Free agency starts / reported signings (merged)

[celticsclay]

"I was speaking to a bunch of folks about [Harden] Sunday evening," said Dave McMenamin on the Dan Patrick Show. "The signals right now is that he will be back with the Philadelphia 76ers."

Harden had a softer than expected free agency market with the Houston Rockets pivoting to Fred VanVleet. The Sixers have evaluated trade options for Harden, but there doesn't appear to be a return package for him they would seriously entertain.

"As of right now, with certainly no momentum appearing on a deal to the Los Angeles Clippers. And Philadelphia obviously still needing what he does without finding a replacement for him. It looks like there's a pathway for him to come back to the Sixers next year."

Yeah, this is looking the most likely end scenario at this point. Just no value in the trade market for Harden. Best to keep him and let him leave as a FA next summer. They have other big contracts coming off the books then as well creating large cap space to retool around Embiid and keep contending.


This is also similar to what I see for Damian Lillard (weak trade market, no high quality offers only mediocre ones) however the team situation is different.

POR are not a title contender like Philly. They are not even a playoff team or even a real playoff hopeful. They are a lottery team. So keeping Lillard is a win-now move like keeping Harden is but it has little justification for the benefit of the team. POR are better off trading him for a weak package and rebuilding properly. Using whatever future picks / prospects they can get for Lillard. Bottoming out. Creating opportunity for Scoot to takeover at PG and be the new franchise player. Get a higher lotto pick next summer. The team will turn around their rebuild quicker this way.

Have people somehow forgotten how harden performed for his last two teams when he didn’t want to be there? He showed up extremely overweight on the rockets and said his teammates were not good enough in a press conference forcing their hand. For the nets he just stopped regularly being in contact with the coach and front office and went off to Atlantic City or Vegas after requesting the trade. Now he will magically be a good soldier for a team he believes broke their agreement? Really crazy idea to me, especially when you consider he has less at risk than ever. In the past when he did all this stuff he was still trying to land a 4 or 5 year max contract down the line. Now reentering free agency at 34 or 35 he isn’t gonna get much more than a two year 45 million dollar deal even if he plays great

I saw somewhere that Philly offered Harden a choice of a 1yr $40mil deal or a 2yr $80mil deal. Whichever he preferred.

That is what set him off. The lack of a long term deal. Just an interesting point of comparison with what Harden is likely looking at next summer which likely will be no better than what Philly are offering right now.

Harden reiterated his trade request today. It seems possible he may start season with them but the idea
Of him being a good soldier for the whole year seems a bit ridiculous to me. Here is the story

"I'll just be clear with you: he felt betrayed," added Shelburne. "He felt like he was going to get a max extension from them either last year and decided 'Okay, I'll leave some money on the table.' And then this year when they were not communicating with him before free agency, because they have the largest tampering fine in league history. But generally speaking, there was no wink or not saying we're going to take care of you. He got upset and that's why he opted in rather than letting it play out and reach free agency."

Harden has little leverage.  If he pouts and acts unprofessional, it will just hurt his already reduced market value in free agency next offseason.  Harden isn't an idiot or crazy.  He has all the incentives to be a good soldier.  Note the wording that he has requested a trade not demanded one. 

“I don’t think they’re close on anything. James Harden has spoken to [president] Daryl Morey since the first trade request, and I think there was a cooling off period … They’ve spoken again, and [Harden] still reiterated he wants to be traded. Now, this isn’t a demand, it’s a request. I think the Sixers have said, ‘Okay we will try to trade you,’ but there is no hurry to do this,” Shelburne said. “I think the Sixers understand here that they have the leverage. James has picked up his option, this is an opt-in … He’s going to be a free agent, so at some point, he needs to play, whether that’s in Philadelphia or elsewhere.”

He probably has had the reputation of being the least disciplined players in the league the last 5 years, even when he is happy. The idea of him being a good soldier and staying fit when he wants to be traded Is a charade I don’t think he can keep for a whole year. He also probably doesn’t help maxey develop at all and they don’t have enough talent as is to win a championship. So what’s the point of having this weird bridge year? Don’t look now but Embid is turning 30 this season.

