IT4 believes he's due a MAX contract

[Green-18]

I've been pretty consistent that I don't think Boston pays IT a max contract because it will be a bad contract that will likely cause Boston to lose a young player for a team that isn't a real contender.  Now if Boston acquires another player this summer or at the deadline that vaults Boston into true contender status, then signing Thomas makes a lot of sense as it keeps the team at that high level.

What young player are you most concerned about?  Jaylen hits restricted free agency during the year that Horford's contract ends.  That immediately removes the strain of 1 max contract.  Tatum would hit restricted free agency the year that Haywards contract ends.  The only dilemma might be regarding the luxury tax and resigning Gordon Hayward.  We don't know what the cap will be but I suppose an IT max could cost us Hayward.  If Tatum reaches his potential then there is no way Hayward stands in the way of bringing him back.  At the end of the day our franchise is fine if Jaylen, Tatum, and future draft picks turn into Stars.

I think you guys are vastly underestimating the cap and more importantly tax implications. 

Boston has under contract for the 2018/19 season right now
Hayward - 31 million
Horford - 29 million
Crowder - 7 million
Tatum - 7 million
Morris - 5 million
Brown - 5 million
Rozier - 3 million
Zizic - 2 million
Yabu - 3 million
BKN - 6-7 million
LAL - 5-6 million
BOS - 2 million

So those 12 contracts are 105-7 million, which is already over the cap.  That doesn't include Thomas or Smart.  Assuming Thomas gets a max at 30 million.  That puts the team at 135 million which is well into luxury tax range and doesn't have Smart.  So Smart is likely gone next summer because I can't see Boston paying him 15-20 million in salary, when every single penny of that is luxury tax. 

So then Boston enters the 19-20 season with 94 million tied up in Thomas, Horford, and Hayward.  Brown, Tatum, and Crowder are another 22 million.  The 3 18 rookies add another 19 million.  So that is 134 million, which will again be over the luxury tax and that is just 9 players and doesn't count Zizic or Yabu (6 million or so) or Boston's 19 pick (3 million).  So that puts the roster at 143 million with 12 players.  Rozier will be a free agent.  No way he is kept.  Boston also loses Morris, who presumably is the starting PF.  Maybe Tatum or one of the 18 rookies is ready to be a starting NBA PF, but maybe not.  So what do you do with that position.

So entering the summer of 2020 when Horford comes off the books, Boston will be a two time luxury tax player on a team that realistically hasn't won a title.  Brown will be due for his  raise that summer and likely replaces much of Horford's salary.  Crowder also comes off the books and Hayward has a player option (which he likely opts out of and then will look for a 10 year vet max contract).  Now maybe a team of Thomas, Hayward, Brown, Tatum, Zizic, Yabu, and the 3 18 rookies is ready to compete for a title, but I think the odds of that are low. Boston may be able to avoid the tax that summer, but it means Horford and Crowder are gone and Boston isn't bring any high paid vets and if Boston can't avoid the tax (because of Hayward's raise and Brown's new contract) that puts Boston into repeater tax range and the team still hasn't realistically competed for a title to that point (though might finally have that team as a result of all the young players).

The repeater tax is nasty.  It is unlikely that Boston will want to pay the repeater tax, but then that means Hayward is gone and it will be hard to keep all of Brown, Tatum, BKN, LAL, Zizic, Bos 18, Bos 19, etc. going forward.


Maxing Thomas next summer just doesn't make financial sense unless Boston is a realistic contender.  I don't see Boston as a realistic contender without acquiring another top level player (which will require some of the prime assets).  So if Boston doesn't trade for that player, I don't expect them to keep Thomas if Thomas really wants a max.  Even a 3 year max won't fix the luxury tax problems the team will have.

I've been pretty consistent that I don't think Boston pays IT a max contract because it will be a bad contract that will likely cause Boston to lose a young player for a team that isn't a real contender.  Now if Boston acquires another player this summer or at the deadline that vaults Boston into true contender status, then signing Thomas makes a lot of sense as it keeps the team at that high level.

