If needed, should Ainge actually put Tatum in package for AD? Nope, walk away.

[Phantom255x]

Wow. First meaningful post I made here and it's blowing up lol (though the poll looks a bit lopsided I'll admit)

Another question to all. Lets pretend the trade is something like Smart/Brown, Tatum, Williams + Picks + salary (Yabu) as most believe it would be to also help match salaries. Do you think we have enough depth and bench help as well? If not, how could we potentially fix that given it's not like we have cap space left.

Also, I posted this on the main site too, and the poll there actually looks different. You can check here.

https://www.celticsblog.com/2018/12/27/18158069/if-needed-should-ainge-actually-put-tatum-in-package-for-ad-nope-walk

Wait... Tatum AND Brown!?!?! Are you nuts!?!? I'll walk away myself if it's BOTH + picks + more... 

And btw, I voted "I Don't Know" in this poll too, because I truly don't know at the moment 

That said... yeah the poll on the main site is a whole different story than the one here. Weird.

[ETNCeltics]

Trading Tatum, sure.

Trading Tatum + all our other assets? Absolutely not. Davis would have one year on his deal. You're giving yourself zero safety net.

[Phantom255x]

Trading Tatum, sure.

Trading Tatum + all our other assets? Absolutely not. Davis would have one year on his deal. You're giving yourself zero safety net.

This is also where Davis and his agent both come into play regarding potential extension talks and such (similar to the Kawhi saga last year). Hopefully unlike Kawhi, AD would be willing to be here long term. Unfortunately his agent being the same as Lebron's though adds to the drama.

[Ogaju]

forget about that why not just put a body on a Houston Rocket tonight and get some rebounds.

[BringToughnessBack]

It wouldn't surprise me at all, ultimately, if New Orleans opts for neither the Lakers nor the Celtics --- maybe they pull a San Antonio and try to get a more establish player.

Don't the Wizards own their own 1st round pick this year?  What if the Wiz end up with a top 5 pick and they package that with Brad Beal for Davis?

Embiid for Davis straight up works too....just saying 😁

[Phantom255x]

It wouldn't surprise me at all, ultimately, if New Orleans opts for neither the Lakers nor the Celtics --- maybe they pull a San Antonio and try to get a more establish player.

Don't the Wizards own their own 1st round pick this year?  What if the Wiz end up with a top 5 pick and they package that with Brad Beal for Davis?

Embiid for Davis straight up works too....just saying 😁

Lol I wonder if the swap works or if a team has to offer a pick in addition. Tough to say

[Birdman]

tatum 5 pts..4 boards..3 assists againat Houston..Davis wouldnt have those numbers

[Moranis]

Let me put it this way, would you have traded Pierce for Tim Duncan early in their careers? Pierce won 1 title while Duncan won 5.

How many titles has AD won?  Why are we so sure he is Duncan?

http://bkref.com/tiny/8Qrxw

Take a look...what is Davis doing to WIN.

When we traded for KG, he had no titles and had led Minnesota to the bottom half of the lottery two years in a row.  Sometimes you just have to trust elite talent.

He was an MVP.  Went to the western conference finals with god-awful Steph Marbury. Stop.

Um.  Marbury was no where near the team that went to the WCF.  And just to be clear, before that season KG had never been out of the 1st round.  That year they added then 2-time NBA Champion Sam Cassell and all of a sudden figured out how to win.  Cassell got hurt the following season and missed a bunch of time and the Wolves didn't even make the playoffs. 

One could argue Cassell was the key to the success of that team and not the superior talent of KG.  Also, KG won that MVP at age 27 in his 9th year in the league (he was actually 28 when he won the award but was 27 during that season).  Davis is 25 and in year 7. 

And don't get me wrong, KG was clearly the most important cog to the Wolves success, but he couldn't do it alone and had he never left Minnesota he would have one, if not the, worst playoff records of any great player in NBA history.  The Wolves were just a terribly constructed and managed team while KG was there (very similar to Cleveland in Lebron's 1st stint there).

[mctyson]

Let me put it this way, would you have traded Pierce for Tim Duncan early in their careers? Pierce won 1 title while Duncan won 5.

How many titles has AD won?  Why are we so sure he is Duncan?

http://bkref.com/tiny/8Qrxw

Take a look...what is Davis doing to WIN.

When we traded for KG, he had no titles and had led Minnesota to the bottom half of the lottery two years in a row.  Sometimes you just have to trust elite talent.

