Author Topic: He can shoot!!!  (Read 8355 times)

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Re: He can shoot!!!
« Reply #30 on: March 20, 2015, 05:51:54 PM »

Offline kozlodoev

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If I was the Celtics coach, I would have everyone shooting threes at the end of practice.

The NBA is all about the three point shot now.

I wish we had signed Korver.

Which I guess begs the question, "if we had signed Korver, keeping Rondo and Green would have been likely. Cool with that?"

Not me, I like our current position better with those guys gone.
Korver started off on fire but has cooled considerably since. Also, the fact that he can't stay in one piece doesn't help either. He's now averaged less than 12 ppg in three of the last four months, and even though his shooting efficiency has remained strong,I don't think he's nearly as impactful as he was early on.
"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."

Re: He can shoot!!!
« Reply #31 on: March 20, 2015, 06:09:33 PM »

Offline LarBrd33

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He's not even in the top 400 in field goal percentage.  This would be like calling Isaiah Thomas a rim protector after he got a single block. 

Marcus Smart is an exceptional defender. His offensive game is garbage slow-cooked in a crock pot for 24 hours until the garbage is literally falling off the bone.  Maybe it improves.

What is your issue?

Or, as I suspect, do you feel the need to troll all the time. It gets very old reading garbage posts like this, from someone who is clearly more intelligent than what he wrote.

No Smart is not Kobe Bryant on offense, but he certainly isn't "garbage".

What a complete joke.
No issue.  Just feel it's good to temper your enthusiasm when the guy is literally one of the worst offensive players in the league so far this year (400+ players with higher FG%).  We all hope Smart turns the corner and suddenly becomes an offensive weapon, but who knows what might happen.  We're 4 years into Ricky Rubio's career and he still can't shoot.  Rubio's dreadful rookie offensive numbers were superior to Marcus Smart

Rookie Rubio (21 years old): 10.6 points, 8.2 assists, 4.2 rebounds, 2.2 steals, 36%/34%/80%
Rookie Smart (21 years old):  7.9 points, 3.3 assists, 3.5 rebounds, 1.4 steals, 36%/34%/65%

So about as bad as Rubio, but with worse free throw shooting.

Sure, maybe Smart gets it together.  Judging by the careers of Rubio and Rondo, I'm certainly not holding my breathe... despite Smart's one big game. Even with that big game, Smart is shooting 33% this month.   I'll hope for the best, but I'm certainly not overreacting to a fluke game where Smart hits 7 three pointers.  Smart's an impact defensive player, though.  He's going to have a career.  It's just not clear yet if his career will be limited to defensive role player.

Re: He can shoot!!!
« Reply #32 on: March 20, 2015, 07:36:13 PM »

Offline Rondo9

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He's not even in the top 400 in field goal percentage.  This would be like calling Isaiah Thomas a rim protector after he got a single block. 

Marcus Smart is an exceptional defender. His offensive game is garbage slow-cooked in a crock pot for 24 hours until the garbage is literally falling off the bone.  Maybe it improves.

What is your issue?

Or, as I suspect, do you feel the need to troll all the time. It gets very old reading garbage posts like this, from someone who is clearly more intelligent than what he wrote.

No Smart is not Kobe Bryant on offense, but he certainly isn't "garbage".

What a complete joke.
No issue.  Just feel it's good to temper your enthusiasm when the guy is literally one of the worst offensive players in the league so far this year (400+ players with higher FG%).  We all hope Smart turns the corner and suddenly becomes an offensive weapon, but who knows what might happen.  We're 4 years into Ricky Rubio's career and he still can't shoot.  Rubio's dreadful rookie offensive numbers were superior to Marcus Smart

Rookie Rubio (21 years old): 10.6 points, 8.2 assists, 4.2 rebounds, 2.2 steals, 36%/34%/80%
Rookie Smart (21 years old):  7.9 points, 3.3 assists, 3.5 rebounds, 1.4 steals, 36%/34%/65%

So about as bad as Rubio, but with worse free throw shooting.

Sure, maybe Smart gets it together.  Judging by the careers of Rubio and Rondo, I'm certainly not holding my breathe... despite Smart's one big game. Even with that big game, Smart is shooting 33% this month.   I'll hope for the best, but I'm certainly not overreacting to a fluke game where Smart hits 7 three pointers.  Smart's an impact defensive player, though.  He's going to have a career.  It's just not clear yet if his career will be limited to defensive role player.

I think you missed the context of the 3 point shooting between the two guards. Smart hits more threes than a rookie Rondo and Rubio.

