP deals the more depressed I get.

I just see no path to saving significant money in these trades without giving up really valuable draft compensation.

Brooklyn's the only team with space and they have zero interest in additional picks this season. So they'll only play ball if we give them either future firsts or players they view as long term pieces.

The Holiday and KP trades themselves seem like they won't save us much or any money. Maybe Detroit decides they love KP but other than that we seem pretty screwed.

The guys we have a realistic chance at getting back in those deals are guys like Fontechio, Stewart, Hachimura, Vanderbilt, Klay Thompson, Gafford, PJ Washington, Bogdanovich, Dunn, Eubanks

Now a few of these guys like Dunn might be easily flippable, but guys like Hachimura, Stewart, Klay, Gafford, Washington and Bogdanovich are all above MLE money so we'll either need to take money back or find someone willing to take them into a TPE. That leaves the Hawks, Nets(not interested), Heat and Kings as the only possible suitors. That leaves me pessimistic about our chances.

You haven't been paying attention.  There have been quite a few posts of potential moves that could save a bunch of cap space.  For example

Celtics in:  Valaciunas, Ellis, Jones, 2nd (2)
Celtics out:  Jrue, Hauser

Kings in: Jrue
Kings out: Valaciunas, Ellis, Jones, Murray

Pels in:  Murray
Pels out:  2nd

Hawks in:  Hauser
Hawks out:  2nd

Of the half a dozen teams I tried besides the Nets, Pels/Hawks/Pistons were all able to absorb Murray or Hauser.  So send those two out in return for 2nd round picks. 

That trade which sends out Jrue and Hauser shouldn't require giving up any picks would save 27.7M which would be well under the 2nd apron.  Personally I'd want to keep Valanciunas but he could be rerouted to another team too which would bump the savings to 38.1M and just be over the tax line.  That's without moving KP.

Yeah I think I might just be overly down on Holiday, or maybe I'm overly high on Murray and Ellis, but I just don't see the Kings as being interested. I read there was rumored interest, but it just doesn't make much sense in my opinion.

If Sacramento was down to do this swap I'd be delighted. Hopefully I'll be pleasantly surprised.

Keegan Murray is far too valuable to be in this deal. Sacramento were keeping him out of deals for All-Star players the last two seasons. Now they overvalued him then but they still rate him high and consider him part of their core & their future. They are not giving him up for a 35yo Jrue Holiday. They gotta get a piece back who will be apart of their core long term to part ways with Keegan Murray. He is the 2nd most valuable piece on their team after D Sabonis.

I expect Keon Ellis has low value. He wasn't playing much earlier in the season. He only saw his playing time come back up because they traded D Fox and ran out of guards. He wouldn't have played as much in the 2nd half of the season otherwise. They tried him at PG (after Fox left) but that was a failure. He was too limited as a ball-handler and as a passer. It is not just that he lacks those skills to be a PG but he is even below average in them fir a SG. He is a reluctant but capable shooter. As a result, he doesn't bring much to the table offensively. A below average offensive player despite his impressive shooting stats (because he won't shoot enough + lacks passing / dribbling skills). If you could get him to shoot more often, he could be solid offensively (realistically achievable). His main value is his defense & hustle which makes up for his limited offense.

You probably could have gotten Keon Ellis for a pair of 2nd round picks at mid-season. Might be worth a 1st now. They like him but they are not tied to him. He is the 9th-10th man on the team and would be so on many teams in the league. I would be very surprised if Sacramento turned down BOS's late 1st round pick this year (#28) for him. He certainly wouldn't be a roadblock in a Jrue Holiday deal. A starting PG is much more valuable than a 9th/10th man.

[Ilikesports17]

More I look at potential Jrue and KP deals the more depressed I get.

I just see no path to saving significant money in these trades without giving up really valuable draft compensation.

Brooklyn's the only team with space and they have zero interest in additional picks this season. So they'll only play ball if we give them either future firsts or players they view as long term pieces.

The Holiday and KP trades themselves seem like they won't save us much or any money. Maybe Detroit decides they love KP but other than that we seem pretty screwed.

