Author Topic: There's something missing with this team......  (Read 2528 times)

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Re: There's something missing with this team......
« Reply #15 on: November 17, 2018, 10:55:05 PM »

Offline Bobshot

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Like I said, what's different from last year? Hayward. Trying to integrate him into their chemistry has maybe upset the chemistry. Or changed it.

Maybe Stevens has overdone him a bit--he isn't 100% yet. Looks heavier and slower than the Utah days. Good game against Toronto, but he needs a breather after 39 mins and OT. Doesn't Leonard get time off in back to back games?

Re: There's something missing with this team......
« Reply #16 on: November 17, 2018, 11:03:58 PM »

Offline Chief Macho

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It probably will all be ok.  But,  they have too many guys that need to play.   They have NBA starters on the bench,    they dont have NBA bench players.

Ainge should gather up his balls and make a trade but he wont.  he will horde talent in case of AD.

Re: There's something missing with this team......
« Reply #17 on: November 17, 2018, 11:07:06 PM »

Online liam

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I think it's as simple as "they are missing a lot of makable shots"...

Re: There's something missing with this team......
« Reply #18 on: November 17, 2018, 11:10:23 PM »

Online blink

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I think it's as simple as "they are missing a lot of makable shots"...

I think you are exactly right.   :)

Re: There's something missing with this team......
« Reply #19 on: November 17, 2018, 11:12:09 PM »

Offline Chief Macho

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I still think a Rozier and Morris trade for someone and a first makes alot of sense.  Makes Brown be the guy and thins the heard.   Maybe try to get a backup point in the deal.

Re: There's something missing with this team......
« Reply #20 on: November 17, 2018, 11:36:05 PM »

Online feckless

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with a player as great as Kyrie guys defer to him too much.  Need to get back to a sense of team.  Kyrie needs to bring role players in  so they feel included, needed - team.  More assists from Kyrie, had just 1 tonight, more ball movement on offense.  We played better last year with Rozier at point and guys knowing they had to step up and stay in the game plan.  This year they think they need to score to stay on the floor and are pressing for shots.

Don't need a trade the players are here it is chemistry and roles.
Days up and down they come, like rain on a conga drum, forget most, remember some, don't turn none away.   Townes Van Zandt

Re: There's something missing with this team......
« Reply #21 on: November 18, 2018, 01:14:32 AM »

Offline Chris22

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When was the last time any Celtic cut back door? Seriously, I can't remember.

Our offense is too one dimensional.

Plus, we need a good interior defender like Williams.

Re: There's something missing with this team......
« Reply #22 on: November 18, 2018, 01:19:45 AM »

Offline TheTruthFot18

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That was a very tense Al Horford, who emphasized he is very concerned about the state of the offense and guys trying to get shots.
whos he calling out?

Brown: 1-9
Rozier 2-9

Itís like every game is game 7 ECF lol

Kyrie added multiple guys do not follow the game plan.

My guess is it is Rozier and Brown and maybe Tatum.

Time to start:

Irving
Smart
Hayward
Morris
Hortford

Rozier, Brown, Tatum, Theis, Baynes off the bench. And only as needed. Get their egos in check ASAP

This is the problem with having a bunch of veterans and also a bunch of young guys. Its fine when one guy needs to prove himself but difficult when 3 guys need to every night.
The Nets will finish with the worst record and the Celtics will end up with the 4th pick.

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Re: There's something missing with this team......
« Reply #23 on: November 18, 2018, 01:48:17 AM »

Offline 10610786d

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@JaredWeissNBA
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That was a very tense Al Horford, who emphasized he is very concerned about the state of the offense and guys trying to get shots.
whos he calling out?

Brown: 1-9
Rozier 2-9

Itís like every game is game 7 ECF lol

Kyrie added multiple guys do not follow the game plan.

My guess is it is Rozier and Brown and maybe Tatum.

