New Ringer article on Loyalty and IT trade

[nickagneta]

I still don't understand the "loyalty" aspect of the IT trade.  The Celtics originally traded FOR him.  Also, it is not like IT gave up millions of dollars for a hometown discount and then got traded. 

Why did the Celtics owe him anymore than they already gave him, which was an opportunity to become a star in the league?

They didn't, so long as you also agree that it’s not disloyal for a player to walk away after fulfilling his contract.

Exactly, it goes both ways. Gotta admit, Danny owed IT nothing but it was pretty cold blooded move to trade IT right after what he did for the team in the playoffs. But Danny did what was best for business. When players leave for more money, they are doing what is best for their business.

[Rosco917]

Admittedly, I was never IT’s biggest fan. I appreciate everything he did here, but I thought he was overrated by a lot of fans and was never going to be a championship-caliber point guard given his diminutive size.

But IT owes just as much to Danny and Brad as they owed him. They are the ones to give him an actual shot at starting and stardom, and without them he’d still be toiling away putting up empty numbers in Phoenix.

And I wonder how “loyal” IT would’ve been when Danny balked on maxing him out this summer; he would’ve been LA bound before you could even say “Brinks truck.”

Bingo...well said.

[GreenFaith1819]

On some level, we have to realize that this could have ramifications on future FA's looking at BOS...

True - The League is a BUSINESS.

True - IT was already a millionaire before even beginning to cash in with the Brinks comments.

True - It could be reasoned that Kyrie is better - but only marginally.

But the NBA can no longer tout those "Feel Good" commercials on Player-Team relationships...and they can no longer expect players to even begin to think loyalty.

IT - by ALL accounts - did EVERYTHING for BOSTON.....EVERYTHING. Boston is where it is RIGHT NOW because of him.

And then he was traded - while he was a broken player.

We'd better be READY once IT gets healthy again - and he WILL. Dude will see blood in the water once he plays us again.

[SHAQATTACK]

I still don't understand the "loyalty" aspect of the IT trade.  The Celtics originally traded FOR him.  Also, it is not like IT gave up millions of dollars for a hometown discount and then got traded. 

Why did the Celtics owe him anymore than they already gave him, which was an opportunity to become a star in the league?

They didn't, so long as you also agree that it’s not disloyal for a player to walk away after fulfilling his contract.

Exactly, it goes both ways. Gotta admit, Danny owed IT nothing but it was pretty cold blooded move to trade IT right after what he did for the team in the playoffs. But Danny did what was best for business. When players leave for more money, they are doing what is best for their business.

being. " the boss ". is a very unpopular job many times.  Ive been a boss and i know .  Danny did what he thought was best to improve the team .  Thats what his job is .  He saw a chance to get Irving and unload a wounded IT in one fell swoop.   Given the exact circumstances , i would have traded too.  I would have tried to trade even if IT was not injuried.   I do admit IT being hurt , and losing his sister and all surely made it tuff on DA.   That said .....i d been the first one fussing  and belly aching about NOT trying to make a trade for Irving  if DA sat on his hands.

one day ....Irving may leave .....so ....i ll try and not bad mouth him.....

[wayupnorth]

I think the article’s premise is wrong.

“Loyalty” in sports has always been one-sided. Fans are always going to blame a player for leaving more than a team trading or releasing a player.  IT is the best example of that. Rather than the majority of fans lamenting the loss of a guy who bled green, many have turned on him.  It’s cool to prefer Kyrie, but IT’s flaws have been exaggerated and some folks are foaming at the mouth attacking IT.

I agree with the premise of this post, but I can't say I have seen anyone "foaming at the mouth attacking IT", for the most part. Maybe one poster.

And I don't really see anyone bashing IT either.

[wayupnorth]

On some level, we have to realize that this could have ramifications on future FA's looking at BOS...

True - The League is a BUSINESS.

True - IT was already a millionaire before even beginning to cash in with the Brinks comments.

True - It could be reasoned that Kyrie is better - but only marginally.

But the NBA can no longer tout those "Feel Good" commercials on Player-Team relationships...and they can no longer expect players to even begin to think loyalty.

IT - by ALL accounts - did EVERYTHING for BOSTON.....EVERYTHING. Boston is where it is RIGHT NOW because of him.

And then he was traded - while he was a broken player.

We'd better be READY once IT gets healthy again - and he WILL. Dude will see blood in the water once he plays us again.

Completely disagree.

Both IT AND the Celtics benefited from that relationship. There are not many franchises that would have given IT the opportunity to show what he can do.

