Poll

Who you got at #14? (players are listed in random order)

Tyrell Terry
13 (25%)
Patrick Williams
6 (11.5%)
Precious Achiuwa
4 (7.7%)
R.J. Hampton
4 (7.7%)
Aleksej Pokusevski
3 (5.8%)
Saddiq Bey
5 (9.6%)
Jalen Smith
4 (7.7%)
Aaron Nesmith
7 (13.5%)
Kira Lewis Jr.
3 (5.8%)
Cole Anthony
2 (3.8%)
other (please name below and I'll include him in the poll)
1 (1.9%)

Total Members Voted: 52

Author Topic: Who You Got with the 14th Pick? (Poll added)  (Read 38190 times)

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Re: Who You Got with the 14th Pick?
« Reply #75 on: August 19, 2020, 01:53:09 PM »

Offline Csfan1984

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If I was taking a boom or bust pick at 14 I'd take Jaden McDaniels. He has serious upside but wasn't very efficient. It would be interesting see him developed.

I doubt he will be available at 14.  Just too much upside to pass up.  Someone like Cole Anthony will drop instead.

The top 12 I have (in no order)

Edwards
Wiseman
Toppin
Vassell
Haliburton
Hayes
Okongwu
Avdija
Ball
Okoro
Patrick Williams
Jaden Mcdaniels

I don't see it with McDaniels. I'd need to do more research into his film outside of playing for Washington, but I don't think he can play in the NBA. I don't see the upside. I see a guy who has a ton of bad habits, question marks about his body, and I've heard some question marks about his character.

Check out the highlight film below

how many players do you know that is 6'9-6'10 with 7'0-7'1 wingspan that can do the things JM can do? His game is sort of Tatumesque (especially dribble stop and pop).  His jump shot has a high release.  And he is not afraid to drive/absorb contact for the finish.   He is a good re bounder considering that he is still has mass to tack on.  Also good passer and shot blocker. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HxK-gseLDpM&t=113s
I felt the same as DFC as far as the guy's overall play but as you point out there are a lot of flashes in moments.
So think both of you guys have a fair opinion. Which I'd why I said biggest boom or bust pick at 14 for me.


Also am I the only one who is iffy on Vassell. The guy seemed to be more of a complement than a leading force. I wonder if he has the attitude to be a elite player or ends up just a bench guy. It's hard for me to think he is a lottery pick being simply a role player in college that looked good.

Re: Who You Got with the 14th Pick?
« Reply #76 on: August 19, 2020, 03:01:55 PM »

Offline footey

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If I was taking a boom or bust pick at 14 I'd take Jaden McDaniels. He has serious upside but wasn't very efficient. It would be interesting see him developed.

I doubt he will be available at 14.  Just too much upside to pass up.  Someone like Cole Anthony will drop instead.

The top 12 I have (in no order)

Edwards
Wiseman
Toppin
Vassell
Haliburton
Hayes
Okongwu
Avdija
Ball
Okoro
Patrick Williams
Jaden Mcdaniels

I think McDaniels will be available at 26. Bad idea to draft at 14. Too soon.

Re: Who You Got with the 14th Pick?
« Reply #77 on: August 19, 2020, 03:30:45 PM »

Offline DefenseWinsChamps

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If I was taking a boom or bust pick at 14 I'd take Jaden McDaniels. He has serious upside but wasn't very efficient. It would be interesting see him developed.

I doubt he will be available at 14.  Just too much upside to pass up.  Someone like Cole Anthony will drop instead.

The top 12 I have (in no order)

Edwards
Wiseman
Toppin
Vassell
Haliburton
Hayes
Okongwu
Avdija
Ball
Okoro
Patrick Williams
Jaden Mcdaniels

I don't see it with McDaniels. I'd need to do more research into his film outside of playing for Washington, but I don't think he can play in the NBA. I don't see the upside. I see a guy who has a ton of bad habits, question marks about his body, and I've heard some question marks about his character.