Time to start:

Irving
Smart
Hayward
Morris
Hortford

Rozier, Brown, Tatum, Theis, Baynes off the bench. And only as needed. Get their egos in check ASAP

This is the problem with having a bunch of veterans and also a bunch of young guys. Its fine when one guy needs to prove himself but difficult when 3 guys need to every night.

Kyrie went supernova last night, and Tatum started taking better shots down the stretch. Better to keep the best 5 together, so they're familiar with each other when playoff time comes.

Re: There's something missing with this team......
« Reply #24 on: November 18, 2018, 02:46:26 AM »

Online ozgod

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I think it's a mental thing - they're unable to maintain the motivation or drive to maintain a sustained level of excellence over the season. Particularly the younger players (but not just them). Last year Hayward went down, so they had something to prove. Tatum wanted to prove he belonged, Brown wanted to prove he had improved and was a genuine starter, same for Rozier. As a result over the course of the season they overachieved, and were anointed to be in the Finals based on their team on paper before the season even started and a ball had been dribbled.

You could see the warning signs even at preseason, they players all said "well it's preseason, we'll be ready come season start". Well we're about a fifth into the season and that drive seems missing, particularly since the expectation before the season was that they would all have reduced roles to accommodate Gordon's return. Whether it's struggling with reduced roles, or uncertainty about what role they are playing, right now they are inconsistent with the fundamentals of the game - shooting the ball, defending with purpose, making the right basketball reads, attacking the basket and not being afraid to go into contact.

Every so often it all clicks, like the Toronto game - it was played like it was a playoff game and we see what they are capable of when they are switched on. But amongst the gold there's a lot of dross, like Utah tonight where they turned up not looking ready to play. All it takes is a few missed shots and their shoulders drop. It's a long season, and by no means is it panic stations, but as coach Brad needs to get them that drive back, that desire to excel every day, that willingness to adhere to the game plan. Play each game like it really matters. Have pride in your performance, no matter what your role is - that's what being a professional is.

Kyrie has it, but he's had years under his belt. The inconsistency from the likes of Tatum, Rozier and Brown is a concern, so I have to remind myself that they are young and inconsistency is part of what young players bring. Just the other night against Philly Mitchell had probably the worst 30-pt game you will see, and he's been inconsistent this year as well. Hayward I can forgive because you really can't diminish what he went through and how that affected him mentally more than physically. We need more from our vets - Horford and Smart - as well. Like Morris, they need to set more of an example.

It's a long season but it's not getting any shorter. At some point the excuses have to end, because come April the result is all that matters, and the purpose of the entire season is to achieve the result they want at that time. Brad is going to have to make some hard decisions to try and shake the team up and iron some of the inconsistency out of them if it continues.

The warning signs are blinking, and right now there's still time to do something about them. There may not be by January or February.
« Last Edit: November 18, 2018, 03:01:43 AM by ozgod »
Any odd typos are because I suck at typing on an iPhone :D

Re: There's something missing with this team......
« Reply #25 on: November 18, 2018, 03:50:20 AM »

Offline bopna

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Id tell you what is missing...

Brown's near 40% shooting from beyond the arc.. I mean JB is so bad right now idk what has happened to him.

And we keep giving Hayward some slack.. Come on, the guy is healthy now and should be consistently dropping 15 a game which coincidentally, we are winning everytime Gordy scores more... Since when he became Draymond as a facilitator.. We need him to score more.

Tatum needs to drive more
Horford needs to step inside the three point line as he too has regressed  from deep.. May need to drive more as well.

Utah had a clinic out there as to how to drive to the hoop and we got shellacked.

Re: There's something missing with this team......
« Reply #26 on: November 18, 2018, 05:06:40 AM »

Online ozgod

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I decided to compare the team's stats this year vs at this point last year so see whether the stats are reflecting what we all see when we're watching (this time last year they were 15-2 vs 9-7 this year). Keep in mind I'm comparing starts - so players who improved significantly over the year (like Rozier) will have their last year stats "understated". Some of the results are confusing  ???

