Woj, Stein, & Lowe - C's and Sixers in serious talks for #1 pick

[Ilikesports17]

Ugh freaking Lowe now saying the principal pieces are in play and he'd be surprised if it doesn't get done at this point...

Why is this "UGH?"  I get being excited about Fultz and having the #1 pick but acting like this isn't a power move by the Celtics is kind of weird.  They are in the driver's seat.

Because we've long been longing for the type of high-level talent that Fultz represents. Making this trade means taking a lesser talent in this draft all for the price of future picks that may or may not be as good as this pick.

As the last several years have shown, with Boston in particular, quality, not quantity, wins in the NBA.

I don't think Danny would do this if he didn't think the player he is getting back (hopefully Jackson) has a good shot of being the best player from the draft.

I truly do not get all of this Jackson love on here. He seems like a bigger, bit more well-rounded version of Marcus Smart to me, only with less defense and more athleticism and size/length. I don't see him ever being even a secondary scorer in the NBA. He's also really similar to Brown in a lot of ways, so why would we want Jackson, too?

I just don't see him as the type of player that this team needs going forward.

I see a top level athlete who plays strong defense and is very versatile.  Everybody sees that.  I also see a guy who, in my estimation, projects to be a lot better lead--or at least secondary--ball handler than he is given credit for.

He looks smooth with the ball in his hands.  He looks like the type of player who can get to where he wants on the floor easily.  He's got good vision, good handles, and a nice mid range game.

I don't think he got to showcase all his skills at Kansas, but I think he has top level NBA small forward talent.

Time will tell.

I see another Justise Winslow / Stanley Johnson etc.

Hes exponentially more athletic than either of those players.

[PhoSita]

Wouldn't it be wrong if Ainge did NOT explore what he could get for the pick?  It's due diligence.  The report that the Lakers are in love with Fultz just strengthens Ainge's justification for a big return.  If Ainge has a likely superstar on his hands in Fultz he won't trade him unless he knows he's getting a superstar back (maybe not on the initial deal, but in a subsequent one based on the additional assets). 

With the hype that Fultz is getting it scares me to lose him, but what the heck do I know?  I rely on highlights, talking heads and a basketball brain 1/20th the size of Danny's (a generous self-assessment).

To me, I just feel that the whole purpose of hoarding all these picks is to increase your chances of being in the position the Celts are already in, where you get to select a consensus #1 pick and add him to an already good team.

Why pass that up by trading down and picking up yet more future picks?  Are we going to defer to the future every year until Ainge retires?

[KGBirdBias]

Guys this trade isn't for Butler. Think about what we looked like in the playoffs. We couldn't get a rebound and it was a layup drill for the Cavs.

I believe Ainge has asked the Pelicans what it would take to get Davis. If they said 3 #1s, AB, Crowder and KO...you do the deal.

If he can get Davis, that will entice either Hayward or PG13 to sign extension.

No way Ainge is making this deal to get younger. He knows we got killed on the boards and we need a shot blocker as well.

[Phantom255x]

Thing that scares me is EVERYONE is on this: Woj, Lowe, Stein, ETC.

It's not some "rumor with less substance.."

[mctyson]

Wouldn't it be wrong if Ainge did NOT explore what he could get for the pick?  It's due diligence. The report that the Lakers are in love with Fultz just strengthens Ainge's justification for a big return.  If Ainge has a likely superstar on his hands in Fultz he won't trade him unless he knows he's getting a superstar back (maybe not on the initial deal, but in a subsequent one based on the additional assets). 

With the hype that Fultz is getting it scares me to lose him, but what the heck do I know?  I rely on highlights, talking heads and a basketball brain 1/20th the size of Danny's (a generous self-assessment).

Of course.  And it would be negligence if he just picked Fultz because Chad Ford and DraftExpress rate him #1 when he (and his staff) really likes Jackson or Tatum or Fox the best.  More importantly, if he has a team that is willing to give up the #3 pick and 2 more likely top-10 picks to move up 2 spots, it would be criminal to not discuss that if not take it.

[PickNRoll]

If they don't rate Fultz much higher than Jackson, they have to trade down.  That is an easy decision.

If they don't rate Fultz much higher than everyone else, that is itself the problem.

I knew Ainge would do something like this. And I don't understand it either. You rarely have a draft as talented as this one....that still has a consensus no. 1 pick.

Not a concensus.  Internet concensus because of Draftexpress maybe.  Danny has seen all these kids in person.  Hundreds of games.  He doesn't care about internet concensus.  Many GM's do not have Fultz #1 reportedly.

Great point about "internet consensus" not necessarily matching the consensus of NBA gms.  If Danny does this deal, it obviously would indicate that he and his staff weren't part of that consensus.

Not necessarily.  Danny could agree with consensus and still make this trade.  It may indicate that he values the additional picks more than the difference between one and three.