He was an MVP.  Went to the western conference finals with god-awful Steph Marbury. Stop.

Um.  Marbury was no where near the team that went to the WCF.  And just to be clear, before that season KG had never been out of the 1st round.  That year they added then 2-time NBA Champion Sam Cassell and all of a sudden figured out how to win.  Cassell got hurt the following season and missed a bunch of time and the Wolves didn't even make the playoffs. 

One could argue Cassell was the key to the success of that team and not the superior talent of KG.  Also, KG won that MVP at age 27 in his 9th year in the league (he was actually 28 when he won the award but was 27 during that season).  Davis is 25 and in year 7. 

And don't get me wrong, KG was clearly the most important cog to the Wolves success, but he couldn't do it alone and had he never left Minnesota he would have one, if not the, worst playoff records of any great player in NBA history.  The Wolves were just a terribly constructed and managed team while KG was there (very similar to Cleveland in Lebron's 1st stint there).

The original point was comparing AD to Tim Duncan.  Tim Duncan is a top-5 player of all-time, a 5-time champion who was the best player on a perennial championship contender spanning 3 decades.  I will go out on a limb and say that AD will never be that.

Then it shifted to KG, but with the caveat the KG never won anything before the Cs traded for him.  At least KG was an MVP in a loaded Western Conference (due to the aforementioned Mr Duncan and Kobe) and went to the West Finals, and was leading his team to the playoffs most years.

My final question (and point) is: what has AD done, from a winning standpoint, to make him beyond criticism?  Lebron would have the Pelicans in the playoffs every year.  Durant probably as well.  AD has been to the playoffs twice in his 7 year career, and his team is one of the worst in the league this year.  How is AD impacting winning?

I understand he has little help (though Jrue Holiday is as much of an All-Star as Gordon Hayward is) but the most wins AD has had in a season is 48.  The history of the NBA is filled with great individual talents that drove teams to consistent mediocrity.  I am not willing to concede he is on Garnett's level until I see something Garnett-like from him.

[gpap]

I am kinda over the AD hype. If he comes....great.

But I am not going to hold my breath, plus I am pretty happy with our current roster.

Could we use more talent? Absolutely. Are we playing below expectations? Definitely!

But Anthony Davis isn't the only guy outside the roster that can help us.

The way I see it, we have a good core starting with Kyrie and Tatum that will only get better. Hayward is going to get better.

Now would I be willing to trade anyone not named Kyrie for upper echelon talent? Absolutely. But at the same time, I am not holding my breath for the unibrow. He can share the same shower with Lebron in the men's room of the Staples Center.

[IDreamCeltics]

I really don't think Ainge has the assets anymore to acquire AD.  Only one of his lottery picks has panned out, and Hayward is now an albatross contract...  I fail to see how the  Pelicans won't get a better offer from another team when a bare minimum of 50% of the league is going to be willing to trade their best veteran and best young players for AD if he's put on the block.

[hpantazo]

I really don't think Ainge has the assets anymore to acquire AD.  Only one of his lottery picks has panned out, and Hayward is now an albatross contract...  I fail to see how the  Pelicans won't get a better offer from another team when a bare minimum of 50% of the league is going to be willing to trade their best veteran and best young players for AD if he's put on the block.

Tatum, Brown,  4 1st round picks and someone to match salaries like Horford is certainly enough to acquire AD. It's just a question of whether Ainge wants to do go all in with no guarantee that AD stays.

[Phantom255x]

Yeah I posted this on Celtics reddit (with CelticQuest's - aka my cousin - permission) and yep @monkhouse was right LOL. Didn't get downvoted to oblivion but there are some hot takes and a few angry comments calling the statement "ridiculous/absurd - of course you do it (trade Tatum in the package if needed)"

Also some actually think Hayward would be in the trade and/or just Jaylen Brown is enough...

[cman88]

Nope. Tatum should be untouchable. Kid has future superstar written all over him. Also you will need 3 stars to go win the finals. and that should be Kyrie/Tatum/AD

everyone else should be available. I think Brown is the chip they use.

[Vermont Green]

Nope. Tatum should be untouchable. Kid has future superstar written all over him. Also you will need 3 stars to go win the finals. and that should be Kyrie/Tatum/AD

everyone else should be available. I think Brown is the chip they use.

Isn't Davis already a super star.  So you wouldn't trade a player who might be a super star for a player that is already a super star?

I can't say what a fair trade is but I would not rule out including Tatum.