The Kyrie Irving free agency thread(to sign 4yr/$141M w/Nets page 105)

[BringToughnessBack]

Yes 😁🤢..hoping for that scenario of him signing.

[gpap]

As for being booed if he doesn't play well, he and any athlete deserve it. This is Boston and we expect winners, not guys who are going to shoot 7 for 22. That applies to anybody else. And Kyrie would get the same reaction from fans of any other major sports city.

I disagree with this part.  I think fans that boo their own players suck, personally, especially if it's just because of a poor shooting night.

We are talking about two different things. Of course every player is going to have rough nights. They're humans after all. I am not saying players deserve to be booed for having a bad night. Over the course of an 82 game season (including playoffs), it's only natural.

My point was Kyrie consistently attempting shot after shot, instead of being cognizant of the fact that his shots weren't falling and then sharing the ball and trying to help his teammates in other ways.

It's not the bad nights that should draw jeers from the crowd, but consistently bad habits. And I feel it bears repeating that I'm a pro-Kyrie guy all the way. However, the optics aren't very good if you go 7-22 and then say "I should've attempted 30 shots."

[Roy H.]

As for being booed if he doesn't play well, he and any athlete deserve it. This is Boston and we expect winners, not guys who are going to shoot 7 for 22. That applies to anybody else. And Kyrie would get the same reaction from fans of any other major sports city.

I disagree with this part.  I think fans that boo their own players suck, personally, especially if it's just because of a poor shooting night.

We are talking about two different things. Of course every player is going to have rough nights. They're humans after all. I am not saying players deserve to be booed for having a bad night. Over the course of an 82 game season (including playoffs), it's only natural.

My point was Kyrie consistently attempting shot after shot, instead of being cognizant of the fact that his shots weren't falling and then sharing the ball and trying to help his teammates in other ways.

It's not the bad nights that should draw jeers from the crowd, but consistently bad habits.

It's not like Kyrie's teammates were shooting lights out.

[gpap]

As for being booed if he doesn't play well, he and any athlete deserve it. This is Boston and we expect winners, not guys who are going to shoot 7 for 22. That applies to anybody else. And Kyrie would get the same reaction from fans of any other major sports city.

I disagree with this part.  I think fans that boo their own players suck, personally, especially if it's just because of a poor shooting night.

We are talking about two different things. Of course every player is going to have rough nights. They're humans after all. I am not saying players deserve to be booed for having a bad night. Over the course of an 82 game season (including playoffs), it's only natural.

My point was Kyrie consistently attempting shot after shot, instead of being cognizant of the fact that his shots weren't falling and then sharing the ball and trying to help his teammates in other ways.

It's not the bad nights that should draw jeers from the crowd, but consistently bad habits.

It's not like Kyrie's teammates were shooting lights out.

Nope, they weren't. Kyrie isn't the only guy who deserves blame and I mentioned that last night. Stevens, Hayward, Ainge, Rozier, Tatum all deserve just as much blame, if not more.

[Roy H.]

As for being booed if he doesn't play well, he and any athlete deserve it. This is Boston and we expect winners, not guys who are going to shoot 7 for 22. That applies to anybody else. And Kyrie would get the same reaction from fans of any other major sports city.

I disagree with this part.  I think fans that boo their own players suck, personally, especially if it's just because of a poor shooting night.

It's more than just a poor shooting night. It's just an overall poor performance on both ends. . You will never see Celtic fans jeer on their team as long as they make effort.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUBsqfkBmYE

It looks like character don't matter to you. They are also a factor for championship recipe

Sure character matters.  I don't see anything that makes me think that Kyrie is low character, any more than any other player on the team.

Kyrie is who he is.  He's a great player who isn't a great leader, who had one bad playoff series.

Maybe not as bad as people paint him to be, but he doesn't fit the Celtic culture. He tried before, but I don't know why he stuck with his old ways.  I have no problem with his off-court personality. But his on-court performance have left alot to be desired.

