2024 NBA Season and Playoffs

[jpotter33]

Hasn't JB played most of his minutes as a small forward this year with us going small more often? I don't have a problem with him as a forward, as I think he's played more as a forward this year than guard.

[tazzmaniac]

How the hell is Lillard an all-star starter???

The 2024 #NBAAllStar Starters!

EAST

Giannis Antetokounmpo (captain)
Joel Embiid
Tyrese Haliburton
Damian Lillard
Jayson Tatum

WEST

LeBron James (captain)
Luka Doncic
Kevin Durant
Shai Gilgeous-Alexander
Nikola Jokic

They had Jaylen Brown listed as a forward. That seems silly to me. He is a guard. He should have beat out Damian Lillard for the second guard spot.  Lillard has not been the second best guard in the east this season.

He was drafted as a small-forward 

And with White and Holiday starting Jaylen is filling the traditional small forward role. 

[tazzmaniac]

Hasn't JB played most of his minutes as a small forward this year with us going small more often? I don't have a problem with him as a forward, as I think he's played more as a forward this year than guard.

Basketball-reference's position estimate has Jaylen as the SF 68% of the time. 

[ozgod]

I know KP probably has the best claim outside of the Jays to be the third Celtic, but I kind of hope Derrick gets it for 2 reasons: 1) KP's been recognized as an All Star before already and I don't want him getting hurt in some meaningless game and 2) I feel like it would be great recognition for Derrick's impact on our team. According to advanced stats he's the player that contributes most to winning in our team and he does it not just by scoring. And I like the fact that our Top 6 players would be all All-Stars (current and past) 

[radiohead]

Mikal Bridges choked 2 freethrows which could have sent the Nets-Wolves game into OT. But hey, Denver and Philly lost so it’s a good day for the Cs!

[jpotter33]

I know KP probably has the best claim outside of the Jays to be the third Celtic, but I kind of hope Derrick gets it for 2 reasons: 1) KP's been recognized as an All Star before already and I don't want him getting hurt in some meaningless game and 2) I feel like it would be great recognition for Derrick's impact on our team. According to advanced stats he's the player that contributes most to winning in our team and he does it not just by scoring. And I like the fact that our Top 6 players would be all All-Stars (current and past) 

With Dame making the starter spot and the coaches - who usually favor winning (White) over individual stats (Trae) - he has a shot.

I do think it's a 50/50 shot that we get a third All-Star at this point. With us distinguishing ourselves as the clear favorite at this point with a significant record lead, I think that'll show up favorably for the coaches. I just hope they don't compete against each other for a wildcard spot as the third Celtic and take votes away from each other.

[Vermont Green]

How the hell is Lillard an all-star starter???

The 2024 #NBAAllStar Starters!

EAST

Giannis Antetokounmpo (captain)
Joel Embiid
Tyrese Haliburton
Damian Lillard
Jayson Tatum

WEST

LeBron James (captain)
Luka Doncic
Kevin Durant
Shai Gilgeous-Alexander
Nikola Jokic

They had Jaylen Brown listed as a forward. That seems silly to me. He is a guard. He should have beat out Damian Lillard for the second guard spot.  Lillard has not been the second best guard in the east this season.

He was drafted as a small-forward 

And with White and Holiday starting Jaylen is filling the traditional small forward role.

I just don’t agree. We play with three guards. Tatum isn’t a power forward and Brown’s natural position isn’t small forward. He can play small forward. But that is not his natural position. His natural position is shooting guard. It has been his position for most of his career.

I can see how our lineups have led to him getting categorized as a forward. They want to apply the classic two guards two forwards one Center mold but it just doesn’t apply to this team this year.

[Who]

Jaylen is clearly a guard, but he also has worse stats than Lillard so he wouldn't start over him anyway.  Brunson should be starting with Haliburton.

Jaylen shooting 49% from field, 36% from 3. 23, 5 and 4 with above average defense. Lilliard 25, 4, 7 with 43% from field 35% from 3 with league worse defense for a team with a worse record. Lillard +204, brown +298. What stats are you referring
To? Or was this blind negativity towards Celtics hoping nobody had internet access?

