How much have we improved?

[hwangjini_1]

Hard to say.  I think our ceiling has risen, but relying on Porzingis to stay healthy has historically not been the best gamble.  At his best he's an All-Star level third option who impacts both ends and should synergize well with Tatum.  At his worst he's not on the court when it matters. 

I suspect Smart is beginning to decline.  His style of play tends to age quickly.  He's already not as quick as he was.  Also, we have the guard depth to absorb his departure.  And is Grant ever going to be consistent?  He looked like a key roleplayer in year one and year three, and he looked like a scrub in year two and a significant chunk of year four.  In either case I don't think he's irreplaceable. 

It's really just those three guys.  The rest of the incoming/outgoing players don't interest me much.  Maybe Brissett surprises us, I don't know.  He sucked last year but has been useful in the past. 

Overall I think we're better in a perfect world, but we're rolling the dice on team health more than ever.

I agree with your overall assessment:  higher upside.  I also think that if this coming season played out 100 times, we'd probably be worse in about 60% - 70% of them, because significant injuries are very likely.  Hopefully those don't hit at playoff time.

I do have some disagreements regarding the sentiment that "it's really just those three guys [KP, Grant, Smart]".  They'll have the biggest individual impacts among the changes, but I do think that Gallinari and Muscala will be quality players this season. 

Essentially, we've replaced Grant, Gallo and Moose with KP, and Smart's contributions with a larger role for White/Brogdon/Pritchard.  I feel alright about the second half of that equation, but trading away all of our big man depth for a very injury prone player scares me.  If Brad had found a replacement big or two, I'd be fine, but for whatever reason he neglected the decision (drafting a wing and signing three wings / guards in free agency).

So, overall, higher upside.  But, also more holes this year than last.  My 10,000 foot view is that championship rosters should probably have more than seven reliable rotation players, particularly when more than half of those players are likely to miss substantial time.

The Nuggets just won with 8 guys. Two of them were Jamal Murray and Michael Porter Jr.

As well as Jeff Green (ancient) and Braun (non-lotto rookie).

That being said, Denver also have one of the best offensive players to ever play the game, and (IMO, of course) the 6th best centre of all time.

just curious about who you have as number five on your list. one to four are easy.

[timpiker]

It all depends on Thee Unicorn's health. 

[Celtics4ever]

Yeah, we can't tell until we see how Porzingas meshes with the Jays.  All on paper.....

[Moranis]

Hard to say.  I think our ceiling has risen, but relying on Porzingis to stay healthy has historically not been the best gamble.  At his best he's an All-Star level third option who impacts both ends and should synergize well with Tatum.  At his worst he's not on the court when it matters. 

I suspect Smart is beginning to decline.  His style of play tends to age quickly.  He's already not as quick as he was.  Also, we have the guard depth to absorb his departure.  And is Grant ever going to be consistent?  He looked like a key roleplayer in year one and year three, and he looked like a scrub in year two and a significant chunk of year four.  In either case I don't think he's irreplaceable. 

It's really just those three guys.  The rest of the incoming/outgoing players don't interest me much.  Maybe Brissett surprises us, I don't know.  He sucked last year but has been useful in the past. 

Overall I think we're better in a perfect world, but we're rolling the dice on team health more than ever.

I agree with your overall assessment:  higher upside.  I also think that if this coming season played out 100 times, we'd probably be worse in about 60% - 70% of them, because significant injuries are very likely.  Hopefully those don't hit at playoff time.

I do have some disagreements regarding the sentiment that "it's really just those three guys [KP, Grant, Smart]".  They'll have the biggest individual impacts among the changes, but I do think that Gallinari and Muscala will be quality players this season. 

Essentially, we've replaced Grant, Gallo and Moose with KP, and Smart's contributions with a larger role for White/Brogdon/Pritchard.  I feel alright about the second half of that equation, but trading away all of our big man depth for a very injury prone player scares me.  If Brad had found a replacement big or two, I'd be fine, but for whatever reason he neglected the decision (drafting a wing and signing three wings / guards in free agency).