Harden the least disciplined player??  Try Simmons.  Try Kyrie.  Harden wasn't the problem in Brooklyn and he hasn't been a problem in Philly so far. 

What's the point of trading Harden if they can't get a good return?  They certainly don't want to take on out year salary for mediocre players.  Better to let Harden and Harris come off the books and use all that cap space in free agency.  If Harden becomes a problem, they can tell him to stay home.  I've said before that Maxey's development is key to the Sixers championship chances.  I don't think Harden adversely impacts Maxey's development.  Maxey is a shooting guard with secondary ball handling skills.  He's not going to run their half-court offense.

Their coach last season (even if he is semi an idiot) disagrees with you on this regarding maxey. He said harden was totally fine the first half of the season and the team and offense were great, but the second half he didn’t want to just be pass all the time and looked for his shot more to the detriment of team (and clearly maxey) success. I gotta take his opinion on this over yours even if it is a hard thing to detect from stats. You also aren’t making much of an argument by comparing two other members of the Mount Rushmore of poorly disciplined players. Harden has been perennially out of his shape for his career including a meme worthy fatness in his final season in Houston. He went off to Vegas or Atlantic and stopped regularly communicating with the nets when he wanted to be traded mid season. He also even went to vegas last year in the middle of the 76ers playoff series. You can argue that someone like mj did this but the difference is mj constantly rose up on the biggest stage and won 6 championships. Harden on the other hand is famous for constantly shrinking in big games. I may suggest you just admit harden is a very undisplined player including his diet, fitness and love of strip clubs and night clubs which is absolutely notorious at this point. You are too knowledgeable a poster to argue the opposite on this to be honest. (I could include like 25 articles written over a decade about challenges with his diet, fitness and love of partying but I hope that is not necessary here). Here is one pretty funny article about him being fat in both Houston and Brooklyn with pics. Enjoy https://amp.marca.com/en/basketball/nba/brooklyn-nets/2021/10/09/616161cee2704ee9018b4602.html

[cman88]

There is no evidence in his past that Harden will just be a good soldier, show up in shape and perform. just not who he is.

last year was probably the best shape he's been in, in awhile. and a disgruntled harden is not going to work.

ONLY reason Harden opted in is because harden knows the clippers or other teams he would go to have no cap space to sign him. unlike the dame situation though they will lose him for nothing next year.

[celticsclay]

There is no evidence in his past that Harden will just be a good soldier, show up in shape and perform. just not who he is.

last year was probably the best shape he's been in, in awhile. and a disgruntled harden is not going to work.

Agree. He also doesn’t really have much to lose. Even at his absolute best he is a lower level all star (and we have to expect a 15% decline year to year when he is 34). He is not getting a huge contract next year no matter what happens. Maybe he gets 2 for 40 for a great season versus 2 for 30 if he pouts. But we saw this past offseason with brooks getting a huge deal after being the laughing stock of the league and a locker room cancer still got money. Actung like he has a 100 million at risk is pretty foolish.

[Vermont Green]

Adrian Wojnarowski: Free agent F Darius Bazley has agreed to a one-year deal with the Brooklyn Nets, Klutch Sports CEO Rich Paul and agent Brandon Cavanaugh tell ESPN. – via Twitter wojespn

A decent depth piece for them.  Probably no better than Brissett.

[Who]

Paul Reed

Reed said he's preparing the upcoming season by diversifying his game. He said he's been taking "like 700" jumpers a day to add range to his shot. Reed is hopeful of being able to play at the 4 more often this season.

"We did it last season against the Bucks. Very limited, but I feel like we didn’t look bad. We didn’t look bad," Reed said. "It was hard to score on us. We were getting a lot of rebounds. I think we can mess up a lot of teams with that combination."

[Who]

(1) Suns signed Bol Bol.

(2) They also traded Cam Payne to San Antonio for a 2nd round pick. Good addition for San Antonio. Payne may be able to win the starting job there. He is a good player.

