Fire Joe! ... or critique Joe ... or defend Joe... or worry about Joe's coaching

[Kernewek]

Brad Stevens to double up as coach and GM?

NO ….he is not a strong voice , he is too soft and a yes man

Ime was supposedly a strong voice last year and the C’s scraped to get by the Bucks (without Middleton) in 7. Scraped to get by the Heat in 7. Udoka was severely out coached by Spolestra that whole series. It was a miracle that the C’s even made it to the Finals. Came down to Jimmy Butler hitting the front rim on a buzzer beater 3pt shot that would have ended the season for Boston. Then the Celtics totally collapsed in the Finals. Only won two games and were eliminated at home.

Correct.

[angryguy77]

Brad Stevens to double up as coach and GM?

NO ….he is not a strong voice , he is too soft and a yes man

Ime was supposedly a strong voice last year and the C’s scraped to get by the Bucks (without Middleton) in 7. Scraped to get by the Heat in 7. Udoka was severely out coached by Spolestra that whole series. It was a miracle that the C’s even made it to the Finals. Came down to Jimmy Butler hitting the front rim on a buzzer beater 3pt shot that would have ended the season for Boston. Then the Celtics totally collapsed in the Finals. Only won two games and were eliminated at home.

Yet they made it to the finals with an injured Rob, a tired Tatum and a first year coach.
Joe's team has health, and better talent but is playing worse.

Ime's team took down the defending champs and the 1 seed. Joe's team struggled against ATL and is on the verge to losing to a team that was once the dog we kicked around.

Go ahead though and please explain further how Ime's achievements are comparable to Joe's.

[Roy H.]

Brad Stevens to double up as coach and GM?

NO ….he is not a strong voice , he is too soft and a yes man

Ime was supposedly a strong voice last year and the C’s scraped to get by the Bucks (without Middleton) in 7. Scraped to get by the Heat in 7. Udoka was severely out coached by Spolestra that whole series. It was a miracle that the C’s even made it to the Finals. Came down to Jimmy Butler hitting the front rim on a buzzer beater 3pt shot that would have ended the season for Boston. Then the Celtics totally collapsed in the Finals. Only won two games and were eliminated at home.

Sounds better than losing in the second round (with a team that added the 6MOY).  Ime was also dealing with a severely hobbled Timelord.

How many games did we lose in last year's playoffs based upon Ime's actions or inactions?

[jpotter33]

Brad Stevens to double up as coach and GM?

NO ….he is not a strong voice , he is too soft and a yes man

Ime was supposedly a strong voice last year and the C’s scraped to get by the Bucks (without Middleton) in 7. Scraped to get by the Heat in 7. Udoka was severely out coached by Spolestra that whole series. It was a miracle that the C’s even made it to the Finals. Came down to Jimmy Butler hitting the front rim on a buzzer beater 3pt shot that would have ended the season for Boston. Then the Celtics totally collapsed in the Finals. Only won two games and were eliminated at home.

This is such revisionist history BS.

Ime wasn’t perfect, but he was far and away more experienced and competent than Joe. He absolutely had full control of the locker room, and he had his guys playing the right way with energy and focus every single night. We just were simply not talented enough offensively.

This year, we are supremely more talented with Brogdon and then another year of development from the Jays and White actually feeling comfortable, but Joe does not hold these guys accountable and we regularly come out with these lackluster efforts. And that’s not even considering the complete reversal of our identity abd gameplan from last year that looks like it’s going to cost us a title.

This revisionist history non-sense trying to equivocate last year to this year is just more Joe apologism. No basis in reality, particularly when we played substantially tougher competition that you’re for some reason trying to downplay.

[Kernewek]

Brad Stevens to double up as coach and GM?

NO ….he is not a strong voice , he is too soft and a yes man

Ime was supposedly a strong voice last year and the C’s scraped to get by the Bucks (without Middleton) in 7. Scraped to get by the Heat in 7. Udoka was severely out coached by Spolestra that whole series. It was a miracle that the C’s even made it to the Finals. Came down to Jimmy Butler hitting the front rim on a buzzer beater 3pt shot that would have ended the season for Boston. Then the Celtics totally collapsed in the Finals. Only won two games and were eliminated at home.

