Poll

If you had to choose someone, who would you pick?

Jayson Freakin' Tatum!
42 (85.7%)
Ben 'Shoot like Julius Randle,' Simmons!
7 (14.3%)

Total Members Voted: 49

Author Topic: Who is better... Tatum or Simmons?  (Read 4070 times)

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Re: Who is better... Tatum or Simmons?
« Reply #45 on: September 19, 2018, 12:29:48 PM »

Offline smokeablount

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Better scorer, Simmons vs Tatum?

Pro Simmons data- More PPG, higher overall FG%, less% of buckets were assisted, and teams can have a hard time keeping him away from the rim where he scores with ease.

Pro Tatum data- He can score from all 3 levels, unlike Simmons who only scores from inside 3 feet.  Higher TS%, higher PPS, PPG is almost identical weighted per 36 minutes, Tatum can do a lot more different things and with less shots and lower usage, didn't get the same opportunity.

Though there's evidence for Simmons, I'd take Tatum.  The more advanced stats and the eye test definitely support Tatum, while the counting stats and rim dominance support Simmons.
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Re: Who is better... Tatum or Simmons?
« Reply #46 on: September 19, 2018, 12:42:31 PM »

Offline rondofan1255

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It's a joke to say Simmons is more Rondo than Lebron.  In year one Rondo scored 6pts on 41% shooting.  Simmons scored 16pts on 55% shooting which is incredibly efficient regardless of where he was shooting from.  James shot 41% his rookie year.  So in year one Simmons was far more efficient than both of them.  And this isn't really part of this particular debate but Simmons averaged far more assists and rebounds as a rookie than Lebron.  It's ridiculous how some posters think every player on the Celtics will keep improving and all the players on other teams are finished products at 20 years old.
When all you can do on offense is inside 5 feet you will get a high percentage and more rebounds,that just shows how limited a player he is

Had he been a Celtic the narrative would have been
Quote
although everyone knows he can only do offence inside 5 feet he still gets a high percentage which shows how good he is at penetrating and when he develops his range he will be unstoppable

No way. Celtics fans would never make excuses for a poor-shooting point guard based on other aspects of his game.

his name rhymes with hondo  :)

Re: Who is better... Tatum or Simmons?
« Reply #47 on: September 19, 2018, 01:04:56 PM »

Offline Moranis

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It will be interesting to see how it shakes out but in last years playoffs it was Tatum and it wasn't close.

Playoff numbers for both

16.3 ppg, 9.4 rpg, 7.7 apg, 1.7 spg, 0.8 bpg, 4.4 tpg, 3.4 fpg, 54.1 TS%, 36.9 mpg
18.5 ppg, 4.4 rpg, 2.7 apg, 1.2 spg, 0.5 bpg, 2.2 tpg, 2.6 fpg, 57.8 TS%, 35.9 mpg

Not sure what stats you were looking at, but those numbers seem fairly close as the better shooter takes care of the ball better, but is basically worse every where else.

I'm seeing Simmons per game vs Celtics in the playoffs:  14pts  8 rbs 6 ast no 3pt % 69% FT 43% FG

Tatum per game vs Sixer's in playoffs: 23pts 3 ast 3 rbs 31% 3pt 81% Ft 52% FG
a series is not the playoffs though.  The Celtics are a bad matchup for the Simmons and the inverse is also true.  What I posted was their entire playoffs, obviously Tatum played more games (and the extra series), but that is absolutely a better gauge than a 5 game series and using the whole season was also a better gauge, and in that the numbers were similar to the playoff numbers.

Re: Who is better... Tatum or Simmons?
« Reply #48 on: September 19, 2018, 01:09:15 PM »

Offline CF033

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Last season, Simmons probably had the edge. Simmons is probably the better all-around player and may be for his whole career.

But, I believe Tatum has a superstar ceiling on his offensive abilities and I don't think Simmons has a superstar ceiling on anything he does, just a very solid all-around game. I doubt he's the next LBJ but you never know.

