Sell At The Deadline

[Who]

I'm about there, especially given the context of the picks we have this year and the fact that we could still legitimately get down to a bottom-5 record.

I don't see that. I think the Celtics can get into the 7-10 range but not the bottom 5.

The team already has 19 wins. Philly has 4. Brooklyn 10. Lakers 8. Pelicans 11. Wolves 12. Suns 13 and falling fast. Then you have Denver, Portland and Sacramento with 14-16 wins.

I don't think it is worth dumping lots of quality players just to get in the 7-10 range.

Especially with the number of future picks & and quality of the Brooklyn picks that Boston already has to play with.

[howl1309]

I'm not sold on being a seller at the deadline.  We already have too many assets that they actually devalue each other. We don't need to add more first rounders or more young, developing players.

If we can truly win a deadline sell, then I would have to be supportive.  But what's the going to look like?

I think we stay the course. Make small improvements or unload on one big player.

I am starting to warm up to getting Dwight Howard. While he is on the downside of his career, he would do wonders for our big man defense and our rebounding. I won't give up any of the brooklyn picks for him but I would still welcome him in. I would also like to see us make a small move for Morris. Yes, he has flaws but he also has a skill set that we could use. The price to get him would be small and could make a big difference to this team.

[Yoki_IsTheName]

We need to first establish who are we keeping as a team before we sell.

Regardless if they ate starting or coming off the bench, we need to know who stays. Figuring that out would make it easy for us to move the other players, either to acquire a better player or just getting more future assets.

[Hemingway]

I'll state the obvious: It all depends on the deals. If some team falls in love with IT or Smart or Crowder or AB and will overpay to get them ok. If a team falls out of love with someone good we should try to get them too. Danny will, as always, play both sides and look for a good deal. We've basically won every trade he has made(or time proved it to be wise even if we lost talent) so I' not to worried.

[Who]

Lots of young developing players who need minutes already

PG: Marcus Smart, Terry Rozier
SG: RJ Hunter
SF: Jae Crowder, James Young
PF: Kelly Olynyk, Jordan Mickey
 C: Jared Sullinger, Tyler Zeller

With more on the way with all those first round picks Ainge owns -- so more of a problem next season.

Tough to take on more young developing players who need minutes -- if trading veterans like Bradley, Isaiah, Turner, D.Lee, Amir for young up and coming guys. 

[Yoki_IsTheName]

Lots of young developing players who need minutes already

PG: Marcus Smart, Terry Rozier
SG: RJ Hunter
SF: Jae Crowder, James Young
PF: Kelly Olynyk, Jordan Mickey
 C: Jared Sullinger, Tyler Zeller

With more on the way with all those first round picks Ainge owns.

Tough to take on more young developing players who need minutes -- if trading veterans like Bradley, Isaiah, Turner, D.Lee, Amir for young up and coming guys.

Which is why we need to identify who we are really keeping. That way we can offload some of the talent, along with the picks and get a player who would fill in the holes that we need.

To me Marcus, Isaiah, Kelly and Jae are the keepers. Either they start or come off the bench, I'd like to have those 4 moving forward. Then we now use the picks and the rest of the guys to either get an established player to join those 4, or clear more cap room, or get future assets, or all of them at once.

But we need to start on figuring out who on our team we are really moving forward with.

[Celtics18]

We would lose Brad Stevens.  As long as you are cool with that.

I like Brad, but if he would decide to leave because the team determines they are still in rebuilding mode instead of remaining committed to a path toward a first round playoff exit, then I'd say he's not the right coach for this franchise.

I think the main problem I have with the premise of this thread is that you seem to have ingrained the notion that an NBA team can't possibly be in rebuilding mode while at the same time being competitive.

As far as I can see, the absolute genius of where Danny Ainge has this team right now is that he has managed to create a perfect "have your cake and eat it too" scenario.

We've got some solid young prospects, we've got boatloads of good draft picks that don't require "tanking," and we don't have any completely crushing oversized contracts.

We are in a great position to continue to build for the future.  Best of all, Danny has accomplished all this while having the team be in a position to keep ownership, our young boy wonder coach, and the fans happy by being competitive while rebuilding.

Why sacrifice wins in the present when we are in such a positive situation?

Frankly, I think Ainge would be foolish to risk upsetting owners, coach, and fans for one or two more prospects who may or may not work out while giving up on hopes of the playoffs.

We are currently mired in a rough patch which is inevitable for a mediocre team like ours.  This probably makes it an ideal time for these kinds of "soft tank" ideas to seem appealing and take hold.

It's simply not worth it in the long run, though.  I'm sure Danny likes his job as Celtics GM.  Right now, he's keeping everyone happy while at the same time having lots of chips at his disposal to keeping building this thing.

