Is Kemba Walker or Kyrie Irving the more appealing free-agent point guard?

[ConnerHenry]

From ESPN today. They feel Walker is more appealing. Link and full article below

http://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/26387828/buy-sell-kemba-better-free-agent-target-kyrie

Buy or sell: Kemba Walker is a better free-agent target than Kyrie Irving

At the end of the season, Irving will become a free agent. Though he said before the season that he anticipated re-signing with the Celtics, he has since left the door open to the possibility that he could sign elsewhere. This makes him one of the most coveted free agents on the market, tied in rumors to every major market team with cap space from the East to the West.

But when you take a step back, is Irving even the best point guard prospect in the 2019 free-agent class? Is it possible that Walker could actually be a better target?

Irving is an electric guard, combining incredible ballhandling ability with an excellent jump shot and a fearless attitude to make him one of the highest impact offensive players in the league. Walker has a very similar set of skills, though, and utilizes them to similar effect. A perusal of their stylistic approaches to the game -- and how effective they are -- speaks to what they would bring to a new team.
Editor's Picks

Irving and Walker are both among the best in the NBA as ballhandlers in screens. The pick-and-roll is one of the most difficult plays to defend in basketball, and a masterful operator of the set imbalances defenses, creates open looks and finishes at a high clip to put pressure on the entire opposing unit. Per Second Spectrum data, Irving has utilized 18.7 direct picks per game (18th most in NBA) since joining the Celtics. He has generated 1.06 points per pick directly ending in a shot or assist opportunity, tied for the second-best mark in the NBA. Walker actually runs the set more often, utilizing 25.9 direct picks per game (fourth in NBA) at a similar efficiency (1.05 points per direct pick).

Both are also excellent at breaking down defenses off the dribble. Irving has generated 1.15 points per direct drive during the past two seasons (tied for first among players with at least 500 drives) on 9.6 direct drives per game, per Second Spectrum. Walker has generated 1.08 points per direct drive on 10.6 drives per game. Although Irving was slightly more efficient, Walker's aggressiveness has generated more foul shots (7.5 vs. 6.0 per 100 possessions).

One area in which Irving has had a clear advantage is with his jumper, particularly when operating off the ball. Walker has a great jump shot, but Irving's has been better. These numbers do require some context, as Irving has played with more offensively talented teammates. Considering how similar their percentages are when working off the dribble, it is possible that some of Irving's advantages in the two catch-and-shoot categories could come from better spacing and more attention paid to teammates.

Moving beyond the stylistic comparison, Walker acquits himself very well against Irving in overall offensive impact. A review of offensive real plus minus (ORPM) over the past two seasons indicates that Walker and Irving have been very similar, with the slight advantage to Walker. Irving currently ranks ninth in the NBA with an ORPM of plus-3.9, which indicates that his presence on the floor has correlated with an improvement of 3.9 points per 100 possessions in the Celtics' offense. Walker is right there ahead of him, ranking eighth in the NBA with an ORPM of plus-4.0. A similar relationship held true last season, with Irving having a big offensive impact (plus-3.7 ORPM, 13th in NBA) but Walker having an incrementally larger one (plus-4.4, sixth in NBA).

There are other factors to consider in this comparison as well. Irving is undoubtedly the bigger draw, with Uncle Drew fame and a championship pedigree from his days playing next to LeBron James in Cleveland. Walker is lesser known after toiling in a smaller market like Charlotte during his NBA career, though he still has some recognition from his legendary NCAA championship run with UConn. With Irving's added fame has come added difficulties, though, from his publicized breakup with LeBron in Cleveland to the equally public growing pains of the Celtics this season. Walker has seemingly avoided similar drama -- instead earning a reputation as a leader and team player while growing into a perennial All Star for the Hornets.

Walker has also been by far the healthier of the two, missing only six games since the start of the 2015-16 season. Irving, on the other hand, has missed 74 games during that same period, and also sat out the 2018 playoffs because of a series of injuries. Though Irving is slightly younger, having just turned 27 while Walker will be 29 in May, Walker has much less wear and tear. Walker appears to carry less of an injury risk.

Irving is set to become one of the most coveted free agents in the NBA this offseason, but Walker plays a similar style with similar results. Walker is one of the biggest offensive impact players in the NBA, he has a more reliable injury history and appears to be a more stable locker room presence. Thus, I buy that Walker is actually a better free-agent target than Irving this offseason.