Re: He can shoot!!!
« Reply #33 on: March 20, 2015, 07:52:48 PM »

Offline jpotter33

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He's not even in the top 400 in field goal percentage.  This would be like calling Isaiah Thomas a rim protector after he got a single block. 

Marcus Smart is an exceptional defender. His offensive game is garbage slow-cooked in a crock pot for 24 hours until the garbage is literally falling off the bone.  Maybe it improves.

What is your issue?

Or, as I suspect, do you feel the need to troll all the time. It gets very old reading garbage posts like this, from someone who is clearly more intelligent than what he wrote.

No Smart is not Kobe Bryant on offense, but he certainly isn't "garbage".

What a complete joke.
No issue.  Just feel it's good to temper your enthusiasm when the guy is literally one of the worst offensive players in the league so far this year (400+ players with higher FG%).  We all hope Smart turns the corner and suddenly becomes an offensive weapon, but who knows what might happen.  We're 4 years into Ricky Rubio's career and he still can't shoot.  Rubio's dreadful rookie offensive numbers were superior to Marcus Smart

Rookie Rubio (21 years old): 10.6 points, 8.2 assists, 4.2 rebounds, 2.2 steals, 36%/34%/80%
Rookie Smart (21 years old):  7.9 points, 3.3 assists, 3.5 rebounds, 1.4 steals, 36%/34%/65%

So about as bad as Rubio, but with worse free throw shooting.

Sure, maybe Smart gets it together.  Judging by the careers of Rubio and Rondo, I'm certainly not holding my breathe... despite Smart's one big game. Even with that big game, Smart is shooting 33% this month.   I'll hope for the best, but I'm certainly not overreacting to a fluke game where Smart hits 7 three pointers.  Smart's an impact defensive player, though.  He's going to have a career.  It's just not clear yet if his career will be limited to defensive role player.

Context is kind of important in these comparisons...

Smart is shooting two more 3's per game with two less total shots per game than Rubio, so OF COURSE his shooting percentage is going to be  skewed. 60% of Smart's shots are 3's; whereas, only 24% of Rubio's shots were 3's.  You can question his shot selection, sure, but it's ridiculous and illogical to present those two as an analogy and not mention the context it's in.

Also, Rubio played 8 more minutes per game, which would definitely affect his higher numbers across the board than Smart.

Furthermore, below are Noel's numbers for the season:

Nerlens Noel (20 years old):  9.3 points, 1.9 blocks, 7.8 rebounds, 1.8 steals, 45%/0%/61%

For someone that's been riding and praising Noel so hard, I don't see that much difference offensively between Smart and Noel, and Smart is on a MUCH better team. His 45 fg% looks nice compared to Smart's 36 fg%, until you factor in that Noel shoots the vast majority of his shots in the paint with only a couple of shots outside of the paint each game. With Noel shooting 75% of his shots in the paint and Marcus shooting 60% of his shots from 3, that distance between the two is hardly impressive given the context.

You clearly give the benefit of the doubt to other teams' players while routinely criticizing ours to a fault. Like I said, criticize his shot selection all you want (which I still hold was probably a ploy by Stevens early in the season to make his shot better), but it's illogical to post two players' numbers as an analogy when their situations and shot charts were much different. That's a false analogy.
Recovering Joe Skeptic, but inching towards a relapse.

Re: He can shoot!!!
« Reply #34 on: March 20, 2015, 07:53:28 PM »

Offline jpotter33

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He's not even in the top 400 in field goal percentage.  This would be like calling Isaiah Thomas a rim protector after he got a single block. 

Marcus Smart is an exceptional defender. His offensive game is garbage slow-cooked in a crock pot for 24 hours until the garbage is literally falling off the bone.  Maybe it improves.

What is your issue?

Or, as I suspect, do you feel the need to troll all the time. It gets very old reading garbage posts like this, from someone who is clearly more intelligent than what he wrote.

No Smart is not Kobe Bryant on offense, but he certainly isn't "garbage".

What a complete joke.
No issue.  Just feel it's good to temper your enthusiasm when the guy is literally one of the worst offensive players in the league so far this year (400+ players with higher FG%).  We all hope Smart turns the corner and suddenly becomes an offensive weapon, but who knows what might happen.  We're 4 years into Ricky Rubio's career and he still can't shoot.  Rubio's dreadful rookie offensive numbers were superior to Marcus Smart

Rookie Rubio (21 years old): 10.6 points, 8.2 assists, 4.2 rebounds, 2.2 steals, 36%/34%/80%
Rookie Smart (21 years old):  7.9 points, 3.3 assists, 3.5 rebounds, 1.4 steals, 36%/34%/65%

So about as bad as Rubio, but with worse free throw shooting.

