Can the Celtics Operate in the Buyout Market?

[Roy H.]

Drummond going to Lakers..our only hope is Demarcus Cousins

The Lakers surprise me, but LA has that allure with players.  Has this been reported?

[Celtics2021]

Drummond meeting with Celtics. If Danny could add him to Fournier and Wagner, I think that's an excellent deadline haul. Big upgrade with AD - RWill still gets his minutes but doesn't have to carry the whole load inside. TT and Wagner give you a couple bangers for depth in a physical series. Bigs with attitudes! I like it.

I don’t think it will go anywhere, but I would love to have him.  We just wouldn’t have a snowball’s chance of retaining him.  The Knicks would.

Assuming we don’t land Drummond and Porter stays put, I’d be down with KO.  He’s a good fit for our roster.



As an aside, I have always wondered if fanswould like KO better if he had a crew cut.  Does appearance matter?

If we're bringing back Celtics who've only played with Brown and Smart, can we bring back IT instead of KO?  I'm not sure what KO adds to a team with Time Lord, Thompson, and Wagner if we're only playing one big.  Meanwhile, we just moved Teague and have an opening for someone with IT's abilities.  He's obviously not what he once was, and admittedly we don't know what he is at all now, but I would rather have him on this team than KO, just given its needs.  He was incredibly supportive of Jaylen and Marcus his first time in Boston, and those guys could use his energy if nothing else.

KO is a two-way player who can play power forward in two-big lineups.

IT is a fringe NBA player who adds league-worst defense and spotty offense.

I will always love IT, but he’s not a sure rotation player.

But the Celtics aren’t using two big lineups.  That’s one reason Theis was traded.  Just last week this was the news:

Brad Stevens said he talked to Daniel Theis at halftime, who barely played tonight after starting. Stevens says they are going to have to limit the center rotation to just two guys between Theis, TT and Time Lord as the season goes on and they look to play smaller.

I get being interested in someone like Aldridge or Drummond, because either could be better than Thompson.  But KO is going to rack up DNPs, and it’s probably better to give what few minutes he might find to audition Wagner.

I’m just suggesting even a diminished IT could be a better fit for this team than Olynyk, even if one could very reasonably prefer Olynyk in the abstract.

I think we both agree the best potential option is Otto Porter Jr. if he becomes available, because that’s exactly the role we have an large opening for.  Wayne Ellington would be a solid consolation prize if we can’t get Porter.

KO gives the Celtics a guy that can play C, hit outside shots and can open the floor for the Celtics.   He gives them a different big man look off the bench in contrast with Thompson.   (R. Williams should be the starter at this point)

Right, but KO is at 32% from 3 this year, and Wagner is at 31%.  Theis was 35 for us%.  If we wanted someone for that role, the best answer was keeping Theis.  It would seem silly to move Theis to create room on the buyout market, only to get someone who filled Theis' role not as well, especially when also trading for someone who can do that role about as equally well as the buyout candidate.

Theis isn’t a good PF; KO is.  Also, KO is a career 37% 3PT shooter.  He fills the role.

I just question whether KO is any more capable at the PF position than Theis was.  Lineup data is imperfect, but at the same time, he's theoretically played 100% of his minutes at center the last two seasons at center.  You'd figure that if he was actually a PF he'd have some amount of data saying that he played there, even if it underestimated such a time.  And again, I point back to the quote I posted earlier -- he's a big, and it seems the Celtics would like to use one big at a time, not two, call it power forward, center, or whatever else.

I like KO.  In the other buyout thread you started (maybe the threads should be merged?) I was the first one to suggest KO as someone to look at.  Just upon reflection, I'm not sure KO is the fit for this team, unless the Celtics decide that, in fact, two bigs are something they want to utilize frequently.

Also, KO's shooting has fallen off a cliff this year.  I'm not sure why that is -- could be bad luck, but the sample size isn't small -- at 243 attempts, he's already at the 3rd-highest number of his career.  And according to his shot chart from statmuse, it's fallen from every location, so it's not probably not just a shot selection issue.

