Talent and Size Wins in the Playoffs

[PhoSita]

Every year some fanbase gets all excited about their starless group of overachievers and then gets throttled by a talent buzzsaw once the playoffs starts.  You'd think a team that has built 17 champions on the shoulders of 30 Hall of Fame players would understand how important talent is in this league.  It's the professional sports league with the least amount of parity.  The teams with the best talent always win.

Yeah.  Their hands were somewhat tied, though.  They could have made a greater effort to avoid winning games, I guess.  They would have had to sabotage the team by selling off players for far less than they were worth to really tank this year.

I wish the lottery operated differently.  It stinks to feel that the team may have assembled too many decent players too soon.  Oh no!  We've got to scrap our roster of likable players because they're too much of a bargain!

[Celtics18]

Every year some fanbase gets all excited about their starless group of overachievers and then gets throttled by a talent buzzsaw once the playoffs starts.  You'd think a team that has built 17 champions on the shoulders of 30 Hall of Fame players would understand how important talent is in this league.  It's the professional sports league with the least amount of parity.  The teams with the best talent always win.

Please.  Nobody (or at least very, very few of us) have ever thought this team is anything other than what it is.

I'm still enjoying them and looking forward to game two.  No need for snide, back handed insults at those who are enjoying rooting for this team. 

[PhoSita]

No need to be such a prick about it all.

Agreed, on both sides of this.  There's a lot of choosing sides and talking to one another like we're enemies around here these days.

I apologize if it seems like I'm trying to rain on people's parades, here.  I'm definitely not trying to make an "I told you so!" pro-tanking thread. 

It's just a bummer to watch a team full of guys I genuinely like get thrashed and not have a clue how they're going to change it for next year.

[LarBrd33]

Every year some fanbase gets all excited about their starless group of overachievers and then gets throttled by a talent buzzsaw once the playoffs starts.  You'd think a team that has built 17 champions on the shoulders of 30 Hall of Fame players would understand how important talent is in this league.  It's the professional sports league with the least amount of parity.  The teams with the best talent always win.

Please.  Nobody (or at least very, very few of us) have ever thought this team is anything other than what it is.

I'm still enjoying them and looking forward to game two.  No need to be such a prick about it all.

Celtics18... I've been pretty vocal that I've been fully supportive of the playoff push despite fully understanding we were in for a beat-down.   

Now that we're getting predictably beat-down, I'm not losing sleep over it.  Why would anyone expect otherwise?  We are a bottom tier fringe playoff team facing a contender.  According to oddsmakers, winning this series would be the biggest upset in the history of basketball.

Sweep is likely, but I was on board with the playoffs for a few reasons.

#1 - Maybe it helps in our free agent pitch
#2 - Maybe it increases the trade value for a couple guys
#3 - I really like Stevens... and if we ever get the proper talent, I want him here.  Making the playoffs keeps him engaged and the players committed. 

I felt those three things offset the difference in draft picks.  Hornets are a better collection of talent and have the 9th best draft odds.  I didn't think a Top 5 pick was likely this year.  We'd have more trade options with a 9th pick, but I doubt it would have made much of a difference.  We're still getting outbid.

[jpotter33]

I am concerned by lack of high quality trade assets on Celtics roster.

Reminds me of those Pau Gasol Memphis Grizzlies teams that won 45-50 games but had no real 2nd option behind Pau.

Boston has no 1st option... which is why they lost more games this year than they won.  They aren't a good team.   A top 5 pick would have done FAR more for our future than a pointless sweep.  A couple weeks ago I did a poll and 70% of the fans here preferred missing the playoffs and having the 9th best draft odds.   

But whatever.   We were mediocre enough that a Top 5 pick wasn't going to happen.  Danny certainly tried to set this team up for failure, but they kept winning games in spite of it.  The difference between 9-16 probably isn't going to be that dramatic.   I like Stevens long-term.  I like that he's built a culture here.  Hopefully they can lure some talent via free agency.  We don't have the trade assets to get the first option.  We'll need to get lucky.  There's a good chance we'll get stuck in perpetual mediocrity.

EDIT: I just don't get all the pessimism and hate towards our guys. Nobody expects us to win the series, but to sit there and just rant and rant on them is a little ridiculous. We tried to tank, but we were too good for it. Not sure what the hell else we were supposed to do.

[Celtics18]

No need to be such a prick about it all.

Agreed, on both sides of this.  There's a lot of choosing sides and talking to one another like we're enemies around here these days.

I apologize if it seems like I'm trying to rain on people's parades, here.  I'm definitely not trying to make an "I told you so!" pro-tanking thread. 

It's just a bummer to watch a team full of guys I genuinely like get thrashed and not have a clue how they're going to change it for next year.

Enjoy it.  Marcus Smart, Kelly Olynyk, Jared Sullinger, Tyler Zeller, and Jae Crowder may all be better players by next season, due in part to this experience.

A sixteenth pick in the draft plus a late first rounder is nothing to sneeze at. 

Who knows how the trade market or free agency will pan out? 