Payne is a significant loss for PHO's bench. Another sign that they are moving away from playing a PG next season. Beal and D Booker likely to start in the backcourt with E Gordon their lead backup guard. Prior to signing E Gordon, it had sounded like Cam Payne was a big part of their plans (role player wise) and would be used to give them a more traditional look in the backcourt while one of Booker or Beal rests. And sometimes play all 3 together. So a big move away from their early offseason ideas.

(3) The Suns also made a similar first round pick swap with Orlando for 3 2nd round draft picks. The pick swap is 2026. Good gamble for Orlando. Their team is on the up. They are a solid 30+ win team now and should grow into a .500 or better team in the next 2 years. PHO have significant injury risks in Durant and Beal. Who knows what their record may be in 2026. That is an unneccsarily risky deal by PHO.

[Birdman]

(1) Suns signed Bol Bol.

(2) They also traded Cam Payne to San Antonio for a 2nd round pick. Good addition for San Antonio. Payne may be able to win the starting job there. He is a good player.

Payne is a significant loss for PHO's bench. Another sign that they are moving away from playing a PG next season. Beal and D Booker likely to start in the backcourt with E Gordon their lead backup guard. Prior to signing E Gordon, it had sounded like Cam Payne was a big part of their plans (role player wise) and would be used to give them a more traditional look in the backcourt while one of Booker or Beal rests. And sometimes play all 3 together. So a big move away from their early offseason ideas.

(3) The Suns also made a similar first round pick swap with Orlando for 3 2nd round draft picks. The pick swap is 2026. Good gamble for Orlando. Their team is on the up. They are a solid 30+ win team now and should grow into a .500 or better team in the next 2 years. PHO have significant injury risks in Durant and Beal. Who knows what their record may be in 2026. That is an unneccsarily risky deal by PHO.

Suns had the best offseason..getting Beal & adding nice pieces to their bench like Eubanks & Gordon

[Who]

Spurs roster

G: Tre Jones, Cam Payne, Devonte Graham
G: D Vassell, D McDermott, J Champagnie
F: K Johnson, Cedi Osman, M Branham
F: J Sochan, R Bullock, C Sissoko
C: V Wembanyama, Z Collins, Khem Birch

Looks like their roster is set now. 3 deep across the board. Interesting that there are 3 vets blocking the path to playing time for the bench SG, SF, PF positions wingman positions. All 6 of the bench SG, SF, PF guys are all natural SFs playing out of position at SG or PF.

Pop has always used SG and SF positions similarly so not much difference there for him. I do wonder if Pop hadn't of had Manu Ginobili would he have struggled more to get enough secondary ball-handling and playmaking from the wings. He doesn't seem to value it enough. Same with his time with Team USA as well.

The starting guards are a real weak point for this team. Probably the worst backcourt in the league. Or at least the least talented backcourt in the league. Some young team might have more flawed less win-now starting guards but with higher upside.

J Sochan showed good defensive talent as a rook but his offensive game was dreadful. They have no real alternative to him at PF. The other players are all natural SFs. They could go big with Z Collins but that isn't a great option either. He is a C not a PF.

Overall, quite a weak team especially their starting unit but with good depth which should carry them to a few extra victories. May be more of a 25-30 win team than a 20-25 win team. If Wemby can have a big rookie season, they should be a 30+ win team given their quality bench.

Keldon Johnson is the only proven quality starter on the team.

[Birdman]

Spurs got a bright future

[Neurotic Guy]

Spurs got a bright future

Could be really good just in time for our pick swap in 2028.

[Who]

Suns Roster

G: B Beal, E Gordon
G: D Booker, Damion Lee
F: K Bates-Diop, J Okogie, C Metu
F: K Durant, Y Watanabe
C: D Ayton, D Eubanks, Bol Bol

See that guard rotation. Strange mix. No PG. All SGs. Beal, Booker and E Gordon do have enough ball-handling to make it work should they decide to continue this way. I would like to see them add a real backup PG though and move Damion Lee to 3rd string SG. Damion Lee is an excellent 3rd stringer. He deserves to be a rotation regular somewhere.