Code: [Select]
TEAM Yr GP W L WIN% MIN PTS FGM FGA FG% 3PM 3PA 3P% FTM FTA FT% OREB DREB REB AST TOV STL BLK BLKA PF PFD +/-
Boston Celtics 2017-18 17 15 2 0.882 48 102.5 36.3 84.5 42.9 10.8 30.5 35.5 19.1 24.4 78.3 10.5 36.9 47.5 21.5 14.5 8.4 4.1 5.1 19.9 21.5 8.1
Boston Celtics 2018-19 16 9 7 0.563 48.6 105.4 38.9 90 43.2 12.7 36.4 34.9 15 19.4 77.2 10.4 36.4 46.8 23.4 13.7 7.8 5.2 3.4 21 20.5 2.9

It's remarkable how similar the stats are, other than the W/L column.  ;D I thought for sure our 3Pt% would be a lot lower but it isn't. We're attempting 6 more shots from 3 and 5 less shots from the FT line. Our assists are slightly better, our rebounding slightly worse. Most important is the +/-, we were +8.1 last year and +2.9 this year so defensively we've deteriorated.

Here's the YTD vs last YTD comparison at the player level:

Code: [Select]
PLAYER TEAM Yr AGE GP MIN PTS FGM FGA FG% 3PM 3PA 3P% FTM FTA FT% OREB DREB REB AST TOV STL BLK PF FP DD2 TD3 +/-
Al Horford BOS 2017-18 32 15 32.2 14.9 5.7 10.3 55.8 1.4 3.3 42 2.1 2.5 83.8 1.4 7.4 8.8 4.5 2.7 0.7 0.5 1.8 33.1 6 0 9.5
Al Horford BOS 2018-19 32 16 29.4 11.5 4.7 10.1 46.3 1.3 4.1 30.3 0.9 1.4 63.6 1.7 4.8 6.4 3.5 1.6 0.8 1.6 1.7 30 1 0 0.4

Aron Baynes BOS 2017-18 31 17 18.6 5.8 2.3 5.2 44.3 0 0.1 0 1.2 1.8 64.5 2.1 3.5 5.6 1 1 0.3 0.8 2.2 16.1 0 0 2.4
Aron Baynes BOS 2018-19 31 13 14.3 5.8 1.9 4.8 40.3 0.8 2.1 37 1.2 1.5 84.2 1.7 2.5 4.2 1.2 0.5 0.2 0.5 2 14.3 0 0 1.9

Daniel Theis BOS 2017-18 26 16 12.6 4.1 1.6 3.1 53.1 0.2 0.6 33.3 0.7 0.9 78.6 1.6 2.7 4.3 0.4 1.3 0.3 0.8 2.5 11.9 1 0 0.9
Daniel Theis BOS 2018-19 26 8 11 4.9 2.1 3.6 58.6 0.3 0.8 33.3 0.4 0.9 42.9 1.1 1.6 2.8 0.5 0.8 0.1 0.3 2.5 9.3 0 0 4.1

Gordon Hayward BOS 2017-18 28 1 5.3 2 1 2 50 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 1 0 0 0 0 1 3.2 0 0 3
Gordon Hayward BOS 2018-19 28 15 26.7 10.1 3.7 9.2 39.9 1.1 3.8 29.8 1.7 2.1 80.6 1 4.3 5.3 3.1 1.3 1.3 0.2 1.7 24.1 0 0 1.3

Guers. Yabusele BOS 2017-18 22 6 4.1 2.3 0.8 1.8 45.5 0.3 1 33.3 0.3 0.3 100 0.8 0.7 1.5 0.2 0.3 0 0 0.8 4.1 0 0 1
Guers. Yabusele BOS 2018-19 22 9 4.2 1.8 0.4 1.4 30.8 0.1 0.6 20 0.8 0.9 87.5 0.4 0.7 1.1 0.2 0.1 0.2 0.1 0.4 4.3 0 0 -0.8

