Author Topic: Am I the only one wanting more?  (Read 17909 times)

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Re: Am I the only one wanting more?
« Reply #60 on: July 03, 2022, 10:32:00 PM »

Offline gouki88

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Would Luke Kennard be a better fit for this team than Derrick White now that we have Malcolm Brogdon on board?

I like the idea of having a shooter like Kennard. I'm not sure a big defensive combo like D White has as much value now that we have a big combo guard like Brogdon who can maintain our size advantage and defensive structure at PG while Smart rests.
I don't think so, given I expect we will see less burn for Al and Timelord to keep them prime for the playoffs. Not to mention the injury history of Brogdon and Smart (and even Brown and White).

I also don't think Brad nor Ime think there's ever too many versatile defenders. Especially if they keep the ball moving / drive inside / shoot the three (White can do the former two consistently, Brogdon all).

That being said, I would still want Kennard (given I'm not the one paying the tax). I would probably move away from the two-big starting lineup, given our lack of a backup big at the moment.

Smart / White / Pritchard
Brogdon / Kennard / Pritchard
Brown / G Williams
Tatum / Gallinari
R Williams / Horford

Hauser as the 12th man.

Even without Kennard I love that as a 10 man rotation.
'23 Historical Draft: Orlando Magic.

PG: Terry Porter (90-91) / Steve Francis (00-01)
SG: Joe Dumars (92-93) / Jeff Hornacek (91-92) / Jerry Stackhouse (00-01)
SF: Brandon Roy (08-09) / Walter Davis (78-79)
PF: Terry Cummings (84-85) / Paul Millsap (15-16)
C: Chris Webber (00-01) / Ralph Sampson (83-84) / Andrew Bogut (09-10)

Re: Am I the only one wanting more?
« Reply #61 on: July 04, 2022, 02:03:44 AM »

Offline #1P4P

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There has to be a point where we trust that the roster is complete and I’m there. We were two wins away from the title, have a young, durable core, and are betting favorites to win the title.

With 9 players already scheduled for regular minutes plus Pritchard and Hauser, this team doesn’t need a player with a big salary on the bench in case of emergency. Udoka struggled distributing minutes in blowouts, I wouldn’t put him in a situation where he has to find minutes for 10-12 players.

There are several open roster spots that should be filled with the right vet minimum players for Championship enthusiasm, practice, spot minutes, and garbage time. I trust Brad to do just that.

I don't Ime will have any problems just playing who he wants to play. Teams win championships.  The more players that can play the better. I hope they all stay ready. It's a long season and you never know what you'll need.

Kanter and Hernangomez were disgruntled at the their roles and standing on the team. They had small enough deals that Brad could offload them as soon as the trade deadline. Teams that win Championships have great chemistry unless they have an overwhelming top talent advantage.

We just added two solid veterans that will play their share of minutes. We are 9 deep without counting Pritchard and Hauser, who are ready to play quality NBA minutes themselves. The rest of the roster should know that their role consists of Championship enthusiasm, practice, spot minutes, and garbage time.

I don’t want a repeat of 2018-19 chemistry issues. We were 2 wins away from the title after defeating the 3 other best teams in the East, young, durable core players, and are the favorites to win the East, wanting more than that is just being unreasonably fearful of what could happen.

Re: Am I the only one wanting more?
« Reply #62 on: July 04, 2022, 02:47:44 AM »

Offline gouki88

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There has to be a point where we trust that the roster is complete and I’m there. We were two wins away from the title, have a young, durable core, and are betting favorites to win the title.

With 9 players already scheduled for regular minutes plus Pritchard and Hauser, this team doesn’t need a player with a big salary on the bench in case of emergency. Udoka struggled distributing minutes in blowouts, I wouldn’t put him in a situation where he has to find minutes for 10-12 players.

There are several open roster spots that should be filled with the right vet minimum players for Championship enthusiasm, practice, spot minutes, and garbage time. I trust Brad to do just that.

