Hayward sign-and-trade completed

[hpantazo]

Get the TPE and use it on Redick or Sweet Lou.  We need an offensive threat in the second unit and I'm not ready to bank on one of our rookies providing it out of the gates.  I'd prefer Redick as I think he would be ideal in this system and he is a better defender.  Throw in a first to Pelicans to get it done.

I think the Celts would get the TPE

but not make a move right now

give the opportunity to Nesmith, Pritchard, Edwards etc. at the start

Yeah. They could even wait until next offseason to use it, when they can use an even bigger portion of it once some of the current contracts expire. So they could see what they have with this group from now until February, see what is the major need, and then either try to use the TPE at the trade deadline if they find an opportunity that fills that need, or wait until the offseason.

[Darth_Yoda]

Probably a pipe dream, but I'd happily take Batum's contract provided that the Hornets throw in PJ Washington.

Boston in: Batum + Washington
Charlotte in: Hayward + Edwards

The Hornets avoid cutting Batum, hence they save $9,043,478 a year for the next 3 seasons. The C's get a very promising 3+D prospect in Washington.


PG: Kemba - Smart - Pritchard - Teague
SG: Brown - Romeo - Smart
SF: Tatum - Nesmith - Batum
PF: Washington - Grant - Semi
C: Thompson - Theis - Timelord

That would put the Celtics over the luxury tax apron, which they are very intentionally trying not to cross this season.

They are realistically only going to be able to acquire a player with a ~$14 million contract. Unless they begin to trade away legitimate rotation players, in which case what's the point.

Ugh, you're right. Forgot we got hard capped by signing Thompson.

How? Signing him did not put the team into lux tax?
Hayward had opted OUT at the point they signed him.

Hard Cap should have nothing to do with his signing or does it just apply to any MLE signing regardless of team payroll. If your team is over the cap and you use more than 1 dollar than the tax payer portion, the BAE or acquire a player in a sign and trade?

Thats dumb if it is.

That wold mean that Charlotte, if they can trade away batum for nothing, and sign and trade for Hayward will be hard capped, even though they are below the salary cap?

[Darth_Yoda]

Based on the Woj news, sounds like we can expect a sign and trade with Charlotte and a corresponding $28M or so trade exemption but that the hold up is the discussion between Charlotte and OKC over Batum.  Both these sound reasonable.

Because we used the non-taxpayer exception for Thompson, we now have a hard cap so for this season, we would be restricted from using all of the $28M TPE.  There is still probably going to be some movement in the final signings and resulting salary/cap numbers but we would probably have in the range of $15M or so to work with from the $28M TPE.  The balance could be used in the offseason in 2021.  I guess having this drag out is better as it extends the 1 year period a little.

I don't see anyone on the Charlotte or Thunder roster that we would want to eat into the 2020 portion of the TPE for, at least not anyone who would likely be available.  This will probably be most useful at the trade deadline to bring in a vet.  What we think we need today and what we end up needing half way through the season can be different.  Hopefully they get this done and then I say start the season with what we have and let's see how it works.  Then we can address the biggest need at the trade deadline.

According to the numbers the team should have upwards of 23 million available to use.

[DefenseWinsChamps]

Get the TPE and use it on Redick or Sweet Lou.  We need an offensive threat in the second unit and I'm not ready to bank on one of our rookies providing it out of the gates.  I'd prefer Redick as I think he would be ideal in this system and he is a better defender.  Throw in a first to Pelicans to get it done.

I think the Celts would get the TPE

but not make a move right now

give the opportunity to Nesmith, Pritchard, Edwards etc. at the start

Yeah. They could even wait until next offseason to use it, when they can use an even bigger portion of it once some of the current contracts expire. So they could see what they have with this group from now until February, see what is the major need, and then either try to use the TPE at the trade deadline if they find an opportunity that fills that need, or wait until the offseason.

The ability to add some dedicated sets to our offense for a shooter might be a way to have some reliable scoring opportunities. I also love the idea of letting Nesmith train with Reddick for a year or two.

[Darth_Yoda]

Looking at team salary etc, we still have the cap hold for Bane on the books. lol.

[Jiri Welsch]

How? Signing him did not put the team into lux tax?
Hayward had opted OUT at the point they signed him.