So, overall, higher upside.  But, also more holes this year than last.  My 10,000 foot view is that championship rosters should probably have more than seven reliable rotation players, particularly when more than half of those players are likely to miss substantial time.

The Nuggets just won with 8 guys. Two of them were Jamal Murray and Michael Porter Jr.

As well as Jeff Green (ancient) and Braun (non-lotto rookie).

That being said, Denver also have one of the best offensive players to ever play the game, and (IMO, of course) the 6th best centre of all time.

just curious about who you have as number five on your list. one to four are easy.

Kareem, Wilt, Bill, Hakeem, Shaq, Moses.  I can see Jokic ahead of Moses at some point, but not yet. Heck I can see Jokic getting to 4th before he is done.  Not sure he can realistically crack the top 3

[Vermont Green]

Yeah, we can't tell until we see how Porzingas meshes with the Jays.  All on paper.....

This is fair, you never know about a new player until you see them on the court with your players, your coach, your system, but I feel pretty confident that Porzingis is going to fit/mesh just fine.  It is all just words of course at this point but I get the feeling that Porzingis is very happy to be in Boston and has fully accepted what his role is going to be on this team, the #3 that needs to complement Tatum and Brown.  I think he has handled everything perfectly, the trade, the contract, the foot injury, everything.

[hwangjini_1]

Hard to say.  I think our ceiling has risen, but relying on Porzingis to stay healthy has historically not been the best gamble.  At his best he's an All-Star level third option who impacts both ends and should synergize well with Tatum.  At his worst he's not on the court when it matters. 

I suspect Smart is beginning to decline.  His style of play tends to age quickly.  He's already not as quick as he was.  Also, we have the guard depth to absorb his departure.  And is Grant ever going to be consistent?  He looked like a key roleplayer in year one and year three, and he looked like a scrub in year two and a significant chunk of year four.  In either case I don't think he's irreplaceable. 

It's really just those three guys.  The rest of the incoming/outgoing players don't interest me much.  Maybe Brissett surprises us, I don't know.  He sucked last year but has been useful in the past. 

Overall I think we're better in a perfect world, but we're rolling the dice on team health more than ever.

I agree with your overall assessment:  higher upside.  I also think that if this coming season played out 100 times, we'd probably be worse in about 60% - 70% of them, because significant injuries are very likely.  Hopefully those don't hit at playoff time.

I do have some disagreements regarding the sentiment that "it's really just those three guys [KP, Grant, Smart]".  They'll have the biggest individual impacts among the changes, but I do think that Gallinari and Muscala will be quality players this season. 

Essentially, we've replaced Grant, Gallo and Moose with KP, and Smart's contributions with a larger role for White/Brogdon/Pritchard.  I feel alright about the second half of that equation, but trading away all of our big man depth for a very injury prone player scares me.  If Brad had found a replacement big or two, I'd be fine, but for whatever reason he neglected the decision (drafting a wing and signing three wings / guards in free agency).

So, overall, higher upside.  But, also more holes this year than last.  My 10,000 foot view is that championship rosters should probably have more than seven reliable rotation players, particularly when more than half of those players are likely to miss substantial time.

The Nuggets just won with 8 guys. Two of them were Jamal Murray and Michael Porter Jr.

As well as Jeff Green (ancient) and Braun (non-lotto rookie).

That being said, Denver also have one of the best offensive players to ever play the game, and (IMO, of course) the 6th best centre of all time.

just curious about who you have as number five on your list. one to four are easy.