Check out the highlight film below

how many players do you know that is 6'9-6'10 with 7'0-7'1 wingspan that can do the things JM can do? His game is sort of Tatumesque (especially dribble stop and pop).  His jump shot has a high release.  And he is not afraid to drive/absorb contact for the finish.   He is a good re bounder considering that he is still has mass to tack on.  Also good passer and shot blocker. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HxK-gseLDpM&t=113s
I felt the same as DFC as far as the guy's overall play but as you point out there are a lot of flashes in moments.
So think both of you guys have a fair opinion. Which I'd why I said biggest boom or bust pick at 14 for me.


Also am I the only one who is iffy on Vassell. The guy seemed to be more of a complement than a leading force. I wonder if he has the attitude to be a elite player or ends up just a bench guy. It's hard for me to think he is a lottery pick being simply a role player in college that looked good.

Here's my two cents on McDaniels. He's a 6'10" shooting guard, but not in the good way. He's not 6'10" in the sense he's super-versatile or able to use his length. He doesn't (can't?) use his length to score inside like Tatum or Siakim or someone like that. Meanwhile, he's a shooting guard without the handle or quickness to beat his man or get separation. His percentages were low this year against mediocre competition and all those highlights in that video including a lot of meh athletes forcing him into contested shots. What will that look like in the NBA?

I see the allure, and sometimes a player like him does develop into something like Rashard Lewis. But other times, players like him develop into Jonathan Bender. I think I would be really interested to see how his body looks after 6 months out of the spotlight. Did he work on his quickness? Is he a little bulkier? Maybe I'd consider him more if I saw some high level work ethic.

Re: Who You Got with the 14th Pick?
« Reply #78 on: August 19, 2020, 06:28:50 PM »

Online gouki88

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If I was taking a boom or bust pick at 14 I'd take Jaden McDaniels. He has serious upside but wasn't very efficient. It would be interesting see him developed.

I doubt he will be available at 14.  Just too much upside to pass up.  Someone like Cole Anthony will drop instead.

The top 12 I have (in no order)

Edwards
Wiseman
Toppin
Vassell
Haliburton
Hayes
Okongwu
Avdija
Ball
Okoro
Patrick Williams
Jaden Mcdaniels
Jaden McDaniels is projected to go 25-30 because he's not very good at the moment. He's a very inefficient scorer (eFG of 47%, TS% of 51.5), he's physically weak, turns it over a lot (over 20% turnover rate), doesn't have a great wingspan (6'11.5" for a 6'10" guy) and didn't contribute to wins by any real advanced metric. Bad offensive and defensive box +/- and weak win shares on both ends.

There is no way he's worth a lottery pick given there are at least 5 SF's better than him in Avdija, Okoro, Nesmith, Saddiq Bey & Tyler Bey, and 5 PF's better than him in Okongwu, Toppin, Williams, Poku and Jalen Smith.

Re: Who You Got with the 14th Pick?
« Reply #79 on: August 19, 2020, 11:55:04 PM »

Offline ImShakHeIsShaq

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if we keep the pick, believe me, danny is going to pick a defender. He's not going to pick anyone who will want touches at this moment. My guess is he will pick a defensive, pass first pg! i don't know who that is but it's my gut feeling. for sure it won't be a big because that's not Cs bag, DA and CBS aren't a fan of bigs.


Can someone give me an idea on who to look for in that mold? Pass first and defensive PG or SG. Bigger Waters is what I'm looking for.
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Re: Who You Got with the 14th Pick?
« Reply #80 on: August 20, 2020, 01:07:12 AM »

Offline Tr1boy

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If I was taking a boom or bust pick at 14 I'd take Jaden McDaniels. He has serious upside but wasn't very efficient. It would be interesting see him developed.

I doubt he will be available at 14.  Just too much upside to pass up.  Someone like Cole Anthony will drop instead.