I don't Ime will have any problems just playing who he wants to play. Teams win championships.  The more players that can play the better. I hope they all stay ready. It's a long season and you never know what you'll need.

Kanter and Hernangomez were disgruntled at the their roles and standing on the team. They had small enough deals that Brad could offload them as soon as the trade deadline. Teams that win Championships have great chemistry unless they have an overwhelming top talent advantage.

We just added two solid veterans that will play their share of minutes. We are 9 deep without counting Pritchard and Hauser, who are ready to play quality NBA minutes themselves. The rest of the roster should know that their role consists of Championship enthusiasm, practice, spot minutes, and garbage time.

I don’t want a repeat of 2018-19 chemistry issues. We were 2 wins away from the title after defeating the 3 other best teams in the East, young, durable core players, and are the favorites to win the East, wanting more than that is just being unreasonably fearful of what could happen.
Chemistry is an interesting point to raise, and definitely one that is worth consideration. It's why I am so against the potential addition of someone like Marcus Morris or Jae Crowder. Guys who have previously been issues in the locker-room, and who believe they deserve more of a share of the ball than they would get here. They also don't really fill a need, in my opinion.

The only issue I have with our roster construction is, assuming Ime perseveres with the dual-big starting lineup, we do not really have a backup 5 unless we have Grant or Gallo play there. I don't think either is ideal as the 2nd string centre (fine as 3rd string in small ball lineups). However, if we start Brogdon/White, then that is solved by Al/Rob going to the bench.
'23 Historical Draft: Orlando Magic.

PG: Terry Porter (90-91) / Steve Francis (00-01)
SG: Joe Dumars (92-93) / Jeff Hornacek (91-92) / Jerry Stackhouse (00-01)
SF: Brandon Roy (08-09) / Walter Davis (78-79)
PF: Terry Cummings (84-85) / Paul Millsap (15-16)
C: Chris Webber (00-01) / Ralph Sampson (83-84) / Andrew Bogut (09-10)

Re: Am I the only one wanting more?
« Reply #63 on: July 04, 2022, 07:24:08 AM »

Offline Surferdad

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There has to be a point where we trust that the roster is complete and I’m there. We were two wins away from the title, have a young, durable core, and are betting favorites to win the title.

With 9 players already scheduled for regular minutes plus Pritchard and Hauser, this team doesn’t need a player with a big salary on the bench in case of emergency. Udoka struggled distributing minutes in blowouts, I wouldn’t put him in a situation where he has to find minutes for 10-12 players.

There are several open roster spots that should be filled with the right vet minimum players for Championship enthusiasm, practice, spot minutes, and garbage time. I trust Brad to do just that.

I don't Ime will have any problems just playing who he wants to play. Teams win championships.  The more players that can play the better. I hope they all stay ready. It's a long season and you never know what you'll need.

Kanter and Hernangomez were disgruntled at the their roles and standing on the team. They had small enough deals that Brad could offload them as soon as the trade deadline. Teams that win Championships have great chemistry unless they have an overwhelming top talent advantage.

We just added two solid veterans that will play their share of minutes. We are 9 deep without counting Pritchard and Hauser, who are ready to play quality NBA minutes themselves. The rest of the roster should know that their role consists of Championship enthusiasm, practice, spot minutes, and garbage time.

I don’t want a repeat of 2018-19 chemistry issues. We were 2 wins away from the title after defeating the 3 other best teams in the East, young, durable core players, and are the favorites to win the East, wanting more than that is just being unreasonably fearful of what could happen.
Chemistry is an interesting point to raise, and definitely one that is worth consideration. It's why I am so against the potential addition of someone like Marcus Morris or Jae Crowder. Guys who have previously been issues in the locker-room, and who believe they deserve more of a share of the ball than they would get here. They also don't really fill a need, in my opinion.