Who would I take? In the long run Tatum, I find his game to be more entertaining and I think he has a higher ceiling. Just my opinion.

Re: Who is better... Tatum or Simmons?
« Reply #49 on: September 19, 2018, 09:54:19 PM »

Offline Rosco917

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IMO Tatum by the end of the year should be our second best option on offense. I think the kid has star written all over him. Dare I say, Kevin Durant-ish if he gets the shot opportunities.

As for Simmons, besides not liking him very much, I remember all those easy shots he missed in the
Playoffs from 10-15 feet away. He struggles with shooting the ball too much. He'll have a good career and get many triple doubles. But, he ain't Magic Johnson.

Re: Who is better... Tatum or Simmons?
« Reply #50 on: September 22, 2018, 01:50:59 PM »

Offline bellerephon

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IMO Tatum by the end of the year should be our second best option on offense. I think the kid has star written all over him. Dare I say, Kevin Durant-ish if he gets the shot opportunities.

As for Simmons, besides not liking him very much, I remember all those easy shots he missed in the
Playoffs from 10-15 feet away. He struggles with shooting the ball too much. He'll have a good career and get many triple doubles. But, he ain't Magic Johnson.
I'm not quite so sure about Tatum being second option at any point this year. He's talented no doubt, but Kyrie and Hayward are one and two I think, although Hayward may need some time to get into real game shape. It is certainly possible that Tatum could surpass one or both of them, but I think people forget just how good Hayward is.

Re: Who is better... Tatum or Simmons?
« Reply #51 on: September 22, 2018, 01:56:16 PM »

Offline hwangjini_1

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It's a joke to say Simmons is more Rondo than Lebron.  In year one Rondo scored 6pts on 41% shooting.  Simmons scored 16pts on 55% shooting which is incredibly efficient regardless of where he was shooting from.  James shot 41% his rookie year.  So in year one Simmons was far more efficient than both of them.  And this isn't really part of this particular debate but Simmons averaged far more assists and rebounds as a rookie than Lebron.  It's ridiculous how some posters think every player on the Celtics will keep improving and all the players on other teams are finished products at 20 years old.
When all you can do on offense is inside 5 feet you will get a high percentage and more rebounds,that just shows how limited a player he is

Had he been a Celtic the narrative would have been
Quote
although everyone knows he can only do offence inside 5 feet he still gets a high percentage which shows how good he is at penetrating and when he develops his range he will be unstoppable

No way. Celtics fans would never make excuses for a poor-shooting point guard based on other aspects of his game.

his name rhymes with hondo  :)
smarto????
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Re: Who is better... Tatum or Simmons?
« Reply #52 on: September 22, 2018, 02:43:32 PM »

Offline td450

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Tatum is one year and eight months younger. This is all going to be about long term mental approach and improvement. We are about two weeks away from having a very good idea about how much each guy did with their offseason.

Simmons did more last year by a significant margin, but I'll bet on Tatum in the long term. Let's take another look after the first week of October.

Re: Who is better... Tatum or Simmons?
« Reply #53 on: September 22, 2018, 04:07:13 PM »

Offline greece666

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I wanted to answer Tatum for some time now, but I felt the need to provide some deep insight, some thoughtful argument and acute observation in my comment.  8)


Re: Who is better... Tatum or Simmons?
« Reply #54 on: September 22, 2018, 04:58:03 PM »

Offline konkmv

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Why do we care who is better.....???
The real question is do you like tatum or Simmons with irwing Hayward rozier smart and brown around him.? I think everyone will choose tatum..
If the question was jordan or drexler it would be obvious.. but times and the games has changed...
And the simple question for every celtics fan is...
Was pierce better before or after the garnett allen arrival.. obviously before.. but wouldn't you prefer to have those guys 2 or 3 years earlier? That would limit pierces touches
So lets say i want the right pick even he could do more for a team like the kings.... tatum for me



Re: Who is better... Tatum or Simmons?
« Reply #55 on: September 22, 2018, 05:07:31 PM »