Plus, we have more picks (from other teams) coming up in the immediate future.

It's one game.  We got pseudo blown out.  It wasn't an official stomping.  We did a good job of "hanging on to the rope" as Jackson said.

That's all I'm asking for.  Keep fighting, keep within range, maybe steal one back home.  We know the crowd at the Garden are going to give them a boost. 

We might get swept in the end, but I don't see this team quitting at any point.  For me that's a victory in itself. 

[jpotter33]

No need to be such a prick about it all.

Agreed, on both sides of this.  There's a lot of choosing sides and talking to one another like we're enemies around here these days.

I apologize if it seems like I'm trying to rain on people's parades, here.  I'm definitely not trying to make an "I told you so!" pro-tanking thread. 

It's just a bummer to watch a team full of guys I genuinely like get thrashed and not have a clue how they're going to change it for next year.

Enjoy it.  Marcus Smart, Kelly Olynyk, Jared Sullinger, Tyler Zeller, and Jae Crowder may all be better players by next season, due in part to this experience.

A sixteenth pick in the draft plus a late first rounder is nothing to sneeze at. 

Who knows how the trade market or free agency will pan out? 

Plus, we have more picks (from other teams) coming up in the immediate future.

It's one game.  We got pseudo blown out.  It wasn't an official stomping.  We did a good job of "hanging on to the rope" as Jackson said.

That's all I'm asking for.  Keep fighting, keep within range, maybe steal one back home.  We know the crowd at the Garden are going to give them a boost. 

We might get swept in the end, but I don't see this team quitting at any point.  For me that's a victory in itself.

TP

[clover]

Sullinger

Size, but not skilled (NBA)

I'd say Sully's size is off, but his skill is generally pretty on.

[LarBrd33]

No need to be such a prick about it all.

Agreed, on both sides of this.  There's a lot of choosing sides and talking to one another like we're enemies around here these days.

I apologize if it seems like I'm trying to rain on people's parades, here.  I'm definitely not trying to make an "I told you so!" pro-tanking thread. 

It's just a bummer to watch a team full of guys I genuinely like get thrashed and not have a clue how they're going to change it for next year.

Enjoy it.  Marcus Smart, Kelly Olynyk, Jared Sullinger, Tyler Zeller, and Jae Crowder may all be better players by next season, due in part to this experience.

Yeah it should help them a bit.  After Boston was swept in 2004 by the Pacers, they bounced back with 45 wins in 2005 and took the Pacers to 7 games... then missed the playoffs in 2006 and 2007.   2008 was title-town baby.  So maybe we'll get to 7 games next season, bottom out for a couple seasons and come storming back with #18 in 2019.  Here's hoping. 

[LarBrd33]

I am concerned by lack of high quality trade assets on Celtics roster.

Reminds me of those Pau Gasol Memphis Grizzlies teams that won 45-50 games but had no real 2nd option behind Pau.

Boston has no 1st option... which is why they lost more games this year than they won.  They aren't a good team.   A top 5 pick would have done FAR more for our future than a pointless sweep.  A couple weeks ago I did a poll and 70% of the fans here preferred missing the playoffs and having the 9th best draft odds.   

But whatever.   We were mediocre enough that a Top 5 pick wasn't going to happen.  Danny certainly tried to set this team up for failure, but they kept winning games in spite of it.  The difference between 9-16 probably isn't going to be that dramatic.   I like Stevens long-term.  I like that he's built a culture here.  Hopefully they can lure some talent via free agency.  We don't have the trade assets to get the first option.  We'll need to get lucky.  There's a good chance we'll get stuck in perpetual mediocrity.

EDIT: I just don't get all the pessimism and hate towards our guys. Nobody expects us to win the series, but to sit there and just rant and rant on them is a little ridiculous. We tried to tank, but we were too good for it. Not sure what the hell else we were supposed to do.

I have no hate for any of these guys.  They play hard.  It's a fun team.  We're going to get crushed in this series in probably 4 games.  It is what it is.  I didn't start this thread, jpotter.  I'm not upset about the inevitable.  I'm looking forward to the summer.   The team should be proud that they got this far.   They are going to hover around 32-45 wins unless Danny makes some significant player additions.   I have faith in him.

[Celtics18]

Every year some fanbase gets all excited about their starless group of overachievers and then gets throttled by a talent buzzsaw once the playoffs starts.  You'd think a team that has built 17 champions on the shoulders of 30 Hall of Fame players would understand how important talent is in this league.  It's the professional sports league with the least amount of parity.  The teams with the best talent always win.

Please.  Nobody (or at least very, very few of us) have ever thought this team is anything other than what it is.

I'm still enjoying them and looking forward to game two.  No need to be such a prick about it all.

Celtics18... I've been pretty vocal that I've been fully supportive of the playoff push despite fully understanding we were in for a beat-down.   

Now that we're getting predictably beat-down, I'm not losing sleep over it.  Why would anyone expect otherwise?  We are a bottom tier fringe playoff team facing a contender.  According to oddsmakers, winning this series would be the biggest upset in the history of basketball.

