Russell Westbrooks fall

[mr. dee]

I always said that Westbrook is a problem even back with the trio of Harden and KD back in OKC. Presti made a fatal mistake of keeping him over Harden and Ibaka.

[Phantom255x]

Still think KD is a snake for his move to the Warriors. But he probably knew Westbrook was detrimental to winning. Even Harden seemed to realize that in both OKC and Houston lol.

The Lakers have a lot of issues and it's not just Westbrook, but boy a lot of the "off-the-court stuff" really is Westbrook tbh. And teams know it.

[SCeltic34]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=91TwgReFvAM

When an NBA Legend has abandoned your real name for an insulting one, you have indeed fallen.

[gouki88]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=91TwgReFvAM

When an NBA Legend has abandoned your real name for an insulting one, you have indeed fallen.

It just made me thought of the joy Larry Bird would have had tormenting Westbrook, given his sensitivity to the nickname.

[18isGREATERthan72]

I don't necessarily take joy in Westbrook "falling from grace."

I hope we can use him as a case study in the future though about how statistical dominance doesn't necessarily correlate to good basketball or winning.  I think he has been extremely overrated as a player because of the insane output he has produced.

He's led the league in scoring, but still as a guard, is left wide open from 3.  He gets rebounds for a guard, but gives up good defensive position to do so.  The one thing I feel like he does bring to the table is he used to create a LOT of shots for his teammates because of his top 1% aggressiveness and athletic ability. I never considered him a savant passer (a la Rondo) but that even though his passing was simple, it was effective.

[Moranis]

Russ is 33 years old and in year 14.  We've been spoiled by Lebron (and Durant to a lesser extent) that we forget most players are shells of themselves when they hit the mileage that Russ has.  In his absolute prime i.e. ages 27-29, Russ' on/off differential per 100 possessions was over 12 all 3 of those seasons.  That is super elite.  The simple reality is, Russ was always the best athlete on the floor and that athleticism is a large part of what made him so great.  He has clearly lost several steps athletically and he was never a skilled enough shooter to survive the loss of those steps.  This is what happens when guys that get by on superior athleticism, no longer have superior athleticism. 

Perhaps he will come to the same realization that Carmelo Anthony and Dwight Howard (among others) came to and embrace and adapt to a very specific role, because Russ is still an excellent rebounder and passer.  He could have a role if he humbled himself enough to take on that role and stopped shooting like he is still a #1 type player.  He isn't that, but he could provide a lot of the dirty work, run an offense, etc. if he actually wanted to.  I just don't think he has hit the point where that is what he wants to do (and he may never get there as some guys don't).

[Kernewek]

Gotta agree with Moranis here. In general I don't enjoy watching folks lose a step: although the fact that he is losing a step on the Lakers is ok insofar as it's great to see the Lakers fail.

I do think he's verging on underrated with regards to his career based on this season, and the folks that have had axes to grind with his play or his presentation have had plenty of opportunities to swing them so far.

I bet there's a riveting conversation about whether or not Westbrook, in sum, was 'detrimental to winning'. Personally, I would say it's very clearly incorrect. 

now, having said that, dude is clearly on the downswing of his career, so he needs to use this offseason (which will be very long, by the looks of things) to shore up things in his game he's been able to ignore for his whole career and learn to accept some criticism when he's playing badly - which he is.

[kraidstar]

Hilarious that Seattle/OKC drafted and had all three of Durant, Harden and Westbrook on the team for years and all three guys are considered some of the biggest, major league prima donna, dirt bags(using dirt because the other d word gets profanitied out)In the league today for various reasons. No wonder they couldn't keep that trio together.

I was wondering what'd caused the Green Words of Wrist-Slapping to appear.

Lol TP

[kraidstar]

Hilarious that Seattle/OKC drafted and had all three of Durant, Harden and Westbrook on the team for years and all three guys are considered some of the biggest, major league prima donna, dirt bags(using dirt because the other d word gets profanitized out)in the league today for various reasons. No wonder they couldn't keep that trio together.

Durant, Harden, Westbrook, Ibaka, Green, Jackson. That team was loaded with athletic freaks.

OKC's inability to win a title has to be one of the biggest failures in any sport. The only thing I can think of that comes close is maybe the Verlander-era Detroit Tigers. So many great players. In that infamous 2013 season they had Verlander, prime David Price, Max Scherzer, prime Anibal Sanchez, Rick Porcello, and Doug Fister. Porcello was the #5 starter on that roster lol.