You hated Jeff Green for his lack of motor, but you seem to defend Kyrie for similar problem.

Kyrie doesn't lack a motor.  He's consistently elite on one side of the ball, which hardly makes him analogous to Jeff Green.

[tenn_smoothie]

As for being booed if he doesn't play well, he and any athlete deserve it. This is Boston and we expect winners, not guys who are going to shoot 7 for 22. That applies to anybody else. And Kyrie would get the same reaction from fans of any other major sports city.

I disagree with this part.  I think fans that boo their own players suck, personally, especially if it's just because of a poor shooting night.

It's more than just a poor shooting night. It's just an overall poor performance on both ends. . You will never see Celtic fans jeer on their team as long as they make effort.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUBsqfkBmYE

It looks like character don't matter to you. They are also a factor for championship recipe

Sure character matters.  I don't see anything that makes me think that Kyrie is low character, any more than any other player on the team.

Kyrie is who he is.  He's a great player who isn't a great leader, who had one bad playoff series.

Maybe not as bad as people paint him to be, but he doesn't fit the Celtic culture. He tried before, but I don't know why he stuck with his old ways.  I have no problem with his off-court personality. But his on-court performance have left alot to be desired.

You hated Jeff Green for his lack of motor, but you seem to defend Kyrie for similar problem.

Kyrie doesn't lack a motor.  He's consistently elite on one side of the ball, which hardly makes him analogous to Jeff Green.

I don't blame a player for a bad shooting streak if the effort is there. Kyrie looked like he couldn't have cared less after Game 2. He often didn't even try to utilize a ball screen before launching a lazy, contested three. He also jacked up contested shots with teammates wide open. Watch the film. And his post-game comments were an embarassment, "Who cares?", I should have shot 30, I'm that great", "I'm doing it all out there", "I'm a basketball genius."

[nickagneta]

I really hope if Kyrie re-signs for 4 or 5 years that fans here embrace him, otherwise, I might need to take a very long vacation from CelticsStrong. Not sure I can put up with 4-5 more years of incessant Kyrie bashing.

[gpap]

Smart seems like a good guy. He doesn't seem like the type that's going to speak negatively of a teammate (yes Kyrie is still technically a Celtic.)

It seems there's 2 different paths the Celts could take this summer:

Path 1 is the Celts keep Kyrie and attempt to lure in a big fish to play alongside him. Obviously AD is the first name that comes to mind though perhaps there might be some other options I can't think of.  In this scenario, I think 2 of Hayward, Brown and Tatum are gone. So the team will basically revolve around Kyrie, insert star player, Smart and Horford.

Path 2 is Kyrie leaves and the core of the Celts is Smart, Tatum, Brown, Hayward and Horford. However, they still possibly ship at least one player in a trade for a big, so we'll still be competitive regardless because I don't think anyone has the time and energy to take a step back and go through another rebuild.

Either way, I think (and HOPE) we'll be much better next year and will have learned from this past season.

[tenn_smoothie]

Roy - you are correct to see that Kyrie needs to be embraced. But to be embraced, he has to produce consistent great basketball and quit shooting his mouth off. Also, he is so moody, I believe no matter how good the fans are to him, he will, on some days, find reasons to be unhappy and feel unappreciated. Poor guy is emotionally shaky and if his world is not going well, his basketball suffers.

To quote Gus McRae, "He is too leaky a vessel to pin anybody's hopes on but his own."

[action781]

Give me
Irving
Smart
Brown
Horford
Davis

And a bench of
Beverly
Moore
Carter
Morris
Baynes

I want Kyrie to walk away and build a team without him, but I wouldn't be too upset if this was our roster next season.

[action781]

My stance on Irving is that he deserves the lion's share of the blame for the team's lack of togetherness this season. There is no "1a" culprit for me. It's:

Blame Tier 1: Irving
Blame TIer 2: ------------
Blame Tier 3: ------------
Blame Tier 4: Everyone else besides Al Horford, Aron Baynes, and Marcus Smart because they are the real heroes.