This is such revisionist history BS.

Ime wasn’t perfect, but he was far and away more experienced and competent than Joe. He absolutely had full control of the locker room, and he had his guys playing the right way with energy and focus every single night. We just were simply not talented enough offensively.

This year, we are supremely more talented with Brogdon and then another year of development from the Jays and White actually feeling comfortable, but Joe does not hold these guys accountable and we regularly come out with these lackluster efforts. And that’s not even considering the complete reversal of our identity abd gameplan from last year that looks like it’s going to cost us a title.

This revisionist history non-sense trying to equivocate last year to this year is just more Joe apologism. No basis in reality, particularly when we played substantially tougher competition that you’re for some reason trying to downplay.

The bolded is equally revisionist. The Fire Ime thread and general tenor of the blog for the first half of last season prove that. The reality is that fans will find things to complain about when their team loses. It's normal.

[Roy H.]

Brad Stevens to double up as coach and GM?

NO ….he is not a strong voice , he is too soft and a yes man

Ime was supposedly a strong voice last year and the C’s scraped to get by the Bucks (without Middleton) in 7. Scraped to get by the Heat in 7. Udoka was severely out coached by Spolestra that whole series. It was a miracle that the C’s even made it to the Finals. Came down to Jimmy Butler hitting the front rim on a buzzer beater 3pt shot that would have ended the season for Boston. Then the Celtics totally collapsed in the Finals. Only won two games and were eliminated at home.

This is such revisionist history BS.

Ime wasn’t perfect, but he was far and away more experienced and competent than Joe. He absolutely had full control of the locker room, and he had his guys playing the right way with energy and focus every single night. We just were simply not talented enough offensively.

This year, we are supremely more talented with Brogdon and then another year of development from the Jays and White actually feeling comfortable, but Joe does not hold these guys accountable and we regularly come out with these lackluster efforts. And that’s not even considering the complete reversal of our identity abd gameplan from last year that looks like it’s going to cost us a title.

This revisionist history non-sense trying to equivocate last year to this year is just more Joe apologism. No basis in reality, particularly when we played substantially tougher competition that you’re for some reason trying to downplay.

The bolded is equally revisionist. The Fire Ime thread and general tenor of the blog for the first half of last season prove that. The reality is that fans will find things to complain about when their team loses. It's normal.

That's the thing, though:  Ime built the team into a cohesive unit.  It took time, and strength, but it worked.  Ime couldn't solve all of the team's bad habits, particularly turnovers, but he had the team playing at an extremely high level for several months.  The team got better as the season went along, and it was really only Timelord's injury (and turnovers) that held it back.

With Joe, it's the opposite.  He took an elite team that added Brogdon and currently has a healthy Timelord, and he made it worse.  And the team hasn't gotten better as the season progressed, it's become worse and less reliable.

Are you impressed by what you see from Joe?

[Kernewek]

Not particularly, but I'm on the record as being pretty ambivalent about coaches in general. He's not my favourite coach, but I don't think we've gone from Kerr to Mark Jackson or anything. I attribute our season more to Timelord starting the season unhealthy, Horford being old, and Smart coasting a bit for the first time in his career.

[angryguy77]

Not particularly, but I'm on the record as being pretty ambivalent about coaches in general. He's not my favourite coach, but I don't think we've gone from Kerr to Mark Jackson or anything. I attribute our season more to Timelord starting the season unhealthy, Horford being old, and Smart coasting a bit for the first time in his career.

In this game, coaching doesn't always matter, but for some teams it absolutely matters. It depends on who you have on the court. This group needs a coach, they have shown without a strong leadership that they fall apart.

I don't think the Heat are getting to the ECF with a lesser coach. While coaching may not matter as much when you're talking about the MJ bulls or Kobe/Shaq lakers, it does matter to teams with a core like ours. They need that helicopter parent, otherwise they're going to eat the crayons if left alone.

[boscel33]

If they lose in this round, I bet its fire everyone!

[Goldstar88]

Brad Stevens to double up as coach and GM?

