Author Topic: Would Atlanta Hawks deal the 6th pick?  (Read 1840 times)

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Would Atlanta Hawks deal the 6th pick?
« on: October 09, 2020, 05:55:00 AM »

Offline shut_the_gate

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For the 2020 draft, the Hawks look like the only team that we could trade up with.

They need defensive players and the GM has already shown he likes having multiple picks.

Kemba Walker isn't getting any younger, but given he's a star free agency signing, we can't trade him but for me...Tyrese Haliburton is his future replacement. He's the perfect guard for Stevens team first system and Tatum's shot making, he's highly intelligent, tall, long and a two way team first player.

Atlanta need defenders and leaders...Marcus Smart would be perfect for them next to Trae Young, along with our 2020 picks should be more than enough to make the trade possible.

Would you could consider this trade?

Re: Would Atlanta Hawks deal the 6th pick?
« Reply #1 on: October 09, 2020, 06:06:56 AM »

Offline ederson

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IMHO a conference finalist whould look for win now moves. We need to get "older"

Re: Would Atlanta Hawks deal the 6th pick?
« Reply #2 on: October 09, 2020, 06:28:14 AM »

Offline shut_the_gate

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IMHO a conference finalist whould look for win now moves. We need to get "older"

I think this team can do both, we can look for other trades for veterans and there are good veteran free agents available e.g Pat Connaughton, Nerlens Noel, Robin Lopez, Avery Bradley, Aron Baynes, Marco Belinelli, E'Twaun Moore.

Tyrese Haliburton is also 20 y.o two year college player and will immediately contribute off the bench.
« Last Edit: October 09, 2020, 06:33:16 AM by shut_the_gate »

Re: Would Atlanta Hawks deal the 6th pick?
« Reply #3 on: October 09, 2020, 06:50:04 AM »

Offline ederson

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A team sure can do both but not by giving up a key player for a rookie
 

Re: Would Atlanta Hawks deal the 6th pick?
« Reply #4 on: October 09, 2020, 07:42:01 AM »

Offline pearljammer10

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With, 7 rookies on our roster last year and 5 more picks this year,  why would we want to trade for the 6th pick?

Re: Would Atlanta Hawks deal the 6th pick?
« Reply #5 on: October 09, 2020, 07:43:26 AM »

Online gouki88

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Smart + 14, 26 & 30 for #6? No thank you! In this draft that’s a terrible move IMO. We’re trying to win now, not add a mediocre-to-decent lottery prospect at the cost of our heart and soul

Re: Would Atlanta Hawks deal the 6th pick?
« Reply #6 on: October 09, 2020, 08:04:48 AM »

Online Csfan1984

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Hayward makes more sense for both clubs. Hawks have Reddish, Hunter, and Huerter all guys that can play SG if needed. Hayward adds a play maker and efficient scorer off the ball. They can create a deadly spread offense around the Young and Collins pick and roll.

Starters
Trae Young, Huerter, Hayward, Collins, Capela
Bench
14th pick, Reddish, Hunter, 26th pick, Fernado

I'd only do this for Okongwu. He has talent and fits a need. Backup PG isn't a big need if we play Smart at backup PG. I do love Haliburton though and I could see DA taking him over Okongwu  but in that case does he then use Smart in a package for a big?

Re: Would Atlanta Hawks deal the 6th pick?
« Reply #7 on: October 09, 2020, 08:41:46 AM »

Online CFAN38

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For the 2020 draft, the Hawks look like the only team that we could trade up with.

They need defensive players and the GM has already shown he likes having multiple picks.

Kemba Walker isn't getting any younger, but given he's a star free agency signing, we can't trade him but for me...Tyrese Haliburton is his future replacement. He's the perfect guard for Stevens team first system and Tatum's shot making, he's highly intelligent, tall, long and a two way team first player.

Atlanta need defenders and leaders...Marcus Smart would be perfect for them next to Trae Young, along with our 2020 picks should be more than enough to make the trade possible.

Would you could consider this trade?

Multiple higher end media sources have speculated that 14,26, and 30 should be enough to land 7 from the pistons. With that in mind if DA really wants Haliburton he should be able to get him without giving up Smart.

Also I like Haliburton but not on this roster. I think he will be at his best playing a Smart like high minutes 6th man role. I don't love the idea of him as a starting PG now or in the future. I don't think he will be able to create off the dribble well enough to ever to a teams secondary initiator. Instead I see him as a glue piece who like Smart comes off the bench but finishes most games. If they trade back he would be a nice Warriors 6th man, the same may be true if drafted by Suns or the Wizards where could back up Rubio/Booker or Wall/Beal.
 
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Re: Would Atlanta Hawks deal the 6th pick?
« Reply #8 on: October 09, 2020, 09:54:05 AM »

Online td450

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IMHO a conference finalist whould look for win now moves. We need to get "older"

I disagree. Our most experienced players were the most disappointing.