Sure, maybe Smart gets it together.  Judging by the careers of Rubio and Rondo, I'm certainly not holding my breathe... despite Smart's one big game. Even with that big game, Smart is shooting 33% this month.   I'll hope for the best, but I'm certainly not overreacting to a fluke game where Smart hits 7 three pointers.  Smart's an impact defensive player, though.  He's going to have a career.  It's just not clear yet if his career will be limited to defensive role player.

I think you missed the context of the 3 point shooting between the two guards. Smart hits more threes than a rookie Rondo and Rubio.

Exactly.
Recovering Joe Skeptic, but inching towards a relapse.

Re: He can shoot!!!
« Reply #35 on: March 20, 2015, 08:05:25 PM »

Offline Asher77

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This is not Smart vs another player as there are examples to use for support no matter what your agenda.

I think what is important is the idea a player earns the time on the court to develop and Smart will do so via his defense as Rubio seems to based on his playmaking.

I would say the majority of the time a player will get better from his rookie year to his prime if given the chance and it seems Smart will get that chance


Re: He can shoot!!!
« Reply #36 on: March 20, 2015, 08:22:39 PM »

Offline flybono

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He's not even in the top 400 in field goal percentage.  This would be like calling Isaiah Thomas a rim protector af


Marcus Smart is an exceptional defender. His offensive game is garbage slow-cooked in a crock pot for 24 hours until the garbage is literally falling off the bone.  Maybe it improves.
[/quote


Another Rondo supporter I presume

Re: He can shoot!!!
« Reply #37 on: March 20, 2015, 09:48:57 PM »

Offline tazzmaniac

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He's not even in the top 400 in field goal percentage.  This would be like calling Isaiah Thomas a rim protector after he got a single block. 

Marcus Smart is an exceptional defender. His offensive game is garbage slow-cooked in a crock pot for 24 hours until the garbage is literally falling off the bone.  Maybe it improves.

What is your issue?

Or, as I suspect, do you feel the need to troll all the time. It gets very old reading garbage posts like this, from someone who is clearly more intelligent than what he wrote.

No Smart is not Kobe Bryant on offense, but he certainly isn't "garbage".

What a complete joke.
No issue.  Just feel it's good to temper your enthusiasm when the guy is literally one of the worst offensive players in the league so far this year (400+ players with higher FG%).  We all hope Smart turns the corner and suddenly becomes an offensive weapon, but who knows what might happen.  We're 4 years into Ricky Rubio's career and he still can't shoot.  Rubio's dreadful rookie offensive numbers were superior to Marcus Smart

Rookie Rubio (21 years old): 10.6 points, 8.2 assists, 4.2 rebounds, 2.2 steals, 36%/34%/80%
Rookie Smart (21 years old):  7.9 points, 3.3 assists, 3.5 rebounds, 1.4 steals, 36%/34%/65%

So about as bad as Rubio, but with worse free throw shooting.

Sure, maybe Smart gets it together.  Judging by the careers of Rubio and Rondo, I'm certainly not holding my breathe... despite Smart's one big game. Even with that big game, Smart is shooting 33% this month.   I'll hope for the best, but I'm certainly not overreacting to a fluke game where Smart hits 7 three pointers.  Smart's an impact defensive player, though.  He's going to have a career.  It's just not clear yet if his career will be limited to defensive role player.

Context is kind of important in these comparisons...

Smart is shooting two more 3's per game with two less total shots per game than Rubio, so OF COURSE his shooting percentage is going to be  skewed. 60% of Smart's shots are 3's; whereas, only 24% of Rubio's shots were 3's.  You can question his shot selection, sure, but it's ridiculous and illogical to present those two as an analogy and not mention the context it's in.

Also, Rubio played 8 more minutes per game, which would definitely affect his higher numbers across the board than Smart.

Furthermore, below are Noel's numbers for the season:

Nerlens Noel (20 years old):  9.3 points, 1.9 blocks, 7.8 rebounds, 1.8 steals, 45%/0%/61%

For someone that's been riding and praising Noel so hard, I don't see that much difference offensively between Smart and Noel, and Smart is on a MUCH better team. His 45 fg% looks nice compared to Smart's 36 fg%, until you factor in that Noel shoots the vast majority of his shots in the paint with only a couple of shots outside of the paint each game. With Noel shooting 75% of his shots in the paint and Marcus shooting 60% of his shots from 3, that distance between the two is hardly impressive given the context.