NO ….he is not a strong voice , he is too soft and a yes man

Ime was supposedly a strong voice last year and the C’s scraped to get by the Bucks (without Middleton) in 7. Scraped to get by the Heat in 7. Udoka was severely out coached by Spolestra that whole series. It was a miracle that the C’s even made it to the Finals. Came down to Jimmy Butler hitting the front rim on a buzzer beater 3pt shot that would have ended the season for Boston. Then the Celtics totally collapsed in the Finals. Only won two games and were eliminated at home.

Yet they made it to the finals with an injured Rob, a tired Tatum and a first year coach.
Joe's team has health, and better talent but is playing worse.

Ime's team took down the defending champs and the 1 seed. Joe's team struggled against ATL and is on the verge to losing to a team that was once the dog we kicked around.

Go ahead though and please explain further how Ime's achievements are comparable to Joe's.

You don’t think guys are tired and/or injured now? The Bucks were missing their second best player and it still took the C’s7 games to advance. Let’s not make it sound like Ime had them steamrolling teams in the postseason. He most certainly did not.

[Donoghus]

I saw someone compare Joe to Grady Little a couple of weeks ago on Twitter. 

It's certainly stuck with me the more we're seeing in these playoffs.

[Roy H.]

I saw someone compare Joe to Grady Little a couple of weeks ago on Twitter. 

It's certainly stuck with me the more we're seeing in these playoffs.

Hmm...  Interesting comparison.  Very likeable guy, good enough for the regular season, didn't have a clue how to handle the big moments and actively hurt the team in certain scenarios.

[Roy H.]

Prior to Game 5 of a tied Eastern Conference semifinals against the Philadelphia 76ers, Celtics head coach Joe Mazzulla said, "It's not much different than the regular season," and his team played like it.

https://sports.yahoo.com/nba-playoffs-sixers-push-celtics-to-brink-of-elimination-and-an-offseason-of-inquiry-070127709.html

Somebody needs to start a Joe quote board, of all the things he says that are just nonsense.

[angryguy77]

Brad Stevens to double up as coach and GM?

NO ….he is not a strong voice , he is too soft and a yes man

Ime was supposedly a strong voice last year and the C’s scraped to get by the Bucks (without Middleton) in 7. Scraped to get by the Heat in 7. Udoka was severely out coached by Spolestra that whole series. It was a miracle that the C’s even made it to the Finals. Came down to Jimmy Butler hitting the front rim on a buzzer beater 3pt shot that would have ended the season for Boston. Then the Celtics totally collapsed in the Finals. Only won two games and were eliminated at home.

Yet they made it to the finals with an injured Rob, a tired Tatum and a first year coach.
Joe's team has health, and better talent but is playing worse.

Ime's team took down the defending champs and the 1 seed. Joe's team struggled against ATL and is on the verge to losing to a team that was once the dog we kicked around.

Go ahead though and please explain further how Ime's achievements are comparable to Joe's.

You don’t think guys are tired and/or injured now? The Bucks were missing their second best player and it still took the C’s7 games to advance. Let’s not make it sound like Ime had them steamrolling teams in the postseason. He most certainly did not.

the level of competition last year was higher than it is now. Even missing Middleton, the Bucks were better than the 2023 hawks and so were the nets.

Sure some guys are tired, but we're healthier now than we were back then, how can you even try to compare the two?

No one said Ime had them steamrolling teams, but they were advancing against quality teams which it doesn't look like we will see a repeat of this year.

[Who]

Agree on 2 points with Goldstar88.

(1) The competition is greater now than last year. This Philly team is better than last year's Bucks who were without Khris Middleton. Philly are also way better than the Heat in the ECF.

(2) Last year's squad messed around in the playoffs and lost silly games just like this year's team have. This is a continuation of the same problem we had under Ime Udoka.

That Bucks series never should have gone 7 games. They were without Middleton and not as good as Boston. But even worse was that Miami series. That should have been over in 4 or 5 games but Boston's lack of professionalism and killer instinct allowed Miami to hang around until game 7 and even almost steal it right at the death.

This messing around with Atlanta in the first round and Philly here in the 2nd round is a continuation of the same problems we had under Udoka.