What young player are you most concerned about?  Jaylen hits restricted free agency during the year that Horford's contract ends.  That immediately removes the strain of 1 max contract.  Tatum would hit restricted free agency the year that Haywards contract ends.  The only dilemma might be regarding the luxury tax and resigning Gordon Hayward.  We don't know what the cap will be but I suppose an IT max could cost us Hayward.  If Tatum reaches his potential then there is no way Hayward stands in the way of bringing him back.  At the end of the day our franchise is fine if Jaylen, Tatum, and future draft picks turn into Stars.

I think you guys are vastly underestimating the cap and more importantly tax implications. 

Boston has under contract for the 2018/19 season right now
Hayward - 31 million
Horford - 29 million
Crowder - 7 million
Tatum - 7 million
Morris - 5 million
Brown - 5 million
Rozier - 3 million
Zizic - 2 million
Yabu - 3 million
BKN - 6-7 million
LAL - 5-6 million
BOS - 2 million

So those 12 contracts are 105-7 million, which is already over the cap.  That doesn't include Thomas or Smart.  Assuming Thomas gets a max at 30 million.  That puts the team at 135 million which is well into luxury tax range and doesn't have Smart.  So Smart is likely gone next summer because I can't see Boston paying him 15-20 million in salary, when every single penny of that is luxury tax. 

So then Boston enters the 19-20 season with 94 million tied up in Thomas, Horford, and Hayward.  Brown, Tatum, and Crowder are another 22 million.  The 3 18 rookies add another 19 million.  So that is 134 million, which will again be over the luxury tax and that is just 9 players and doesn't count Zizic or Yabu (6 million or so) or Boston's 19 pick (3 million).  So that puts the roster at 143 million with 12 players.  Rozier will be a free agent.  No way he is kept.  Boston also loses Morris, who presumably is the starting PF.  Maybe Tatum or one of the 18 rookies is ready to be a starting NBA PF, but maybe not.  So what do you do with that position.

So entering the summer of 2020 when Horford comes off the books, Boston will be a two time luxury tax player on a team that realistically hasn't won a title.  Brown will be due for his  raise that summer and likely replaces much of Horford's salary.  Crowder also comes off the books and Hayward has a player option (which he likely opts out of and then will look for a 10 year vet max contract).  Now maybe a team of Thomas, Hayward, Brown, Tatum, Zizic, Yabu, and the 3 18 rookies is ready to compete for a title, but I think the odds of that are low. Boston may be able to avoid the tax that summer, but it means Horford and Crowder are gone and Boston isn't bring any high paid vets and if Boston can't avoid the tax (because of Hayward's raise and Brown's new contract) that puts Boston into repeater tax range and the team still hasn't realistically competed for a title to that point (though might finally have that team as a result of all the young players).

The repeater tax is nasty.  It is unlikely that Boston will want to pay the repeater tax, but then that means Hayward is gone and it will be hard to keep all of Brown, Tatum, BKN, LAL, Zizic, Bos 18, Bos 19, etc. going forward.


Maxing Thomas next summer just doesn't make financial sense unless Boston is a realistic contender.  I don't see Boston as a realistic contender without acquiring another top level player (which will require some of the prime assets).  So if Boston doesn't trade for that player, I don't expect them to keep Thomas if Thomas really wants a max.  Even a 3 year max won't fix the luxury tax problems the team will have.

These are all great points.  I have mentioned in other threads that it will be interesting to find out how far into the luxury tax ownership is willing to go.  At some point there will need to be significant roster consolidation and that's where I have faith in Danny Ainge.  I still think IT gets a max contract and Danny will attempt to move assets proactively to avoid the repeater tax.  A lot of this ultimately comes down to Tatum, Brown, and Brooklyn 18 panning out.

The other aspect of this is potential playoff revenue.  Does anyone know how much our team profits from a multiple round playoff run?  I know it does nothing to help with the repeater tax but I would still be interested in finding out if it helps justify paying into the luxury tax to a certain extent.