The guys we have a realistic chance at getting back in those deals are guys like Fontechio, Stewart, Hachimura, Vanderbilt, Klay Thompson, Gafford, PJ Washington, Bogdanovich, Dunn, Eubanks

Now a few of these guys like Dunn might be easily flippable, but guys like Hachimura, Stewart, Klay, Gafford, Washington and Bogdanovich are all above MLE money so we'll either need to take money back or find someone willing to take them into a TPE. That leaves the Hawks, Nets(not interested), Heat and Kings as the only possible suitors. That leaves me pessimistic about our chances.

You haven't been paying attention.  There have been quite a few posts of potential moves that could save a bunch of cap space.  For example

Celtics in:  Valaciunas, Ellis, Jones, 2nd (2)
Celtics out:  Jrue, Hauser

Kings in: Jrue
Kings out: Valaciunas, Ellis, Jones, Murray

Pels in:  Murray
Pels out:  2nd

Hawks in:  Hauser
Hawks out:  2nd

Of the half a dozen teams I tried besides the Nets, Pels/Hawks/Pistons were all able to absorb Murray or Hauser.  So send those two out in return for 2nd round picks. 

That trade which sends out Jrue and Hauser shouldn't require giving up any picks would save 27.7M which would be well under the 2nd apron.  Personally I'd want to keep Valanciunas but he could be rerouted to another team too which would bump the savings to 38.1M and just be over the tax line.  That's without moving KP.

Yeah I think I might just be overly down on Holiday, or maybe I'm overly high on Murray and Ellis, but I just don't see the Kings as being interested. I read there was rumored interest, but it just doesn't make much sense in my opinion.

If Sacramento was down to do this swap I'd be delighted. Hopefully I'll be pleasantly surprised.

Keegan Murray is far too valuable to be in this deal. Sacramento were keeping him out of deals for All-Star players the last two seasons. Now they overvalued him then but they still rate him high and consider him part of their core & their future. They are not giving him up for a 35yo Jrue Holiday. They gotta get a piece back who will be apart of their core long term to part ways with Keegan Murray. He is the 2nd most valuable piece on their team after D Sabonis.

I expect Keon Ellis has low value. He wasn't playing much earlier in the season. He only saw his playing time come back up because they traded D Fox and ran out of guards. He wouldn't have played as much in the 2nd half of the season otherwise. They tried him at PG (after Fox left) but that was a failure. He was too limited as a ball-handler and as a passer. It is not just that he lacks those skills to be a PG but he is even below average in them fir a SG. He is a reluctant but capable shooter. As a result, he doesn't bring much to the table offensively. A below average offensive player despite his impressive shooting stats (because he won't shoot enough + lacks passing / dribbling skills). If you could get him to shoot more often, he could be solid offensively (realistically achievable). His main value is his defense & hustle which makes up for his limited offense.

You probably could have gotten Keon Ellis for a pair of 2nd round picks at mid-season. Might be worth a 1st now. They like him but they are not tied to him. He is the 9th-10th man on the team and would be so on many teams in the league. I would be very surprised if Sacramento turned down BOS's late 1st round pick this year (#28) for him. He certainly wouldn't be a roadblock in a Jrue Holiday deal. A starting PG is much more valuable than a 9th/10th man.

Monk-JV-Ellis seems to make more sense from a value perspective.

I suppose funnel JV into someone's MLE and you can walk out of that saving 13 mil? I cannot stand Malik Monk, but I suppose he's a better problem to have than Holiday is right now.

Does Sacramento value Monk?

[Who]

More I look at potential Jrue and KP deals the more depressed I get.

I just see no path to saving significant money in these trades without giving up really valuable draft compensation.

Brooklyn's the only team with space and they have zero interest in additional picks this season. So they'll only play ball if we give them either future firsts or players they view as long term pieces.

The Holiday and KP trades themselves seem like they won't save us much or any money. Maybe Detroit decides they love KP but other than that we seem pretty screwed.

The guys we have a realistic chance at getting back in those deals are guys like Fontechio, Stewart, Hachimura, Vanderbilt, Klay Thompson, Gafford, PJ Washington, Bogdanovich, Dunn, Eubanks

Now a few of these guys like Dunn might be easily flippable, but guys like Hachimura, Stewart, Klay, Gafford, Washington and Bogdanovich are all above MLE money so we'll either need to take money back or find someone willing to take them into a TPE. That leaves the Hawks, Nets(not interested), Heat and Kings as the only possible suitors. That leaves me pessimistic about our chances.