I believe that.

But I also believe that he's smart enough and driven enough to learn from this season and come back a radically different player. And be a radically different leader. Damian Lillard used his butt-whoopin from the Pelicans as an anvil to temper his leadership and poise and came back stronger. There is no reason 25 year old Kyrie couldn't do the same.

I'm with you on the blame.  I think Kyrie could come back a radically different player and leader, but I'm not sure he will.  He seems to have a different personality than Lillard.  Kyrie seems a little more self-centered and egotistical and a bit more out of touch with reality.

[action781]

As for being booed if he doesn't play well, he and any athlete deserve it. This is Boston and we expect winners, not guys who are going to shoot 7 for 22. That applies to anybody else. And Kyrie would get the same reaction from fans of any other major sports city.

I disagree with this part.  I think fans that boo their own players suck, personally, especially if it's just because of a poor shooting night.

It's more than just a poor shooting night. It's just an overall poor performance on both ends. . You will never see Celtic fans jeer on their team as long as they make effort.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUBsqfkBmYE

It looks like character don't matter to you. They are also a factor for championship recipe

Sure character matters.  I don't see anything that makes me think that Kyrie is low character, any more than any other player on the team.

Kyrie is who he is.  He's a great player who isn't a great leader, who had one bad playoff series.

He shot below 37% from the field in 7 of the 9 postseason games.  I wouldn't say he played great in the first playoff series either.  So I would say that he's played well in 0/2 playoff series here.  If you wanna say he played well against Indy, I suppose that could be debatable.

I'm with you on not booing your own players though for poor performance.  IMO, you can only boo your own players for:
1) consistently selfish play -- which I never saw out of Kyrie any more than what we would have expected when we embraced him upon trading for him
2) lazy/effortless play -- which every player might have a small glimpse of here, but I never saw as a problem from Kyrie.  I've seen all the video clips, but I think you'd be able to scrape together a few clips like that for lots of players.  I'd like better in that regard, but I don't think its enough to boo him.
So while I don't like Kyrie on this team, I would never boo him for anything I saw this postseason or past two seasons.

[ozgod]

I really hope if Kyrie re-signs for 4 or 5 years that fans here embrace him, otherwise, I might need to take a very long vacation from CelticsStrong. Not sure I can put up with 4-5 more years of incessant Kyrie bashing.

Nobody was bashing him in 2017. I think fans will forgive anyone if he brings them success. Nobody was bashing him when we went on a 16-0 run. People were upset when he got injured on Mar 11 2018 when we were 2nd in the East with a 46-21 record.

The Kyrie bashing only really magnified this season when we stumbled out of the blocks and he made ill advised comments in the media. Then it got a lot worse when he refused to re-commit to the team after the AD trade rumors brought his free agency to the forefront again. Fans felt betrayed - "how dare he even think of turning us down!".

Then obviously if you promise a Boston fan success and fail, and are perceived to not take responsibility for your failings, or worse appear to blame it on others, watch out 

[LarBrd33]

It’s not kyries fault this team lacks talent outside of him.  49 wins and a 2nd round exit makes perfect sense for a 1 Star team with Marcus Morris as their 3rd best player. 

There’s nobody to blame.  Blame yourselves for having unreasonable expectations of an also-ran roster.

“Toughness”. “Leadership”.  Bunch of nonsense.  He’s a top 25 player with no other star on his team.  Ain’t nothin surprising about them failing to beat a multi star 60 win team built around an MVP

[Tr1boy]

It’s not kyries fault this team lacks talent outside of him.  49 wins and a 2nd round exit makes perfect sense for a 1 Star team with Marcus Morris as their 3rd best player. 

There’s nobody to blame.  Blame yourselves for having unreasonable expectations of an also-ran roster.

“Toughness”. “Leadership”.  Bunch of nonsense.  He’s a top 25 player with no other star on his team.  Ain’t nothin surprising about them failing to beat a multi star 60 win team built around an MVP

Last season playoff squad says hi