The top 12 I have (in no order)

Edwards
Wiseman
Toppin
Vassell
Haliburton
Hayes
Okongwu
Avdija
Ball
Okoro
Patrick Williams
Jaden Mcdaniels
Jaden McDaniels is projected to go 25-30 because he's not very good at the moment. He's a very inefficient scorer (eFG of 47%, TS% of 51.5), he's physically weak, turns it over a lot (over 20% turnover rate), doesn't have a great wingspan (6'11.5" for a 6'10" guy) and didn't contribute to wins by any real advanced metric. Bad offensive and defensive box +/- and weak win shares on both ends.

There is no way he's worth a lottery pick given there are at least 5 SF's better than him in Avdija, Okoro, Nesmith, Saddiq Bey & Tyler Bey, and 5 PF's better than him in Okongwu, Toppin, Williams, Poku and Jalen Smith.

Didnt you just describe Fultz or Langford(school situation) in a nutshell?

Going to a bad school doesnt mean you are a bad player

And having a 6'10 wingspan but is also close to 6'10... you left that part out

He was a rookie. He has things to iron out. But he has innate skills, that some guys could never develop/execute even with hours of work

I'm looking at his upside more than ground work

This is how he slips out of top 10. Celts can then try to refine his body, efficiency etc. Like they have done and will continue to do with Langford
« Last Edit: August 20, 2020, 01:17:50 AM by Tr1boy »

Re: Who You Got with the 14th Pick?
« Reply #81 on: August 20, 2020, 01:17:05 AM »

Offline Tr1boy

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If I was taking a boom or bust pick at 14 I'd take Jaden McDaniels. He has serious upside but wasn't very efficient. It would be interesting see him developed.

I doubt he will be available at 14.  Just too much upside to pass up.  Someone like Cole Anthony will drop instead.

The top 12 I have (in no order)

Edwards
Wiseman
Toppin
Vassell
Haliburton
Hayes
Okongwu
Avdija
Ball
Okoro
Patrick Williams
Jaden Mcdaniels

I don't see it with McDaniels. I'd need to do more research into his film outside of playing for Washington, but I don't think he can play in the NBA. I don't see the upside. I see a guy who has a ton of bad habits, question marks about his body, and I've heard some question marks about his character.

Check out the highlight film below

how many players do you know that is 6'9-6'10 with 7'0-7'1 wingspan that can do the things JM can do? His game is sort of Tatumesque (especially dribble stop and pop).  His jump shot has a high release.  And he is not afraid to drive/absorb contact for the finish.   He is a good re bounder considering that he is still has mass to tack on.  Also good passer and shot blocker. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HxK-gseLDpM&t=113s
I felt the same as DFC as far as the guy's overall play but as you point out there are a lot of flashes in moments.
So think both of you guys have a fair opinion. Which I'd why I said biggest boom or bust pick at 14 for me.


Also am I the only one who is iffy on Vassell. The guy seemed to be more of a complement than a leading force. I wonder if he has the attitude to be a elite player or ends up just a bench guy. It's hard for me to think he is a lottery pick being simply a role player in college that looked good.

Here's my two cents on McDaniels. He's a 6'10" shooting guard, but not in the good way. He's not 6'10" in the sense he's super-versatile or able to use his length. He doesn't (can't?) use his length to score inside like Tatum or Siakim or someone like that. Meanwhile, he's a shooting guard without the handle or quickness to beat his man or get separation. His percentages were low this year against mediocre competition and all those highlights in that video including a lot of meh athletes forcing him into contested shots. What will that look like in the NBA?

I see the allure, and sometimes a player like him does develop into something like Rashard Lewis. But other times, players like him develop into Jonathan Bender. I think I would be really interested to see how his body looks after 6 months out of the spotlight. Did he work on his quickness? Is he a little bulkier? Maybe I'd consider him more if I saw some high level work ethic.

6'10 SG?? I can buy that

Cam Johnson is sort of similar... tall, skinny, good shooter

People said he was going to go in the 20s this past draft

But phx didnt listen ... look at Coby White reaction during the pick  ;D

Phx got the pick correct imo. Solid pick

Re: Who You Got with the 14th Pick?
« Reply #82 on: August 20, 2020, 02:13:29 AM »

Online gouki88

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If I was taking a boom or bust pick at 14 I'd take Jaden McDaniels. He has serious upside but wasn't very efficient. It would be interesting see him developed.