The only issue I have with our roster construction is, assuming Ime perseveres with the dual-big starting lineup, we do not really have a backup 5 unless we have Grant or Gallo play there. I don't think either is ideal as the 2nd string centre (fine as 3rd string in small ball lineups). However, if we start Brogdon/White, then that is solved by Al/Rob going to the bench.
I'm more confident that Brad adds a 2nd-3rd string center than a wing.  Keeping the same defensive strategy and size advantage seems like the priority.  Adding Brogdon (6'5") and Gallinari (6'10") gives enough flexibility to hide the backup SF "hole", and you could argue a hole doesn't really exist with so many switchable players.

Re: Am I the only one wanting more?
« Reply #64 on: July 04, 2022, 09:25:34 AM »

Offline Silas

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What's happening with Bryant?  Last I read he was looking at the Cs and Lakers.  If healthy, he would be a good backup for Rob.
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Re: Am I the only one wanting more?
« Reply #65 on: July 04, 2022, 09:34:02 AM »

Offline dannyboy35

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   I can’t express how little I care about billionaires and their money.  Obviously the Celtics are very close so if it’s worth winning the title paying a severe tax I hope they do it. I’m not gonna complain up and down if they don’t spend much more but I certainly won’t have any love for them.
   They wouldn’t pay Posey which could have been the reason not winning it in 2009 if KG DIDN’T go down. I was pretty blown away they took that risk when they did.

Re: Am I the only one wanting more?
« Reply #66 on: July 04, 2022, 11:32:59 AM »

Offline liam

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   I can’t express how little I care about billionaires and their money.  Obviously the Celtics are very close so if it’s worth winning the title paying a severe tax I hope they do it. I’m not gonna complain up and down if they don’t spend much more but I certainly won’t have any love for them.
   They wouldn’t pay Posey which could have been the reason not winning it in 2009 if KG DIDN’T go down. I was pretty blown away they took that risk when they did.

Yeah, The Warriors are signing as many players as they can get.

Re: Am I the only one wanting more?
« Reply #67 on: July 04, 2022, 11:41:17 AM »

Online Roy H.

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   I can’t express how little I care about billionaires and their money.  Obviously the Celtics are very close so if it’s worth winning the title paying a severe tax I hope they do it. I’m not gonna complain up and down if they don’t spend much more but I certainly won’t have any love for them.
   They wouldn’t pay Posey which could have been the reason not winning it in 2009 if KG DIDN’T go down. I was pretty blown away they took that risk when they did.

Yeah, The Warriors are signing as many players as they can get.

This is sort of where I fall, as well.  Our ownership group is obscenely rich, particularly Pags.  It’s essentially about bragging rights at this point.  Use the TPE and truly go for it, at least this season.  Next year spending can dip a little with Horford’s money coming off the books.

But, that said, historically our ownership hasn’t spent big.  The commitment to Brogdon was expensive, and might be the most we could have reasonably expected.  I know that I’m pleasantly surprised.


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Re: Am I the only one wanting more?
« Reply #68 on: July 04, 2022, 01:46:12 PM »

Offline Moranis

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I don't think Boston needs a wing, per se, but if the right guy comes along sure.  They absolutely need a big guy though. 

This is the way I generally see the roster playing out

Playoff Rotation (tighter/more minutes)

PG - Smart 36, White 12
SG - Brown 24, Brogdon 24
SF - Tatum 34, Brown 14
PF - Horford 12, Grant 30, Tatum 6
C - Rob 30, Horford 18

Grant is the problem and that is a bigger issue in the regular season when the minutes are lessened.  Grant shouldn't be playing that many minutes and I don't want Tatum playing many more than 6 at PF.  There is also a huge issue if either Rob or Al goes down.  That rotation completely cuts Pritchard out and White doesn't play all that much.  Adding a wing just makes that worse.  Again you don't pass on talent, like a TJ Warren at a vet minimum contract, but the focus shouldn't be on a wing.

