Gordon Hayward

[CoachBo]

For the 1 billionth time, Crowder and Hayward can play next to each other.  If the Celtics sign Hayward, it is most likely that Bradley will be moved, because his contract is shorter, he clears more cap room by being moved, and we're more likely to draft an elite prospect at his position.  The starting lineup (when healthy) would likely be one of the following:

IT/Hayward/Crowder/Olynyk/Horford
IT/Smart/Hayward/Crowder/Horford
IT/Brown/Hayward/Crowder/Horford

I think IT/Smart/Hayward/Crowder/Horford finishes the game.

TP!

Adding Hayward would also make it easier to package other players to improve. Trading Crowder , Bradley and picks for a star level player makes a lot more sense if Hayward is in the fold.

No argument here. Good post.

[footey]

I guess the sabremetrics suggest Hayward an upgrade over Crowder, but  watching him play he seems a tad slow, like Horford. I prefer we focus on getting quicker. Seems turn in wrong direction.

[Evantime34]

I guess the sabremetrics suggest Hayward an upgrade over Crowder, but  watching him play he seems a tad slow, like Horford. I prefer we focus on getting quicker. Seems turn in wrong direction.

What make you think Hayward is slower than Crowder?

Hayward gets to the hoop a lot more than Crowder which to me is a big example of quickness. I think Hayward is quicker, has better handle and is a better vertical athlete than Crowder. Crowder is certainly stronger though.

We don't need to sign Hayward as an upgrade though, Crowder and Hayward can play next to each other.

[BitterJim]

We don't need Hayward. Overrated and overpaid.
We need a big who can defend and rebound.

But if we got Hayward we could trade Bradley and or Crowder with pick(s) for a big man... Regarding Hayward at SG - maybe, but what about Smart?

Smart would have the same role he has now.  Depth chart w/ rough minutes for the affected positions:

IT(32)/Fultz?(16)
Hayward(16)/Smart(32)
Crowder(32)/Hayward(16)

Obviously Crowder would spend some time at PF, opening up time for Brown (and Brown could play some PF as well).  This assumes that we draft a PG (I said Fultz, but it could be Ball in there), Bradley gets traded, and is just a super rough approximation, but there are definitely minutes there

[jambr380]

What if the team was thinking of moving AB and playing Hayward at SG?

I think that would work. Or they could move AB, play Smart at SG, Hayward at SF and Crowder at PF

Couldn't we do Cauley-Stein and Casspi for Bradley? I love Crowder's contract.

That's not a bad deal at all if you like WCS. Some people don't. I could see the Kings pulling the trigger for that deal without a doubt.

I dont understand liking WCS honestly.

Avery Bradley averages 17/8 with 40% shooting from deep and made 1st team all-Defense just last season.

Trading AB for WCS is exactly the kind-of move I think Danny might do this off-season after Hayward has agreed to sign with us, but not now.

Not only would it allow us to sign Hayward for near max, but it would also allow us to keep KO as we would be able to offer him his qualifying offer. We may need to make another side move (ie, Rozier, to make all of this work, though.

I can't think of a truer professional than AB - each season he has progressed, he causes absolutely no drama, and we have had him for his whole career - but with IT and Smart also due for major raises next year, we likely will have to make a decision on him if Hayward agrees to sign here.

[Ilikesports17]

What if the team was thinking of moving AB and playing Hayward at SG?

I think that would work. Or they could move AB, play Smart at SG, Hayward at SF and Crowder at PF

Couldn't we do Cauley-Stein and Casspi for Bradley? I love Crowder's contract.

That's not a bad deal at all if you like WCS. Some people don't. I could see the Kings pulling the trigger for that deal without a doubt.

I dont understand liking WCS honestly.

Avery Bradley averages 17/8 with 40% shooting from deep and made 1st team all-Defense just last season.

Trading AB for WCS is exactly the kind-of move I think Danny might do this off-season after Hayward has agreed to sign with us, but not now.

Not only would it allow us to sign Hayward for near max, but it would also allow us to keep KO as we would be able to offer him his qualifying offer. We may need to make another side move (ie, Rozier, to make all of this work, though.

I can't think of a truer professional than AB - each season he has progressed, he causes absolutely no drama, and we have had him for his whole career - but with IT and Smart also due for major raises next year, we likely will have to make a decision on him if Hayward agrees to sign here.

if all you can get for AB is Willie Cauley Stein than just keep Bradley and deal with the log jam.

WCS for AB is an overpay of epic proportions.

[jambr380]

You add as much talent as you can for 'free'. Sure his salary is going to be exorbitant, but this is the last time we are going to have cap space for a while. We can either going to use it on an all-star entering the prime of his career or watch it all dwindle away when we re-sign all of our own players (which we can do regardless of whether or not we sign Hayward).

As others have mentioned, a trade becomes a lot less negatively impactful with the more star or near star level players we have on our roster.

Until Wyc and gang prove they are not willing to spend on a contender, I am all about stealing as many all-stars from other teams as possible.

[Roy H.]

Hayward is on the level of Butler, George and 27 year old Paul Pierce. Statistically, he's a top-10 defender among all starting forwards, and he's obviously a better scorer and passer than Crowder. He'd fit our system perfectly.

[jmen788]

Celtics fans that are still talking about him need to shut it cause its starting to get disrespectful.  Why would we spent max money on a player only to the marginally better at the SF position.  We have Jae of a 7mil/year contract and you want to switch that into a max contract for someone who is a borderline star?  Not only that we also have Jaylen Brown who might develop in to a weapon real soon and there's also a good possibility of us drafting a Josh Jackson.  With Al Hordord already taking up a max, overpaying for another max contract would be disastrous. 