I doubt he will be available at 14.  Just too much upside to pass up.  Someone like Cole Anthony will drop instead.

The top 12 I have (in no order)

Edwards
Wiseman
Toppin
Vassell
Haliburton
Hayes
Okongwu
Avdija
Ball
Okoro
Patrick Williams
Jaden Mcdaniels
Jaden McDaniels is projected to go 25-30 because he's not very good at the moment. He's a very inefficient scorer (eFG of 47%, TS% of 51.5), he's physically weak, turns it over a lot (over 20% turnover rate), doesn't have a great wingspan (6'11.5" for a 6'10" guy) and didn't contribute to wins by any real advanced metric. Bad offensive and defensive box +/- and weak win shares on both ends.

There is no way he's worth a lottery pick given there are at least 5 SF's better than him in Avdija, Okoro, Nesmith, Saddiq Bey & Tyler Bey, and 5 PF's better than him in Okongwu, Toppin, Williams, Poku and Jalen Smith.

Didnt you just describe Fultz or Langford(school situation) in a nutshell?

Going to a bad school doesnt mean you are a bad player

And having a 6'10 wingspan but is also close to 6'10... you left that part out

He was a rookie. He has things to iron out. But he has innate skills, that some guys could never develop/execute even with hours of work

I'm looking at his upside more than ground work

This is how he slips out of top 10. Celts can then try to refine his body, efficiency etc. Like they have done and will continue to do with Langford
No, they were both considerably better college players than McDaniels was.

I didnít leave the part about his height out, you just skimmed over what I wrote. An ape index of +1.5 is well below average for an NBA player. Langford has a +6 ape index, and Fultz has a +5 ape index - both were heavier than McDaniels is now also. Way more NBA ready bodies with NBA-level frames and NBA-level athleticism than McDaniels possesses.

McDaniels isnít even going top 20 according to most, which is fair considering his pretty awful collegiate play. The only reason people are considering him as a first round pick is his size and his youth. Him going too 10 or even lottery would be a horrible reach.

Heís not the kind of guy we should bother with. Heíll never get minutes on this team as heís a weak defender all around and a weak passer, which is what our rookies get minutes on to begin with, and heís not a position of need at all

Re: Who You Got with the 14th Pick?
« Reply #83 on: August 20, 2020, 03:44:23 PM »

Offline RPGenerate

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On Jaden McDaniels, he definitely isn't at the top of my list for #14 in terms of prospects or even just wings. He's way too raw, and while his measurements are good, they aren't overly impressive. He's as thin as a rail, with a similar body type to guys like Jonathan Isaac and Brandon Ingram when they came out of college, but without the massive wingspan of either of those players. Isaac and Ingram's game was also far more polished at this point than McDaniels.

However, similar to the sentiment Roy brought up about a different player, if Danny and Brad see something in him that would cause them to confidently pick him at #14, I'd be fine with it. Under Brad I could see McDaniels developing into an NBA player. Would rather use our late first round pick to get him tho.
2020 Celticsstrong All-2000s Draft: Denver Nuggets:
PG: Gary Payton / Steve Francis
SG: Kyrie Irving / Raja Bell / Danny Green
SF: Rip Hamiltion / Glenn Robinson / Robert Covington
PF: Carmelo Anthony / Draymond Green / Anthony Mason
C: Tim Duncan / DeMarcus Cousins / Zydrunas Ilgauskas

Re: Who You Got with the 14th Pick?
« Reply #84 on: August 20, 2020, 06:03:47 PM »

Offline Csfan1984

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if we keep the pick, believe me, danny is going to pick a defender. He's not going to pick anyone who will want touches at this moment. My guess is he will pick a defensive, pass first pg! i don't know who that is but it's my gut feeling. for sure it won't be a big because that's not Cs bag, DA and CBS aren't a fan of bigs.


