Author Topic: NBA Season 2021-22  (Read 744322 times)

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Re: NBA Season 2021-22
« Reply #4950 on: May 05, 2022, 12:30:30 AM »

Offline celticsclay

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Moranis, your Mavs are getting beat up pretty good…

I kind of think he had to be trolling with the Brunson take at half. But yeah they have so much less talent than the suns. There was a reason Dallas had astronomical odds to win the west or title even after beating the last breaths of Utah. You need more than one 1.5 good players to win even if one is a top 3 players.

Re: NBA Season 2021-22
« Reply #4951 on: May 05, 2022, 12:40:28 AM »

Offline pokeKingCurtis

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That YouTube screencap of Cam Johnson falling over is amazing.

Celtics fans were pining for us to trade JB for Jimmy Butler, or Anthony Davis and calling Ainge cheap. Imagine ending up with Porzingas as the best player you ever play with if you're Luka Doncic man.

Re: NBA Season 2021-22
« Reply #4952 on: May 05, 2022, 12:48:32 AM »

Offline JSD

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Watching the Heat, Philly recap.

For real, Miami fans should feel personally ashamed for how empty that stadium was in the first half. Unbelievable. Looked like a summer league game

Re: NBA Season 2021-22
« Reply #4953 on: May 05, 2022, 05:56:46 AM »

Offline Kernewek

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Barkley was on Sirius XM and blamed Harden's quick and sudden demise in part on Mike D'Antoni.  Said his offense requires so much from the lead guy that it just takes years off their career.  Said we are seeing that with Harden and is why he felt Nash just fell off a cliff suddenly as well at the end.  Not sure I buy it, but it was something I had never thought about till Barkley said it.

Maybe my memory is deceiving me but didn’t Nash suffer a broken knee during his ill-fated run with the Lakers? Not sure that’s something you can blame on Dantoni
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Re: NBA Season 2021-22
« Reply #4954 on: May 05, 2022, 09:23:27 AM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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Watching the Heat, Philly recap.

For real, Miami fans should feel personally ashamed for how empty that stadium was in the first half. Unbelievable. Looked like a summer league game

If the fan base is anything like the Miami jerk that lives behind me part time , I can understand why , no show all mouth and no action.

Re: NBA Season 2021-22
« Reply #4955 on: May 05, 2022, 09:36:46 AM »

Online Roy H.

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Barkley was on Sirius XM and blamed Harden's quick and sudden demise in part on Mike D'Antoni.  Said his offense requires so much from the lead guy that it just takes years off their career.  Said we are seeing that with Harden and is why he felt Nash just fell off a cliff suddenly as well at the end.  Not sure I buy it, but it was something I had never thought about till Barkley said it.

I don't know.  If Harden was a fitness nut I might agree, but the guy has noticeably put on weight and doesn't work on his conditioning like he should. 



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Re: NBA Season 2021-22
« Reply #4956 on: May 05, 2022, 10:51:29 AM »

Offline GetLucky

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Barkley was on Sirius XM and blamed Harden's quick and sudden demise in part on Mike D'Antoni.  Said his offense requires so much from the lead guy that it just takes years off their career.  Said we are seeing that with Harden and is why he felt Nash just fell off a cliff suddenly as well at the end.  Not sure I buy it, but it was something I had never thought about till Barkley said it.

I don't know.  If Harden was a fitness nut I might agree, but the guy has noticeably put on weight and doesn't work on his conditioning like he should.

Agreed, Nash was 39 when he signed with the Lakers. Before then, up until age 38, he was still regarded as a pretty good to elite point guard. I remember how hyped up the media/Rondo got when he visited the Garden in 2011 with the Suns, two years before he retired. I think those injuries were just bad luck/age catching up, not necessarily premature at all.