PS all things considered I believe the overall package Crowder brings is on par with Gordan Hayward, hes a lockdown defender and an emotional leader.

You should direct your anger at the front office then, and not us for reading the tea leaves. No offense but I trust Ainge more than you (or more than me obviously haha) and he could for sure not be angling for Hayward (although all his moves really look like he is) and if he thinks that's right then I will support him on that. As mentioned in previous posts, Hayward is good at D and superior on offense. With the game on the line and IT gets trapped in game 6 of the ECF, who do you want taking the shot, Crowder or Hayward? And in the playoffs when things become more of a half court game, Hayward's game is much better suited for that style than Crowder's.

[mctyson]

For the 1 billionth time, Crowder and Hayward can play next to each other.  If the Celtics sign Hayward, it is most likely that Bradley will be moved, because his contract is shorter, he clears more cap room by being moved, and we're more likely to draft an elite prospect at his position.  The starting lineup (when healthy) would likely be one of the following:

IT/Hayward/Crowder/Olynyk/Horford
IT/Smart/Hayward/Crowder/Horford
IT/Brown/Hayward/Crowder/Horford

I think IT/Smart/Hayward/Crowder/Horford finishes the game.

No guarantees, but that is a lineup that could compete with CLE and maybe GSW.

[PAOBoston]

Not sure why people think Crowder needs to be gone if Hayward comes to Boston. First, Hayward is a much better overall player than Crowder. Crowder is a role 3 and D guy ( even though I think his defense isn't very good this year). Hayward is better scorer/defender/ball handler.

All that being said, not sure why they can't play together. The C's play small a lot. They would be able to coexist.

And if Hayward does come, I'd think Bradley is the odd man out. Need to keep all the depth you can once you use up all you salary cap. With Crowder/Smart/Brown and another lottonpick, the bench might become a huge plus for this team next season.

[saltlover]

For the 1 billionth time, Crowder and Hayward can play next to each other.  If the Celtics sign Hayward, it is most likely that Bradley will be moved, because his contract is shorter, he clears more cap room by being moved, and we're more likely to draft an elite prospect at his position.  The starting lineup (when healthy) would likely be one of the following:

IT/Hayward/Crowder/Olynyk/Horford
IT/Smart/Hayward/Crowder/Horford
IT/Brown/Hayward/Crowder/Horford

I think IT/Smart/Hayward/Crowder/Horford finishes the game.

No guarantees, but that is a lineup that could compete with CLE and maybe GSW.

Yep.  Admittedly, if we get "unlucky" and "only" get to draft Josh Jackson, the lineup I really want to see is Smart/Jackson/Hayward/Brown/Crowder.  Not on a regular basis, but occasional 5-minute blitzkriegs.

[Chris22]

We don't need Hayward. Overrated and overpaid.
We need a big who can defend and rebound.

But if we got Hayward we could trade Bradley and or Crowder with pick(s) for a big man... Regarding Hayward at SG - maybe, but what about Smart?

No trades.
Draft Fultz and sign a big in the off season and keep Kelly Olynyk.

[Ilikesports17]

For the 1 billionth time, Crowder and Hayward can play next to each other.  If the Celtics sign Hayward, it is most likely that Bradley will be moved, because his contract is shorter, he clears more cap room by being moved, and we're more likely to draft an elite prospect at his position.  The starting lineup (when healthy) would likely be one of the following:

IT/Hayward/Crowder/Olynyk/Horford
IT/Smart/Hayward/Crowder/Horford
IT/Brown/Hayward/Crowder/Horford

I think IT/Smart/Hayward/Crowder/Horford finishes the game.

No guarantees, but that is a lineup that could compete with CLE and maybe GSW.

Yep.  Admittedly, if we get "unlucky" and "only" get to draft Josh Jackson, the lineup I really want to see is Smart/Jackson/Hayward/Brown/Crowder.  Not on a regular basis, but occasional 5-minute blitzkriegs.

lol
"unlucky" what a time to be a Celtics fan!

This is off-topic, but I know you are a big Otto Porter guy, do you think he could start next to Al at PF? or would that make us too small.

[saltlover]

For the 1 billionth time, Crowder and Hayward can play next to each other.  If the Celtics sign Hayward, it is most likely that Bradley will be moved, because his contract is shorter, he clears more cap room by being moved, and we're more likely to draft an elite prospect at his position.  The starting lineup (when healthy) would likely be one of the following:

IT/Hayward/Crowder/Olynyk/Horford
IT/Smart/Hayward/Crowder/Horford
IT/Brown/Hayward/Crowder/Horford

I think IT/Smart/Hayward/Crowder/Horford finishes the game.

No guarantees, but that is a lineup that could compete with CLE and maybe GSW.

Yep.  Admittedly, if we get "unlucky" and "only" get to draft Josh Jackson, the lineup I really want to see is Smart/Jackson/Hayward/Brown/Crowder.  Not on a regular basis, but occasional 5-minute blitzkriegs.

lol
"unlucky" what a time to be a Celtics fan!

This is off-topic, but I know you are a big Otto Porter guy, do you think he could start next to Al at PF? or would that make us too small.

I think he could or Jae could.  Porter is longer but Jae is thicker -- depends a bit on the matchup.  But Porter is 6'9" with a 7'2" wingspan, so he's definitely got the length, especially as teams continue to play smaller.