[gift]

I wonder if the Celtics can offer IT4 a player option after year 2 or 3 of the max in exchange for a team option going into year 4 or 5. This might be a more palatable way to get the team option worked in, if it seems like IT4 has some control before it gets to that point.

[Kuberski33]

And let's think about this logically, there is no way Thomas, Hayward, and Horford with really young players and guys like Crowder and Morris are a team that is going to win a title with that core group.  Even if the Cavs implode next summer, Boston isn't better than any number of western teams and who knows maybe the Sixers or Bucks take a big leap this season and enter the 19 season as the best team in the East. 

Boston isn't winning a title with Thomas, Hayward, and Horford as the core of the team.  Sadly that team just isn't good enough.  And you can't keep all 3 and expect the young players to really develop into a contender for the tax reasons I outlined.  It would be great if those guys could all be around and be bench players on a team led by Brown, Tatum, Porter, Bamba, etc. but financially it just isn't going to work.

If they're not, it made little sense bringing Horford here for what they're paying him.  And Ainge has said they're not done building the roster.  There may still be one more major move coming this summer.

[Rosco917]

As the Celtics gain more, and better two way players...players that can both score by creating their own shot and play solid defense, the value of IT will decrease. The need for a more balanced point guard will be a necessity.

The signing of Hayward, and hopefully the development of Tatum, and Brown will eventually reduce the scoring attempts of IT, and thus reduce his true, and only value. 

Sign him for fair money with that in mind.

[kozlodoev]

Also included in this news item: Thomas hasn't played basketball yet this summer, and still doesn't know whether he'll need surgery on the hip.

[kozlodoev]

Paying max money to perennial All-Stars is just a normal part of the NBA.   

Well, Thomas has 2 allstar appearances so far, so the jury is still out on how perennial he is.

On the other hand Horford and Hayward have 17 seasons between themselves, and just 5 allstar appearances to show for it, so who knows what's a normal part of the NBA anymore.

[Moranis]

And let's think about this logically, there is no way Thomas, Hayward, and Horford with really young players and guys like Crowder and Morris are a team that is going to win a title with that core group.  Even if the Cavs implode next summer, Boston isn't better than any number of western teams and who knows maybe the Sixers or Bucks take a big leap this season and enter the 19 season as the best team in the East. 

Boston isn't winning a title with Thomas, Hayward, and Horford as the core of the team.  Sadly that team just isn't good enough.  And you can't keep all 3 and expect the young players to really develop into a contender for the tax reasons I outlined.  It would be great if those guys could all be around and be bench players on a team led by Brown, Tatum, Porter, Bamba, etc. but financially it just isn't going to work.

If they're not, it made little sense bringing Horford here for what they're paying him.  And Ainge has said they're not done building the roster.  There may still be one more major move coming this summer.

well yeah, and I've consistently said from the moment he signed that Horford was a bad signing once Durant didn't sign in Boston.  Horford is a quality player, but he isn't a max player and he certainly isn't a max player on a team that lacks a transcendent player.  I mean if he was playing next to James, Durant, Leonard, etc. then his skill set is a perfect one to have, but on this team with this roster, he just wasn't a good signing.  I'd have rather just gone for short term or low dollar contracts last summer instead of Horford and entered last season with the ability to acquire a max and still have max cap room.   It would have allowed Ainge to have a lot more flexibility at the deadline and he could have taken on some rentals or gone after Cousins and still had the room available for a max this summer.  I also think Thomas at a max makes a lot more sense if Horford isn't on the team.  His contract is just awful. 

[GreenEnvy]

Paying max money to perennial All-Stars is just a normal part of the NBA.   

Well, Thomas has 2 allstar appearances so far, so the jury is still out on how perennial he is.

On the other hand Horford and Hayward have 17 seasons between themselves, and just 5 allstar appearances to show for it, so who knows what's a normal part of the NBA anymore.

But he's 2 for 2 since coming to Boston. His trajectory is upward. He's a hard worker and continues to improve each season.

All-star. Perennial all-star. All-NBA. MVP candidate. Whatever. He's getting the max. He's a great player. He's likeable. He's marketable. He's worth it, plain and simple.