[Monkhouse]

Irving is the more appealing free-agent point guard, and it's not even close in my book.

I always felt like Kemba Walker was the most underappreciated All-Star in the East, I know he won All-NBA Team, but it doesn't discount the fact that the entire offense and quite literally crunch time buckets are solely committed by Walker, and Walker alone. Formidable undersized guard that zips and zags throughout the big men, he uses a lot of hesitation, and pound dribbles to keep his defenders wary of his next move. The problem is while Walker has more FTA, and is certainly the more virulent, in your face, going straight to the rim kind of player. We've seen what happens to players that are undersized and coming off of injuries.

As much as people crap on Irving for his questionable injury history, Walker has had 3 surgeries in 3 years. From 2015-2017, and all in the same left leg. Not looking good, not to mention his effort on defense should be awarded, but the results just haven't been pretty. He's a sieve on defense, he's undersized, but boy can he score.

But is he better than Irving? I don't know, I would lean towards, probably not, but while Irving is the more appealing free-agent point guard, Walker is definitely the heart and soul of the CHA.

The Hornets have been one of the biggest running joke in sports. Desperate for something, even any tinkle of playoff aspirations led to make the trade for Gerald Wallace, giving up some assets, only to flunk out by getting swept. With the 2nd round pick, they drafted MKG, who I believed was Wallace on steroids.

You would think a player like MKG, would've been perfect alongside Walker, but you take a look at their roster, and you wonder why the heck they even bothered drafting a defensive specialist wing that cannot shoot.

I'll just leave this here...

https://streamable.com/fqd8p

[RPGenerate]

Kyrie Irving, 100%. He's a proven playoff performer, and until I can see what Kemba can do in the playoffs, there's no way I can put Kemba over Kyrie.

[td450]

Generally speaking, it is difficult to make a good case for paying any point guards big money. Neither guy is worth it.

[Green-18]

From ESPN today. They feel Walker is more appealing. Link and full article below

http://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/26387828/buy-sell-kemba-better-free-agent-target-kyrie

Buy or sell: Kemba Walker is a better free-agent target than Kyrie Irving

At the end of the season, Irving will become a free agent. Though he said before the season that he anticipated re-signing with the Celtics, he has since left the door open to the possibility that he could sign elsewhere. This makes him one of the most coveted free agents on the market, tied in rumors to every major market team with cap space from the East to the West.

But when you take a step back, is Irving even the best point guard prospect in the 2019 free-agent class? Is it possible that Walker could actually be a better target?

Irving is an electric guard, combining incredible ballhandling ability with an excellent jump shot and a fearless attitude to make him one of the highest impact offensive players in the league. Walker has a very similar set of skills, though, and utilizes them to similar effect. A perusal of their stylistic approaches to the game -- and how effective they are -- speaks to what they would bring to a new team.
Editor's Picks

Irving and Walker are both among the best in the NBA as ballhandlers in screens. The pick-and-roll is one of the most difficult plays to defend in basketball, and a masterful operator of the set imbalances defenses, creates open looks and finishes at a high clip to put pressure on the entire opposing unit. Per Second Spectrum data, Irving has utilized 18.7 direct picks per game (18th most in NBA) since joining the Celtics. He has generated 1.06 points per pick directly ending in a shot or assist opportunity, tied for the second-best mark in the NBA. Walker actually runs the set more often, utilizing 25.9 direct picks per game (fourth in NBA) at a similar efficiency (1.05 points per direct pick).

Both are also excellent at breaking down defenses off the dribble. Irving has generated 1.15 points per direct drive during the past two seasons (tied for first among players with at least 500 drives) on 9.6 direct drives per game, per Second Spectrum. Walker has generated 1.08 points per direct drive on 10.6 drives per game. Although Irving was slightly more efficient, Walker's aggressiveness has generated more foul shots (7.5 vs. 6.0 per 100 possessions).

One area in which Irving has had a clear advantage is with his jumper, particularly when operating off the ball. Walker has a great jump shot, but Irving's has been better. These numbers do require some context, as Irving has played with more offensively talented teammates. Considering how similar their percentages are when working off the dribble, it is possible that some of Irving's advantages in the two catch-and-shoot categories could come from better spacing and more attention paid to teammates.