Tatum and Brown and defense will get us there if we don't screw it up. If we trade up and draft Okongwu and/or Halliburton, and if Walker, Hayward and Smart accept and adjust to second tier status, that would make us better than the Lakers if Tatum and Brown continue to develop normally. They are that good, and we are that close.


Re: Would Atlanta Hawks deal the 6th pick?
« Reply #9 on: October 09, 2020, 09:56:05 AM »

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The version of this trade that makes the most sense to me would be with Hayward and Collins involved.

It's unclear what the Hawks have planned for Collins, but it is apparent they did not view him as the future big man on their roster after trading for Dedmon and Capella. Maybe they view him more as a scoring forward, which, honestly, he might be. But combine those trades with the rumors that the Hawks might have been looking to trade him at the deadline, and I think it may be apparent that the Hawks don't like his fit with Young.

The Hawks can absorb Hayward's full contract into their cap space, generating a sizable trade exemption back to the Cs. This exemption could be used on an expiring contract like Steven Adam or Andre Drummond at the deadline without putting us back into the luxury tax.

The Hawks apparently feel the pressure to put some veterans around Trae Young and try to win. Hayward can run an effective offense while Young is off the court and play off of Young when they play together. This also keeps their cap flexibility for next summer, when they may feel they could be in the running for a big free agent to pair with their dynamic guard. The Hawks also get multiple swings at 3-D players to put next to Trae Young--that don't have a single one yet.

For the Cs, there are four positives. First, it puts off the repeater tax for another year. Second, it gets us a top 6 pick that could turn into a key young piece to put with Tatum and Brown. Third, it gives us a huge trade exemption that can be used to absorb a huge expiring contract veteran for our playoff push without going into the luxury tax. Fourth, it gives us a look at John Collins.

I think without John Collins in this trade, there are still enough positives for the Cs to consider it. But how you view him might really affect whether this trade gets done. My personal opinion is that if CBS can turn Sullinger, Olynyk, Zeller, Amir Johnson (at the end of his career) and even Daniel Theis (who I think had more natural defensive ability than the aforementioned players) into defensive advanced stat darlings, then he could probably do it with Collins. Collins is really, really long and tall. He also has a ridiculous vertical. There are times when he gets vertical, or gets a trailing block on a ball-handler, or uses his quick hands to poke the ball away, and I think, "Maybe he could be a switchy center that is effective in small stints."

Obviously, the greatest benefit is that Collins is one of the best shot finishers in the NBA--at the rim, from three, driving, postups, rolling, offensive rebounds, etc. This dude gets buckets. I wonder if pairing a player like him with Tatum's newfound playmaking elevate Tatum's passing even more. I wonder if having a highly effective scorer inside would pull attention for Brown, Walker, and Tatum and make them more effective scorers.

At worst, he's a more versatile version of Montrezl Harrell, who gets buckets but can play defense. That's a player that can be very valuable to our team.

Re: Would Atlanta Hawks deal the 6th pick?
« Reply #10 on: October 09, 2020, 09:57:40 AM »

Online td450

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For the 2020 draft, the Hawks look like the only team that we could trade up with.

They need defensive players and the GM has already shown he likes having multiple picks.

Kemba Walker isn't getting any younger, but given he's a star free agency signing, we can't trade him but for me...Tyrese Haliburton is his future replacement. He's the perfect guard for Stevens team first system and Tatum's shot making, he's highly intelligent, tall, long and a two way team first player.

Atlanta need defenders and leaders...Marcus Smart would be perfect for them next to Trae Young, along with our 2020 picks should be more than enough to make the trade possible.

Would you could consider this trade?

Multiple higher end media sources have speculated that 14,26, and 30 should be enough to land 7 from the pistons. With that in mind if DA really wants Haliburton he should be able to get him without giving up Smart.

Also I like Haliburton but not on this roster. I think he will be at his best playing a Smart like high minutes 6th man role. I don't love the idea of him as a starting PG now or in the future. I don't think he will be able to create off the dribble well enough to ever to a teams secondary initiator. Instead I see him as a glue piece who like Smart comes off the bench but finishes most games. If they trade back he would be a nice Warriors 6th man, the same may be true if drafted by Suns or the Wizards where could back up Rubio/Booker or Wall/Beal.

The offense will run through Tatum and Brown going forward, and we need players who compliment that. Halliburton makes great decisions with the basketball. He wouldn't be depended on to consistently break defenses. We need a long defensive point who can make good decisions when Tatum and Brown pass out of double teams.

If we added a Shaun Livingston type on this roster, I think that would be a major add.

That being said, Marcus Smart isn't likly being traded for this pick.

Re: Would Atlanta Hawks deal the 6th pick?
« Reply #11 on: October 09, 2020, 10:39:34 AM »

Online Csfan1984

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The version of this trade that makes the most sense to me would be with Hayward and Collins involved.