Re: NBA Season 2021-22
« Reply #4957 on: May 05, 2022, 10:55:51 AM »

Offline Phantom255x

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Scott Foster will probably rescue the Mavericks soon  :laugh:
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Re: NBA Season 2021-22
« Reply #4958 on: May 05, 2022, 10:58:53 AM »

Offline Kernewek

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Barkley was on Sirius XM and blamed Harden's quick and sudden demise in part on Mike D'Antoni.  Said his offense requires so much from the lead guy that it just takes years off their career.  Said we are seeing that with Harden and is why he felt Nash just fell off a cliff suddenly as well at the end.  Not sure I buy it, but it was something I had never thought about till Barkley said it.

I don't know.  If Harden was a fitness nut I might agree, but the guy has noticeably put on weight and doesn't work on his conditioning like he should.

Agreed, Nash was 39 when he signed with the Lakers. Before then, up until age 38, he was still regarded as a pretty good to elite point guard. I remember how hyped up the media/Rondo got when he visited the Garden in 2011 with the Suns, two years before he retired. I think those injuries were just bad luck/age catching up, not necessarily premature at all.

As an aside, while I guess I 'knew' that Nash was 39 when he signed with the Lakers at the time, I'd definitely forgotten it in the interim. I'm going to assume Chuck has as well, because comparing the athleticism of a 39 year old with a 32 year old (the age Harden is now), even among world class athletes, is a little silly.
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Re: NBA Season 2021-22
« Reply #4959 on: May 05, 2022, 11:04:06 AM »

Offline Atzar

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Regarding Doncic here:  am I the only one who thinks he tries to do too much by himself?  He's a hell of a scorer and a very good facilitator.  But man, you have to trust your teammates with responsibilities.  Let them do things, let them be engaged.  There's a time for Doncic to take over and run the show.  That time isn't "all 48 minutes of the game."   

One of the things that I've harped on over the last couple of months is that making teammates better isn't just about putting more assists in the box score.  Not every roleplayer is meant to be turned into a catch-and-shoot statue on the perimeter, but that doesn't mean you can't help them maximize the skills they do have.  Imagine if the Warriors just stuck Draymond in the corner every possession while Curry dribbled the air out of the ball.  That would be a huge waste of Draymond's abilities, right?  I feel like one of the underdiscussed parts of our turnaround was that we started putting Smart and Horford and these other guys in positions to succeed, rather than trying to pigeonhole them into roles they aren't well-suited to.  Tatum is quietly turning into a f***ing problem off the ball, and that wreaks all kinds of havoc on defenses that even our lesser players are able to take advantage of.

Of course, the part that I'm leaving out is that Luka's best teammates are Jalen Brunson and Spencer Dinwiddie.  Perhaps he's perfectly willing to share responsibility and the other Mavs just aren't talented enough to deliver consistently enough, so he tries to do it himself.  It's hard to tell the difference from a distance.

Re: NBA Season 2021-22
« Reply #4960 on: May 05, 2022, 11:09:23 AM »

Online Moranis

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Moranis, your Mavs are getting beat up pretty good…

I kind of think he had to be trolling with the Brunson take at half. But yeah they have so much less talent than the suns. There was a reason Dallas had astronomical odds to win the west or title even after beating the last breaths of Utah. You need more than one 1.5 good players to win even if one is a top 3 players.
I was not.  Brunson averaged essentially 28 ppg with a TS% of 58.3 in the 1st round series.  In the 2 games in this series his TS% is 37.5 and he is averaging 11 ppg.  Dinwiddie is down from basically 15 to 10.  They need at least one of those guys to show up.  Kidd said it after the game i.e. Luka needs help.  Brunson in particular has been awful shooting the ball.  On the season, Brunson was 54.5 from 2 and 37.3 from 3.  In the 2 games he is 33.3 from 2 and 25.0 from 3.  He just isn't hitting his shots.  He also isn't defending well.  Luka is obviously not a good defender, but Brunson can, and should, be a lot better defensively than he has been. 

Going back to Dallas I'd expect Brunson to play a lot better.  If he doesn't, the Mavs are done, but if he just shoots better, the Mavs will be fine because the Suns can't stop Luka.  He just can't do it alone.
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Re: NBA Season 2021-22
« Reply #4961 on: May 05, 2022, 11:20:19 AM »

Online Vermont Green

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Barkley was on Sirius XM and blamed Harden's quick and sudden demise in part on Mike D'Antoni.  Said his offense requires so much from the lead guy that it just takes years off their career.  Said we are seeing that with Harden and is why he felt Nash just fell off a cliff suddenly as well at the end.  Not sure I buy it, but it was something I had never thought about till Barkley said it.