Moving beyond the stylistic comparison, Walker acquits himself very well against Irving in overall offensive impact. A review of offensive real plus minus (ORPM) over the past two seasons indicates that Walker and Irving have been very similar, with the slight advantage to Walker. Irving currently ranks ninth in the NBA with an ORPM of plus-3.9, which indicates that his presence on the floor has correlated with an improvement of 3.9 points per 100 possessions in the Celtics' offense. Walker is right there ahead of him, ranking eighth in the NBA with an ORPM of plus-4.0. A similar relationship held true last season, with Irving having a big offensive impact (plus-3.7 ORPM, 13th in NBA) but Walker having an incrementally larger one (plus-4.4, sixth in NBA).

There are other factors to consider in this comparison as well. Irving is undoubtedly the bigger draw, with Uncle Drew fame and a championship pedigree from his days playing next to LeBron James in Cleveland. Walker is lesser known after toiling in a smaller market like Charlotte during his NBA career, though he still has some recognition from his legendary NCAA championship run with UConn. With Irving's added fame has come added difficulties, though, from his publicized breakup with LeBron in Cleveland to the equally public growing pains of the Celtics this season. Walker has seemingly avoided similar drama -- instead earning a reputation as a leader and team player while growing into a perennial All Star for the Hornets.

Walker has also been by far the healthier of the two, missing only six games since the start of the 2015-16 season. Irving, on the other hand, has missed 74 games during that same period, and also sat out the 2018 playoffs because of a series of injuries. Though Irving is slightly younger, having just turned 27 while Walker will be 29 in May, Walker has much less wear and tear. Walker appears to carry less of an injury risk.

Irving is set to become one of the most coveted free agents in the NBA this offseason, but Walker plays a similar style with similar results. Walker is one of the biggest offensive impact players in the NBA, he has a more reliable injury history and appears to be a more stable locker room presence. Thus, I buy that Walker is actually a better free-agent target than Irving this offseason.

It really depends on the criteria we are using.  The article is correct in stating that Walker is a more stable option.  Paired with another All-Star, I could see Kemba being part of a solid 45-50 win team that gets bounced in the first or second round every season.

With Irving you have a much higher risk vs reward.  Is it really possible to build a true contender around Kemba as a max contract player?  Also, Irving would likely bring an All-NBA caliber player with him if he leaves Boston.

Unless Kemba re-signs in Charlotte, he will likely be stuck waiting for Durant, Irving, and Leonard to make their decisions.  Maybe he partners with one of them but I think it's more realistic that he joins with a borderline All-Star instead.     

[Monkhouse]

From ESPN today. They feel Walker is more appealing. Link and full article below

http://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/26387828/buy-sell-kemba-better-free-agent-target-kyrie

Buy or sell: Kemba Walker is a better free-agent target than Kyrie Irving

At the end of the season, Irving will become a free agent. Though he said before the season that he anticipated re-signing with the Celtics, he has since left the door open to the possibility that he could sign elsewhere. This makes him one of the most coveted free agents on the market, tied in rumors to every major market team with cap space from the East to the West.

But when you take a step back, is Irving even the best point guard prospect in the 2019 free-agent class? Is it possible that Walker could actually be a better target?

Irving is an electric guard, combining incredible ballhandling ability with an excellent jump shot and a fearless attitude to make him one of the highest impact offensive players in the league. Walker has a very similar set of skills, though, and utilizes them to similar effect. A perusal of their stylistic approaches to the game -- and how effective they are -- speaks to what they would bring to a new team.
Editor's Picks

Irving and Walker are both among the best in the NBA as ballhandlers in screens. The pick-and-roll is one of the most difficult plays to defend in basketball, and a masterful operator of the set imbalances defenses, creates open looks and finishes at a high clip to put pressure on the entire opposing unit. Per Second Spectrum data, Irving has utilized 18.7 direct picks per game (18th most in NBA) since joining the Celtics. He has generated 1.06 points per pick directly ending in a shot or assist opportunity, tied for the second-best mark in the NBA. Walker actually runs the set more often, utilizing 25.9 direct picks per game (fourth in NBA) at a similar efficiency (1.05 points per direct pick).