[GreenEnvy]

I've been pretty consistent that I don't think Boston pays IT a max contract because it will be a bad contract that will likely cause Boston to lose a young player for a team that isn't a real contender.  Now if Boston acquires another player this summer or at the deadline that vaults Boston into true contender status, then signing Thomas makes a lot of sense as it keeps the team at that high level.

What young player are you most concerned about?  Jaylen hits restricted free agency during the year that Horford's contract ends.  That immediately removes the strain of 1 max contract.  Tatum would hit restricted free agency the year that Haywards contract ends.  The only dilemma might be regarding the luxury tax and resigning Gordon Hayward.  We don't know what the cap will be but I suppose an IT max could cost us Hayward.  If Tatum reaches his potential then there is no way Hayward stands in the way of bringing him back.  At the end of the day our franchise is fine if Jaylen, Tatum, and future draft picks turn into Stars.

I think you guys are vastly underestimating the cap and more importantly tax implications. 

Boston has under contract for the 2018/19 season right now
Hayward - 31 million
Horford - 29 million
Crowder - 7 million
Tatum - 7 million
Morris - 5 million
Brown - 5 million
Rozier - 3 million
Zizic - 2 million
Yabu - 3 million
BKN - 6-7 million
LAL - 5-6 million
BOS - 2 million

So those 12 contracts are 105-7 million, which is already over the cap.  That doesn't include Thomas or Smart.  Assuming Thomas gets a max at 30 million.  That puts the team at 135 million which is well into luxury tax range and doesn't have Smart.  So Smart is likely gone next summer because I can't see Boston paying him 15-20 million in salary, when every single penny of that is luxury tax. 

So then Boston enters the 19-20 season with 94 million tied up in Thomas, Horford, and Hayward.  Brown, Tatum, and Crowder are another 22 million.  The 3 18 rookies add another 19 million.  So that is 134 million, which will again be over the luxury tax and that is just 9 players and doesn't count Zizic or Yabu (6 million or so) or Boston's 19 pick (3 million).  So that puts the roster at 143 million with 12 players.  Rozier will be a free agent.  No way he is kept.  Boston also loses Morris, who presumably is the starting PF.  Maybe Tatum or one of the 18 rookies is ready to be a starting NBA PF, but maybe not.  So what do you do with that position.

So entering the summer of 2020 when Horford comes off the books, Boston will be a two time luxury tax player on a team that realistically hasn't won a title.  Brown will be due for his  raise that summer and likely replaces much of Horford's salary.  Crowder also comes off the books and Hayward has a player option (which he likely opts out of and then will look for a 10 year vet max contract).  Now maybe a team of Thomas, Hayward, Brown, Tatum, Zizic, Yabu, and the 3 18 rookies is ready to compete for a title, but I think the odds of that are low. Boston may be able to avoid the tax that summer, but it means Horford and Crowder are gone and Boston isn't bring any high paid vets and if Boston can't avoid the tax (because of Hayward's raise and Brown's new contract) that puts Boston into repeater tax range and the team still hasn't realistically competed for a title to that point (though might finally have that team as a result of all the young players).

The repeater tax is nasty.  It is unlikely that Boston will want to pay the repeater tax, but then that means Hayward is gone and it will be hard to keep all of Brown, Tatum, BKN, LAL, Zizic, Bos 18, Bos 19, etc. going forward.


Maxing Thomas next summer just doesn't make financial sense unless Boston is a realistic contender.  I don't see Boston as a realistic contender without acquiring another top level player (which will require some of the prime assets).  So if Boston doesn't trade for that player, I don't expect them to keep Thomas if Thomas really wants a max.  Even a 3 year max won't fix the luxury tax problems the team will have.

I think they fully expect to contend for the title as soon as this season but definitely next season.

No they don't.  There is a reason Wyc said they were 2 players away, because they were 2 players away.  They added Hayward, meaning they are still 1 player away.  That player isn't on the roster for this season and probably next (maybe Brown or Tatum gets there, maybe not). 