Lillard has superior overall scoring efficiency at 60.3% TS% over Jaylen's 57.8% (average mark). Lillard gets to the FT line a lot more than Jaylen so even though Lillard hasn't shot the ball as well, he gets a lot of easy points at the line. He gets to the FT line at almost twice the rate of Jaylen. Jaylen gets 4.4 FTA. Lillard 8.1 FTA.

Add in Lillard's superior playmaking with 6.8apg to Jaylen's 3.4apg and Lillard is clearly having a much larger impact on the game offensively than Jaylen is. Offensive box plus/minus on Bball-ref has Lillard at a +3.8 to Jaylen's +0.7.

Jaylen is much better defensively. An above average defender vs Lillard's poor defense. Defensive box plus/minus on Bball-ref has Lillard as a -1.5 (bad) and Jaylen at +0.2.

I don't know how I'd rank them overall. I do think it is clear that Lillard has been far better offensively than Jaylen and that Jaylen has been far better than Lillard defensively.

[celticsclay]

Jaylen is clearly a guard, but he also has worse stats than Lillard so he wouldn't start over him anyway.  Brunson should be starting with Haliburton.

Jaylen shooting 49% from field, 36% from 3. 23, 5 and 4 with above average defense. Lilliard 25, 4, 7 with 43% from field 35% from 3 with league worse defense for a team with a worse record. Lillard +204, brown +298. What stats are you referring
To? Or was this blind negativity towards Celtics hoping nobody had internet access?

Lillard has superior overall scoring efficiency at 60.3% TS% over Jaylen's 57.8% (average mark). Lillard gets to the FT line a lot more than Jaylen so even though Lillard hasn't shot the ball as well, he gets a lot of easy points at the line. He gets to the FT line at almost twice the rate of Jaylen. Jaylen gets 4.4 FTA. Lillard 8.1 FTA.

Add in Lillard's superior playmaking with 6.8apg to Jaylen's 3.4apg and Lillard is clearly having a much larger impact on the game offensively than Jaylen is. Offensive box plus/minus on Bball-ref has Lillard at a +3.8 to Jaylen's +0.7.

Jaylen is much better defensively. An above average defender vs Lillard's poor defense. Defensive box plus/minus on Bball-ref has Lillard as a -1.5 (bad) and Jaylen at +0.2.

I don't know how I'd rank them overall. I do think it is clear that Lillard has been far better offensively than Jaylen and that Jaylen has been far better than Lillard defensively.

Yes of course lillard is gonna have more assists… they have very similar stats overall when you take into account defensive stats. Saying lillard has better stats is highly debatable. When you add in Jaylen is on the better team there isn’t much of an argument for Lilliard starting over him. 

[Moranis]

Jaylen is clearly a guard, but he also has worse stats than Lillard so he wouldn't start over him anyway.  Brunson should be starting with Haliburton.

Jaylen shooting 49% from field, 36% from 3. 23, 5 and 4 with above average defense. Lilliard 25, 4, 7 with 43% from field 35% from 3 with league worse defense for a team with a worse record. Lillard +204, brown +298. What stats are you referring
To? Or was this blind negativity towards Celtics hoping nobody had internet access?

Lillard has superior overall scoring efficiency at 60.3% TS% over Jaylen's 57.8% (average mark). Lillard gets to the FT line a lot more than Jaylen so even though Lillard hasn't shot the ball as well, he gets a lot of easy points at the line. He gets to the FT line at almost twice the rate of Jaylen. Jaylen gets 4.4 FTA. Lillard 8.1 FTA.

Add in Lillard's superior playmaking with 6.8apg to Jaylen's 3.4apg and Lillard is clearly having a much larger impact on the game offensively than Jaylen is. Offensive box plus/minus on Bball-ref has Lillard at a +3.8 to Jaylen's +0.7.

Jaylen is much better defensively. An above average defender vs Lillard's poor defense. Defensive box plus/minus on Bball-ref has Lillard as a -1.5 (bad) and Jaylen at +0.2.