As a fan, I'm excited by it. I'll take being a playoff contender while we rebuild.  I like cake.  I like eating it.

[Yenohb]

We would lose Brad Stevens.  As long as you are cool with that.

I like Brad, but if he would decide to leave because the team determines they are still in rebuilding mode instead of remaining committed to a path toward a first round playoff exit, then I'd say he's not the right coach for this franchise.

I think the main problem I have with the premise of this thread is that you seem to have ingrained the notion that an NBA team can't possibly be in rebuilding mode while at the same time being competitive.

As far as I can see, the absolute genius of where Danny Ainge has this team right now is that he has managed to create a perfect "have your cake and eat it too" scenario.

We've got some solid young prospects, we've got boatloads of good draft picks that don't require "tanking," and we don't have any completely crushing oversized contracts.

We are in a great position to continue to build for the future.  Best of all, Danny has accomplished all this while having the team be in a position to keep ownership, our young boy wonder coach, and the fans happy by being competitive while rebuilding.

Why sacrifice wins in the present when we are in such a positive situation?

Frankly, I think Ainge would be foolish to risk upsetting owners, coach, and fans for one or two more prospects who may or may not work out while giving up on hopes of the playoffs.

We are currently mired in a rough patch which is inevitable for a mediocre team like ours.  This probably makes it an ideal time for these kinds of "soft tank" ideas to seem appealing and take hold.

It's simply not worth it in the long run, though.  I'm sure Danny likes his job as Celtics GM.  Right now, he's keeping everyone happy while at the same time having lots of chips at his disposal to keeping building this thing.

As a fan, I'm excited by it. I'll take being a playoff contender while we rebuild.  I like cake.  I like eating it.

This deserves a TP.

[chambers]

We would lose Brad Stevens.  As long as you are cool with that.

I like Brad, but if he would decide to leave because the team determines they are still in rebuilding mode instead of remaining committed to a path toward a first round playoff exit, then I'd say he's not the right coach for this franchise.

I think the main problem I have with the premise of this thread is that you seem to have ingrained the notion that an NBA team can't possibly be in rebuilding mode while at the same time being competitive.

As far as I can see, the absolute genius of where Danny Ainge has this team right now is that he has managed to create a perfect "have your cake and eat it too" scenario.

We've got some solid young prospects, we've got boatloads of good draft picks that don't require "tanking," and we don't have any completely crushing oversized contracts.

We are in a great position to continue to build for the future.  Best of all, Danny has accomplished all this while having the team be in a position to keep ownership, our young boy wonder coach, and the fans happy by being competitive while rebuilding.

Why sacrifice wins in the present when we are in such a positive situation?

Frankly, I think Ainge would be foolish to risk upsetting owners, coach, and fans for one or two more prospects who may or may not work out while giving up on hopes of the playoffs.

We are currently mired in a rough patch which is inevitable for a mediocre team like ours.  This probably makes it an ideal time for these kinds of "soft tank" ideas to seem appealing and take hold.

It's simply not worth it in the long run, though.  I'm sure Danny likes his job as Celtics GM.  Right now, he's keeping everyone happy while at the same time having lots of chips at his disposal to keeping building this thing.

As a fan, I'm excited by it. I'll take being a playoff contender while we rebuild.  I like cake.  I like eating it.

I agree with your sentiments.
It's also important (from the other side of the coin) to consider that after this 2016 Nets pick, what exactly are we going to be 'rebuilding' with if we can't sign any free agents and our own picks+Nets picks are late lottery or mid first round?
Do we just wait around for free agents some more?

This is Phosita's concern (I think). Everything looks good in a weak East, but the reality is we are two top 15 players away from even taking the Cavs to 7 games, let alone beating them in the Eastern Conference Finals.

We have a bunch of great role players, and some young guys that aren't getting any time to show us what they have, and some Nets picks. We have an *almost* All Star who *might* be able to be the 3rd best player on a championship team....

We are a looooong way from banner 18...but I do get what you're saying.

[PhoSita]

I think the main problem I have with the premise of this thread is that you seem to have ingrained the notion that an NBA team can't possibly be in rebuilding mode while at the same time being competitive.

No, that's not really what's going on here.


What's going on here is this:  You say you want to have your cake and eat it too.


Me?  I don't like cake.  Making the playoffs just to watch the team get killed in the first round, all for the sake of some nebulous "experience" for players who probably won't even be here when the team is actually relevant again -- that is not enticing to me at all.