And let's think about this logically, there is no way Thomas, Hayward, and Horford with really young players and guys like Crowder and Morris are a team that is going to win a title with that core group.  Even if the Cavs implode next summer, Boston isn't better than any number of western teams and who knows maybe the Sixers or Bucks take a big leap this season and enter the 19 season as the best team in the East. 

Boston isn't winning a title with Thomas, Hayward, and Horford as the core of the team.  Sadly that team just isn't good enough.  And you can't keep all 3 and expect the young players to really develop into a contender for the tax reasons I outlined.  It would be great if those guys could all be around and be bench players on a team led by Brown, Tatum, Porter, Bamba, etc. but financially it just isn't going to work.

Well, we were clearly the 4th best team last season (GSW, SAS, CLE). We undoubtedly got better. I love AB, but Hayward is a better player. We got bigger and more talented. We added Tatum, who by all accounts is an NBA-ready scorer. We added Morris, who is a solid player in his own right. We can expect Brown to be improved.

So the question remains how much better? Nobody knows yet. But I'm sure the other top teams are certainly watching us. They know we have the current roster and future assets to make a move to the very top.


As for the salaries, I wouldn't worry too much about them, especially 2-3'years down the road. We see how teams can dump bad contracts if they add a little sweetener to the deal. We can give any GM in the league a mouthful of cavities if we really had to. Ainge and Wyc seem to be very cohesive in the deals being made. You're not signing Horford, then Hayward, only to let IT walk. Who thought he would only be asking for $15M a season? The guy is the best bargain off a rookie deal in the entire NBA. He deserves to get paid now. We will do it, and Ainge will continue adding talent to this team until we raise our next banner.

[bdm860]

The other aspect of this is potential playoff revenue.  Does anyone know how much our team profits from a multiple round playoff run?  I know it does nothing to help with the repeater tax but I would still be interested in finding out if it helps justify paying into the luxury tax to a certain extent.

ESPN estimated it was about $10m in revenue per home game for GS for the Finals this year.  Remember though, revenue and profit are two different things.

There's a Wages of Wins article from 2013 that estimates regular season ticket revenue was $1m+ for top teams (which included the Celtics).  A more recent Forbes article from 2016 shows many teams at more than $1m per game when you look at total gate revenue, but unsure if these numbers include playoff games or not.

So probably somewhere between $2m and $10m per home game in the playoffs, depending on the round.  So simple SWAG math, let's say:

$2.5m for 1st round * 3 games (assuming C's in 5 or 6) = $7.5m
$3.5m for 2nd round * 3 games (assuming C's in 5 or 6) = $10.5m
$5m for ECF * 3 games (who has home court? Can they take the Cavs to at least 6? Do they upset the Cavs?) = $15m
$10m for Finals * 2 games (swept by the Warriors) = $20m

Getting to the ECF and keeping it competitive probably gets the team and additional $33m in revenue, and just getting swept in the Finals probably earns the team another $20m+.  C's may have made $36.5m from the 10 playoff games this year, which hopefully got deposited into the future luxury tax account.

[ashanm10]

look, if he produces the same year as last (and better), that MAX is gonna be ready for him before FA even reaches lol. He will prove his worth for sure tho, coz we arent the only ones who would offer him a MAX if he clearly deserves it, so he knows he has to earn it too, hes been doing it on a night in night out proving everyone!

[Green-18]

The other aspect of this is potential playoff revenue.  Does anyone know how much our team profits from a multiple round playoff run?  I know it does nothing to help with the repeater tax but I would still be interested in finding out if it helps justify paying into the luxury tax to a certain extent.

ESPN estimated it was about $10m in revenue per home game for GS for the Finals this year.  Remember though, revenue and profit are two different things.

There's a Wages of Wins article from 2013 that estimates regular season ticket revenue was $1m+ for top teams (which included the Celtics).  A more recent Forbes article from 2016 shows many teams at more than $1m per game when you look at total gate revenue, but unsure if these numbers include playoff games or not.