Unlikely, IMO.  This type of decision is weighted so heavily towards best player available.  Look at an average draft.  Find the best player.  Now find the 3rd best.  In most years it would be unthinkable to swap.  Danny thinks the BPA will be there at 3.

[RJ87]

Ugh freaking Lowe now saying the principal pieces are in play and he'd be surprised if it doesn't get done at this point...

Why is this "UGH?"  I get being excited about Fultz and having the #1 pick but acting like this isn't a power move by the Celtics is kind of weird.  They are in the driver's seat.

Because we've long been longing for the type of high-level talent that Fultz represents. Making this trade means taking a lesser talent in this draft all for the price of future picks that may or may not be as good as this pick.

As the last several years have shown, with Boston in particular, quality, not quantity, wins in the NBA.

I don't think Danny would do this if he didn't think the player he is getting back (hopefully Jackson) has a good shot of being the best player from the draft.

I truly do not get all of this Jackson love on here. He seems like a bigger, bit more well-rounded version of Marcus Smart to me, only with less defense and more athleticism and size/length. I don't see him ever being even a secondary scorer in the NBA. He's also really similar to Brown in a lot of ways, so why would we want Jackson, too?

I just don't see him as the type of player that this team needs going forward.

I see a top level athlete who plays strong defense and is very versatile.  Everybody sees that.  I also see a guy who, in my estimation, projects to be a lot better lead--or at least secondary--ball handler than he is given credit for.

He looks smooth with the ball in his hands.  He looks like the type of player who can get to where he wants on the floor easily.  He's got good vision, good handles, and a nice mid range game.

I don't think he got to showcase all his skills at Kansas, but I think he has top level NBA small forward talent.

Time will tell.

I see another Justise Winslow / Stanley Johnson etc.

Hes exponentially more athletic than either of those players.

Allegedly we were willing to give up the moon for Justise Winslow so this is right in line....

[PhoSita]

I would so much rather have an elite pick and roll scorer type prospect than a guy who projects as a kind of Gerald Wallace / Joe Johnson / Andre Iguodala type player.

Look, if we were sitting at #3 after the lottery I'd be all about Josh Jackson.

Fultz is a better prospect. 

I know we already have a great lead scoring guard in Thomas, but he won't last forever.  To me the value of a prospect like Fultz is exponentially higher than a guy like Jackson.

The chances of him becoming another tweener who can't shoot (e.g. MKG, Winslow, Johnson, etc) seem a lot higher than the chance he becomes Kawhi Leonard.

[GetLucky]

Kyler reporting that the deal will not go any farther until Fultz visits the Sixers and the Celtics can get some of the potential #3 guys in for workouts. "Not just" contingent on physical. We might be up in the air about nothing here.

[CelticSooner]

That Lakers pick probably wont even be top 5 next season. They have no incentive to tank anymore. They could win 30+ next season.

[GratefulCs]

DSJ

[CelticsElite]

Guys this trade isn't for Butler. Think about what we looked like in the playoffs. We couldn't get a rebound and it was a layup drill for the Cavs.

I believe Ainge has asked the Pelicans what it would take to get Davis. If they said 3 #1s, AB, Crowder and KO...you do the deal.

If he can get Davis, that will entice either Hayward or PG13 to sign extension.

No way Ainge is making this deal to get younger. He knows we got killed on the boards and we need a shot blocker as well.

that would be amazing if true

[Ilikesports17]

That Lakers pick probably wont even be top 5 next season. They have no incentive to tank anymore. They could win 30+ next season.

that doesnt change the fact that they suck. Brooklyn had no incentive to tank either.

[CelticSooner]

That Lakers pick probably wont even be top 5 next season. They have no incentive to tank anymore. They could win 30+ next season.

that doesnt change the fact that they suck. Brooklyn had no incentive to tank either.

They won't suck as bad next season. Book it

[Celtics18]

I would so much rather have an elite pick and roll scorer type prospect than a guy who projects as a kind of Gerald Wallace / Joe Johnson / Andre Iguodala type player.

Look, if we were sitting at #3 after the lottery I'd be all about Josh Jackson.

Fultz is a better prospect. 

I know we already have a great lead scoring guard in Thomas, but he won't last forever.  To me the value of a prospect like Fultz is exponentially higher than a guy like Jackson.

The chances of him becoming another tweener who can't shoot (e.g. MKG, Winslow, Johnson, etc) seem a lot higher than the chance he becomes Kawhi Leonard.

You are most likely only sure of this because you've been reading it from Chad Ford and Johnathan Givony and the rest of the "experts" for months.  This doesn't make it reality.

Some basketball observers (myself) have been saying they see more potential in Josh Jackson than anyone else in this draft for a while now.

It's nice to see that Danny Ainge may be sharing those observations and projections.