You haven't been paying attention.  There have been quite a few posts of potential moves that could save a bunch of cap space.  For example

Celtics in:  Valaciunas, Ellis, Jones, 2nd (2)
Celtics out:  Jrue, Hauser

Kings in: Jrue
Kings out: Valaciunas, Ellis, Jones, Murray

Pels in:  Murray
Pels out:  2nd

Hawks in:  Hauser
Hawks out:  2nd

Of the half a dozen teams I tried besides the Nets, Pels/Hawks/Pistons were all able to absorb Murray or Hauser.  So send those two out in return for 2nd round picks. 

That trade which sends out Jrue and Hauser shouldn't require giving up any picks would save 27.7M which would be well under the 2nd apron.  Personally I'd want to keep Valanciunas but he could be rerouted to another team too which would bump the savings to 38.1M and just be over the tax line.  That's without moving KP.

Yeah I think I might just be overly down on Holiday, or maybe I'm overly high on Murray and Ellis, but I just don't see the Kings as being interested. I read there was rumored interest, but it just doesn't make much sense in my opinion.

If Sacramento was down to do this swap I'd be delighted. Hopefully I'll be pleasantly surprised.

Keegan Murray is far too valuable to be in this deal. Sacramento were keeping him out of deals for All-Star players the last two seasons. Now they overvalued him then but they still rate him high and consider him part of their core & their future. They are not giving him up for a 35yo Jrue Holiday. They gotta get a piece back who will be apart of their core long term to part ways with Keegan Murray. He is the 2nd most valuable piece on their team after D Sabonis.

I expect Keon Ellis has low value. He wasn't playing much earlier in the season. He only saw his playing time come back up because they traded D Fox and ran out of guards. He wouldn't have played as much in the 2nd half of the season otherwise. They tried him at PG (after Fox left) but that was a failure. He was too limited as a ball-handler and as a passer. It is not just that he lacks those skills to be a PG but he is even below average in them fir a SG. He is a reluctant but capable shooter. As a result, he doesn't bring much to the table offensively. A below average offensive player despite his impressive shooting stats (because he won't shoot enough + lacks passing / dribbling skills). If you could get him to shoot more often, he could be solid offensively (realistically achievable). His main value is his defense & hustle which makes up for his limited offense.

You probably could have gotten Keon Ellis for a pair of 2nd round picks at mid-season. Might be worth a 1st now. They like him but they are not tied to him. He is the 9th-10th man on the team and would be so on many teams in the league. I would be very surprised if Sacramento turned down BOS's late 1st round pick this year (#28) for him. He certainly wouldn't be a roadblock in a Jrue Holiday deal. A starting PG is much more valuable than a 9th/10th man.

Monk-JV-Ellis seems to make more sense from a value perspective.

I suppose funnel JV into someone's MLE and you can walk out of that saving 13 mil? I cannot stand Malik Monk, but I suppose he's a better problem to have than Holiday is right now.

Does Sacramento value Monk?

I don't know.

Monk had a valued place in that team prior to the D Fox trade but he is sorta surplus to requirements now that they have gotten Z LaVine. Both LaVine and Monk are one position players. They tried to play Monk as a PG and he did a better job than anyone else did but it was still a train wreck. Monk and LaVine are both one position players. There aren't enough minutes to keep them happy. LaVine needs 35 minutes with Monk needing 28-30 minutes and neither guy can play a 2nd position.

Monk was playing great basketball for them before LaVine showed up. His ball-handling and passing have improved so much from his early years. He was one of the top bench scorers in the league. One of the top playmakers off the bench in the league. One of the top clutch guys off the bench. He was a great 6th man. But if he is a 6th man, your starter is a low minute starter or he can shift over to SF when Monk comes in. Huerter could do that. LaVine cannot.

They should trade Monk. He is surplus to requirements and they have major needs at both PG and big forward. DeRozan & K Murray are too small to play PF. But what Sacramento should do and what Sacramento will do are not necessarily the same thing.

