Is Grant a goner? (Yes: Traded to DAL for second rounders)

[JBcat]

Multiple second round picks, for a productive 22nd pick??? Let’s not forget the Celtics had multiple teams interested in Grant Williams too.

What a joke, Spurs got a better deal than us lol

The TPE was what we wanted, as well as to get under the second apron next year.

TPE will never be used

Agreed.  We can't use it in a sign-and-trade.  We can't use it on draft night or next off-season. 

What $6 million players are out there that we're going to trade for?

Just spitballing but maybe an intriguing young player still on his rookie contract where we attach some of our excess draft picks to get.

Generally teams don't trade those guys.  Maybe we could land a guy like Saddiq Bey, but he'd only last one season before leaving in free agency because we're not going to sign anybody to MLE or higher contracts.

I would take that even for just 1 year. Each passing year becomes more precious in the Tatum and Brown era.

[Roy H.]

So originally Woj had reported:

Adrian Wojnarowski: Boston gets the more favorable of New Orleans-Chicago seconds in 2024, and 2025 via Toronto and 2028 via Miami, sources said. The Spurs land Reggie Bullock and a 2030 Dallas pick swap.
1 hour ago

I think he deleted that tweet, and updated it to say that we got two picks.  Himmelsbach said:

According to a league source, the Celtics will get two second-round picks and a 2025 second-round pick swap in the Grant Williams deal.

So, maybe...

2024 hetter of NOP/CHI #2
2025 second round pick swap with TOR (via SAS)
2028 MIA #2

?

[Muzzy66]

I've never been a Grant fan but [dang] this bench is weak and the cs are 1 Tatum injury away from the play in tourney.  No depth.  I wonder if we see  brogdon deal for 2 bench pieces.  The cs now have plenty of minutes for a vet but the good ones are gone.

There are more domino's to fall. Right now there's no bench and we can't handle the ball very well.

To be fair we do have Brogdon, Horford, Pritchard and Brisset which is a pretty good start for a second unit.

Come playoff time the rotations usually shrink to 7 or 8, so if we can add another two productive bench players using the MLE and TPE (to help cover for Brodon's injury) then we probably aren't in a bad place at all.

Multiple second round picks, for a productive 22nd pick??? Let’s not forget the Celtics had multiple teams interested in Grant Williams too.

What a joke, Spurs got a better deal than us lol

The TPE was what we wanted, as well as to get under the second apron next year.

TPE will never be used

Agreed.  We can't use it in a sign-and-trade.  We can't use it on draft night or next off-season. 

What $6 million players are out there that we're going to trade for?

Well, Westbrook signed for like $4M/year!

Could we do a sneaky and sign Gallinari back again? He's expected to be bought out right?

To be fair there may be some older but still useful veterans out there (Derrick Rose types) who are willing to sign for $6M a year in a last ditch attempt to win a title in a supporting role.  Lebron has basically made a career of drawing in guys like this to fill out his rosters. 

With Brogdon and Horford already strong bench options we really only need 2 or 3 additional useful guys to really fill out the roster.  If we can use the MLE to bring in one guy and the $6M TPE to bring in another, then we could probably draw in a vet minimum guy to fill in the third spot.

[Roy H.]

I've never been a Grant fan but [dang] this bench is weak and the cs are 1 Tatum injury away from the play in tourney.  No depth.  I wonder if we see  brogdon deal for 2 bench pieces.  The cs now have plenty of minutes for a vet but the good ones are gone.

There are more domino's to fall. Right now there's no bench and we can't handle the ball very well.

To be fair we do have Brogdon, Horford, Pritchard and Brisset which id a pretty good start for a second unit.  If we can add another 2 or 3 productive  guys off the bench then we're doing pretty well I think.

Multiple second round picks, for a productive 22nd pick??? Let’s not forget the Celtics had multiple teams interested in Grant Williams too.

What a joke, Spurs got a better deal than us lol

The TPE was what we wanted, as well as to get under the second apron next year.

TPE will never be used

Agreed.  We can't use it in a sign-and-trade.  We can't use it on draft night or next off-season. 

What $6 million players are out there that we're going to trade for?

Well, Westbrook signed for like $4M/year!

Could we do a sneaky and sign Gallinari back again? He's expected to be bought out right?

To be fair there may be some older but still useful veterans out there (Derrick Rose types) who are willing to sign for $6M a year in a last ditch attempt to win a title in a supporting role.  Lebron has basically made a career of drawing in guys like this to fill out his rosters. 

With Brogdon and Horford already strong bench options we really only need 2 or 3 additional useful guys to really fill out the roster.  If we can use the MLE to bring in one guy and the $6M TPE to bring in another, then we could probably draw in a vet minimum guy to fill in the third spot.