So probably somewhere between $2m and $10m per home game in the playoffs, depending on the round.  So simple SWAG math, let's say:

$2.5m for 1st round * 3 games (assuming C's in 5 or 6) = $7.5m
$3.5m for 2nd round * 3 games (assuming C's in 5 or 6) = $10.5m
$5m for ECF * 3 games (who has home court? Can they take the Cavs to at least 6? Do they upset the Cavs?) = $15m
$10m for Finals * 2 games (swept by the Warriors) = $20m

Getting to the ECF and keeping it competitive probably gets the team and additional $33m in revenue, and just getting swept in the Finals probably earns the team another $20m+.  C's may have made $36.5m from the 10 playoff games this year, which hopefully got deposited into the future luxury tax account.

Thank you for taking the time to post this.  The repeater tax is it's own beast but it's nice to see that team success can probably help us pay into the luxury tax for a few seasons.  A Finals appearence would really make an impact.

[CelticSince83]

He should get max $ and max years because it is common sense to pay for future services based on past performance.  Especially in a sport like basketball where smaller speed dependent guards perform at the same level into their 30s as they did in their mid 20s. 

[Moranis]

I've been pretty consistent that I don't think Boston pays IT a max contract because it will be a bad contract that will likely cause Boston to lose a young player for a team that isn't a real contender.  Now if Boston acquires another player this summer or at the deadline that vaults Boston into true contender status, then signing Thomas makes a lot of sense as it keeps the team at that high level.

What young player are you most concerned about?  Jaylen hits restricted free agency during the year that Horford's contract ends.  That immediately removes the strain of 1 max contract.  Tatum would hit restricted free agency the year that Haywards contract ends.  The only dilemma might be regarding the luxury tax and resigning Gordon Hayward.  We don't know what the cap will be but I suppose an IT max could cost us Hayward.  If Tatum reaches his potential then there is no way Hayward stands in the way of bringing him back.  At the end of the day our franchise is fine if Jaylen, Tatum, and future draft picks turn into Stars.

I think you guys are vastly underestimating the cap and more importantly tax implications. 

Boston has under contract for the 2018/19 season right now
Hayward - 31 million
Horford - 29 million
Crowder - 7 million
Tatum - 7 million
Morris - 5 million
Brown - 5 million
Rozier - 3 million
Zizic - 2 million
Yabu - 3 million
BKN - 6-7 million
LAL - 5-6 million
BOS - 2 million

So those 12 contracts are 105-7 million, which is already over the cap.  That doesn't include Thomas or Smart.  Assuming Thomas gets a max at 30 million.  That puts the team at 135 million which is well into luxury tax range and doesn't have Smart.  So Smart is likely gone next summer because I can't see Boston paying him 15-20 million in salary, when every single penny of that is luxury tax. 

So then Boston enters the 19-20 season with 94 million tied up in Thomas, Horford, and Hayward.  Brown, Tatum, and Crowder are another 22 million.  The 3 18 rookies add another 19 million.  So that is 134 million, which will again be over the luxury tax and that is just 9 players and doesn't count Zizic or Yabu (6 million or so) or Boston's 19 pick (3 million).  So that puts the roster at 143 million with 12 players.  Rozier will be a free agent.  No way he is kept.  Boston also loses Morris, who presumably is the starting PF.  Maybe Tatum or one of the 18 rookies is ready to be a starting NBA PF, but maybe not.  So what do you do with that position.

So entering the summer of 2020 when Horford comes off the books, Boston will be a two time luxury tax player on a team that realistically hasn't won a title.  Brown will be due for his  raise that summer and likely replaces much of Horford's salary.  Crowder also comes off the books and Hayward has a player option (which he likely opts out of and then will look for a 10 year vet max contract).  Now maybe a team of Thomas, Hayward, Brown, Tatum, Zizic, Yabu, and the 3 18 rookies is ready to compete for a title, but I think the odds of that are low. Boston may be able to avoid the tax that summer, but it means Horford and Crowder are gone and Boston isn't bring any high paid vets and if Boston can't avoid the tax (because of Hayward's raise and Brown's new contract) that puts Boston into repeater tax range and the team still hasn't realistically competed for a title to that point (though might finally have that team as a result of all the young players).