The other option is to trade Zach LaVine. Start Keon Ellis and play him 20mpg but as a starter and give Monk the other 28mpg at SG off the bench. But they won't trade LaVine. And what happens to Keon Ellis if they don't trade Monk? Already a minutes squeeze at SG. I guess they either won't play him or will try him as a backup SF.

That SG position is a mess for Sacramento.

I think Monk is still a favourite in Sacramento among the coaches and front office. But given the situation, I have to think he can be had for a fair price - if it fills the hole at PG or at forward.

[tazzmaniac]

More I look at potential Jrue and KP deals the more depressed I get.

I just see no path to saving significant money in these trades without giving up really valuable draft compensation.

Brooklyn's the only team with space and they have zero interest in additional picks this season. So they'll only play ball if we give them either future firsts or players they view as long term pieces.

The Holiday and KP trades themselves seem like they won't save us much or any money. Maybe Detroit decides they love KP but other than that we seem pretty screwed.

The guys we have a realistic chance at getting back in those deals are guys like Fontechio, Stewart, Hachimura, Vanderbilt, Klay Thompson, Gafford, PJ Washington, Bogdanovich, Dunn, Eubanks

Now a few of these guys like Dunn might be easily flippable, but guys like Hachimura, Stewart, Klay, Gafford, Washington and Bogdanovich are all above MLE money so we'll either need to take money back or find someone willing to take them into a TPE. That leaves the Hawks, Nets(not interested), Heat and Kings as the only possible suitors. That leaves me pessimistic about our chances.

You haven't been paying attention.  There have been quite a few posts of potential moves that could save a bunch of cap space.  For example

Celtics in:  Valaciunas, Ellis, Jones, 2nd (2)
Celtics out:  Jrue, Hauser

Kings in: Jrue
Kings out: Valaciunas, Ellis, Jones, Murray

Pels in:  Murray
Pels out:  2nd

Hawks in:  Hauser
Hawks out:  2nd

Of the half a dozen teams I tried besides the Nets, Pels/Hawks/Pistons were all able to absorb Murray or Hauser.  So send those two out in return for 2nd round picks. 

That trade which sends out Jrue and Hauser shouldn't require giving up any picks would save 27.7M which would be well under the 2nd apron.  Personally I'd want to keep Valanciunas but he could be rerouted to another team too which would bump the savings to 38.1M and just be over the tax line.  That's without moving KP.

Yeah I think I might just be overly down on Holiday, or maybe I'm overly high on Murray and Ellis, but I just don't see the Kings as being interested. I read there was rumored interest, but it just doesn't make much sense in my opinion.

If Sacramento was down to do this swap I'd be delighted. Hopefully I'll be pleasantly surprised.

Keegan Murray is far too valuable to be in this deal. Sacramento were keeping him out of deals for All-Star players the last two seasons. Now they overvalued him then but they still rate him high and consider him part of their core & their future. They are not giving him up for a 35yo Jrue Holiday. They gotta get a piece back who will be apart of their core long term to part ways with Keegan Murray. He is the 2nd most valuable piece on their team after D Sabonis.

I expect Keon Ellis has low value. He wasn't playing much earlier in the season. He only saw his playing time come back up because they traded D Fox and ran out of guards. He wouldn't have played as much in the 2nd half of the season otherwise. They tried him at PG (after Fox left) but that was a failure. He was too limited as a ball-handler and as a passer. It is not just that he lacks those skills to be a PG but he is even below average in them fir a SG. He is a reluctant but capable shooter. As a result, he doesn't bring much to the table offensively. A below average offensive player despite his impressive shooting stats (because he won't shoot enough + lacks passing / dribbling skills). If you could get him to shoot more often, he could be solid offensively (realistically achievable). His main value is his defense & hustle which makes up for his limited offense.

You probably could have gotten Keon Ellis for a pair of 2nd round picks at mid-season. Might be worth a 1st now. They like him but they are not tied to him. He is the 9th-10th man on the team and would be so on many teams in the league. I would be very surprised if Sacramento turned down BOS's late 1st round pick this year (#28) for him. He certainly wouldn't be a roadblock in a Jrue Holiday deal. A starting PG is much more valuable than a 9th/10th man.