It's unclear what the Hawks have planned for Collins, but it is apparent they did not view him as the future big man on their roster after trading for Dedmon and Capella. Maybe they view him more as a scoring forward, which, honestly, he might be. But combine those trades with the rumors that the Hawks might have been looking to trade him at the deadline, and I think it may be apparent that the Hawks don't like his fit with Young.

The Hawks can absorb Hayward's full contract into their cap space, generating a sizable trade exemption back to the Cs. This exemption could be used on an expiring contract like Steven Adam or Andre Drummond at the deadline without putting us back into the luxury tax.

The Hawks apparently feel the pressure to put some veterans around Trae Young and try to win. Hayward can run an effective offense while Young is off the court and play off of Young when they play together. This also keeps their cap flexibility for next summer, when they may feel they could be in the running for a big free agent to pair with their dynamic guard. The Hawks also get multiple swings at 3-D players to put next to Trae Young--that don't have a single one yet.

For the Cs, there are four positives. First, it puts off the repeater tax for another year. Second, it gets us a top 6 pick that could turn into a key young piece to put with Tatum and Brown. Third, it gives us a huge trade exemption that can be used to absorb a huge expiring contract veteran for our playoff push without going into the luxury tax. Fourth, it gives us a look at John Collins.

I think without John Collins in this trade, there are still enough positives for the Cs to consider it. But how you view him might really affect whether this trade gets done. My personal opinion is that if CBS can turn Sullinger, Olynyk, Zeller, Amir Johnson (at the end of his career) and even Daniel Theis (who I think had more natural defensive ability than the aforementioned players) into defensive advanced stat darlings, then he could probably do it with Collins. Collins is really, really long and tall. He also has a ridiculous vertical. There are times when he gets vertical, or gets a trailing block on a ball-handler, or uses his quick hands to poke the ball away, and I think, "Maybe he could be a switchy center that is effective in small stints."

Obviously, the greatest benefit is that Collins is one of the best shot finishers in the NBA--at the rim, from three, driving, postups, rolling, offensive rebounds, etc. This dude gets buckets. I wonder if pairing a player like him with Tatum's newfound playmaking elevate Tatum's passing even more. I wonder if having a highly effective scorer inside would pull attention for Brown, Walker, and Tatum and make them more effective scorers.

At worst, he's a more versatile version of Montrezl Harrell, who gets buckets but can play defense. That's a player that can be very valuable to our team.
If Hawks like Okongwu, Collins could be moved. Don't see 6th pick and Collins being in a deal for Hayward and the three first. Just not enough. Collins works well with Young but they need another shooter and plus a stretch big off the bench.

Re: Would Atlanta Hawks deal the 6th pick?
« Reply #12 on: October 09, 2020, 10:54:02 AM »

Offline jambr380

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The version of this trade that makes the most sense to me would be with Hayward and Collins involved.

It's unclear what the Hawks have planned for Collins, but it is apparent they did not view him as the future big man on their roster after trading for Dedmon and Capella. Maybe they view him more as a scoring forward, which, honestly, he might be. But combine those trades with the rumors that the Hawks might have been looking to trade him at the deadline, and I think it may be apparent that the Hawks don't like his fit with Young.

The Hawks can absorb Hayward's full contract into their cap space, generating a sizable trade exemption back to the Cs. This exemption could be used on an expiring contract like Steven Adam or Andre Drummond at the deadline without putting us back into the luxury tax.

The Hawks apparently feel the pressure to put some veterans around Trae Young and try to win. Hayward can run an effective offense while Young is off the court and play off of Young when they play together. This also keeps their cap flexibility for next summer, when they may feel they could be in the running for a big free agent to pair with their dynamic guard. The Hawks also get multiple swings at 3-D players to put next to Trae Young--that don't have a single one yet.

For the Cs, there are four positives. First, it puts off the repeater tax for another year. Second, it gets us a top 6 pick that could turn into a key young piece to put with Tatum and Brown. Third, it gives us a huge trade exemption that can be used to absorb a huge expiring contract veteran for our playoff push without going into the luxury tax. Fourth, it gives us a look at John Collins.

I think without John Collins in this trade, there are still enough positives for the Cs to consider it. But how you view him might really affect whether this trade gets done. My personal opinion is that if CBS can turn Sullinger, Olynyk, Zeller, Amir Johnson (at the end of his career) and even Daniel Theis (who I think had more natural defensive ability than the aforementioned players) into defensive advanced stat darlings, then he could probably do it with Collins. Collins is really, really long and tall. He also has a ridiculous vertical. There are times when he gets vertical, or gets a trailing block on a ball-handler, or uses his quick hands to poke the ball away, and I think, "Maybe he could be a switchy center that is effective in small stints."

