Celtics Off-Season News

[celticinorlando]

No get brogdan healthy because the bench really needs him to score

[Goldstar88]

Adrian Wojnarowski: Boston Celtics G Payton Pritchard will be part of the USA Select team that will practice and scrimmage against the Team USA roster at a Las Vegas training camp in August, sources tell ESPN. Team USA is preparing for the FIBA World Cup later this summer in the Philippines. – via Twitter wojespn


Good for Payton. Glad he’s getting that experience.

[Celtics2021]

Adrian Wojnarowski: Boston Celtics G Payton Pritchard will be part of the USA Select team that will practice and scrimmage against the Team USA roster at a Las Vegas training camp in August, sources tell ESPN. Team USA is preparing for the FIBA World Cup later this summer in the Philippines. – via Twitter wojespn


Good for Payton. Glad he’s getting that experience.

Very good for Payton.  Other names on that 12-person team include Cade Cunningham, Chet Holmgren, Jalen Green, and Keegan Murray, so he’s in pretty fine company.  USA basketball thinks more highly of him than many posters here, at least (myself included if I’m honest).

[gouki88]

Adrian Wojnarowski: Boston Celtics G Payton Pritchard will be part of the USA Select team that will practice and scrimmage against the Team USA roster at a Las Vegas training camp in August, sources tell ESPN. Team USA is preparing for the FIBA World Cup later this summer in the Philippines. – via Twitter wojespn


Good for Payton. Glad he’s getting that experience.

Very good for Payton.  Other names on that 12-person team include Cade Cunningham, Chet Holmgren, Jalen Green, and Keegan Murray, so he’s in pretty fine company.  USA basketball thinks more highly of him than many posters here, at least (myself included if I’m honest).

Pritchard also seems to love playing basketball, constantly. Always popping up in the offseason hooping a lot.

[cman88]

Pritchard IMO is the one guy I have no idea how he will perform next year. hes basically replacing white in the rotation. will he be good, will he be average, will he be bad?

[Neurotic Guy]

Pritchard IMO is the one guy I have no idea how he will perform next year. hes basically replacing white in the rotation. will he be good, will he be average, will he be bad?

He’s a weapon.  Looking forward to seeing how he does with regular rotation minutes.

[hwangjini_1]

i suspect he will be fine on offense, but hunted and over matched on defense. match ups will be key for him.

[Who]

i suspect he will be fine on offense, but hunted and over matched on defense. match ups will be key for him.

I am the opposite. I am more concerned about his offense than his defense. He is limited by his size on defense but he handles himself well considering that. He does about as well as other small guards his size. So I am happy enough with that. The issue for me is the same as it is for all small guards, can Pritchard bring enough offensively to counteract his defensive limtations which brings us back to his offense.

I have been disappointed in his offense thus far. He has always been able to shoot and I have utmost confidence in his shot. My concern is how limited his handles have been. How reluctant he is to drive in any shape. Just basic drive and kick actions. How passive he is. How much he stands around at the three point.

Okay, some small guards can still be effective while being a limited ball-handler and passer like Pritchard is. Eddie House is an excellent example of that. Difference was that House was a gunner who could get shots up quickly and often. A prolific jump-shooter. Pritchard is not that. He is a lower volume shooter. He is not comfortable or able to get off a higher volume of shot attempts. So that limits him as a scorer.

So he is a well below average scorer, near the bottom level of ball-handlers and passers at PG with his only above average skill (or even average skill) being his spot up shooting.

In order to be successful in the NBA as a small guard with defensive limitations, Pritchard has to be able to be more of a positive factor on offense to make up for his weak D to be a net positive overall. That means either (1) developing his handles, driving capabilities and playmaking, or, (2) learning how to get his shot off more often so that he can get more value out his outside shooting.

Without either one of those two things changing, Pritchard will be limited to being a below average backup PG to 3rd string PG. That is why I was and still am happy to move on from him this summer. He hasn't shown enough to invest in him further.

Funnily enough, Pritchard's defense is his 2nd best quality after his outside shooting. His D rates better to his peers (PGs) than his ball-handling, driving, playmaking or shot creation do. Also his rebounding rates better compared to his peers than those other skills do. That is not good.

[boscel33]

https://www.celticsblog.com/2023/7/21/23802978/report-boston-celtics-payton-pritchard-to-play-for-usa-select-team

Wonder if Pritchard balls with the Select Team, might not open the door for a trade.  We're short on PG's so I'd hope he helps the C's, but with Brad you never know.

[hwangjini_1]

i suspect he will be fine on offense, but hunted and over matched on defense. match ups will be key for him.

I am the opposite. I am more concerned about his offense than his defense. He is limited by his size on defense but he handles himself well considering that. He does about as well as other small guards his size. So I am happy enough with that. The issue for me is the same as it is for all small guards, can Pritchard bring enough offensively to counteract his defensive limtations which brings us back to his offense.

