Celts get Derrick White for Richardson, Langford, #1, 2028 pick swap

[gouki88]

Should've shipped Smart instead

[slamtheking]

Is there any criticism of White that isn't centered on his shooting?

Is White had averaged 36% from 3 since the trade deadline and otherwise played exactly the same way, would there be any criticism of him at all?

It sucks that his shot hasn't been falling but the shots he's taking have been good and the way he's been playing otherwise has been excellent. I'm optimistic that his shot will turn around and maybe it already has. He's 5/13 against the Bucks which is good.

about White himself, I don't think so.

about what it cost to acquire White, plenty.

He's not a stiff but his acquisition essentially has to replace the production of Richardson, Romeo and Schroder.  Schroder wasn't in that specific deal but he was moved because the C's now had a ballhandler that could step in for what Schroder offered.  While he does offer that ballhandling aspect as well as good defense, he's not covering the scoring aspect sufficiently.

I would argue that Schroder was a net negative. I'd be interested to see Smart's stats (on an individual level) and team stats pre-and-post Schroder from this year. Although Schroder produced counting stats, I think for this particular team moving off him was addition by subtraction.

Also, if you’re including Schroder, don’t you also have to include Theis’ production, as well as Pritchard’s insertion into the rotation?

Theis is essentially replacing the bigs that were shipped out -- Freedom, etc....   

[Rosco917]

How many offensive rebounds did Celtics give up? They got beat by a team that simply fought harder. The Buck owned the offensive boards.

Smarts hero ball at the end…horrible.

[flybono]

White’s balls dropped tonight game 5

Very good trade Player is getting better

[droopdog7]

Have the White debate been put to bed?  Even with the shooting struggles, White can be effective.  That's what separates him from any of the guys we traded away (and a whole lot of NBA players).

[colincb]

Have the White debate been put to bed?  Even with the shooting struggles, White can be effective.  That's what separates him from any of the guys we traded away (and a whole lot of NBA players).

White moves the ball, he makes decisions quickly, and he never ISOs. He also seems to navigate his way through defenses better than the rest of our rotation players. Rather see him handling the ball than Smart and in the closing lineup instead of GW.

His advanced defensive stats are stellar and have been since his rookie year when he rode the bench.

[Neurotic Guy]

Have the White debate been put to bed?  Even with the shooting struggles, White can be effective.  That's what separates him from any of the guys we traded away (and a whole lot of NBA players).

Game 5 was a good game for White and Game 6 may have been his best as a Celtic.  Good D, rebounding, ball movement.  White was a catalyst in the win.  The debate should be put to rest - he was brought in to make the Cs better, and he has.

[liam]

I love when White drives that ball and either passes out, hits that floater, or gets fouled.

[ozgod]

I love when White drives that ball and either passes out, hits that floater, or gets fouled.

Ime loves it too. He's had White closing games since Timelord has been out.

The Celtics may have found something that really works against the Bucks in their three(ish)-guard lineup: Tatum, White, Jaylen Brown and Marcus Smart plus a big man. That group — which closed Friday’s game on the floor — stretches the Bucks out and keeps one good Antetokounmpo defender on the floor. Even if Antetokounmpo goes off (and he certainly did in Game 6), the additional spacing pays major dividends.

In the playoffs, those four players on the floor together with a big are outscoring opponents by more than 30 points per 100 possessions, after winning their minutes by 18.7 points per 100 possessions in the regular season (which was still a 100th percentile total).

“They’ve been good all year, honestly, with Derrick in the game,” Ime Udoka said after Game 6. “Got four guys that can create, space it out different, and are threats out there and they defend it a little bit differently. They got another guy to worry about other than spot up shooting, and just to get another guy that can initiate. They put their best defenders on certain guys and it frees up others to get loose, and Derrick was one of them that can get downhill and make the right play and initiate our offense with a little less pressure. So, love what he’s doing out there with that group.”

https://www.boston.com/sports/boston-celtics/2022/05/13/jayson-tatum-celtics-bucks-game-6/

[tonydelk]

Have the White debate been put to bed?  Even with the shooting struggles, White can be effective.  That's what separates him from any of the guys we traded away (and a whole lot of NBA players).