Also, it isn't like Danny sent him to a bad team.

[TheTruthFot18]

Go away with this stuff. 

[GreenFaith1819]

On some level, we have to realize that this could have ramifications on future FA's looking at BOS...

True - The League is a BUSINESS.

True - IT was already a millionaire before even beginning to cash in with the Brinks comments.

True - It could be reasoned that Kyrie is better - but only marginally.

But the NBA can no longer tout those "Feel Good" commercials on Player-Team relationships...and they can no longer expect players to even begin to think loyalty.

IT - by ALL accounts - did EVERYTHING for BOSTON.....EVERYTHING. Boston is where it is RIGHT NOW because of him.

And then he was traded - while he was a broken player.

We'd better be READY once IT gets healthy again - and he WILL. Dude will see blood in the water once he plays us again.

Completely disagree.

Both IT AND the Celtics benefited from that relationship. There are not many franchises that would have given IT the opportunity to show what he can do.

Also, it isn't like Danny sent him to a bad team.

You can disagree all you want to, but there is NO WAY that Danny Ainge - in ALL of his wisdom  - saw IT being as good as he was - as charismatic as he was - and helping BOS to become as good as we ARE.

No way.

NONE of us saw this.

And he sent him to a team that Kyrie Irving was hell-bent on getting AWAY from - because of the LeBron James LEAVING or STAYING controversy, among other things.

What IS the latest on THAT, anyway? Is it Houston OR The Lakers?

Now IT has to deal with it and I wish him well. He's playing with the BEST player in the NBA - right now - and perhaps ONLY for a few months.

lol let's not sugar-coat this.

[wayupnorth]

On some level, we have to realize that this could have ramifications on future FA's looking at BOS...

True - The League is a BUSINESS.

True - IT was already a millionaire before even beginning to cash in with the Brinks comments.

True - It could be reasoned that Kyrie is better - but only marginally.

But the NBA can no longer tout those "Feel Good" commercials on Player-Team relationships...and they can no longer expect players to even begin to think loyalty.

IT - by ALL accounts - did EVERYTHING for BOSTON.....EVERYTHING. Boston is where it is RIGHT NOW because of him.

And then he was traded - while he was a broken player.

We'd better be READY once IT gets healthy again - and he WILL. Dude will see blood in the water once he plays us again.

Completely disagree.

Both IT AND the Celtics benefited from that relationship. There are not many franchises that would have given IT the opportunity to show what he can do.

Also, it isn't like Danny sent him to a bad team.

You can disagree all you want to, but there is NO WAY that Danny Ainge - in ALL of his wisdom  - saw IT being as good as he was - as charismatic as he was - and helping BOS to become as good as we ARE.

No way.

NONE of us saw this.

And he sent him to a team that Kyrie Irving was hell-bent on getting AWAY from - because of the LeBron James LEAVING or STAYING controversy, among other things.

What IS the latest on THAT, anyway? Is it Houston OR The Lakers?

Now IT has to deal with it and I wish him well. He's playing with the BEST player in the NBA - right now - and perhaps ONLY for a few months.

lol let's not sugar-coat this.

So Danny and IT were lying when he said Danny called him right when he was a free agent, even though we couldn't sign him?

And he was lying when he said that immediately after the trade Danny said he could be a Celtic great?

Danny knew what he was getting, and had wanted him for some time.

Also, he will be a free agent after this year whether traded or not, so your statement about how he only might be playing with the best player in the world "for only a few months" holds no weight. It is very possible he was only going to play HERE for only a few more months.

IT was treated extremely well as a Celtic. He was traded for a better player, when he was hurt and set to be a free agent (clearly wanting big money).

Nothing to sugar coat, IT is is a a better career position because of Danny and the Celtics. This is not debatable.

[GreenFaith1819]

On some level, we have to realize that this could have ramifications on future FA's looking at BOS...

True - The League is a BUSINESS.

True - IT was already a millionaire before even beginning to cash in with the Brinks comments.

True - It could be reasoned that Kyrie is better - but only marginally.

But the NBA can no longer tout those "Feel Good" commercials on Player-Team relationships...and they can no longer expect players to even begin to think loyalty.

IT - by ALL accounts - did EVERYTHING for BOSTON.....EVERYTHING. Boston is where it is RIGHT NOW because of him.

And then he was traded - while he was a broken player.

We'd better be READY once IT gets healthy again - and he WILL. Dude will see blood in the water once he plays us again.