I have been disappointed in his offense thus far. He has always been able to shoot and I have utmost confidence in his shot. My concern is how limited his handles have been. How reluctant he is to drive in any shape. Just basic drive and kick actions. How passive he is. How much he stands around at the three point.

Okay, some small guards can still be effective while being a limited ball-handler and passer like Pritchard is. Eddie House is an excellent example of that. Difference was that House was a gunner who could get shots up quickly and often. A prolific jump-shooter. Pritchard is not that. He is a lower volume shooter. He is not comfortable or able to get off a higher volume of shot attempts. So that limits him as a scorer.

So he is a well below average scorer, near the bottom level of ball-handlers and passers at PG with his only above average skill (or even average skill) being his spot up shooting.

In order to be successful in the NBA as a small guard with defensive limitations, Pritchard has to be able to be more of a positive factor on offense to make up for his weak D to be a net positive overall. That means either (1) developing his handles, driving capabilities and playmaking, or, (2) learning how to get his shot off more often so that he can get more value out his outside shooting.

Without either one of those two things changing, Pritchard will be limited to being a below average backup PG to 3rd string PG. That is why I was and still am happy to move on from him this summer. He hasn't shown enough to invest in him further.

Funnily enough, Pritchard's defense is his 2nd best quality after his outside shooting. His D rates better to his peers (PGs) than his ball-handling, driving, playmaking or shot creation do. Also his rebounding rates better compared to his peers than those other skills do. That is not good.

you make very good points and do so articulately. thank you.

i agree with most of your points and learned as well. my disagreement (which is mild) is over the defense part. aside from pritchard's physical limitations, time and time again i saw him simply miss his defensive assignments.

i am speaking to mental lapses. as one example, while guarding his man in the corner (non-ball handler) he simply turns his back to the man and watches the ball instead. his man moves into an open position without pritchard knowing it, catches a pass, and makes an open 3.

pritchard was lost. and he did the same thing the next time down the floor. the coach sat him down after that one.

so, i disagree with you not in a "you be wrong" way, but in a "it's even worse than that" way. 

[W8ting2McHale]

I’m wondering if someone could give a little clarification on Payton’s alleged “poor handles.”

I understand the criticism with JB, when he decides to split a double or go 1 on 3 and gets stripped, but Payton was supposed to be a good ball handler coming out of Oregon. I remember seeing it watching highlights after the draft. I remember in camp that year him showing off his dribbling skills. He was not Kyrie, but he looked to have good handles.

To be sure I wasn’t misremembering I looked at his draft profile and  his shooting, passing and ball handling were all above average. His size, speed and drawing fouls were listed as weaknesses.

A quote from NBAdraft:

Dynamic scorer both on the drive and from beyond the arc … Can create his own shot with above average ball-handling, a fluid shooting motion and limitless range

Another weakness was “sometimes careless with the ball.” I didn’t see Payton play much last year, and when I did I saw a few things he gets legitimately criticized for, like not getting to the rim and not probing the defense hard enough before passing. I didn’t see loose handles.

Rewatching some college highlights he often settles for a floater rather than going through contact to the rim. That seems like something that hasn’t changed? A weakness was not drawing enough fouls and that still seems to be the case. He was fine creating space using single and double cross over dribbles and dribbling through traffic while being double teamed. He just wasn’t forcing his way to the rim if there wasn’t a clear path and settled for floaters or passing the ball.

Is that what people are actually complaining about when they see/say “poor handles?” Sometimes careless with the ball and not continuing to the basket, because otherwise I’m not getting the criticism?

[Vermont Green]

I’m wondering if someone could give a little clarification on Payton’s alleged “poor handles.”

I understand the criticism with JB, when he decides to split a double or go 1 on 3 and gets stripped, but Payton was supposed to be a good ball handler coming out of Oregon. I remember seeing it watching highlights after the draft. I remember in camp that year him showing off his dribbling skills. He was not Kyrie, but he looked to have good handles.

To be sure I wasn’t misremembering I looked at his draft profile and  his shooting, passing and ball handling were all above average. His size, speed and drawing fouls were listed as weaknesses.

A quote from NBAdraft:

Dynamic scorer both on the drive and from beyond the arc … Can create his own shot with above average ball-handling, a fluid shooting motion and limitless range

Another weakness was “sometimes careless with the ball.” I didn’t see Payton play much last year, and when I did I saw a few things he gets legitimately criticized for, like not getting to the rim and not probing the defense hard enough before passing. I didn’t see loose handles.

Rewatching some college highlights he often settles for a floater rather than going through contact to the rim. That seems like something that hasn’t changed? A weakness was not drawing enough fouls and that still seems to be the case. He was fine creating space using single and double cross over dribbles and dribbling through traffic while being double teamed. He just wasn’t forcing his way to the rim if there wasn’t a clear path and settled for floaters or passing the ball.