Kareem, Wilt, Bill, Hakeem, Shaq, Moses.  I can see Jokic ahead of Moses at some point, but not yet. Heck I can see Jokic getting to 4th before he is done.  Not sure he can realistically crack the top 3

thanks. i thought it might be malone. i can see the argument for jokic being better than malone soon, given that malone was pretty much restricted to being under the basket and jokic can shoot 3s and pass much better from the post.

as for passing oneil, i am doubtful about that given the oneil's early career numbers are better than jokic's early career numbers. and oneil simply dominated at his position. but eventually it may come down to what the fan wants to include when making their decisions...blocks over 3 pointers? defense over offense?

also, jokic is still young. let's see what he does in his 30s.

[SHAQATTACK]

Yeah, we can't tell until we see how Porzingas meshes with the Jays.  All on paper.....

Depends on how many games he ll actually be available to play fully healthy.

He and Time lord have to stay on the court. ….not the doctor office

[Moranis]

Hard to say.  I think our ceiling has risen, but relying on Porzingis to stay healthy has historically not been the best gamble.  At his best he's an All-Star level third option who impacts both ends and should synergize well with Tatum.  At his worst he's not on the court when it matters. 

I suspect Smart is beginning to decline.  His style of play tends to age quickly.  He's already not as quick as he was.  Also, we have the guard depth to absorb his departure.  And is Grant ever going to be consistent?  He looked like a key roleplayer in year one and year three, and he looked like a scrub in year two and a significant chunk of year four.  In either case I don't think he's irreplaceable. 

It's really just those three guys.  The rest of the incoming/outgoing players don't interest me much.  Maybe Brissett surprises us, I don't know.  He sucked last year but has been useful in the past. 

Overall I think we're better in a perfect world, but we're rolling the dice on team health more than ever.

I agree with your overall assessment:  higher upside.  I also think that if this coming season played out 100 times, we'd probably be worse in about 60% - 70% of them, because significant injuries are very likely.  Hopefully those don't hit at playoff time.

I do have some disagreements regarding the sentiment that "it's really just those three guys [KP, Grant, Smart]".  They'll have the biggest individual impacts among the changes, but I do think that Gallinari and Muscala will be quality players this season. 

Essentially, we've replaced Grant, Gallo and Moose with KP, and Smart's contributions with a larger role for White/Brogdon/Pritchard.  I feel alright about the second half of that equation, but trading away all of our big man depth for a very injury prone player scares me.  If Brad had found a replacement big or two, I'd be fine, but for whatever reason he neglected the decision (drafting a wing and signing three wings / guards in free agency).

So, overall, higher upside.  But, also more holes this year than last.  My 10,000 foot view is that championship rosters should probably have more than seven reliable rotation players, particularly when more than half of those players are likely to miss substantial time.

The Nuggets just won with 8 guys. Two of them were Jamal Murray and Michael Porter Jr.

As well as Jeff Green (ancient) and Braun (non-lotto rookie).

That being said, Denver also have one of the best offensive players to ever play the game, and (IMO, of course) the 6th best centre of all time.

just curious about who you have as number five on your list. one to four are easy.

Kareem, Wilt, Bill, Hakeem, Shaq, Moses.  I can see Jokic ahead of Moses at some point, but not yet. Heck I can see Jokic getting to 4th before he is done.  Not sure he can realistically crack the top 3

thanks. i thought it might be malone. i can see the argument for jokic being better than malone soon, given that malone was pretty much restricted to being under the basket and jokic can shoot 3s and pass much better from the post.

as for passing oneil, i am doubtful about that given the oneil's early career numbers are better than jokic's early career numbers. and oneil simply dominated at his position. but eventually it may come down to what the fan wants to include when making their decisions...blocks over 3 pointers? defense over offense?

also, jokic is still young. let's see what he does in his 30s.

I'm not the same person, but I think that is pretty widely regarded as the top 6.  Kareem 1 and Moses 6, but some variety at 2 and 3 and 4 and 5.

[TheBig3]

Hard to say.  I think our ceiling has risen, but relying on Porzingis to stay healthy has historically not been the best gamble.  At his best he's an All-Star level third option who impacts both ends and should synergize well with Tatum.  At his worst he's not on the court when it matters. 