Completely disagree.

Both IT AND the Celtics benefited from that relationship. There are not many franchises that would have given IT the opportunity to show what he can do.

Also, it isn't like Danny sent him to a bad team.

You can disagree all you want to, but there is NO WAY that Danny Ainge - in ALL of his wisdom  - saw IT being as good as he was - as charismatic as he was - and helping BOS to become as good as we ARE.

No way.

NONE of us saw this.

And he sent him to a team that Kyrie Irving was hell-bent on getting AWAY from - because of the LeBron James LEAVING or STAYING controversy, among other things.

What IS the latest on THAT, anyway? Is it Houston OR The Lakers?

Now IT has to deal with it and I wish him well. He's playing with the BEST player in the NBA - right now - and perhaps ONLY for a few months.

lol let's not sugar-coat this.

So Danny and IT were lying when he said Danny called him right when he was a free agent, even though we couldn't sign him?

And he was lying when he said that immediately after the trade Danny said he could be a Celtic great?

Danny knew what he was getting, and had wanted him for some time.

Also, he will be a free agent after this year whether traded or not, so your statement about how he only might be playing with the best player in the world "for only a few months" holds no weight. It is very possible he was only going to play HERE for only a few more months.

IT was treated extremely well as a Celtic. He was traded for a better player, when he was hurt and set to be a free agent (clearly wanting big money).

Nothing to sugar coat, IT is is a a better career position because of Danny and the Celtics. This is not debatable.

Oh sweet summer child.....

IT was HURT PLAYING FOR BOSTON....he did NOT shut himself DOWN when he SHOULD HAVE...

Is it ANY wonder why the MEDICAL staff was turned over so fast in the fashion that it was?

If IT DID SHUT HIMSELF down we would NOT have beaten WASHINGTON...

If we DID NOT beat WAS then would Gordon Hayward have left UTAH for a 2nd-round exit Boston Celtics team?

[mctyson]

The loyalty part of this all was

1. IT4 sacrificed his mental state (loss of sister) and physical health (clearly unfit to play, but played anyways) for the organization and fans

2. In the past 2 offseasons he worked hard to recruit FAs.  Helping to land Horford and Hayward.  Were they going to come anyways?  maybe...but both Horford and Hayward have said IT4 was one of the reasons why they joined the team


BUT  Ainge didn't care , made a shrewd business move and still traded him....  It was a cold calculated business move.  But on a personal level IT4 had the Organization back .. and thought the feeling was mutual

I am very grateful that IT did these things, as I am sure Wyc and Ainge are, but none of this warrants not trading him.

[wayupnorth]

On some level, we have to realize that this could have ramifications on future FA's looking at BOS...

True - The League is a BUSINESS.

True - IT was already a millionaire before even beginning to cash in with the Brinks comments.

True - It could be reasoned that Kyrie is better - but only marginally.

But the NBA can no longer tout those "Feel Good" commercials on Player-Team relationships...and they can no longer expect players to even begin to think loyalty.

IT - by ALL accounts - did EVERYTHING for BOSTON.....EVERYTHING. Boston is where it is RIGHT NOW because of him.

And then he was traded - while he was a broken player.

We'd better be READY once IT gets healthy again - and he WILL. Dude will see blood in the water once he plays us again.

Completely disagree.

Both IT AND the Celtics benefited from that relationship. There are not many franchises that would have given IT the opportunity to show what he can do.

Also, it isn't like Danny sent him to a bad team.

You can disagree all you want to, but there is NO WAY that Danny Ainge - in ALL of his wisdom  - saw IT being as good as he was - as charismatic as he was - and helping BOS to become as good as we ARE.

No way.

NONE of us saw this.

And he sent him to a team that Kyrie Irving was hell-bent on getting AWAY from - because of the LeBron James LEAVING or STAYING controversy, among other things.

What IS the latest on THAT, anyway? Is it Houston OR The Lakers?

Now IT has to deal with it and I wish him well. He's playing with the BEST player in the NBA - right now - and perhaps ONLY for a few months.

lol let's not sugar-coat this.

So Danny and IT were lying when he said Danny called him right when he was a free agent, even though we couldn't sign him?

And he was lying when he said that immediately after the trade Danny said he could be a Celtic great?

Danny knew what he was getting, and had wanted him for some time.

Also, he will be a free agent after this year whether traded or not, so your statement about how he only might be playing with the best player in the world "for only a few months" holds no weight. It is very possible he was only going to play HERE for only a few more months.