Offline playdream

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It's a joke to say Simmons is more Rondo than Lebron.  In year one Rondo scored 6pts on 41% shooting.  Simmons scored 16pts on 55% shooting which is incredibly efficient regardless of where he was shooting from.  James shot 41% his rookie year.  So in year one Simmons was far more efficient than both of them.  And this isn't really part of this particular debate but Simmons averaged far more assists and rebounds as a rookie than Lebron.  It's ridiculous how some posters think every player on the Celtics will keep improving and all the players on other teams are finished products at 20 years old.
When all you can do on offense is inside 5 feet you will get a high percentage and more rebounds,that just shows how limited a player he is

Had he been a Celtic the narrative would have been
Quote
although everyone knows he can only do offence inside 5 feet he still gets a high percentage which shows how good he is at penetrating and when he develops his range he will be unstoppable

No way. Celtics fans would never make excuses for a poor-shooting point guard based on other aspects of his game.
Well i was the one calling Danny to trade Rondo before the deadline because he is hurting the team so much with his inability to shoot and ball hug

Re: Who is better... Tatum or Simmons?
« Reply #56 on: September 22, 2018, 05:14:49 PM »

Offline greece666

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Why do we care who is better..... ???
The real question is do you like tatum or Simmons with irwing Hayward rozier smart and brown around him.? I think everyone will choose tatum..
If the question was jordan or drexler it would be obvious.. but times and the games has changed...
And the simple question for every celtics fan is...
Was pierce better before or after the garnett allen arrival.. obviously before.. but wouldn't you prefer to have those guys 2 or 3 years earlier? That would limit pierces touches
So lets say i want the right pick even he could do more for a team like the kings.... tatum for me

Personally, I don't, but I find Philly fans obnoxious and hope some of them read this thread.

Re: Who is better... Tatum or Simmons?
« Reply #57 on: September 22, 2018, 05:51:32 PM »

Offline sdceltsfan

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Tatum's ceiling for his game is Kobe. He may never be the ultra aggressive Mamba assassin, but his execution when it counts is already reliable. I would even say I'm taking Tatum over healthy Kyrie for a last second shot to win a game.

Simmons obviously has more to grow, but it is only in his jump shot, IMO. He has a very unhealthy arrogance.....the self-centered kind, not the team leader kind. If he gets a jump shot going, he can be like 80-85% of what Lebron has done in the league with that skill set. I just see him getting more in his own way than Tatum, who seems immensely more coachable and a better teammate.

I'm taking Tatum now, and I think 3-5 years from now, the answer won't change.

Re: Who is better... Tatum or Simmons?
« Reply #58 on: September 22, 2018, 06:02:43 PM »

Offline PAOBoston

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They are different types of players. Simmons will be a top player in this league, probably the next great point forward after LeBron. The question as to how good he will be depends on of he figures out with what hand to shoot a jump shot with. Green goggles aside, Simmons has the size, athleticism, and ball ha doing ability to be a top 5 player in this league.

All that being said, Tatum has his own skill set that can lead him as an elite player on this league. His scoring game is already elite. His main question is how his body fills out. He's going to be one of the most lethal scorers in the league when he physically matures.

Re: Who is better... Tatum or Simmons?
« Reply #59 on: September 23, 2018, 02:39:54 PM »

Offline Big333223

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Tatum's ceiling for his game is Kobe. He may never be the ultra aggressive Mamba assassin, but his execution when it counts is already reliable. I would even say I'm taking Tatum over healthy Kyrie for a last second shot to win a game.

Simmons obviously has more to grow, but it is only in his jump shot, IMO. He has a very unhealthy arrogance.....the self-centered kind, not the team leader kind. If he gets a jump shot going, he can be like 80-85% of what Lebron has done in the league with that skill set. I just see him getting more in his own way than Tatum, who seems immensely more coachable and a better teammate.

I'm taking Tatum now, and I think 3-5 years from now, the answer won't change.

I'd say his ceiling is Durant and, for my money, Durant > Kobe.
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