I don't know how I'd rank them overall. I do think it is clear that Lillard has been far better offensively than Jaylen and that Jaylen has been far better than Lillard defensively.

Yes of course lillard is gonna have more assists… they have very similar stats overall when you take into account defensive stats. Saying lillard has better stats is highly debatable. When you add in Jaylen is on the better team there isn’t much of an argument for Lilliard starting over him.

Lillard scores over 2 more ppg on 0.5 less fga.  Lillard has nearly double the assists and turns it over less. Lillard commits 1 less foul and gets an equal amount of steals.  Brown gets about 1 more rebound and about a half a block more per game.  Lillard has a better PER on a lower usage.  Lillard has more total WS, better WS per 48, a better bpm, a better vorp, and just about any other advanced metric you want to look at.  The stats are not close and while Brown is obviously a better defensive player there is a larger gap offensively, which is why the stats aren't close.  Lillard has better stats than Brown because Lillard is a better player than Brown, even as he adjusts to a new team and new role.

[celticsclay]

Jaylen is clearly a guard, but he also has worse stats than Lillard so he wouldn't start over him anyway.  Brunson should be starting with Haliburton.

Jaylen shooting 49% from field, 36% from 3. 23, 5 and 4 with above average defense. Lilliard 25, 4, 7 with 43% from field 35% from 3 with league worse defense for a team with a worse record. Lillard +204, brown +298. What stats are you referring
To? Or was this blind negativity towards Celtics hoping nobody had internet access?

Lillard has superior overall scoring efficiency at 60.3% TS% over Jaylen's 57.8% (average mark). Lillard gets to the FT line a lot more than Jaylen so even though Lillard hasn't shot the ball as well, he gets a lot of easy points at the line. He gets to the FT line at almost twice the rate of Jaylen. Jaylen gets 4.4 FTA. Lillard 8.1 FTA.

Add in Lillard's superior playmaking with 6.8apg to Jaylen's 3.4apg and Lillard is clearly having a much larger impact on the game offensively than Jaylen is. Offensive box plus/minus on Bball-ref has Lillard at a +3.8 to Jaylen's +0.7.

Jaylen is much better defensively. An above average defender vs Lillard's poor defense. Defensive box plus/minus on Bball-ref has Lillard as a -1.5 (bad) and Jaylen at +0.2.

I don't know how I'd rank them overall. I do think it is clear that Lillard has been far better offensively than Jaylen and that Jaylen has been far better than Lillard defensively.

Yes of course lillard is gonna have more assists… they have very similar stats overall when you take into account defensive stats. Saying lillard has better stats is highly debatable. When you add in Jaylen is on the better team there isn’t much of an argument for Lilliard starting over him.

Lillard scores over 2 more ppg on 0.5 less fga.  Lillard has nearly double the assists and turns it over less. Lillard commits 1 less foul and gets an equal amount of steals.  Brown gets about 1 more rebound and about a half a block more per game.  Lillard has a better PER on a lower usage.  Lillard has more total WS, better WS per 48, a better bpm, a better vorp, and just about any other advanced metric you want to look at.  The stats are not close and while Brown is obviously a better defensive player there is a larger gap offensively, which is why the stats aren't close.  Lillard has better stats than Brown because Lillard is a better player than Brown, even as he adjusts to a new team and new role.

Whatever you say chief

[Who]

Utah were 9-17. They have won 14 of their last 20 games to go .500 tonight.

[Kernewek]

Jaylen is clearly a guard, but he also has worse stats than Lillard so he wouldn't start over him anyway.  Brunson should be starting with Haliburton.

Jaylen shooting 49% from field, 36% from 3. 23, 5 and 4 with above average defense. Lilliard 25, 4, 7 with 43% from field 35% from 3 with league worse defense for a team with a worse record. Lillard +204, brown +298. What stats are you referring
To? Or was this blind negativity towards Celtics hoping nobody had internet access?