Both are also excellent at breaking down defenses off the dribble. Irving has generated 1.15 points per direct drive during the past two seasons (tied for first among players with at least 500 drives) on 9.6 direct drives per game, per Second Spectrum. Walker has generated 1.08 points per direct drive on 10.6 drives per game. Although Irving was slightly more efficient, Walker's aggressiveness has generated more foul shots (7.5 vs. 6.0 per 100 possessions).

One area in which Irving has had a clear advantage is with his jumper, particularly when operating off the ball. Walker has a great jump shot, but Irving's has been better. These numbers do require some context, as Irving has played with more offensively talented teammates. Considering how similar their percentages are when working off the dribble, it is possible that some of Irving's advantages in the two catch-and-shoot categories could come from better spacing and more attention paid to teammates.

Moving beyond the stylistic comparison, Walker acquits himself very well against Irving in overall offensive impact. A review of offensive real plus minus (ORPM) over the past two seasons indicates that Walker and Irving have been very similar, with the slight advantage to Walker. Irving currently ranks ninth in the NBA with an ORPM of plus-3.9, which indicates that his presence on the floor has correlated with an improvement of 3.9 points per 100 possessions in the Celtics' offense. Walker is right there ahead of him, ranking eighth in the NBA with an ORPM of plus-4.0. A similar relationship held true last season, with Irving having a big offensive impact (plus-3.7 ORPM, 13th in NBA) but Walker having an incrementally larger one (plus-4.4, sixth in NBA).

There are other factors to consider in this comparison as well. Irving is undoubtedly the bigger draw, with Uncle Drew fame and a championship pedigree from his days playing next to LeBron James in Cleveland. Walker is lesser known after toiling in a smaller market like Charlotte during his NBA career, though he still has some recognition from his legendary NCAA championship run with UConn. With Irving's added fame has come added difficulties, though, from his publicized breakup with LeBron in Cleveland to the equally public growing pains of the Celtics this season. Walker has seemingly avoided similar drama -- instead earning a reputation as a leader and team player while growing into a perennial All Star for the Hornets.

Walker has also been by far the healthier of the two, missing only six games since the start of the 2015-16 season. Irving, on the other hand, has missed 74 games during that same period, and also sat out the 2018 playoffs because of a series of injuries. Though Irving is slightly younger, having just turned 27 while Walker will be 29 in May, Walker has much less wear and tear. Walker appears to carry less of an injury risk.

Irving is set to become one of the most coveted free agents in the NBA this offseason, but Walker plays a similar style with similar results. Walker is one of the biggest offensive impact players in the NBA, he has a more reliable injury history and appears to be a more stable locker room presence. Thus, I buy that Walker is actually a better free-agent target than Irving this offseason.

It really depends on the criteria we are using.  The article is correct in stating that Walker is a more stable option.  Paired with another All-Star, I could see Kemba being part of a solid 45-50 win team that gets bounced in the first or second round every season.

With Irving you have a much higher risk vs reward.  Is it really possible to build a true contender around Kemba as a max contract player?  Also, Irving would likely bring an All-NBA caliber player with him if he leaves Boston.

Unless Kemba re-signs in Charlotte, he will likely be stuck waiting for Durant, Irving, and Leonard to make their decisions.  Maybe he partners with one of them but I think it's more realistic that he joins with a borderline All-Star instead.   

I think that's the main difference.

Kemba suffers from the same issue that Isaiah Thomas suffered in Boston.

Fantastic scorer, but as the go to option, it's really tough unless you have players who can also help you in that department. Irving is the bigger draw, because he knows more players, is a champion, and has been widely celebrated more.

At the end of the day, superstar is just a label.

[Chris22]

Find a big man to sign.

Small guards don't win championships.

[jbpats]

Kyrie if you are trying to sell tickets and merchandise

Kemba if you trying to build a cohesive team without drama

[Monkhouse]

Kyrie if you're looking for someone that can hit a tough shot in Game 7

Kemba if you want to only make it to the 1st round

The hate here is ridiculous.

FTFY

[Who]

Kyrie = more defensive ability thanks to superior size. 

[jbpats]

Kyrie if you're looking for someone that can hit a tough shot in Game 7

Kemba if you want to only make it to the 1st round

The hate here is ridiculous.