Jaylen Brown BOS 2017-18 21 17 32.3 15.8 5.6 12.4 45.7 1.9 4.8 39.5 2.6 4.3 61.6 1.3 5.3 6.6 1.1 1.5 1.2 0.3 2.8 28.3 2 0 8.7
Jaylen Brown BOS 2018-19 22 15 29.1 10.9 4.2 11.6 36.2 1.2 4.4 27.3 1.3 2.1 64.5 1.3 2.9 4.3 1.3 1.3 0.5 0.5 2.5 19.4 0 0 -0.3

Jayson Tatum BOS 2017-18 20 17 29.8 13.9 4.5 9.2 49.4 1.4 2.8 47.9 3.5 4.1 84.3 1 4.6 5.6 1.4 1.6 1 0.8 2.4 26.6 1 0 3.1
Jayson Tatum BOS 2018-19 20 16 32.3 15.9 5.6 13.1 42.4 1.8 4.4 39.4 3 3.4 88.9 1.4 5.6 6.9 2.1 1.9 0.9 0.5 2.5 29.8 1 0 4.3

Kyrie Irving BOS 2017-18 26 16 31.1 20.9 7.6 17.1 44.7 2.1 6.1 35.1 3.6 4 89.1 0.4 2.8 3.3 5.3 1.9 1.7 0.4 2.1 37 1 0 6.4
Kyrie Irving BOS 2018-19 26 15 32.6 22.1 8.5 16.9 50 2.6 6.2 41.9 2.6 3.2 81.3 0.9 3.9 4.9 5.6 2.3 1.7 0.6 2.5 40.8 1 0 1.7

Marcus Morris BOS 2017-18 28 8 23.4 13.5 4.8 10.1 46.9 1.4 3.4 40.7 2.6 3 87.5 0.5 4.8 5.3 1.1 1.1 0.8 0.3 1.4 23.4 1 0 1.3
Marcus Morris BOS 2018-19 29 15 25.8 13.8 4.9 10.1 48.7 2.1 4.7 45.7 1.8 2.2 81.8 0.7 5.7 6.5 1.1 1.9 0.5 0.2 2.8 23.4 2 0 0.1

Marcus Smart BOS 2017-18 24 15 30.4 9.1 2.7 10 27.3 1.2 4.4 27.3 2.4 3.1 76.6 1.3 3.3 4.5 5.1 2.2 1.5 0.4 2.4 25.6 0 0 7.9
Marcus Smart BOS 2018-19 24 16 23.1 5.5 1.8 4.9 35.4 0.8 2.9 25.5 1.3 1.7 74.1 0.6 2.3 2.8 3.9 1.6 1.2 0.6 2.7 18.3 1 0 1.7

Semi Ojeleye BOS 2017-18 23 16 13.6 2.7 0.8 2.4 34.2 0.6 1.9 30 0.5 0.6 80 0.4 1.2 1.6 0.1 0.3 0.3 0 1.1 5.5 0 0 -1.9
Semi Ojeleye BOS 2018-19 23 11 9 2.3 0.9 1.9 47.6 0.3 1.1 25 0.2 0.5 40 0.4 0.8 1.2 0 0.2 0.3 0.1 0.7 4.6 0 0 2.5

Terry Rozier BOS 2017-18 24 17 24.4 9.1 3.2 9.2 34.4 1.5 4.5 32.5 1.3 1.6 81.5 0.8 4.2 4.9 2.3 0.7 1.1 0.1 1.3 21.3 0 0 2.9
Terry Rozier BOS 2018-19 24 16 23.3 8.4 3.1 8.4 36.6 1.3 3.7 33.9 1 1.4 72.7 0.4 4 4.4 2 0.6 0.6 0.3 1.4 18.7 0 0 0.9

Jaylen, Al and Smart's ppg numbers have dropped even though their attempts have remained approximately the same (except Smart he's attempting a lot less this year). It was interesting that the attempts remained the same despite Gordon in the team this year. The mix is different, they (along with Tatum) attempting more 3s than this time last year and have big drops in their 3pfg%. What's interesting is Jaylen is actually taking less threes this year than this time last year and is missing more of them. As for Gordon, nobody expected him to be his usual efficient self but it's fair to say that the points he's scored this year have come at a much more inefficient rate than the players who had to cover for him last year.