The repeater tax is nasty.  It is unlikely that Boston will want to pay the repeater tax, but then that means Hayward is gone and it will be hard to keep all of Brown, Tatum, BKN, LAL, Zizic, Bos 18, Bos 19, etc. going forward.


Maxing Thomas next summer just doesn't make financial sense unless Boston is a realistic contender.  I don't see Boston as a realistic contender without acquiring another top level player (which will require some of the prime assets).  So if Boston doesn't trade for that player, I don't expect them to keep Thomas if Thomas really wants a max.  Even a 3 year max won't fix the luxury tax problems the team will have.

I think they fully expect to contend for the title as soon as this season but definitely next season.

No they don't.  There is a reason Wyc said they were 2 players away, because they were 2 players away.  They added Hayward, meaning they are still 1 player away.  That player isn't on the roster for this season and probably next (maybe Brown or Tatum gets there, maybe not). 

And let's think about this logically, there is no way Thomas, Hayward, and Horford with really young players and guys like Crowder and Morris are a team that is going to win a title with that core group.  Even if the Cavs implode next summer, Boston isn't better than any number of western teams and who knows maybe the Sixers or Bucks take a big leap this season and enter the 19 season as the best team in the East. 

Boston isn't winning a title with Thomas, Hayward, and Horford as the core of the team.  Sadly that team just isn't good enough.  And you can't keep all 3 and expect the young players to really develop into a contender for the tax reasons I outlined.  It would be great if those guys could all be around and be bench players on a team led by Brown, Tatum, Porter, Bamba, etc. but financially it just isn't going to work.

Well, we were clearly the 4th best team last season (GSW, SAS, CLE). We undoubtedly got better. I love AB, but Hayward is a better player. We got bigger and more talented. We added Tatum, who by all accounts is an NBA-ready scorer. We added Morris, who is a solid player in his own right. We can expect Brown to be improved.

So the question remains how much better? Nobody knows yet. But I'm sure the other top teams are certainly watching us. They know we have the current roster and future assets to make a move to the very top.


As for the salaries, I wouldn't worry too much about them, especially 2-3'years down the road. We see how teams can dump bad contracts if they add a little sweetener to the deal. We can give any GM in the league a mouthful of cavities if we really had to. Ainge and Wyc seem to be very cohesive in the deals being made. You're not signing Horford, then Hayward, only to let IT walk. Who thought he would only be asking for $15M a season? The guy is the best bargain off a rookie deal in the entire NBA. He deserves to get paid now. We will do it, and Ainge will continue adding talent to this team until we raise our next banner.

Houston had more wins than Boston did last year as well and then proceeded to add one of the best PG's in basketball history.  Boston barely beat Washington and if not for a Rondo injury might have lost to Chicago.  Sure Boston was in the ECF, but they got absolutely shellacked by a team that went on to lose the Finals in 5 games.  Hayward, Tatum and Morris are collectively better than Bradley, Olynyk, and Johnson, so the gap has closed a bit, but not nearly enough.  If Boston was in the west it would probably be the 5th seed this season behind GS, SA, Houston, and OKC.  Cleveland is still clearly a better team (though Boston will probably have more regular season wins).  A team that is at its best the 6th best team in the game is not a contender and ownership isn't going to pay crazy luxury taxes for a team that isn't a contender. 

[kozlodoev]

Paying max money to perennial All-Stars is just a normal part of the NBA.   

Well, Thomas has 2 allstar appearances so far, so the jury is still out on how perennial he is.

On the other hand Horford and Hayward have 17 seasons between themselves, and just 5 allstar appearances to show for it, so who knows what's a normal part of the NBA anymore.

But he's 2 for 2 since coming to Boston. His trajectory is upward. He's a hard worker and continues to improve each season.

All-star. Perennial all-star. All-NBA. MVP candidate. Whatever. He's getting the max. He's a great player. He's likeable. He's marketable. He's worth it, plain and simple.

He might be the first 29-year old whose trajectory is upward. Paying him the max when he's 34 might not be all that great, but I'm sure someone will do it.