We can't use both the TPE and the MLE unless we cut another another significant chunk of salary (like dumping Pritchard).  And, I'm unsure about the TPE, but I don't think it can be used to sign free agents, only to trade for players already under contract (since we can't bring in guys via S&T).

[Atzar]

I wonder how much Joe had to do with this?  I mean grant was missing in action for a LONG time there in the 2nd 1/2 of the season.
Is there a part of this that is Joe doesn't like Grant?

I see this sentiment around here pretty often. 

Grant was MIA because he sucked.  This wasn't a demotion because of some personal vendetta.  He was struggling hard for an extended period of time, so he lost his job.

He bounced back some in the playoffs so he got more run, but there was a very good reason Grant was glued to the bench for significant parts of the second half of the season.  Mazzulla deserves flak for plenty of the decisions he made, but Grant's play time should not be on the list IMO. 

[Muzzy66]

I've never been a Grant fan but [dang] this bench is weak and the cs are 1 Tatum injury away from the play in tourney.  No depth.  I wonder if we see  brogdon deal for 2 bench pieces.  The cs now have plenty of minutes for a vet but the good ones are gone.

There are more domino's to fall. Right now there's no bench and we can't handle the ball very well.

To be fair we do have Brogdon, Horford, Pritchard and Brisset which id a pretty good start for a second unit.  If we can add another 2 or 3 productive  guys off the bench then we're doing pretty well I think.

Multiple second round picks, for a productive 22nd pick??? Let’s not forget the Celtics had multiple teams interested in Grant Williams too.

What a joke, Spurs got a better deal than us lol

The TPE was what we wanted, as well as to get under the second apron next year.

TPE will never be used

Agreed.  We can't use it in a sign-and-trade.  We can't use it on draft night or next off-season. 

What $6 million players are out there that we're going to trade for?

Well, Westbrook signed for like $4M/year!

Could we do a sneaky and sign Gallinari back again? He's expected to be bought out right?

To be fair there may be some older but still useful veterans out there (Derrick Rose types) who are willing to sign for $6M a year in a last ditch attempt to win a title in a supporting role.  Lebron has basically made a career of drawing in guys like this to fill out his rosters. 

With Brogdon and Horford already strong bench options we really only need 2 or 3 additional useful guys to really fill out the roster.  If we can use the MLE to bring in one guy and the $6M TPE to bring in another, then we could probably draw in a vet minimum guy to fill in the third spot.

We can't use both the TPE and the MLE unless we cut another another significant chunk of salary (like dumping Pritchard).  And, I'm unsure about the TPE, but I don't think it can be used to sign free agents, only to trade for players already under contract (since we can't bring in guys via S&T).

I was thinking of bringing a vet in via trade (from a team who is trying to cut salary) using the TPE and then using the MLE to sign somebody, but you're probably right...bringing someone in to that TPE would probably result in us losing the MLE. 

I guess it gives us a bit of flexibility, as we can now use either the TPE or MLE to bring in one useful vet.  Any others I suppose will need to be Vet min deals.

[ozgod]

Multiple second round picks, for a productive 22nd pick??? Let’s not forget the Celtics had multiple teams interested in Grant Williams too.

What a joke, Spurs got a better deal than us lol

The TPE was what we wanted, as well as to get under the second apron next year.

TPE will never be used

Agreed.  We can't use it in a sign-and-trade.  We can't use it on draft night or next off-season. 

What $6 million players are out there that we're going to trade for?

There's a few players that can fit in that, either vets or young players...Ricky Rubio, Patty Mills...even old friend Gallo 

Though I doubt it will be used this offseason...more likely it's going to be a just another tool to provide Brad with flexibility to fill out what the team's needs may be come midseason. He can either sign someone outright with the MLE or trade for someone with the TPE, since (and I could be wrong here) the TPE is already part of our cap, using it shouldn't push us past the apron. If there aren't any needs that are apparent at that point I agree it won't be used for the sake of it.

[Ed Monix]

Honestly, these decisions are pushing me to not post on here because I know I am going to just complain and become toxically negative.

Wyc, Stevens & Mazzulla for me are a slow and painful death for this iteration of the Celtics.

What could go wrong with a cheap owner, an inexperienced general manger and head coach? All while having multiple All-NBA players in their prime…what could go wrong?

[scaryjerry]

Dumb.
How they handled grant all of last season and now this. Super dumb.

[ozgod]

Honestly, these decisions are pushing me to not post on here because I know I am going to just complain and become toxically negative.

Wyc, Stevens & Mazzulla for me are a slow and painful death for this iteration of the Celtics.