The Marino Dolphins are another travesty. And maybe the Aaron Rodgers Packers with just 1 SB appearance. The Brees/Rivers Chargers had some loaded teams too but imploded spectacularly every year come playoff time. But for sheer wasted talent the Thunder might eclipse them all.

[Moranis]

Hilarious that Seattle/OKC drafted and had all three of Durant, Harden and Westbrook on the team for years and all three guys are considered some of the biggest, major league prima donna, dirt bags(using dirt because the other d word gets profanitized out)in the league today for various reasons. No wonder they couldn't keep that trio together.

Durant, Harden, Westbrook, Ibaka, Green, Jackson. That team was loaded with athletic freaks.

OKC's inability to win a title has to be one of the biggest failures in any sport. The only thing I can think of that comes close is maybe the Verlander-era Detroit Tigers. So many great players. In that infamous 2013 season they had Verlander, prime David Price, Max Scherzer, prime Anibal Sanchez, Rick Porcello, and Doug Fister. Porcello was the #5 starter on that roster lol.

The Marino Dolphins are another travesty. And maybe the Aaron Rodgers Packers with just 1 SB appearance. The Brees/Rivers Chargers had some loaded teams too but imploded spectacularly every year come playoff time. But for sheer wasted talent the Thunder might eclipse them all.

OKC got cheap.  They didn't want to give Harden the extra 4.5 million total that he wanted.  Just cheap.  had they kept Harden, he probably doesn't develop to the same peak, but they would have almost certainly would have won a title at some point. 

[Surferdad]

Hilarious that Seattle/OKC drafted and had all three of Durant, Harden and Westbrook on the team for years and all three guys are considered some of the biggest, major league prima donna, dirt bags(using dirt because the other d word gets profanitized out)in the league today for various reasons. No wonder they couldn't keep that trio together.

Durant, Harden, Westbrook, Ibaka, Green, Jackson. That team was loaded with athletic freaks.

OKC's inability to win a title has to be one of the biggest failures in any sport. The only thing I can think of that comes close is maybe the Verlander-era Detroit Tigers. So many great players. In that infamous 2013 season they had Verlander, prime David Price, Max Scherzer, prime Anibal Sanchez, Rick Porcello, and Doug Fister. Porcello was the #5 starter on that roster lol.

The Marino Dolphins are another travesty. And maybe the Aaron Rodgers Packers with just 1 SB appearance. The Brees/Rivers Chargers had some loaded teams too but imploded spectacularly every year come playoff time. But for sheer wasted talent the Thunder might eclipse them all.

There was a Knicks team when Isaiah Thomas was the GM that had a monster payroll and couldn't win.  Need to look that one up.

[greg683x]

Hilarious that Seattle/OKC drafted and had all three of Durant, Harden and Westbrook on the team for years and all three guys are considered some of the biggest, major league prima donna, dirt bags(using dirt because the other d word gets profanitized out)in the league today for various reasons. No wonder they couldn't keep that trio together.

Durant, Harden, Westbrook, Ibaka, Green, Jackson. That team was loaded with athletic freaks.

OKC's inability to win a title has to be one of the biggest failures in any sport. The only thing I can think of that comes close is maybe the Verlander-era Detroit Tigers. So many great players. In that infamous 2013 season they had Verlander, prime David Price, Max Scherzer, prime Anibal Sanchez, Rick Porcello, and Doug Fister. Porcello was the #5 starter on that roster lol.

The Marino Dolphins are another travesty. And maybe the Aaron Rodgers Packers with just 1 SB appearance. The Brees/Rivers Chargers had some loaded teams too but imploded spectacularly every year come playoff time. But for sheer wasted talent the Thunder might eclipse them all.

There was a Knicks team when Isaiah Thomas was the GM that had a monster payroll and couldn't win.  Need to look that one up.

I wouldn’t really say that falls into the same category as the OKC failure. 

Isaiah had stars on his team but a large part of his payroll if I remember correctly was him grossly overpaying mediocre players.  It’s kind of the opposite of OKCs failure right?  OKC couldn’t keep their elite core of players together bc they were being too tight financially, whereas Thomas and Knicks is more of a lesson of complete financial irresponsibility

[JSD]

It'll be funny when Westbrook randomly opts out to free the Lakers of his $50 Million cap hit next season.

[Kernewek]

Westbrook has apparently been playing pretty well by the numbers over the last few games, but the Lakers are still losing. I dunno how much we can blame him against the rest of the team (obviously he has fallen off since his prime).

[Moranis]

Westbrook might be out of the league soon unless he gets out of the denial he is quite obviously in.  His interview yesterday just smells of someone that has no idea what his role should be.