Monk-JV-Ellis seems to make more sense from a value perspective.

I suppose funnel JV into someone's MLE and you can walk out of that saving 13 mil? I cannot stand Malik Monk, but I suppose he's a better problem to have than Holiday is right now.

Does Sacramento value Monk?

I don't know.

Monk had a valued place in that team prior to the D Fox trade but he is sorta surplus to requirements now that they have gotten Z LaVine. Both LaVine and Monk are one position players. They tried to play Monk as a PG and he did a better job than anyone else did but it was still a train wreck. Monk and LaVine are both one position players. There aren't enough minutes to keep them happy. LaVine needs 35 minutes with Monk needing 28-30 minutes and neither guy can play a 2nd position.

Monk was playing great basketball for them before LaVine showed up. His ball-handling and passing have improved so much from his early years. He was one of the top bench scorers in the league. One of the top playmakers off the bench in the league. One of the top clutch guys off the bench. He was a great 6th man. But if he is a 6th man, your starter is a low minute starter or he can shift over to SF when Monk comes in. Huerter could do that. LaVine cannot.

They should trade Monk. He is surplus to requirements and they have major needs at both PG and big forward. DeRozan & K Murray are too small to play PF. But what Sacramento should do and what Sacramento will do are not necessarily the same thing.

The other option is to trade Zach LaVine. Start Keon Ellis and play him 20mpg but as a starter and give Monk the other 28mpg at SG off the bench. But they won't trade LaVine. And what happens to Keon Ellis if they don't trade Monk? Already a minutes squeeze at SG. I guess they either won't play him or will try him as a backup SF.

That SG position is a mess for Sacramento.

I think Monk is still a favourite in Sacramento among the coaches and front office. But given the situation, I have to think he can be had for a fair price - if it fills the hole at PG or at forward.

TP for the analysis.  Didn't realize the Kings valued Murray that much. 

[tazzmaniac]

This trade makes a lot of sense for both SA and Boston:

Out: Jrue Holiday

In: Barnes(exp $19M), Wesley(exp $4.7M), Champagnie $3M.

Celtics: White, Brown, Hauser, Tatum, KP.
Bench: Pritchard, Schieriman, Champagnie, Kornet, Queta,  FA, FA

Spurs: Fox, Holiday, Vassell, Sochan, Wemby
Bench: Castle, Johnson, Mamu, Biyombo.

Trading Hauser would be crazy, IMO. He?s 27 and on a very team friendly deal. Sam is also a solid two way player. Has good chemistry with the J?s.

I?d be fine getting rid of Tillman, Davison, Walsh if they need to trim additional salary next year. KP is a wild card, but he?s still in his prime so I?d keep him and roll the dice. If healthy, that?s a very competitive team for Boston.

You trade for Barnes and Wesley but you don't include them on the Celts roster.
Where'd they go? 

Hauser is gone.  Saves way too much salary/tax to replace him with a minimum contract player.  Kornet is a free agent and won't be back as it will cost too much to resign him.  Tillman, Davison and Walsh make the minimum.  Getting rid of them doesn't trim salary because they'd be replaced with other minimum players.

Expirings=Salary dump.

They don't disappear.  They both have 1-year left on their contracts. They'd have to be on the Celtics roster or re-routed to other teams.  They won't being expiring until after next season when they'd become free agents unless they re-signed by their current team. 

Wesley should be easy to reroute.  Rerouting Barnes's to some team other than the Nets, who would probably want a 1st to do it, would take a bit of work but should be doable.  Doing so would get to your proposed roster and save 29.4M of cap space (and lots of tax for the owners) getting well under the 2nd apron. 

[Phantom255x]

Keep it simple

Jrue + 2nd round pick for Gafford + Hardy

Dallas feels like the perfect trade partner. They'll have legit interest in Jrue and could use him since they are a contender when healthy and Kyrie also will miss at least the first half of the season. Flagg, Jrue, Kyrie (2nd half), AD, 1 of Lively/Gafford, Klay, etc. I doubt they will get someone like KD/Giannis, etc. either

Loop in BKN as the 3rd team to facilitate and provide (or eat up) some assets and technically the C's would also save about 10-15M in this trade.