I don't know.  If Harden was a fitness nut I might agree, but the guy has noticeably put on weight and doesn't work on his conditioning like he should.

Agreed, Nash was 39 when he signed with the Lakers. Before then, up until age 38, he was still regarded as a pretty good to elite point guard. I remember how hyped up the media/Rondo got when he visited the Garden in 2011 with the Suns, two years before he retired. I think those injuries were just bad luck/age catching up, not necessarily premature at all.

As an aside, while I guess I 'knew' that Nash was 39 when he signed with the Lakers at the time, I'd definitely forgotten it in the interim. I'm going to assume Chuck has as well, because comparing the athleticism of a 39 year old with a 32 year old (the age Harden is now), even among world class athletes, is a little silly.

This is the big question on Harden.  I thought he still played at an elite star player level at the end of the 2020-21 season and playoffs.  But you have not seen that at all this season.  The big question is if Harden is done or if he can come back in shape and perhaps with a redefined game.  He will be 33 just by the start of next season.  I think he could get himself ready to play and be a star again if he wants to.  Hard to know but it doesn't seem like he should be completely spent, even if you consider the extra load he has carried through his career. 

For comparison, Harden at 32 has 942 Regular Season games and 145 playoff games.  Durant at 33 has 939 RS games and 155 PO games.  974 to 972, almost the exact number of games and Harden is almost exactly 1 year younger.  Harden should be motivated.  Paired with Embiid, he is in position to win a title.  Embiid, Harden, Harris is a legit big 3 (assuming Harden can get it back together).  That is what it comes down to for him, get in shape/healthy and make a run for a title.  If you don't, you are going to suffer an uncomfortable season in Philly.

Re: NBA Season 2021-22
« Reply #4962 on: May 05, 2022, 11:22:06 AM »

Offline Who

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Moranis, your Mavs are getting beat up pretty good…

I kind of think he had to be trolling with the Brunson take at half. But yeah they have so much less talent than the suns. There was a reason Dallas had astronomical odds to win the west or title even after beating the last breaths of Utah. You need more than one 1.5 good players to win even if one is a top 3 players.
I was not.  Brunson averaged essentially 28 ppg with a TS% of 58.3 in the 1st round series.  In the 2 games in this series his TS% is 37.5 and he is averaging 11 ppg.  Dinwiddie is down from basically 15 to 10.  They need at least one of those guys to show up.  Kidd said it after the game i.e. Luka needs help.  Brunson in particular has been awful shooting the ball.  On the season, Brunson was 54.5 from 2 and 37.3 from 3.  In the 2 games he is 33.3 from 2 and 25.0 from 3.  He just isn't hitting his shots.  He also isn't defending well.  Luka is obviously not a good defender, but Brunson can, and should, be a lot better defensively than he has been. 

Going back to Dallas I'd expect Brunson to play a lot better.  If he doesn't, the Mavs are done, but if he just shoots better, the Mavs will be fine because the Suns can't stop Luka.  He just can't do it alone.

When I look at Brunson, I see a below average but serviceable defender. He doesn't have enough quickness to handle top PGs and he is a small guard who can get punished on switches. I do not see a good defender there. I actually prefer Doncic as a defender because at 6-8 he is more switchable.

When I look at Dinwiddie's offense, I see a player who lacks shooting chops and makes up for it by being a well-rounded and creative shot-creator at middle of the pack efficiency. Brunson is similar to Dinwiddie in this respect but has a superior shot-selection and decision making profile which allows him to be an above average scorer efficiency wise despite his sketchy outside shot (reluctant outside shooter, passes up shots unless wide wide open, shows up in volume). This decision making & scoring variety usually allows him to more consistent but is absent at the moment.