Lillard has superior overall scoring efficiency at 60.3% TS% over Jaylen's 57.8% (average mark). Lillard gets to the FT line a lot more than Jaylen so even though Lillard hasn't shot the ball as well, he gets a lot of easy points at the line. He gets to the FT line at almost twice the rate of Jaylen. Jaylen gets 4.4 FTA. Lillard 8.1 FTA.

Add in Lillard's superior playmaking with 6.8apg to Jaylen's 3.4apg and Lillard is clearly having a much larger impact on the game offensively than Jaylen is. Offensive box plus/minus on Bball-ref has Lillard at a +3.8 to Jaylen's +0.7.

Jaylen is much better defensively. An above average defender vs Lillard's poor defense. Defensive box plus/minus on Bball-ref has Lillard as a -1.5 (bad) and Jaylen at +0.2.

I don't know how I'd rank them overall. I do think it is clear that Lillard has been far better offensively than Jaylen and that Jaylen has been far better than Lillard defensively.

Yes of course lillard is gonna have more assists… they have very similar stats overall when you take into account defensive stats. Saying lillard has better stats is highly debatable. When you add in Jaylen is on the better team there isn’t much of an argument for Lilliard starting over him.

Lillard scores over 2 more ppg on 0.5 less fga.  Lillard has nearly double the assists and turns it over less. Lillard commits 1 less foul and gets an equal amount of steals.  Brown gets about 1 more rebound and about a half a block more per game.  Lillard has a better PER on a lower usage.  Lillard has more total WS, better WS per 48, a better bpm, a better vorp, and just about any other advanced metric you want to look at.  The stats are not close and while Brown is obviously a better defensive player there is a larger gap offensively, which is why the stats aren't close.  Lillard has better stats than Brown because Lillard is a better player than Brown, even as he adjusts to a new team and new role.

Whatever you say chief

Eh, I think most people would say that Lillard is probably more valuable to more teams, even if Brown is a much better fit for us.

[Moranis]

Jaylen is clearly a guard, but he also has worse stats than Lillard so he wouldn't start over him anyway.  Brunson should be starting with Haliburton.

Jaylen shooting 49% from field, 36% from 3. 23, 5 and 4 with above average defense. Lilliard 25, 4, 7 with 43% from field 35% from 3 with league worse defense for a team with a worse record. Lillard +204, brown +298. What stats are you referring
To? Or was this blind negativity towards Celtics hoping nobody had internet access?

Lillard has superior overall scoring efficiency at 60.3% TS% over Jaylen's 57.8% (average mark). Lillard gets to the FT line a lot more than Jaylen so even though Lillard hasn't shot the ball as well, he gets a lot of easy points at the line. He gets to the FT line at almost twice the rate of Jaylen. Jaylen gets 4.4 FTA. Lillard 8.1 FTA.

Add in Lillard's superior playmaking with 6.8apg to Jaylen's 3.4apg and Lillard is clearly having a much larger impact on the game offensively than Jaylen is. Offensive box plus/minus on Bball-ref has Lillard at a +3.8 to Jaylen's +0.7.

Jaylen is much better defensively. An above average defender vs Lillard's poor defense. Defensive box plus/minus on Bball-ref has Lillard as a -1.5 (bad) and Jaylen at +0.2.

I don't know how I'd rank them overall. I do think it is clear that Lillard has been far better offensively than Jaylen and that Jaylen has been far better than Lillard defensively.

Yes of course lillard is gonna have more assists… they have very similar stats overall when you take into account defensive stats. Saying lillard has better stats is highly debatable. When you add in Jaylen is on the better team there isn’t much of an argument for Lilliard starting over him.

Lillard scores over 2 more ppg on 0.5 less fga.  Lillard has nearly double the assists and turns it over less. Lillard commits 1 less foul and gets an equal amount of steals.  Brown gets about 1 more rebound and about a half a block more per game.  Lillard has a better PER on a lower usage.  Lillard has more total WS, better WS per 48, a better bpm, a better vorp, and just about any other advanced metric you want to look at.  The stats are not close and while Brown is obviously a better defensive player there is a larger gap offensively, which is why the stats aren't close.  Lillard has better stats than Brown because Lillard is a better player than Brown, even as he adjusts to a new team and new role.