I suspect Smart is beginning to decline.  His style of play tends to age quickly.  He's already not as quick as he was.  Also, we have the guard depth to absorb his departure.  And is Grant ever going to be consistent?  He looked like a key roleplayer in year one and year three, and he looked like a scrub in year two and a significant chunk of year four.  In either case I don't think he's irreplaceable. 

It's really just those three guys.  The rest of the incoming/outgoing players don't interest me much.  Maybe Brissett surprises us, I don't know.  He sucked last year but has been useful in the past. 

Overall I think we're better in a perfect world, but we're rolling the dice on team health more than ever.

I agree with your overall assessment:  higher upside.  I also think that if this coming season played out 100 times, we'd probably be worse in about 60% - 70% of them, because significant injuries are very likely.  Hopefully those don't hit at playoff time.

I do have some disagreements regarding the sentiment that "it's really just those three guys [KP, Grant, Smart]".  They'll have the biggest individual impacts among the changes, but I do think that Gallinari and Muscala will be quality players this season. 

Essentially, we've replaced Grant, Gallo and Moose with KP, and Smart's contributions with a larger role for White/Brogdon/Pritchard.  I feel alright about the second half of that equation, but trading away all of our big man depth for a very injury prone player scares me.  If Brad had found a replacement big or two, I'd be fine, but for whatever reason he neglected the decision (drafting a wing and signing three wings / guards in free agency).

So, overall, higher upside.  But, also more holes this year than last.  My 10,000 foot view is that championship rosters should probably have more than seven reliable rotation players, particularly when more than half of those players are likely to miss substantial time.

The Nuggets just won with 8 guys. Two of them were Jamal Murray and Michael Porter Jr.

As well as Jeff Green (ancient) and Braun (non-lotto rookie).

That being said, Denver also have one of the best offensive players to ever play the game, and (IMO, of course) the 6th best centre of all time.

just curious about who you have as number five on your list. one to four are easy.

Kareem, Wilt, Bill, Hakeem, Shaq, Moses.  I can see Jokic ahead of Moses at some point, but not yet. Heck I can see Jokic getting to 4th before he is done.  Not sure he can realistically crack the top 3

Where would David Robinson sit on this list?

[hpantazo]

I think reading between the lines from Brad Stevens and Tatum's comments on the offseason moves, a major factor in moving Smart was to give Tatum and Brown full control of the team. They deferred to Smart too much, especially late in games. Smart, as others have said, has been declining too. His defense was mediocre last season. White is a much more natural fit at PG, and adding Porzingis is huge for this team as Horford can't be a full-time starter on a contending team anymore. With these changes and the improvement of the coaching staff, I think we improved a great deal.

I also would not underestimate Jordan Walsh. I know he's a rookie and will have a learning curve, but he looks like an excellent fit for this team at the wing spots.

[Moranis]

Hard to say.  I think our ceiling has risen, but relying on Porzingis to stay healthy has historically not been the best gamble.  At his best he's an All-Star level third option who impacts both ends and should synergize well with Tatum.  At his worst he's not on the court when it matters. 

I suspect Smart is beginning to decline.  His style of play tends to age quickly.  He's already not as quick as he was.  Also, we have the guard depth to absorb his departure.  And is Grant ever going to be consistent?  He looked like a key roleplayer in year one and year three, and he looked like a scrub in year two and a significant chunk of year four.  In either case I don't think he's irreplaceable. 

It's really just those three guys.  The rest of the incoming/outgoing players don't interest me much.  Maybe Brissett surprises us, I don't know.  He sucked last year but has been useful in the past. 

Overall I think we're better in a perfect world, but we're rolling the dice on team health more than ever.

I agree with your overall assessment:  higher upside.  I also think that if this coming season played out 100 times, we'd probably be worse in about 60% - 70% of them, because significant injuries are very likely.  Hopefully those don't hit at playoff time.