The way I comfort myself is I assume they and their army of quant geeks, scouts and analysts probably know more than me sitting on my couch about their master plan 

(hopefully there is a master plan  )

If their plan doesn't work out or is an epic fail this season then I will complain and become toxically negative 

If it's any consolation, there's a lot of teams shedding salary because of the second apron...it's not just a matter of spend, spend, spend like the Dubs did, spending what, nearly $360m in taxes over the last 2 years, now they want to hamspring overspending teams' ability to build their roster as well.

[celticinorlando]

I don't mind moving on from Grant. I do not like the fact they brought nothing back in for him but cheap second round picks.

If the thinking is Brissett and Walsh are going to fill the void I am not sure that is going to work. Neither can shoot. One is a rookie the other a fringe NBA player that is pretty terrible within 10 feet of the rim.

Just feels like ownership and brad are just too cautious when they have a real chance to win a title. But I don't think this team as constructed now can win one with this bench.

[scaryjerry]

I wonder how much Joe had to do with this?  I mean grant was missing in action for a LONG time there in the 2nd 1/2 of the season.
Is there a part of this that is Joe doesn't like Grant?

I see this sentiment around here pretty often. 

Grant was MIA because he sucked.  This wasn't a demotion because of some personal vendetta.  He was struggling hard for an extended period of time, so he lost his job.

He bounced back some in the playoffs so he got more run, but there was a very good reason Grant was glued to the bench for significant parts of the second half of the season.  Mazzulla deserves flak for plenty of the decisions he made, but Grant's play time should not be on the list IMO.

Eh, If that’s the case and grant lost his minutes solely because he sucked and was out performed by others then those others should’ve still gotten the playoff minutes over him. It was mishandled.

[ozgod]

I don't mind moving on from Grant. I do not like the fact they brought nothing back in for him but cheap second round picks.

If the thinking is Brissett and Walsh are going to fill the void I am not sure that is going to work. Neither can shoot. One is a rookie the other a fringe NBA player that is pretty terrible within 10 feet of the rim.

Probably the logic is that KP is going to take the bulk of whatever minutes GWill had. I'd be surprised if Brissett and Walsh got anywhere near as many minutes as GWill did this season, even when they were reduced after Timelord came back from injury.

Which by the way is the joker in the deck - injury. If any of the three (KP, Timelord, Al) get injured for any length of time then it obviously throws a wrench into their plans. But that's when having that $7m TPE, or the MLE, could come in handy to find a bargain basement guy - there's a few 4s in that $5-$7m range

[jpotter33]

I wonder how much Joe had to do with this?  I mean grant was missing in action for a LONG time there in the 2nd 1/2 of the season.
Is there a part of this that is Joe doesn't like Grant?

I see this sentiment around here pretty often. 

Grant was MIA because he sucked.  This wasn't a demotion because of some personal vendetta.  He was struggling hard for an extended period of time, so he lost his job.

He bounced back some in the playoffs so he got more run, but there was a very good reason Grant was glued to the bench for significant parts of the second half of the season.  Mazzulla deserves flak for plenty of the decisions he made, but Grant's play time should not be on the list IMO.

Eh, If that’s the case and grant lost his minutes solely because he sucked and was out performed by others then those others should’ve still gotten the playoff minutes over him. It was mishandled.

Yep. And to no one’s surprise, when Grant actually got minutes in the playoffs he played very well.

It never made sense how Joe played him after the ASB. I chock it up to how green Joe was and him overdoing the shortening of the rotation to prep for the playoffs.

[tonydelk]

I wonder how much Joe had to do with this?  I mean grant was missing in action for a LONG time there in the 2nd 1/2 of the season.
Is there a part of this that is Joe doesn't like Grant?

I see this sentiment around here pretty often. 

Grant was MIA because he sucked.  This wasn't a demotion because of some personal vendetta.  He was struggling hard for an extended period of time, so he lost his job.

He bounced back some in the playoffs so he got more run, but there was a very good reason Grant was glued to the bench for significant parts of the second half of the season.  Mazzulla deserves flak for plenty of the decisions he made, but Grant's play time should not be on the list IMO.

Eh, If that’s the case and grant lost his minutes solely because he sucked and was out performed by others then those others should’ve still gotten the playoff minutes over him. It was mishandled.

It's more likely Grant was ineffective because of his injury.  His D was decent but he was always a tweener.  I was never a big fan of Grant.  Whines to much to the refs, doesn't rebound and gets abused by lengthy players.  The issue is losing Grant, Gallo, Muscala, Smart and bringing in KP hurts the depth.  What happens when Brogdon, KP, Rob, Al are all out resting or hurt.  Tatum, Brown and Dwhite are going to be exhausted by the end of the season.  A guy like Richardson and Beverly would both have helped tremendously.  The minutes weren't there and now with all of these guys gone there are plenty of backup minutes available.