The forward mix is interesting too. The two defensive forwards in Bates-Diop and Okogie and two offensive forwards in Durant and Watanabe.

I wonder if this Bol Bol addition is a sign that they are not interested in bringing back Biyombo or do they intend to sign a 3rd string center and use Bol Bol as a 3rd string PF.

[footey]

Spurs roster

G: Tre Jones, Cam Payne, Devonte Graham
G: D Vassell, D McDermott, J Champagnie
F: K Johnson, Cedi Osman, M Branham
F: J Sochan, R Bullock, C Sissoko
C: V Wembanyama, Z Collins, Khem Birch

Looks like their roster is set now. 3 deep across the board. Interesting that there are 3 vets blocking the path to playing time for the bench SG, SF, PF positions wingman positions. All 6 of the bench SG, SF, PF guys are all natural SFs playing out of position at SG or PF.

Pop has always used SG and SF positions similarly so not much difference there for him. I do wonder if Pop hadn't of had Manu Ginobili would he have struggled more to get enough secondary ball-handling and playmaking from the wings. He doesn't seem to value it enough. Same with his time with Team USA as well.

The starting guards are a real weak point for this team. Probably the worst backcourt in the league. Or at least the least talented backcourt in the league. Some young team might have more flawed less win-now starting guards but with higher upside.

J Sochan showed good defensive talent as a rook but his offensive game was dreadful. They have no real alternative to him at PF. The other players are all natural SFs. They could go big with Z Collins but that isn't a great option either. He is a C not a PF.

Overall, quite a weak team especially their starting unit but with good depth which should carry them to a few extra victories. May be more of a 25-30 win team than a 20-25 win team. If Wemby can have a big rookie season, they should be a 30+ win team given their quality bench.

Keldon Johnson is the only proven quality starter on the team.

Have read that Collins will start and Sochan will come in as 6th man.  Victor lacks the physicality to guard most centers.

[hpantazo]

(1) Suns signed Bol Bol.

(2) They also traded Cam Payne to San Antonio for a 2nd round pick. Good addition for San Antonio. Payne may be able to win the starting job there. He is a good player.

Payne is a significant loss for PHO's bench. Another sign that they are moving away from playing a PG next season. Beal and D Booker likely to start in the backcourt with E Gordon their lead backup guard. Prior to signing E Gordon, it had sounded like Cam Payne was a big part of their plans (role player wise) and would be used to give them a more traditional look in the backcourt while one of Booker or Beal rests. And sometimes play all 3 together. So a big move away from their early offseason ideas.

(3) The Suns also made a similar first round pick swap with Orlando for 3 2nd round draft picks. The pick swap is 2026. Good gamble for Orlando. Their team is on the up. They are a solid 30+ win team now and should grow into a .500 or better team in the next 2 years. PHO have significant injury risks in Durant and Beal. Who knows what their record may be in 2026. That is an unneccsarily risky deal by PHO.

Suns had the best offseason..getting Beal & adding nice pieces to their bench like Eubanks & Gordon

I think it's a mistake for them going without a true PG on the roster. With a large group of scorers who need the ball in their hands and no true facilitator, this will come back to haunt them.

[Who]

Spurs roster

G: Tre Jones, Cam Payne, Devonte Graham
G: D Vassell, D McDermott, J Champagnie
F: K Johnson, Cedi Osman, M Branham
F: J Sochan, R Bullock, C Sissoko
C: V Wembanyama, Z Collins, Khem Birch

Looks like their roster is set now. 3 deep across the board. Interesting that there are 3 vets blocking the path to playing time for the bench SG, SF, PF positions wingman positions. All 6 of the bench SG, SF, PF guys are all natural SFs playing out of position at SG or PF.

Pop has always used SG and SF positions similarly so not much difference there for him. I do wonder if Pop hadn't of had Manu Ginobili would he have struggled more to get enough secondary ball-handling and playmaking from the wings. He doesn't seem to value it enough. Same with his time with Team USA as well.