Hard Cap should have nothing to do with his signing or does it just apply to any MLE signing regardless of team payroll. If your team is over the cap and you use more than 1 dollar than the tax payer portion, the BAE or acquire a player in a sign and trade?

Thats dumb if it is.

That wold mean that Charlotte, if they can trade away batum for nothing, and sign and trade for Hayward will be hard capped, even though they are below the salary cap?

Two things going on:

1. When Hayward opted out, the Celtics went below the luxury tax apron (but still above the salary cap). This granted them the non-taxpayer MLE they used to sign Thompson. As far as I know, the Celtics did not become hard-capped for the entire season by signing Thompson. Instead, they seem intent on not going into luxury tax territory this year. That is so that the taxpayer penalties reset for the years they plan to pay it in the future. 

2. When a team S&T's for a player they become hard-capped. That means they cannot go above the apron for the rest of the season.

Hopefully this is clarifying slightly, lol.

[Tr1boy]

I wonder what the Hornets would need to include for a team to take Batum off their books

I'm thinking quite a bit of cash and multiple 2nds/Monk ?

Celtics would need to then send the 2021 memphis 2nd to Hornets?  for the TPE


does this check out?

[Jiri Welsch]

I wonder what the Hornets would need to include for a team to take Batum off their books

I'm thinking quite a bit of cash and multiple 2nds/Monk ?

Celtics would need to then send the 2021 memphis 2nd to Hornets?  for the TPE


does this check out?

I'm thinking the same thing. Or maybe the C's just send their 2nd to whatever team absorbs Batum.

I think the Celtics will try to only spend one 2nd rounder so that they can use the other when absorbing a player into the TPE.

[Tr1boy]

How? Signing him did not put the team into lux tax?
Hayward had opted OUT at the point they signed him.

Hard Cap should have nothing to do with his signing or does it just apply to any MLE signing regardless of team payroll. If your team is over the cap and you use more than 1 dollar than the tax payer portion, the BAE or acquire a player in a sign and trade?

Thats dumb if it is.

That wold mean that Charlotte, if they can trade away batum for nothing, and sign and trade for Hayward will be hard capped, even though they are below the salary cap?

Two things going on:

1. When Hayward opted out, the Celtics went below the luxury tax apron (but still above the salary cap). This granted them the non-taxpayer MLE they used to sign Thompson. As far as I know, the Celtics did not become hard-capped for the entire season by signing Thompson. Instead, they seem intent on not going into luxury tax territory this year. That is so that the taxpayer penalties reset for the years they plan to pay it in the future. 

2. When a team S&T's for a player they become hard-capped. That means they cannot go above the apron for the rest of the season.

Hopefully this is clarifying slightly, lol.

I don't understand this part

then what is the benefit of the TPE?   

[Darth_Yoda]

I wonder what the Hornets would need to include for a team to take Batum off their books

I'm thinking quite a bit of cash and multiple 2nds/Monk ?

Celtics would need to then send the 2021 memphis 2nd to Hornets?  for the TPE


does this check out?

If Charlotte were smart they should try to get Horford from OKC for Batum and filler. If my math is correct they need to gain about 9 million dollars to complete the sign and trade with Boston.

Batum and Zeller to Thunder

Horford and Hayward and about 6 mill in salary from OKC to Charlotte

TPE to Boston


edit: I typed a much longer post out here, but got signed out during composition. That happens alot?

[Darth_Yoda]

How? Signing him did not put the team into lux tax?
Hayward had opted OUT at the point they signed him.

Hard Cap should have nothing to do with his signing or does it just apply to any MLE signing regardless of team payroll. If your team is over the cap and you use more than 1 dollar than the tax payer portion, the BAE or acquire a player in a sign and trade?

Thats dumb if it is.

That wold mean that Charlotte, if they can trade away batum for nothing, and sign and trade for Hayward will be hard capped, even though they are below the salary cap?

Two things going on:

1. When Hayward opted out, the Celtics went below the luxury tax apron (but still above the salary cap). This granted them the non-taxpayer MLE they used to sign Thompson. As far as I know, the Celtics did not become hard-capped for the entire season by signing Thompson. Instead, they seem intent on not going into luxury tax territory this year. That is so that the taxpayer penalties reset for the years they plan to pay it in the future. 

2. When a team S&T's for a player they become hard-capped. That means they cannot go above the apron for the rest of the season.

Hopefully this is clarifying slightly, lol.