Sweep is likely, but I was on board with the playoffs for a few reasons.

#1 - Maybe it helps in our free agent pitch
#2 - Maybe it increases the trade value for a couple guys
#3 - I really like Stevens... and if we ever get the proper talent, I want him here.  Making the playoffs keeps him engaged and the players committed. 

I felt those three things offset the difference in draft picks.  Hornets are a better collection of talent and have the 9th best draft odds.  I didn't think a Top 5 pick was likely this year.  We'd have more trade options with a 9th pick, but I doubt it would have made much of a difference.  We're still getting outbid.

Plus, playoff experience is valuable for players.  Some of our young guys are getting some.  In the long run, that will end up being a positive for some of these guys, whether they are Celtics forever or not.

For most players, regardless of their draft position or their star potential, their initial playoff experience tends to end in defeat.  I'm glad a few of our young guys are getting some of their playoff apprenticeship time in at the beginning of their careers.  They'll be more prepared for when they get back there with a better team. 

[LarBrd33]

Every year some fanbase gets all excited about their starless group of overachievers and then gets throttled by a talent buzzsaw once the playoffs starts.  You'd think a team that has built 17 champions on the shoulders of 30 Hall of Fame players would understand how important talent is in this league.  It's the professional sports league with the least amount of parity.  The teams with the best talent always win.

Please.  Nobody (or at least very, very few of us) have ever thought this team is anything other than what it is.

I'm still enjoying them and looking forward to game two.  No need to be such a prick about it all.

Celtics18... I've been pretty vocal that I've been fully supportive of the playoff push despite fully understanding we were in for a beat-down.   

Now that we're getting predictably beat-down, I'm not losing sleep over it.  Why would anyone expect otherwise?  We are a bottom tier fringe playoff team facing a contender.  According to oddsmakers, winning this series would be the biggest upset in the history of basketball.

Sweep is likely, but I was on board with the playoffs for a few reasons.

#1 - Maybe it helps in our free agent pitch
#2 - Maybe it increases the trade value for a couple guys
#3 - I really like Stevens... and if we ever get the proper talent, I want him here.  Making the playoffs keeps him engaged and the players committed. 

I felt those three things offset the difference in draft picks.  Hornets are a better collection of talent and have the 9th best draft odds.  I didn't think a Top 5 pick was likely this year.  We'd have more trade options with a 9th pick, but I doubt it would have made much of a difference.  We're still getting outbid.

Plus, playoff experience is valuable for players.  Some of our young guys are getting some.  In the long run, that will end up being a positive for some of these guys, whether they are Celtics forever or not.

For most players, regardless of their draft position or their star potential, their initial playoff experience tends to end in defeat.  I'm glad a few of our young guys are getting some of their playoff apprenticeship time in at the beginning of their careers.  They'll be more prepared for when they get back there with a better team.

I was really happy with the effort today.  We just don't have the talent to compete with LeBron.  It's going to be a quick series. 

But it was great to see guys like Olynyk and Smart come in swinging without fear.  Hopefully they keep playing hard throughout the entire series.  Over the past couple months it was fun watching this little ant of a team lift 10 times it's weight.  I hope they don't get disheartened once it becomes clear to them they are an ant going up against a boot.

[SHAQATTACK]

And refs cheating for one team....no calls on LeBron as he hacks our players like crazy......this is huge advantage ..

LeBron crying and complaining after every call , gets old .......it's as bad as flopping for calls ...watching him crying and whining is so bad  ......I suppose he is considered an adult mentally

LeBron is a talented cry baby, faker , flopper .......very selfish is his worst trait

[Celtics18]

No need to be such a prick about it all.

Agreed, on both sides of this.  There's a lot of choosing sides and talking to one another like we're enemies around here these days.

I apologize if it seems like I'm trying to rain on people's parades, here.  I'm definitely not trying to make an "I told you so!" pro-tanking thread. 

It's just a bummer to watch a team full of guys I genuinely like get thrashed and not have a clue how they're going to change it for next year.

Enjoy it.  Marcus Smart, Kelly Olynyk, Jared Sullinger, Tyler Zeller, and Jae Crowder may all be better players by next season, due in part to this experience.

Yeah it should help them a bit.  After Boston was swept in 2004 by the Pacers, they bounced back with 45 wins in 2005 and took the Pacers to 7 games... then missed the playoffs in 2006 and 2007.   2008 was title-town baby.  So maybe we'll get to 7 games next season, bottom out for a couple seasons and come storming back with #18 in 2019.  Here's hoping.

I'd gladly take 45 regular season wins and being a team with a legitimate shot at advancing past the first round next season. 

[mctyson]

Really disappointed to lose out on a lottery pick in this year's draft. That asset was best short term opportunity to add a young player with star.

And we lost that, for what? To get walloped in the first round? Blown out in multiple (I expect) and lose in 4-5 games? I'd much rather have gotten that draft pick.

It would be one thing if C's made the playoffs because young guys were playing at a high level but they got here because of depth. Not young guys breaking through and showing they are stars in the making.

Please go root for another franchise.