[Goldstar88]

This trade makes a lot of sense for both SA and Boston:

Out: Jrue Holiday

In: Barnes(exp $19M), Wesley(exp $4.7M), Champagnie $3M.

Celtics: White, Brown, Hauser, Tatum, KP.
Bench: Pritchard, Schieriman, Champagnie, Kornet, Queta,  FA, FA

Spurs: Fox, Holiday, Vassell, Sochan, Wemby
Bench: Castle, Johnson, Mamu, Biyombo.

Trading Hauser would be crazy, IMO. He?s 27 and on a very team friendly deal. Sam is also a solid two way player. Has good chemistry with the J?s.

I?d be fine getting rid of Tillman, Davison, Walsh if they need to trim additional salary next year. KP is a wild card, but he?s still in his prime so I?d keep him and roll the dice. If healthy, that?s a very competitive team for Boston.

You trade for Barnes and Wesley but you don't include them on the Celts roster.
Where'd they go? 

Hauser is gone.  Saves way too much salary/tax to replace him with a minimum contract player.  Kornet is a free agent and won't be back as it will cost too much to resign him.  Tillman, Davison and Walsh make the minimum.  Getting rid of them doesn't trim salary because they'd be replaced with other minimum players.

Expirings=Salary dump.

They don't disappear.  They both have 1-year left on their contracts. They'd have to be on the Celtics roster or re-routed to other teams.  They won't being expiring until after next season when they'd become free agents unless they re-signed by their current team. 

Wesley should be easy to reroute.  Rerouting Barnes's to some team other than the Nets, who would probably want a 1st to do it, would take a bit of work but should be doable.  Doing so would get to your proposed roster and save 29.4M of cap space (and lots of tax for the owners) getting well under the 2nd apron.

Sounds good to me! Also, Champagnie would be a solid addition. He?s a 6?7 wing who shot 37% from 3pt last year and averaged 10ppg. Good defender, too. Could certainly use the depth with Tatum out.

[Roy H.]

What's the reason to trade Jrue if we don't end up below the second apron at the very least?

Why wouldn't we be better off just running it back?  We should be beneath the second apron next season regardless.

[DefenseWinsChamps]

What's the reason to trade Jrue if we don't end up below the second apron at the very least?

Why wouldn't we be better off just running it back?  We should be beneath the second apron next season regardless.

I agree with you on this. Trading Jrue should create significant value for the Cs, either by getting a good young prospect/pick back, or by getting under the 2nd tax, or both.

[DefenseWinsChamps]

All of our conversations have been about trading Jrue or Zinger primarily.

Serious question on this: What order would you put our top 8 in regarding their ability to add wins?

I ask because I thought the sentiment among many Celtic fans had been that Jaylen Brown did not add to Celtic wins as much as Tatum, and I thought others argued that White, Zinger, and maybe even Jrue added more wins.

A lot of that got thrown out the window with how Jaylen played in the playoffs last year. I think Brown gives you a slight boost in big games that these other guys may not have. But for regular season wins, he probably doesn't help the team win games to the same extent as the top 3.

I guess my ranking might be something like:
1. Tatum
2. Healthy Zinger
3a. White
3b. Brown
5. Jrue
6. Pritchard
7. Horford
8. Hauser/Kornet

If that is true, then maybe trading Brown would be the best idea. There's almost certainly a market for Brown. He has the biggest contract, which gives us the most potential future cap flexibility. And we could probably get 2x the value for White, 4-5x the value for Jrue, and 10x the value for Zinger.

That's one reason I like the Spurs as a trade partner for Brown. They send back Vassell as another wing to help us, the 2nd overall pick, and possibly Castle (the other iteration is probably Castle, 2nd pick, and Keldon Johnson). Both trades have Barnes and Hauser probably going to the Nets (or a random other team with TEs).

That trade could develop further from there, with the 2nd pick going to the Nets for multiple draft picks back to the Cs. Another iteration would have Vassell going to the Nets with Cam Johnson back to the Cs instead if the Cs prefer a big wing.