I don't understand this part

then what is the benefit of the TPE?

So we can use it up to the apron?

[Jiri Welsch]

How? Signing him did not put the team into lux tax?
Hayward had opted OUT at the point they signed him.

Hard Cap should have nothing to do with his signing or does it just apply to any MLE signing regardless of team payroll. If your team is over the cap and you use more than 1 dollar than the tax payer portion, the BAE or acquire a player in a sign and trade?

Thats dumb if it is.

That wold mean that Charlotte, if they can trade away batum for nothing, and sign and trade for Hayward will be hard capped, even though they are below the salary cap?

Two things going on:

1. When Hayward opted out, the Celtics went below the luxury tax apron (but still above the salary cap). This granted them the non-taxpayer MLE they used to sign Thompson. As far as I know, the Celtics did not become hard-capped for the entire season by signing Thompson. Instead, they seem intent on not going into luxury tax territory this year. That is so that the taxpayer penalties reset for the years they plan to pay it in the future. 

2. When a team S&T's for a player they become hard-capped. That means they cannot go above the apron for the rest of the season.

Hopefully this is clarifying slightly, lol.

I don't understand this part

then what is the benefit of the TPE?

Charlotte will become hard-capped by acquiring Hayward via S&T.

For Boston, the TPE can be used during this season to acquire a player making ~$14 million and under. This allows them to take on salary while still not crossing into the (self-inflicted) restricted luxury tax zone. Conversely, there could be a few day window at the start of next year when they could use it.

[Tr1boy]

How? Signing him did not put the team into lux tax?
Hayward had opted OUT at the point they signed him.

Hard Cap should have nothing to do with his signing or does it just apply to any MLE signing regardless of team payroll. If your team is over the cap and you use more than 1 dollar than the tax payer portion, the BAE or acquire a player in a sign and trade?

Thats dumb if it is.

That wold mean that Charlotte, if they can trade away batum for nothing, and sign and trade for Hayward will be hard capped, even though they are below the salary cap?

Two things going on:

1. When Hayward opted out, the Celtics went below the luxury tax apron (but still above the salary cap). This granted them the non-taxpayer MLE they used to sign Thompson. As far as I know, the Celtics did not become hard-capped for the entire season by signing Thompson. Instead, they seem intent on not going into luxury tax territory this year. That is so that the taxpayer penalties reset for the years they plan to pay it in the future. 

2. When a team S&T's for a player they become hard-capped. That means they cannot go above the apron for the rest of the season.

Hopefully this is clarifying slightly, lol.

I don't understand this part

then what is the benefit of the TPE?

So we can use it up to the apron?

what is the 2020-2021 apron?   

I believe the Celts with addition of Tristan, Teague, 2 rookies,  plus 2 ways are at approx 115M

[Tr1boy]

How? Signing him did not put the team into lux tax?
Hayward had opted OUT at the point they signed him.

Hard Cap should have nothing to do with his signing or does it just apply to any MLE signing regardless of team payroll. If your team is over the cap and you use more than 1 dollar than the tax payer portion, the BAE or acquire a player in a sign and trade?

Thats dumb if it is.

That wold mean that Charlotte, if they can trade away batum for nothing, and sign and trade for Hayward will be hard capped, even though they are below the salary cap?

Two things going on:

1. When Hayward opted out, the Celtics went below the luxury tax apron (but still above the salary cap). This granted them the non-taxpayer MLE they used to sign Thompson. As far as I know, the Celtics did not become hard-capped for the entire season by signing Thompson. Instead, they seem intent on not going into luxury tax territory this year. That is so that the taxpayer penalties reset for the years they plan to pay it in the future. 

2. When a team S&T's for a player they become hard-capped. That means they cannot go above the apron for the rest of the season.

Hopefully this is clarifying slightly, lol.

I don't understand this part

then what is the benefit of the TPE?

Charlotte will become hard-capped by acquiring Hayward via S&T.

For Boston, the TPE can be used during this season to acquire a player making ~$14 million and under. This allows them to take on salary while still not crossing into the (self-inflicted) restricted luxury tax zone. Conversely, there could be a few day window at the start of next year when they could use it.

thanks

[Jiri Welsch]

Hopefully this trade happens soon, so that we can start speculating on potential player acquisitions rather than our (collective) blind spots re: the CBA!