The team needs at least 1 big man and frankly probably 2.  Maybe one of them is Bryant, but he is so injury prone he makes Rob look like an ironman. Plus, he also isn't that good and can't play PF at all.

I'd take a look at Dwight Howard.  And I know he can't play PF, but I think he is the right kind of player for the team i.e. a guy that will rebound, block shots, and can handle a lob.  Team needs some toughness down low.  He is the right guy. 
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Re: Am I the only one wanting more?
« Reply #69 on: July 04, 2022, 01:57:57 PM »

Offline footey

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I don't think Boston needs a wing, per se, but if the right guy comes along sure.  They absolutely need a big guy though. 

This is the way I generally see the roster playing out

Playoff Rotation (tighter/more minutes)

PG - Smart 36, White 12
SG - Brown 24, Brogdon 24
SF - Tatum 34, Brown 14
PF - Horford 12, Grant 30, Tatum 6
C - Rob 30, Horford 18

Grant is the problem and that is a bigger issue in the regular season when the minutes are lessened.  Grant shouldn't be playing that many minutes and I don't want Tatum playing many more than 6 at PF.  There is also a huge issue if either Rob or Al goes down.  That rotation completely cuts Pritchard out and White doesn't play all that much.  Adding a wing just makes that worse.  Again you don't pass on talent, like a TJ Warren at a vet minimum contract, but the focus shouldn't be on a wing.

The team needs at least 1 big man and frankly probably 2.  Maybe one of them is Bryant, but he is so injury prone he makes Rob look like an ironman. Plus, he also isn't that good and can't play PF at all.

I'd take a look at Dwight Howard.  And I know he can't play PF, but I think he is the right kind of player for the team i.e. a guy that will rebound, block shots, and can handle a lob.  Team needs some toughness down low.  He is the right guy.

White at 12 minutes a game? That seems off. Closer to 20 I would think.

LMA better choice than Howard IMO as he can plan some 4 in addition to backing up at 5.


Re: Am I the only one wanting more?
« Reply #70 on: July 04, 2022, 03:11:13 PM »

Offline GreenBoomer

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Sign Howard. It'd be worth it to watch him bang with Draymond twice a year and potentially in the finals.

Re: Am I the only one wanting more?
« Reply #71 on: July 04, 2022, 03:14:28 PM »

Online Goldstar88

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I don't think Boston needs a wing, per se, but if the right guy comes along sure.  They absolutely need a big guy though. 

This is the way I generally see the roster playing out

Playoff Rotation (tighter/more minutes)

PG - Smart 36, White 12
SG - Brown 24, Brogdon 24
SF - Tatum 34, Brown 14
PF - Horford 12, Grant 30, Tatum 6
C - Rob 30, Horford 18

Grant is the problem and that is a bigger issue in the regular season when the minutes are lessened.  Grant shouldn't be playing that many minutes and I don't want Tatum playing many more than 6 at PF.  There is also a huge issue if either Rob or Al goes down.  That rotation completely cuts Pritchard out and White doesn't play all that much.  Adding a wing just makes that worse.  Again you don't pass on talent, like a TJ Warren at a vet minimum contract, but the focus shouldn't be on a wing.

The team needs at least 1 big man and frankly probably 2.  Maybe one of them is Bryant, but he is so injury prone he makes Rob look like an ironman. Plus, he also isn't that good and can't play PF at all.

I'd take a look at Dwight Howard.  And I know he can't play PF, but I think he is the right kind of player for the team i.e. a guy that will rebound, block shots, and can handle a lob.  Team needs some toughness down low.  He is the right guy.

Feel like JB and JT are going to get worn out playing that many minutes in the postseason.