The starting guards are a real weak point for this team. Probably the worst backcourt in the league. Or at least the least talented backcourt in the league. Some young team might have more flawed less win-now starting guards but with higher upside.

J Sochan showed good defensive talent as a rook but his offensive game was dreadful. They have no real alternative to him at PF. The other players are all natural SFs. They could go big with Z Collins but that isn't a great option either. He is a C not a PF.

Overall, quite a weak team especially their starting unit but with good depth which should carry them to a few extra victories. May be more of a 25-30 win team than a 20-25 win team. If Wemby can have a big rookie season, they should be a 30+ win team given their quality bench.

Keldon Johnson is the only proven quality starter on the team.

Have read that Collins will start and Sochan will come in as 6th man.  Victor lacks the physicality to guard most centers.

Ah okay, that makes sense.

Of course Wemby also lacks the footspeed to defend PFs. Wherever you put him on defense, he is going to be a liability. Both on and off the ball. His off ball positioning and footwork is terrible.

[Who]

I am reading an article in the Toronto Sun that is proposing a starting lineup of:

G: Scottie Barnes
G: Gradey Dick
F: OG Anunoby
F: Pascal Siakam
C: Jakob Poeltl

The writer is talking about how Ujiri is doubling down on his 6-9 project his summer with the draft pick of Gradey Dick and the signing of Jalen McDaniels.

He (the writer) suggests the Raps should look to the future and move Gary Trent Jr as a bench player in favour of Gradey Dick and start Scottie Barnes at PG instead of Schroder. Go with a super versatile defensive big lineup. Plan for the future. Start developing with a full commitment to the 6-9 project by starting S Barnes and G Dick at guard this year.


This would give TOR a bench of

G: Schroder
G: Trent Jr
F: J McDaniels
F: O Porter, Thad Young, C Boucher
C: P Achiuwa, C Koloko


I don't see that starting lineup working. Scottie Barnes was already struggling next to Poeltl after his acquisition midseason last year. Barnes isn't a good enough shooter to play next to a non-spacing big man. An interior-only big man.

There is a clear lack of dribble penetration and playmaking. TOR already suffered from a lack of open shots last year with VanVleet at PG. This would be even harder with this lineup. Two non-shooters in S Barnes and Poeltl. A rookie shooter in Gradey Dick who is the only possible high level shooter in the lineup and he is only a rookie (who struggled in Summer League). OG Anunoby is a good shooter on lower volume but has seen his efficiency drop off as he tries to take on a larger offensive role. We saw the same thing with Siakam. Not enough shooting. Not enough ball-handling. Not enough playmaking. Not quick quickness. Slow and easy to defend on the perimeter.


It reminds me a bit of the Chicago Bulls in 1996 or 1997 when tried to play MJ and Pippen as their guards with Toni Kukoc at SF. I believe Ron Harper was injured or something like that. So they tried to stay big and keep their defense going. The defense was fine but the team struggled on offense. They lost their quickness advantage. MJ wanted to post. Kukoc wanted to post. Pippen wanted to post. There wasn't room for all of them to exploit their size advantage. The ball movement got worse. It was stodgy. The team worked much better with a lesser talented small guard (like Steve Kerr or Randy Brown) who let MJ and Pip play their natural positions.

Now those guys were far more talented and well rounded basketball players than these dudes in Toronto so I would expect it to be far worse for the Raps if they did indeed try this plan.


Scottie Barnes has a huge amount of work to do to improve his jump-shooting. It is a major factor in holding back the team right now. He needs to step up. Quite a few criticisms about his attitude and work ethic from last year which appearently were also around him during his time in college too. So not a new issue.

I'd love to see them trade S Barnes for Lillard. Lillard is exactly that guy that team needs to lead them. Siakam can become a #2 again. Anunoby, Trent Jr in supporting roles. Gradey Dick, Schoder, good bench forwards. Poeltl doing the dirty work in the middle.