Can someone give me an idea on who to look for in that mold? Pass first and defensive PG or SG. Bigger Waters is what I'm looking for.
Theo Maledon from what I've seen fits as a bigger Waters.

Re: Who You Got with the 14th Pick?
« Reply #85 on: August 20, 2020, 07:05:09 PM »

Offline tenn_smoothie

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Danny and Brad may not like "bigs."  But they ain't winning a title until they get more talent and size in the post.
I like Theis, Kanter and Rob Williams, their competitiveness, hustle, willingness to play their role, etc.
But we ain't hanging another banner with any of them starting.
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Re: Who You Got with the 14th Pick?
« Reply #86 on: August 20, 2020, 07:19:49 PM »

Online gouki88

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Danny and Brad may not like "bigs."  But they ain't winning a title until they get more talent and size in the post.
I like Theis, Kanter and Rob Williams, their competitiveness, hustle, willingness to play their role, etc.
But we ain't hanging another banner with any of them starting.
I still think Rob Williams could develop into a starting calibre big man. I could easily see him developing into a Theo Ratliff type of big, except with better passing and less blocked shots. Hopefully less injury-prone too.

I posted in another thread a few big-men who I think we should look at in the 2021 draft (as I see this one as quite shallow. I like guys like Nnaji and Tillman as genuine big-men, or Paul Reed as undersized 5s, but next years the one. I'll copy and paste the info about them in case you wanted to look.

Ibou Dianko Badji: 7'1", 230lbs with a 7'8" wingspan. I feel like he'll rise a lot though. Looks like a clone of Dikembe on film.

Oscar Tshiebwe: 6'9, 260lbs with a 7'4" wingspan. Amazing rebounder (over 9RPG in just over 20MPG as a freshman) and active on defence.

Amar Sylla: 6'9", 200lbs with a 7'2" wingspan. Really raw but has all the tools, seen lots of forwards in this mould over the last few years.

Moussa Cisse: 6'10", 215lbs with a 7'1.5" wingspan. Really coordinated athletic big, swats a lot of shots.

A lot depends on what happens with our pick from the Grizzlies

Re: Who You Got with the 14th Pick?
« Reply #87 on: August 20, 2020, 07:41:51 PM »

Offline tenn_smoothie

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If ppl think that Grant & Robert Williams are our future starters than I got magic sand to sell ya

A realist is on the board.

Thanks Gouk. Attractive prospects and it may be true that our best chance to improve in the post is next year. I'd like to keep Kanter and Williams. Theis too, for that matter, but may not be possible to keep him if we draft an upgrade at center. Just hope Danny is not completely blinded by his obsession with perimeter players and can see we need more to overcome the Bucks, Lakers, Clippers and future teams like Mavericks and the regrouped Warriors.
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Russell - Cowens - Bird - Garnett

The Four Celtic Lieutenants:
Cousy - Havlicek - McHale - Pierce

Re: Who You Got with the 14th Pick?
« Reply #88 on: August 20, 2020, 08:00:42 PM »

Offline tenn_smoothie

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Why is it exactly that we were unable to keep Baynes ? He would have been a huge asset to this group.

We simply don't have any size to throw at Embiid, Giannis, the Lopez brothers, Davis and Lebron, Siakim or Vucevic.
Celts do manage to win some of these games, but we get eaten alive inside against the bigger contenders.
We are too dependent on our 3-point shooting to compete at the top of the league.
The Four Celtic Generals:
Russell - Cowens - Bird - Garnett

The Four Celtic Lieutenants:
Cousy - Havlicek - McHale - Pierce

Re: Who You Got with the 14th Pick?
« Reply #89 on: August 20, 2020, 09:01:54 PM »

Offline footey

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Why is it exactly that we were unable to keep Baynes ? He would have been a huge asset to this group.

We simply don't have any size to throw at Embiid, Giannis, the Lopez brothers, Davis and Lebron, Siakim or Vucevic.
Celts do manage to win some of these games, but we get eaten alive inside against the bigger contenders.
We are too dependent on our 3-point shooting to compete at the top of the league.

Needed cap space to sign Kemba.