IT was treated extremely well as a Celtic. He was traded for a better player, when he was hurt and set to be a free agent (clearly wanting big money).

Nothing to sugar coat, IT is is a a better career position because of Danny and the Celtics. This is not debatable.

Oh sweet summer child.....

IT was HURT PLAYING FOR BOSTON....he did NOT shut himself DOWN when he SHOULD HAVE...

Is it ANY wonder why the MEDICAL staff was turned over so fast in the fashion that it was?

If IT DID SHUT HIMSELF down we would NOT have beaten WASHINGTON...

If we DID NOT beat WAS then would Gordon Hayward have left UTAH for a 2nd-round exit Boston Celtics team?

He was playing thriugh that as much for his next contract as he was for us. (There is nothing wrong with that. Guy has been really underpaid by NBA standards, and they play this game for money at the end of the day).

I applaud and greatly appreciate him gutting it out through both physical and emotional pain, and will always root for him to do well (except when he loses to the Celtics.)

But Danny and Brad helped him as much as he helped this team.

It has to suck for him to have it end like that, but it isn't that bad. No worse than if he left next year for more money. (And I truly think had he done that, the fans wouldn't have hated him like Ray, because it would be only because he wanted to make as much as he could, and again, given his earnings relative to his peers, that is very fair.)

[mctyson]

I still don't understand the "loyalty" aspect of the IT trade.  The Celtics originally traded FOR him.  Also, it is not like IT gave up millions of dollars for a hometown discount and then got traded. 

Why did the Celtics owe him anymore than they already gave him, which was an opportunity to become a star in the league?

They didn't, so long as you also agree that it’s not disloyal for a player to walk away after fulfilling his contract.

That has nothing to do with IT (or others) complaining about the Celtics being disloyal to him by trading him. 

And for the record I have no problem with pros going where they want to go, playing where they want to play, for whatever reason.

[tarheelsxxiii]

Love this piece.  This week, John Gonzalez(?) and Anthony Davis have become 2 of the "5 people I'd like to have dinner with."  IT4, Mike Tyson, and Natalie Portman round out an exciting core.  I feel like a child again.  A young boy living in a Robert Frost scene.

Probably not intentional, but the article throws shade at Ainge and the FO.  This great for IT4, fans that appreciate players and the storyline of a great team as much as reading box scores and bragging to friends, and NBA athletes in general.

The point is that loyalty was always a fallacy, but that doesn’t mean every free-agent signing or trade has to be a bitter affair that ends with one side (or both) writing a “Dear Diary” entry stained with tears. The players and executives are all adults. It goes a long way when everyone acts like it.

Great Zinger from the Ringer right there.  Finally some vindication for the Little Guy.

As for the Ainge apologists, I'm sure you're in the clear regardless.  Unless, of course, his next great trade target has taken issue with how he handled the situation, is good friends with IT, etc.  Woof.  Round and round we go.

[wayupnorth]

Love this piece.  This week, John Gonzalez(?) and Anthony Davis have become 2 of the "5 people I'd like to have dinner with."  IT4, Mike Tyson, and Natalie Portman round out an exciting core.

Probably not intentional, but the article throws shade at Ainge and the FO.  This great for IT4, fans that appreciate players and the storyline of a great team as much as reading box scores and bragging to friends, and NBA athletes in general.

The point is that loyalty was always a fallacy, but that doesn’t mean every free-agent signing or trade has to be a bitter affair that ends with one side (or both) writing a “Dear Diary” entry stained with tears. The players and executives are all adults. It goes a long way when everyone acts like it.

Great zinger right there.  Finally some vindication for the Little Guy.

As for the Ainge apologists, I'm sure your in the clear regardless.  Unless, of course, his next great trade target has taken issue with how he handled the situation, or is good friends with IT, etc.  Woof.

Ainge is one of the best GMs in the league.

He made an excellent trade, and most NBA players would probably acknowledge Kyrie is the better player.

No players will think ill of Ainge over this, and honestly most players would rather play with Kyrie.

You are, once again, trying to make an excellent trade, and player, look bad because you don't personally like him for irrational reasons like "privilege".

"Ainge apologist". A top 5 GM in this league doesn't need apologists. His work speaks for itself.

It is hilarious to watch you trip over yourself trying to dog DA, Kyrie, and this team.

We are playing really well without having our best or second best player, our young players are playing well, and Kyrie is a just about unanimous top 15 player in this league.

Why not enjoy it instead of reveling in hating our best player, and seemingly rooting against this team?