Whatever you say chief

Eh, I think most people would say that Lillard is probably more valuable to more teams, even if Brown is a much better fit for us.

my orogonal comment wasn't even about that. All I said was Lillard had better stats and thus implied because of that, that Lillard would be more likely to be an all star.  There is nothing controversial or untrue in that statement.  Lillard had better stats than Brown. 

I mentioned Brunson, but I looked at this a bit deeper. My 5th starter would have been Mitchell.  What he has done after Garland and Mobley went down has been amazing.  Cavs are on a role and he is playing great.  Mitchell might be in the top 5 of MVP at this point (I didn't look that closely).  His numbers are great and the Cavs are winning down 2 starters

[RodyTur10]

Jaylen is clearly a guard, but he also has worse stats than Lillard so he wouldn't start over him anyway.  Brunson should be starting with Haliburton.

Jaylen shooting 49% from field, 36% from 3. 23, 5 and 4 with above average defense. Lilliard 25, 4, 7 with 43% from field 35% from 3 with league worse defense for a team with a worse record. Lillard +204, brown +298. What stats are you referring
To? Or was this blind negativity towards Celtics hoping nobody had internet access?

Lillard has superior overall scoring efficiency at 60.3% TS% over Jaylen's 57.8% (average mark). Lillard gets to the FT line a lot more than Jaylen so even though Lillard hasn't shot the ball as well, he gets a lot of easy points at the line. He gets to the FT line at almost twice the rate of Jaylen. Jaylen gets 4.4 FTA. Lillard 8.1 FTA.

Add in Lillard's superior playmaking with 6.8apg to Jaylen's 3.4apg and Lillard is clearly having a much larger impact on the game offensively than Jaylen is. Offensive box plus/minus on Bball-ref has Lillard at a +3.8 to Jaylen's +0.7.

Jaylen is much better defensively. An above average defender vs Lillard's poor defense. Defensive box plus/minus on Bball-ref has Lillard as a -1.5 (bad) and Jaylen at +0.2.

I don't know how I'd rank them overall. I do think it is clear that Lillard has been far better offensively than Jaylen and that Jaylen has been far better than Lillard defensively.

Yes of course lillard is gonna have more assists… they have very similar stats overall when you take into account defensive stats. Saying lillard has better stats is highly debatable. When you add in Jaylen is on the better team there isn’t much of an argument for Lilliard starting over him.

Lillard scores over 2 more ppg on 0.5 less fga.  Lillard has nearly double the assists and turns it over less. Lillard commits 1 less foul and gets an equal amount of steals.  Brown gets about 1 more rebound and about a half a block more per game.  Lillard has a better PER on a lower usage.  Lillard has more total WS, better WS per 48, a better bpm, a better vorp, and just about any other advanced metric you want to look at.  The stats are not close and while Brown is obviously a better defensive player there is a larger gap offensively, which is why the stats aren't close.  Lillard has better stats than Brown because Lillard is a better player than Brown, even as he adjusts to a new team and new role.

Whatever you say chief

Eh, I think most people would say that Lillard is probably more valuable to more teams, even if Brown is a much better fit for us.

my orogonal comment wasn't even about that. All I said was Lillard had better stats and thus implied because of that, that Lillard would be more likely to be an all star.  There is nothing controversial or untrue in that statement.  Lillard had better stats than Brown. 

I mentioned Brunson, but I looked at this a bit deeper. My 5th starter would have been Mitchell.  What he has done after Garland and Mobley went down has been amazing.  Cavs are on a role and he is playing great.  Mitchell might be in the top 5 of MVP at this point (I didn't look that closely).  His numbers are great and the Cavs are winning down 2 starters

Mitchell would be mine too. He's overlooked, like Markkanen and Sabonis may be overlooked as reserves in the West. Stars who shine under the radar on smaller franchises.