I just look at it like this.  We already had one more big than we could reasonably use.  We traded a PG, wing, and big for a wing, big, and a waivable big.  It feels like adding another big is the least efficient use of a roster space.  Wing would probably be the best, since we play more of them, but we also play two-guard lineups with more frequency than two-big lineups.  Absent getting someone like Drummond or Aldridge, who could be a significant upgrade to Thompson if not Time Lord, we should target positions we are most likely to use, and that's wings and guards.

[Celtics2021]

Drummond going to Lakers..our only hope is Demarcus Cousins

The Lakers surprise me, but LA has that allure with players.  Has this been reported?

No, this seems more like fatalism.  That said, it has been reported that he was working out in LA after Cleveland told him to stay home, so it's not unreasonable fatalism.

[Roy H.]

Drummond meeting with Celtics. If Danny could add him to Fournier and Wagner, I think that's an excellent deadline haul. Big upgrade with AD - RWill still gets his minutes but doesn't have to carry the whole load inside. TT and Wagner give you a couple bangers for depth in a physical series. Bigs with attitudes! I like it.

I don’t think it will go anywhere, but I would love to have him.  We just wouldn’t have a snowball’s chance of retaining him.  The Knicks would.

Assuming we don’t land Drummond and Porter stays put, I’d be down with KO.  He’s a good fit for our roster.



As an aside, I have always wondered if fanswould like KO better if he had a crew cut.  Does appearance matter?

If we're bringing back Celtics who've only played with Brown and Smart, can we bring back IT instead of KO?  I'm not sure what KO adds to a team with Time Lord, Thompson, and Wagner if we're only playing one big.  Meanwhile, we just moved Teague and have an opening for someone with IT's abilities.  He's obviously not what he once was, and admittedly we don't know what he is at all now, but I would rather have him on this team than KO, just given its needs.  He was incredibly supportive of Jaylen and Marcus his first time in Boston, and those guys could use his energy if nothing else.

KO is a two-way player who can play power forward in two-big lineups.

IT is a fringe NBA player who adds league-worst defense and spotty offense.

I will always love IT, but he’s not a sure rotation player.

But the Celtics aren’t using two big lineups.  That’s one reason Theis was traded.  Just last week this was the news:

Brad Stevens said he talked to Daniel Theis at halftime, who barely played tonight after starting. Stevens says they are going to have to limit the center rotation to just two guys between Theis, TT and Time Lord as the season goes on and they look to play smaller.

I get being interested in someone like Aldridge or Drummond, because either could be better than Thompson.  But KO is going to rack up DNPs, and it’s probably better to give what few minutes he might find to audition Wagner.

I’m just suggesting even a diminished IT could be a better fit for this team than Olynyk, even if one could very reasonably prefer Olynyk in the abstract.

I think we both agree the best potential option is Otto Porter Jr. if he becomes available, because that’s exactly the role we have an large opening for.  Wayne Ellington would be a solid consolation prize if we can’t get Porter.

KO gives the Celtics a guy that can play C, hit outside shots and can open the floor for the Celtics.   He gives them a different big man look off the bench in contrast with Thompson.   (R. Williams should be the starter at this point)

Right, but KO is at 32% from 3 this year, and Wagner is at 31%.  Theis was 35 for us%.  If we wanted someone for that role, the best answer was keeping Theis.  It would seem silly to move Theis to create room on the buyout market, only to get someone who filled Theis' role not as well, especially when also trading for someone who can do that role about as equally well as the buyout candidate.

Theis isn’t a good PF; KO is.  Also, KO is a career 37% 3PT shooter.  He fills the role.

I just question whether KO is any more capable at the PF position than Theis was.  Lineup data is imperfect, but at the same time, he's theoretically played 100% of his minutes at center the last two seasons at center.  You'd figure that if he was actually a PF he'd have some amount of data saying that he played there, even if it underestimated such a time.  And again, I point back to the quote I posted earlier -- he's a big, and it seems the Celtics would like to use one big at a time, not two, call it power forward, center, or whatever else.