Finally I looked at the schedule:

Code: [Select]
G H/A Opponent Result Tm Opp W L Streak G H/A Opponent Result Tm Opp W L Streak
1 H Philadelphia 76ers W 105 87 1 0 W 1 1 A Cleveland Cavaliers L 99 102 0 1 L 1
2 A Toronto Raptors L 101 113 1 1 L 1 2 H Milwaukee Bucks L 100 108 0 2 L 2
3 A New York Knicks W 103 101 2 1 W 1 3 A Philadelphia 76ers W 102 92 1 2 W 1
4 H Orlando Magic L 90 93 2 2 L 1 4 H New York Knicks W 110 89 2 2 W 2
5 A Oklahoma City Thunder W 101 95 3 2 W 1 5 A Milwaukee Bucks W 96 89 3 2 W 3
6 A Detroit Pistons W 109 89 4 2 W 2 6 A Miami Heat W 96 90 4 2 W 4
7 H Detroit Pistons W 108 105 5 2 W 3 7 H San Antonio Spurs W 108 94 5 2 W 5
8 H Milwaukee Bucks W 117 113 6 2 W 4 8 H Sacramento Kings W 113 86 6 2 W 6
9 A Indiana Pacers L 101 102 6 3 L 1 9 A Oklahoma City Thunder W 101 94 7 2 W 7
10 A Denver Nuggets L 107 115 6 4 L 2 10 A Orlando Magic W 104 88 8 2 W 8
11 A Phoenix Suns W (OT) 116 109 7 4 W 1 11 A Atlanta Hawks W 110 107 9 2 W 9
12 A Utah Jazz L 115 123 7 5 L 1 12 H Los Angeles Lakers W 107 96 10 2 W 10
13 A Portland Trail Blazers L 94 100 7 6 L 2 13 H Charlotte Hornets W 90 87 11 2 W 11
14 H Chicago Bulls W 111 82 8 6 W 1 14 H Toronto Raptors W 95 94 12 2 W 12
15 H Toronto Raptors W (OT) 123 116 9 6 W 2 15 A Brooklyn Nets W 109 102 13 2 W 13
16 H Utah Jazz L 86 98 9 7 L 1 16 H Golden State Warriors W 92 88 14 2 W 14
17 A Atlanta Hawks W 110 99 15 2 W 15

We played a few more lottery teams last year and our away games this year came against better opposition. Hopefully this next month or so balances that out.
« Last Edit: November 18, 2018, 06:57:35 AM by ozgod »
Any odd typos are because I suck at typing on an iPhone :D

Re: There's something missing with this team......
« Reply #27 on: November 18, 2018, 05:19:45 AM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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I think we are shooting poorly and we only get motivated to play against good teams.   Against teams that are decent or bad, I think we have shown a hubris that has allowed the other teams to trounce on us and take advantage of the opportunity.  We need to take every team seriously.

Re: There's something missing with this team......
« Reply #28 on: November 18, 2018, 06:20:09 AM »

Offline Somebody

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We're missing starting Horford/Baynes in our frontcourt.

Re: There's something missing with this team......
« Reply #29 on: November 18, 2018, 06:32:29 AM »

Offline RodyTur10

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We're missing starting Horford/Baynes in our frontcourt.

We're playing too fancy. Trying to play with 5 shooters, multiple players who can be the ballhandler, everybody can be a volume scorer. We need to get back to basics.

Play with a rim protector who sets screens on offense and plays the boards hard. Have wing players who move off the ball for cuts to the basket or get open for a corner three. When was the last time we saw a simple pick-and-roll executed?
George Carlin ó 'That's why they call it the American Dream, because you have to be asleep to believe it.'

 

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