I do have some disagreements regarding the sentiment that "it's really just those three guys [KP, Grant, Smart]".  They'll have the biggest individual impacts among the changes, but I do think that Gallinari and Muscala will be quality players this season. 

Essentially, we've replaced Grant, Gallo and Moose with KP, and Smart's contributions with a larger role for White/Brogdon/Pritchard.  I feel alright about the second half of that equation, but trading away all of our big man depth for a very injury prone player scares me.  If Brad had found a replacement big or two, I'd be fine, but for whatever reason he neglected the decision (drafting a wing and signing three wings / guards in free agency).

So, overall, higher upside.  But, also more holes this year than last.  My 10,000 foot view is that championship rosters should probably have more than seven reliable rotation players, particularly when more than half of those players are likely to miss substantial time.

The Nuggets just won with 8 guys. Two of them were Jamal Murray and Michael Porter Jr.

As well as Jeff Green (ancient) and Braun (non-lotto rookie).

That being said, Denver also have one of the best offensive players to ever play the game, and (IMO, of course) the 6th best centre of all time.

just curious about who you have as number five on your list. one to four are easy.

Kareem, Wilt, Bill, Hakeem, Shaq, Moses.  I can see Jokic ahead of Moses at some point, but not yet. Heck I can see Jokic getting to 4th before he is done.  Not sure he can realistically crack the top 3

Where would David Robinson sit on this list?

he is 7 or 8 depending on where you put Jokic

[gouki88]

Hard to say.  I think our ceiling has risen, but relying on Porzingis to stay healthy has historically not been the best gamble.  At his best he's an All-Star level third option who impacts both ends and should synergize well with Tatum.  At his worst he's not on the court when it matters. 

I suspect Smart is beginning to decline.  His style of play tends to age quickly.  He's already not as quick as he was.  Also, we have the guard depth to absorb his departure.  And is Grant ever going to be consistent?  He looked like a key roleplayer in year one and year three, and he looked like a scrub in year two and a significant chunk of year four.  In either case I don't think he's irreplaceable. 

It's really just those three guys.  The rest of the incoming/outgoing players don't interest me much.  Maybe Brissett surprises us, I don't know.  He sucked last year but has been useful in the past. 

Overall I think we're better in a perfect world, but we're rolling the dice on team health more than ever.

I agree with your overall assessment:  higher upside.  I also think that if this coming season played out 100 times, we'd probably be worse in about 60% - 70% of them, because significant injuries are very likely.  Hopefully those don't hit at playoff time.

I do have some disagreements regarding the sentiment that "it's really just those three guys [KP, Grant, Smart]".  They'll have the biggest individual impacts among the changes, but I do think that Gallinari and Muscala will be quality players this season. 

Essentially, we've replaced Grant, Gallo and Moose with KP, and Smart's contributions with a larger role for White/Brogdon/Pritchard.  I feel alright about the second half of that equation, but trading away all of our big man depth for a very injury prone player scares me.  If Brad had found a replacement big or two, I'd be fine, but for whatever reason he neglected the decision (drafting a wing and signing three wings / guards in free agency).

So, overall, higher upside.  But, also more holes this year than last.  My 10,000 foot view is that championship rosters should probably have more than seven reliable rotation players, particularly when more than half of those players are likely to miss substantial time.

The Nuggets just won with 8 guys. Two of them were Jamal Murray and Michael Porter Jr.

As well as Jeff Green (ancient) and Braun (non-lotto rookie).

That being said, Denver also have one of the best offensive players to ever play the game, and (IMO, of course) the 6th best centre of all time.

just curious about who you have as number five on your list. one to four are easy.

Kareem, Bill, Wilt, Hakeem, Shaq. Jokic has edged out David Robinson & Moses with his most recent title. I could see him jumping Shaq & Hakeem if he wins a couple more rings and continues his dominance