Obviously, the greatest benefit is that Collins is one of the best shot finishers in the NBA--at the rim, from three, driving, postups, rolling, offensive rebounds, etc. This dude gets buckets. I wonder if pairing a player like him with Tatum's newfound playmaking elevate Tatum's passing even more. I wonder if having a highly effective scorer inside would pull attention for Brown, Walker, and Tatum and make them more effective scorers.

At worst, he's a more versatile version of Montrezl Harrell, who gets buckets but can play defense. That's a player that can be very valuable to our team.

I'm all for re-signing Hayward at a $20M/yr salary, but this would be a great deal for the Cs. I've always liked Collins and he obviously can score from all over. I am not sure of his defensive abilities, but if we're able to hold on to TL/Theis, then I think it allows us some flexibility on that end.

Being able to re-start the clock on the luxury tax would be enormous (we could conceivably get there by restructuring Hayward's contract, too). And the TPE is a totally underrated part of this deal.

Again, I do have interest in keeping Hayward, but I am also aware of how far we went without him in these playoffs. Just having him available [healthy] would have been a huge upgrade, but simply adding Collins would likely have been just as useful and would have balanced our line-up a bit more.

Re: Would Atlanta Hawks deal the 6th pick?
« Reply #13 on: October 09, 2020, 11:20:46 AM »

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Aforementioned deal would be something like:

Hawks receive: Gordon Hayward, 14, 27, 30
Celtics receive: John Collins, 6, $34,187085 trade exemption.

Hawks:
Young, PG Free Agent (Dunn? Clarkson? Van Fleet? Augustin?)
Heurter, 14th pick (Saddiq Bey), 27th pick (Desmond Bane?)
Hayward, Reddish
Hunter, 30th pick (Reggie Perry?)
Capella, Dedmon, Fernando

Celtics:
Walker, Smart, Wanamaker
Brown, Langford
Tatum, 6th pick (Okongwu, Haliburton, Wiseman, Hayes, etc.)
Collins, Grant Williams
Theis, Rob Williams

Then at the deadline, the Cs could pair their 2021 1st rounder to grab a veteran to help us like Conley, Adams, Drummond, Aldridge, Green, Zeller, Reddick, etc.

I would also add that doing this allows the Cs to use their full MLE this off-season on another veteran rotation player. Joe Harris or Davis Bertans would be great additions to our roster.

Re: Would Atlanta Hawks deal the 6th pick?
« Reply #14 on: October 09, 2020, 12:07:27 PM »

Online CFAN38

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For the 2020 draft, the Hawks look like the only team that we could trade up with.

They need defensive players and the GM has already shown he likes having multiple picks.

Kemba Walker isn't getting any younger, but given he's a star free agency signing, we can't trade him but for me...Tyrese Haliburton is his future replacement. He's the perfect guard for Stevens team first system and Tatum's shot making, he's highly intelligent, tall, long and a two way team first player.

Atlanta need defenders and leaders...Marcus Smart would be perfect for them next to Trae Young, along with our 2020 picks should be more than enough to make the trade possible.

Would you could consider this trade?

Multiple higher end media sources have speculated that 14,26, and 30 should be enough to land 7 from the pistons. With that in mind if DA really wants Haliburton he should be able to get him without giving up Smart.

Also I like Haliburton but not on this roster. I think he will be at his best playing a Smart like high minutes 6th man role. I don't love the idea of him as a starting PG now or in the future. I don't think he will be able to create off the dribble well enough to ever to a teams secondary initiator. Instead I see him as a glue piece who like Smart comes off the bench but finishes most games. If they trade back he would be a nice Warriors 6th man, the same may be true if drafted by Suns or the Wizards where could back up Rubio/Booker or Wall/Beal.

The offense will run through Tatum and Brown going forward, and we need players who compliment that. Halliburton makes great decisions with the basketball. He wouldn't be depended on to consistently break defenses. We need a long defensive point who can make good decisions when Tatum and Brown pass out of double teams.

If we added a Shaun Livingston type on this roster, I think that would be a major add.

That being said, Marcus Smart isn't likely being traded for this pick.

When I look at last seasons roster Kemba, Tatum, and Hayward where all what I would consider offensive initiators. They are able to create shots for themselves and others. Smart has some creation equity as a P&R passer, Brown creates in transition but is much more of a role player in the half court.

With Hayward injured and Kemba not looking 100% Tatum was pressed into a more primary creation role and over all did a good job with it. Looking to the future I expect Tatum to solidify himself as a primary initiator and for Brown to continue improving his decision making in the half court. I also expect we will see a gradual decline in Kemba's ability to create separation and with Hayward we don't know how healthy he will be or home long his is on the roster.

This is why despite the surface need to add shooting or a better big to pair with Theis I think a guard who can at least project as a secondary initiator should be a priority in this draft.   
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