So my point here is to say, Why do that?  If there is an opportunity to improve the chances of making big moves that will get the team where I actually want them to be -- i.e. having the kind of talent in place to actually matter in the post-season -- I want Danny to make them, with no regard whatsoever for the win total this season.

[PhoSita]

Tough to take on more young developing players who need minutes -- if trading veterans like Bradley, Isaiah, Turner, D.Lee, Amir for young up and coming guys.

Maybe.  But on the flip side, it's hard for the team to develop the young guys they already have with all of these journeymen at the top of the roster.

How will they ever get any playing time for the guys they'll be drafting this summer?


This is the thing with Danny's plan of hoarding draft picks.  You actually have to use them! 

If Danny can't find trade partners for some quantity-for-quality type deals around draft day, the Celts will have a roster that's chock full of guys with zero experience, but still plenty of road blocks to those guys getting playing time to develop. 

That creates even more conflict between the urge to "focus on winning" and roll with Thomas, Bradley, Crowder, Amir, Sullinger, etc, versus actually making something of those young players sitting on the bench.

[Moranis]

The team is now in year 4 of the past legitimate contender status and there isn't a single player on this team that I could say with certainty could be a starter on the next title team.  That is a problem.  I've been saying for awhile I don't really care what way Ainge goes, I just want him to pick a direction and stick with it.  If that means going all in, cool.  If that means tanking, cool.  Just pick a [dang] direction already. 

And here's the thing, if we end up with one of the top guys with the Nets pick, it isn't like that guy is going to come and be able to lead a team to a title in the first couple of seasons.  It will be years before that guy can do that (if ever).  If you are going to build around that pick, then Boston should do everything in its power to find guys to build around that player with (by increasing its own draft odds).  If Boston, is going to trade the pick, then it should just do it and start building around that star level player. 

[Csfan1984]

The team is now in year 4 of the past legitimate contender status and there isn't a single player on this team that I could say with certainty could be a starter on the next title team.  That is a problem.  I've been saying for awhile I don't really care what way Ainge goes, I just want him to pick a direction and stick with it.  If that means going all in, cool.  If that means tanking, cool.  Just pick a [dang] direction already. 

And here's the thing, if we end up with one of the top guys with the Nets pick, it isn't like that guy is going to come and be able to lead a team to a title in the first couple of seasons.  It will be years before that guy can do that (if ever).  If you are going to build around that pick, then Boston should do everything in its power to find guys to build around that player with (by increasing its own draft odds).  If Boston, is going to trade the pick, then it should just do it and start building around that star level player.

I ask this all the time. You have a competitive regular season team but it's a no shot in playoffs club. You get a top three pick do you trade it for a established star who can get team out of a round or two in playoffs yet still not a contender? Or do you go full youth build around Smart and the pick allowing them to develop? We aren't the Spurs that tanked for Duncan that was a multi 50 game winner which got the tank just right. We are a .500 club. We need a ton of pieces.

[LarBrd33]

Pho, I've said this before but basically the only reason I was ok with our run (despite the fact that the final two weeks of the season cost us Winslow or perhaps Porzingus) was that it theoretically kept Stevens content.  There was growing buzz last season that Stevens would jump ship for a big time College program ... and I wanted to keep Stevens here.  He's obviously a great coach. 

I said this in another thread, but I'll say it here, too.

If Stevens is gonna jump ship because Danny Ainge trades away journeyman role players in order to continue to position the team to make moves to secure legitimate core talent, then I don't want him here.

Brad has shown himself to be a very good coach, it's true, and I like the positive buzz surrounding the team because of him.  At the same time, he tinkers with rotations to an extreme and I have some concerns long term about the coach being the biggest star on the team, getting much of the credit when they succeed and taking little of the blame when they don't.  That's a problematic dynamic at the professional level (see: Chip Kelly).

If Brad is really here to take the team deep in the playoffs, then he'll be able to appreciate the big picture.  He'll give Danny Ainge a reasonable window of time to build the team up.

 The Celts have only been rebuilding for a couple years now.  Brad couldn't possibly have been under the impression that the team would have a set group in place, with a win-now mentality from management, within two seasons.  It was obvious from the start this process would take longer than that.

If Brad couldn't see that, he's either a fool, or a hypocrite for signing on for this job ostensibly with the purpose of being a part of the process of rebuilding the Celtics into a contender even though his patience for losing was limited to a season or two.  Doc Rivers comes to mind.

alright you sold me.  Sell!!

[Evantime34]

Sell anyone that isn't going to be here long term. To me that means Turner, Zeller, Lee and potentially Sullinger/Jerebko.

I feel like AB, Thomas and Crowder are all on reasonable contracts and give us a good supporting cast in case we can get a star, whether it's through the draft, free agency or trade.