PG: Smart(30) White(18)
SG: Brown(30), Brogdon(18)
SF: Tatum(30) Brogdon (9), Brown(6)
PF: Horford (20) Grant(22) Tatum(6)
C:  Timelord (32) Horford(10) Grant(6)
« Last Edit: July 04, 2022, 03:29:27 PM by Goldstar88 »
Quoting Nick from the now locked Ime thread:
Quote
At some point you have to blame the performance on the court on the players on the court. Every loss is not the coach's fault and every win isn't because of the players.

Re: Am I the only one wanting more?
« Reply #72 on: July 04, 2022, 03:17:31 PM »

Offline GreenBoomer

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Get TJ Warren. A bench of Brogdon,  Gallo, and Warren could definitely put points on the board.

Re: Am I the only one wanting more?
« Reply #73 on: July 04, 2022, 03:56:04 PM »

Offline ozgod

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There has to be a point where we trust that the roster is complete and I’m there. We were two wins away from the title, have a young, durable core, and are betting favorites to win the title.

With 9 players already scheduled for regular minutes plus Pritchard and Hauser, this team doesn’t need a player with a big salary on the bench in case of emergency. Udoka struggled distributing minutes in blowouts, I wouldn’t put him in a situation where he has to find minutes for 10-12 players.

There are several open roster spots that should be filled with the right vet minimum players for Championship enthusiasm, practice, spot minutes, and garbage time. I trust Brad to do just that.

I don't Ime will have any problems just playing who he wants to play. Teams win championships.  The more players that can play the better. I hope they all stay ready. It's a long season and you never know what you'll need.

Kanter and Hernangomez were disgruntled at the their roles and standing on the team. They had small enough deals that Brad could offload them as soon as the trade deadline. Teams that win Championships have great chemistry unless they have an overwhelming top talent advantage.

We just added two solid veterans that will play their share of minutes. We are 9 deep without counting Pritchard and Hauser, who are ready to play quality NBA minutes themselves. The rest of the roster should know that their role consists of Championship enthusiasm, practice, spot minutes, and garbage time.

I don’t want a repeat of 2018-19 chemistry issues. We were 2 wins away from the title after defeating the 3 other best teams in the East, young, durable core players, and are the favorites to win the East, wanting more than that is just being unreasonably fearful of what could happen.

I'm with you on this one, I mentioned it earlier in the thread. We all saw what happened in 2018 when we get talented players with expectations that are different to how the coach plans to use them. We had too many players who wanted a finite amount of minutes that were available, we had players putting their contract needs first, we had players who were unhappy which caused destabilization in the team.

Obviously everyone wants to play. But this is a team that now has clearly defined roles and a clearly defined rotation of 9 players (Jaylen, Jayson, Smartacus, Al, Timelord, White, GWill, Brodgon, Gallo). Then you have PP and Hauser who you're trying to develop. That's 11. That's more than what Ime ran with for most of this past season. Probably at least 2 of those 11's roles will shrink during playoff time (Gallo, Hauser and PP). It doesn't leave much room for others to take up minutes unless someone is injured or being load managed. So the fit has to be really important, and Ime and Brad need to make it crystal clear what roles these players will have. Anyone we sign needs to know exactly how they will be used, or not used. If they're going to sit on the pine and be a backup, make it clear to them. Don't lead them on.

Man management is an underrated part of managing a sports team but it's probably one of the most important things a coach needs to do. It's a balance between stacking the roster and making sure you have a balance between having too many generals and not enough privates. Brad was unable to do it effectively in 2018, maybe he didn't want to hurt everyone's feelings or maybe he was learning how to manage egos at that point - that was probably the most talented team he had managed. I think Ime will be more forthright with people at least. But for the roles we're envisaging, there's going to be a level of player that would be realistic for that role. The better players are not going to want to not be part of the rotation.
« Last Edit: July 04, 2022, 04:10:53 PM by ozgod »
Any odd typos are because I suck at typing on an iPhone :D


Re: Am I the only one wanting more?
« Reply #74 on: July 04, 2022, 03:59:57 PM »

Offline GreenBoomer

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Not getting by Milwaukee as is.