FTFY

Love the way you rearranged my comment.

Kyrie didn’t even make it to the first round of the playoffs without lebron.

Kyrie is a fine player who hit a big shot.. but he had arguably the best player of all time on his team in his prime.

Lebron has two championship rings due to two shots that were not his own, Kyrie and Ray but let’s not sugarcoat why those teams were even in those positions in the first place.

If I had the choice of either player, kemba or Kyrie. I take the no nonsense one that is a slight tier below the other.. and kemba can hit big shots also - do people already forget what he did to us in the 4th two week ago?

[Roy H.]

I think the injury history + leadership points are fair.  I think they’re very similar players. Kyrie is very slightly better overall, though, and he’s younger and has been a vital player in multiple Finals runs (including the biggest shot in Game 7 against Golden State).

So, I take Kyrie, but both are fantastic franchise-level players.

[Monkhouse]

Kyrie if you're looking for someone that can hit a tough shot in Game 7

Kemba if you want to only make it to the 1st round

The hate here is ridiculous.

FTFY

Love the way you rearranged my comment.

Kyrie didn’t even make it to the first round of the playoffs without lebron.

Kyrie is a fine player who hit a big shot.. but he had arguably the best player of all time on his team in his prime.

Lebron has two championship rings due to two shots that were not his own, Kyrie and Ray but let’s not sugarcoat why those teams were even in those positions in the first place.

If I had the choice of either player, kemba or Kyrie. I take the no nonsense one that is a slight tier below the other.. and kemba can hit big shots also - do people already forget what he did to us in the 4th two week ago?

Considering how terrible his roster was 2011-2014, is it even that much of a surprise? You guys seriously expect an scoring first PG to be able to lead his team to the playoffs, when his best teammate was Dion Waiters?

Just like LeBron helped Irving to the playoffs, (it is a team game,) same should apply for Irving helped LeBron secure a championship for Cleveland.

Who's sugarcoating anything?

Oh yes, because regular season games are so important! 

Did you by any chance watch that video I posted?

By the way, Walker is now 0-28 against LeBron.

[jbpats]

Kyrie if you're looking for someone that can hit a tough shot in Game 7

Kemba if you want to only make it to the 1st round

The hate here is ridiculous.

FTFY

Love the way you rearranged my comment.

Kyrie didn’t even make it to the first round of the playoffs without lebron.

Kyrie is a fine player who hit a big shot.. but he had arguably the best player of all time on his team in his prime.

Lebron has two championship rings due to two shots that were not his own, Kyrie and Ray but let’s not sugarcoat why those teams were even in those positions in the first place.

If I had the choice of either player, kemba or Kyrie. I take the no nonsense one that is a slight tier below the other.. and kemba can hit big shots also - do people already forget what he did to us in the 4th two week ago?

Considering how terrible his roster was 2011-2014, is it even that much of a surprise? You guys seriously expect an scoring first PG to be able to lead his team to the playoffs, when his best teammate was Dion Waiters?

Just like LeBron helped Irving to the playoffs, (it is a team game,) same should apply for Irving helped LeBron secure a championship for Cleveland.

Who's sugarcoating anything?

Oh yes, because regular season games are so important! 

Did you by any chance watch that video I posted?

By the way, Walker is now 0-28 against LeBron.

Okay and by that logic how many all stars has kemba walker played with?

The Celtics have regressed with Kyrie. The Cavs were terrible with him (without Lebron)

The Cavs still made the championship without him last year.. how important is this guy really?

I feel like one big shot has defined his career, it’s always the first thing anybody ever says in their defense of Kyrie.. his game 7 shot.

Kyrie is great, I think he is better than kemba but only slightly. I personally would take Kemba, Kyrie is a lot more baggage and not that much better of a player to justify the head ache

How much dysfunction has come out of Charlotte with kemba as their leader.. none. Give me the guy who shuts up and puts it out on the court. Not the guy who can bring his entire team down because his moods change more frequently then the weather

[Moranis]

I think the injury history + leadership points are fair.  I think they’re very similar players. Kyrie is very slightly better overall, though, and he’s younger and has been a vital player in multiple Finals runs (including the biggest shot in Game 7 against Golden State).

So, I take Kyrie, but both are fantastic franchise-level players.

this is where I'm at as well.