Is that what people are actually complaining about when they see/say “poor handles?” Sometimes careless with the ball and not continuing to the basket, because otherwise I’m not getting the criticism?

I think this is a case of conflating ball handling and decision making.  Pritchard can dribble the ball fine.  And he is fast when he dribbles.  What happens is he dribbles himself into trouble and doesn't have the talent or size to deal with it, which leads to bad things.  This also true of Brown, although Brown's handle (dribbling) is not nearly as good as Pritchard's.

[liam]

I’m wondering if someone could give a little clarification on Payton’s alleged “poor handles.”

I understand the criticism with JB, when he decides to split a double or go 1 on 3 and gets stripped, but Payton was supposed to be a good ball handler coming out of Oregon. I remember seeing it watching highlights after the draft. I remember in camp that year him showing off his dribbling skills. He was not Kyrie, but he looked to have good handles.

To be sure I wasn’t misremembering I looked at his draft profile and  his shooting, passing and ball handling were all above average. His size, speed and drawing fouls were listed as weaknesses.

A quote from NBAdraft:

Dynamic scorer both on the drive and from beyond the arc … Can create his own shot with above average ball-handling, a fluid shooting motion and limitless range

Another weakness was “sometimes careless with the ball.” I didn’t see Payton play much last year, and when I did I saw a few things he gets legitimately criticized for, like not getting to the rim and not probing the defense hard enough before passing. I didn’t see loose handles.

Rewatching some college highlights he often settles for a floater rather than going through contact to the rim. That seems like something that hasn’t changed? A weakness was not drawing enough fouls and that still seems to be the case. He was fine creating space using single and double cross over dribbles and dribbling through traffic while being double teamed. He just wasn’t forcing his way to the rim if there wasn’t a clear path and settled for floaters or passing the ball.

Is that what people are actually complaining about when they see/say “poor handles?” Sometimes careless with the ball and not continuing to the basket, because otherwise I’m not getting the criticism?

I think this is a case of conflating ball handling and decision making.  Pritchard can dribble the ball fine.  And he is fast when he dribbles.  What happens is he dribbles himself into trouble and doesn't have the talent or size to deal with it, which leads to bad things.  This also true of Brown, although Brown's handle (dribbling) is not nearly as good as Pritchard's.

Pritchard has an elite handle and shot but needs many more reps. He just hasn't played enough to get to the point where he doesn't have to think as much. I hope they play him more earlier in the season and don't try and toss him into the deep end in the eastern conference finals.

[W8ting2McHale]

I’m wondering if someone could give a little clarification on Payton’s alleged “poor handles.”

I understand the criticism with JB, when he decides to split a double or go 1 on 3 and gets stripped, but Payton was supposed to be a good ball handler coming out of Oregon. I remember seeing it watching highlights after the draft. I remember in camp that year him showing off his dribbling skills. He was not Kyrie, but he looked to have good handles.

To be sure I wasn’t misremembering I looked at his draft profile and  his shooting, passing and ball handling were all above average. His size, speed and drawing fouls were listed as weaknesses.

A quote from NBAdraft:

Dynamic scorer both on the drive and from beyond the arc … Can create his own shot with above average ball-handling, a fluid shooting motion and limitless range

Another weakness was “sometimes careless with the ball.” I didn’t see Payton play much last year, and when I did I saw a few things he gets legitimately criticized for, like not getting to the rim and not probing the defense hard enough before passing. I didn’t see loose handles.

Rewatching some college highlights he often settles for a floater rather than going through contact to the rim. That seems like something that hasn’t changed? A weakness was not drawing enough fouls and that still seems to be the case. He was fine creating space using single and double cross over dribbles and dribbling through traffic while being double teamed. He just wasn’t forcing his way to the rim if there wasn’t a clear path and settled for floaters or passing the ball.

Is that what people are actually complaining about when they see/say “poor handles?” Sometimes careless with the ball and not continuing to the basket, because otherwise I’m not getting the criticism?

I think this is a case of conflating ball handling and decision making.  Pritchard can dribble the ball fine.  And he is fast when he dribbles.  What happens is he dribbles himself into trouble and doesn't have the talent or size to deal with it, which leads to bad things.  This also true of Brown, although Brown's handle (dribbling) is not nearly as good as Pritchard's.

Pritchard has an elite handle and shot but needs many more reps. He just hasn't played enough to get to the point where he doesn't have to think as much. I hope they play him more earlier in the season and don't try and toss him into the deep end in the eastern conference finals.

TP - this is more in line with what I’m seeing. Thanks.

[Neurotic Guy]

This isn’t actual news but listened to Gasper & Murray (I think) on my lunch drive today - they were talking about Brogdon being out 6-8 months (perhaps the season) with his arm injury. It was something one of them had “heard”.   I don’t believe it but thought I’d post to see if this is being floated more legitimately elsewhere.