I like KO.  In the other buyout thread you started (maybe the threads should be merged?) I was the first one to suggest KO as someone to look at.  Just upon reflection, I'm not sure KO is the fit for this team, unless the Celtics decide that, in fact, two bigs are something they want to utilize frequently.

Also, KO's shooting has fallen off a cliff this year.  I'm not sure why that is -- could be bad luck, but the sample size isn't small -- at 243 attempts, he's already at the 3rd-highest number of his career.  And according to his shot chart from statmuse, it's fallen from every location, so it's not probably not just a shot selection issue.

I just look at it like this.  We already had one more big than we could reasonably use.  We traded a PG, wing, and big for a wing, big, and a waivable big.  It feels like adding another big is the least efficient use of a roster space.  Wing would probably be the best, since we play more of them, but we also play two-guard lineups with more frequency than two-big lineups.  Absent getting someone like Drummond or Aldridge, who could be a significant upgrade to Thompson if not Time Lord, we should target positions we are most likely to use, and that's wings and guards.

Who is available that is higher quality than Kelly, though? I just fundamentally disagree that that guy is IT.  I’m not a “Kelly or bust” guy, but I don’t see a lot of quality wings or guards.

[Birdman]

Drummond going to Lakers..our only hope is Demarcus Cousins

The Lakers surprise me, but LA has that allure with players.  Has this been reported?

Take this as a grain of salt but it’s being reported by Terry Pluto who writes for a LA paper..saying Drummond wants to play for Lakers .

[Celtics2021]

Drummond meeting with Celtics. If Danny could add him to Fournier and Wagner, I think that's an excellent deadline haul. Big upgrade with AD - RWill still gets his minutes but doesn't have to carry the whole load inside. TT and Wagner give you a couple bangers for depth in a physical series. Bigs with attitudes! I like it.

I don’t think it will go anywhere, but I would love to have him.  We just wouldn’t have a snowball’s chance of retaining him.  The Knicks would.

Assuming we don’t land Drummond and Porter stays put, I’d be down with KO.  He’s a good fit for our roster.



As an aside, I have always wondered if fanswould like KO better if he had a crew cut.  Does appearance matter?

If we're bringing back Celtics who've only played with Brown and Smart, can we bring back IT instead of KO?  I'm not sure what KO adds to a team with Time Lord, Thompson, and Wagner if we're only playing one big.  Meanwhile, we just moved Teague and have an opening for someone with IT's abilities.  He's obviously not what he once was, and admittedly we don't know what he is at all now, but I would rather have him on this team than KO, just given its needs.  He was incredibly supportive of Jaylen and Marcus his first time in Boston, and those guys could use his energy if nothing else.

KO is a two-way player who can play power forward in two-big lineups.

IT is a fringe NBA player who adds league-worst defense and spotty offense.

I will always love IT, but he’s not a sure rotation player.

But the Celtics aren’t using two big lineups.  That’s one reason Theis was traded.  Just last week this was the news:

Brad Stevens said he talked to Daniel Theis at halftime, who barely played tonight after starting. Stevens says they are going to have to limit the center rotation to just two guys between Theis, TT and Time Lord as the season goes on and they look to play smaller.

I get being interested in someone like Aldridge or Drummond, because either could be better than Thompson.  But KO is going to rack up DNPs, and it’s probably better to give what few minutes he might find to audition Wagner.

I’m just suggesting even a diminished IT could be a better fit for this team than Olynyk, even if one could very reasonably prefer Olynyk in the abstract.

I think we both agree the best potential option is Otto Porter Jr. if he becomes available, because that’s exactly the role we have an large opening for.  Wayne Ellington would be a solid consolation prize if we can’t get Porter.

KO gives the Celtics a guy that can play C, hit outside shots and can open the floor for the Celtics.   He gives them a different big man look off the bench in contrast with Thompson.   (R. Williams should be the starter at this point)

Right, but KO is at 32% from 3 this year, and Wagner is at 31%.  Theis was 35 for us%.  If we wanted someone for that role, the best answer was keeping Theis.  It would seem silly to move Theis to create room on the buyout market, only to get someone who filled Theis' role not as well, especially when also trading for someone who can do that role about as equally well as the buyout candidate.