White moves the ball, he makes decisions quickly, and he never ISOs. He also seems to navigate his way through defenses better than the rest of our rotation players. Rather see him handling the ball than Smart and in the closing lineup instead of GW.

His advanced defensive stats are stellar and have been since his rookie year when he rode the bench.

This series is over if we didn't have White.  I'm not sure why the debate.  The only thing of Value the C's gave up is the swap that we don't know about.  Chances are the C's are still contending and the Spurs are not because we will have Prime JT and JB.  If that swap wasn't there then this deal would be in major favor of the C's.  I clamored for white and still love his fit with this team.  I'm still super excite about  the deal.

[pablohoney]

White is shooting 40% from 3 in this series.  He is +59 for the series.

We traded our #1 pick, Langford and JRich for White and his longer term contract that gives this team a more secure nucleus.  What are odds that Langford is a rotation player in NBA next year? <10%?  Probably.

What chance is the #25 pick in a very weak draft next year worth his first round salary?  <10%?  Probably.

What chance is there that San Antonio has a better team than the Celtics in 5 years?  <10%?  Most likely meaning pick swap never happens.  Even if it does we are likely talking about a slide of no more than 4-5 spots.

White’s biggest impact has been his implementation of the Popovic mentality.  His first game in Boston he shifted the style being played and the rest of team bought in almost immediately.  This remained true when the rest of the team flourished while White himself struggled with his shot.

Scroeder trade was a completely separate transaction so has nothing to do with evaluating White trade.  The removal of all the defensive dead weight on roster and replacement with guys who fit the scheme better like White and Theis helped this team immensely however.

[bogg]

The other thing I keep coming back to in regard to the White trade is that, to this day, I believe the decision to sit out the 2020 trade deadline cost Boston a Finals appearance. I wouldn't be surprised if Stevens feels the same way. Whether they win it all or Milwaukee wins the next two and the season's over, having White and Theis off the bench instead of Schroeder and Enes leaves the team better-positioned in a year when they have a plausible path to the Finals. I can live with that.

I don't disagree with this, but the trade off is really having White and Theis vs Schroder, Richardson, and Enes (and Romeo). I'm not sure if you just forgot about Richardson, but he has been the main topic in this debate.

I didn't want to throw Richardson under the bus because he was decent enough that I wouldn't mind him back, but White's just a more versatile all-around player. Boston's better off having consolidated the Schroeder/Richardson minutes into White.

[Goldstar88]

Starting to feel like White is incapable of having back to back good games. He looked good on Friday, thought he was turning the corner and then lays an absolute egg today.  Played 18 mins and had 3pts, 2reb, 1ast while shooting 1-10 from the field , 1-6 from 3pt. Why is he shooting so much? He also got torched by Holiday. Pritchard played 17 mins and had 14pts, 3ast, 5rebs while shooting 5-7 from the field and 4-6 from 3pt.

[gouki88]

Starting to feel like White is incapable of having back to back good games. He looked good on Friday, thought he was turning the corner and then lays an absolute egg today.  Played 18 mins and had 3pts, 2reb, 1ast while shooting 1-10 from the field , 1-6 from 3pt. Why is he shooting so much? He also got torched by Holiday. Pritchard played 17 mins and had 14pts, 3ast, 5rebs while shooting 5-7 from the field and 4-6 from 3pt.

Games 3-6 were all good from White.

[Goldstar88]

Starting to feel like White is incapable of having back to back good games. He looked good on Friday, thought he was turning the corner and then lays an absolute egg today.  Played 18 mins and had 3pts, 2reb, 1ast while shooting 1-10 from the field , 1-6 from 3pt. Why is he shooting so much? He also got torched by Holiday. Pritchard played 17 mins and had 14pts, 3ast, 5rebs while shooting 5-7 from the field and 4-6 from 3pt.

Games 3-6 were all good from White.

So playing 30mins and giving the C’s 9pts, 2ast, 5rebs while shooting 3-9 from the field and 1-5 from 3pt is a good game? Think we have very different definitions of what a good game is.

In the Bucks series, White played 25.6mpg and averaged 8pts, 3.7rebs, 2.6ast while shooting 39% from the field, 36% from 3pt, and 53% from the FT line. I thought his defense was good, not great. I’m hoping he looks better next year, but at this point I’m still on the fence about the trade.