Brunson's first round numbers were unsustainable (particularly his outside shooting). He is not that type of talent. He is a good 3rd/4th option on offense. Dinwiddie can handle more offensive responsibility than that (largely due to his superior size which allows him get off more shot attempts - not high efficiency shots but middle efficiency shots) but you don't really want Dinwiddie to because of his average efficiency and only allow him to do so when your team is really poor offensively.

The disappointing factor to me is Dallas' defense which was punching way above its weight from Jan 1st onwards has come back to reality.

Re: NBA Season 2021-22
« Reply #4963 on: May 05, 2022, 11:28:48 AM »

Online Moranis

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Moranis, your Mavs are getting beat up pretty good…

I kind of think he had to be trolling with the Brunson take at half. But yeah they have so much less talent than the suns. There was a reason Dallas had astronomical odds to win the west or title even after beating the last breaths of Utah. You need more than one 1.5 good players to win even if one is a top 3 players.
I was not.  Brunson averaged essentially 28 ppg with a TS% of 58.3 in the 1st round series.  In the 2 games in this series his TS% is 37.5 and he is averaging 11 ppg.  Dinwiddie is down from basically 15 to 10.  They need at least one of those guys to show up.  Kidd said it after the game i.e. Luka needs help.  Brunson in particular has been awful shooting the ball.  On the season, Brunson was 54.5 from 2 and 37.3 from 3.  In the 2 games he is 33.3 from 2 and 25.0 from 3.  He just isn't hitting his shots.  He also isn't defending well.  Luka is obviously not a good defender, but Brunson can, and should, be a lot better defensively than he has been. 

Going back to Dallas I'd expect Brunson to play a lot better.  If he doesn't, the Mavs are done, but if he just shoots better, the Mavs will be fine because the Suns can't stop Luka.  He just can't do it alone.

When I look at Brunson, I see a below average but serviceable defender. He doesn't have enough quickness to handle top PGs and he is a small guard who can get punished on switches. I do not see a good defender there. I actually prefer Doncic as a defender because at 6-8 he is more switchable.

When I look at Dinwiddie's offense, I see a player who lacks shooting chops and makes up for it by being a well-rounded and creative shot-creator at middle of the pack efficiency. Brunson is similar to Dinwiddie in this respect but has a superior shot-selection and decision making profile which allows him to be an above average scorer efficiency wise despite his sketchy outside shot (reluctant outside shooter, passes up shots unless wide wide open, shows up in volume). This decision making & scoring variety usually allows him to more consistent but is absent at the moment.

Brunson's first round numbers were unsustainable (particularly his outside shooting). He is not that type of talent. He is a good 3rd/4th option on offense. Dinwiddie can handle more offensive responsibility than that (largely due to his superior size which allows him get off more shot attempts - not high efficiency shots but middle efficiency shots) but you don't really want Dinwiddie to because of his average efficiency and only allow him to do so when your team is really poor offensively.

The disappointing factor to me is Dallas' defense which was punching way above its weight from Jan 1st onwards has come back to reality.
Oh yeah I wasn't expecting Brunson to look like the All NBA level player he did in the 1st round, but he shouldn't be so below his season averages either.  He is shooting terribly in the series.  If he had his season average shooting in game 1, the Mavs probably win that game, and while game 2 ended up 20 points it was a 4 point game early in the 4th quarter, so the Mavs were in it until the very last part of the game.
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Re: NBA Season 2021-22
« Reply #4964 on: May 05, 2022, 11:57:47 AM »

Offline Who

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Is James Harden entering that Clyde Drexler joining the Rockets stage of his career?

Where Drexler was no longer able to be the franchise guy in Portland, his powers were declining and he was able to hop on Hakeem's back, let Hakeem be the man and the secondary star to provide Houston with more offensive variety to win a well a 2nd title.

Is this Harden's new stage in his career with Embiid as Hakeem? Harden no longer the franchise, declining powers but still potent as a secondary option. As a release valve when teams surround Embiid.

Drexler went from being a top 10 player to a top 20 player in that period. Is Harden going through the same transition - even if he gets his butt back in shape.