Theis isn’t a good PF; KO is.  Also, KO is a career 37% 3PT shooter.  He fills the role.

I just question whether KO is any more capable at the PF position than Theis was.  Lineup data is imperfect, but at the same time, he's theoretically played 100% of his minutes at center the last two seasons at center.  You'd figure that if he was actually a PF he'd have some amount of data saying that he played there, even if it underestimated such a time.  And again, I point back to the quote I posted earlier -- he's a big, and it seems the Celtics would like to use one big at a time, not two, call it power forward, center, or whatever else.

I like KO.  In the other buyout thread you started (maybe the threads should be merged?) I was the first one to suggest KO as someone to look at.  Just upon reflection, I'm not sure KO is the fit for this team, unless the Celtics decide that, in fact, two bigs are something they want to utilize frequently.

Also, KO's shooting has fallen off a cliff this year.  I'm not sure why that is -- could be bad luck, but the sample size isn't small -- at 243 attempts, he's already at the 3rd-highest number of his career.  And according to his shot chart from statmuse, it's fallen from every location, so it's not probably not just a shot selection issue.

I just look at it like this.  We already had one more big than we could reasonably use.  We traded a PG, wing, and big for a wing, big, and a waivable big.  It feels like adding another big is the least efficient use of a roster space.  Wing would probably be the best, since we play more of them, but we also play two-guard lineups with more frequency than two-big lineups.  Absent getting someone like Drummond or Aldridge, who could be a significant upgrade to Thompson if not Time Lord, we should target positions we are most likely to use, and that's wings and guards.

Who is available that is higher quality than Kelly, though? I just fundamentally disagree that that guy is IT.  I’m not a “Kelly or bust” guy, but I don’t see a lot of quality wings or guards.

I offered that Kelly is higher quality in a vacuum -- I just think IT fits a need better, and part of that need is his infectious drive.  I actually think Wagner fills that particular need better than Kelly as well, which is why I hope he gets some run early while Thompson is still out, such that he's able to get a rotation spot.

As for other players (and Celtics), Avery Bradley was also sent to Houston for Oladipo, and seems to be a buyout candidate.  That said, he's hardly played this year -- I think I remember him getting Covid in January, and I don't know what his status is.  Mo Harkless and James Johnson would also seem to be possibilities.

[Birdman]

When is deadline for buyouts for players? And when can u sign them to be eligible for playoffs?

[Roy H.]

When is deadline for buyouts for players? And when can u sign them to be eligible for playoffs?

You can sign a player at any point before the end of the season.  They will be playoff eligible so long as they were a free agent by a certain deadline.  Usually that's March 1.  No idea what it is this year, but I would assume it's within two weeks of the trade deadline.

[Celtics2021]

When is deadline for buyouts for players? And when can u sign them to be eligible for playoffs?

To be eligible for the playoffs, a player has to be bought out (or otherwise unsigned) by April 9th.  A team can sign anyone up until the last day of the season (as usual) and have them playoff-eligible, provided they've been a free agent from April 9th onwards.

[liam]

If we really want Drummond don't we get Tristain Thompson on the phone?

[Roy H.]

Gorgui Dieng bought out.

[Celtics2021]

If we really want Drummond don't we get Tristain Thompson on the phone?

And say what?  "Hope you're starting to feel better, take your time coming back?"  You can't expect Thompson to recruit someone who will send him to the bench.

[liam]

If we really want Drummond don't we get Tristain Thompson on the phone?

And say what?  "Hope you're starting to feel better, take your time coming back?"  You can't expect Thompson to recruit someone who will send him to the bench.

If you wanted your team to win you would but if all you cared about was your numbers you wouldn't.

[liam]

Does Gorgui Dieng have anything left. He's only 31 but 31 looks different on different guys.

[Tr1boy]

Does Gorgui Dieng have anything left. He's only 31 but 31 looks different on different guys.

I would pass

He is too slow twitch on the D end