You clearly give the benefit of the doubt to other teams' players while routinely criticizing ours to a fault. Like I said, criticize his shot selection all you want (which I still hold was probably a ploy by Stevens early in the season to make his shot better), but it's illogical to post two players' numbers as an analogy when their situations and shot charts were much different. That's a false analogy.
Early in the season, Noel looked like a 5th wheel on offense but he's improved significantly over the season.  Especially since the MCW trade.  His mid range jumper is looking pretty good.  He's driving the lane effectively.  He's obviously quite raw with lots of areas for improvement. 
Noel is not the type of player to be able to pad his offensive stats by being on a bad team.  I think he'll perform better once he starts playing with Embiid. 

On the other hand Smart doesn't seem to have improved much over the season.  I want to see him driving the lane, posting up smaller guards, working on a floater, etc.  At this point I'm concerned that Smart's ceiling may be modest. 

Re: He can shoot!!!
« Reply #38 on: March 20, 2015, 09:53:09 PM »

Offline jpotter33

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He's not even in the top 400 in field goal percentage.  This would be like calling Isaiah Thomas a rim protector after he got a single block. 

Marcus Smart is an exceptional defender. His offensive game is garbage slow-cooked in a crock pot for 24 hours until the garbage is literally falling off the bone.  Maybe it improves.

What is your issue?

Or, as I suspect, do you feel the need to troll all the time. It gets very old reading garbage posts like this, from someone who is clearly more intelligent than what he wrote.

No Smart is not Kobe Bryant on offense, but he certainly isn't "garbage".

What a complete joke.
No issue.  Just feel it's good to temper your enthusiasm when the guy is literally one of the worst offensive players in the league so far this year (400+ players with higher FG%).  We all hope Smart turns the corner and suddenly becomes an offensive weapon, but who knows what might happen.  We're 4 years into Ricky Rubio's career and he still can't shoot.  Rubio's dreadful rookie offensive numbers were superior to Marcus Smart

Rookie Rubio (21 years old): 10.6 points, 8.2 assists, 4.2 rebounds, 2.2 steals, 36%/34%/80%
Rookie Smart (21 years old):  7.9 points, 3.3 assists, 3.5 rebounds, 1.4 steals, 36%/34%/65%

So about as bad as Rubio, but with worse free throw shooting.

Sure, maybe Smart gets it together.  Judging by the careers of Rubio and Rondo, I'm certainly not holding my breathe... despite Smart's one big game. Even with that big game, Smart is shooting 33% this month.   I'll hope for the best, but I'm certainly not overreacting to a fluke game where Smart hits 7 three pointers.  Smart's an impact defensive player, though.  He's going to have a career.  It's just not clear yet if his career will be limited to defensive role player.

Context is kind of important in these comparisons...

Smart is shooting two more 3's per game with two less total shots per game than Rubio, so OF COURSE his shooting percentage is going to be  skewed. 60% of Smart's shots are 3's; whereas, only 24% of Rubio's shots were 3's.  You can question his shot selection, sure, but it's ridiculous and illogical to present those two as an analogy and not mention the context it's in.

Also, Rubio played 8 more minutes per game, which would definitely affect his higher numbers across the board than Smart.

Furthermore, below are Noel's numbers for the season:

Nerlens Noel (20 years old):  9.3 points, 1.9 blocks, 7.8 rebounds, 1.8 steals, 45%/0%/61%

For someone that's been riding and praising Noel so hard, I don't see that much difference offensively between Smart and Noel, and Smart is on a MUCH better team. His 45 fg% looks nice compared to Smart's 36 fg%, until you factor in that Noel shoots the vast majority of his shots in the paint with only a couple of shots outside of the paint each game. With Noel shooting 75% of his shots in the paint and Marcus shooting 60% of his shots from 3, that distance between the two is hardly impressive given the context.

You clearly give the benefit of the doubt to other teams' players while routinely criticizing ours to a fault. Like I said, criticize his shot selection all you want (which I still hold was probably a ploy by Stevens early in the season to make his shot better), but it's illogical to post two players' numbers as an analogy when their situations and shot charts were much different. That's a false analogy.
Early in the season, Noel looked like a 5th wheel on offense but he's improved significantly over the season.  Especially since the MCW trade.  His mid range jumper is looking pretty good.  He's driving the lane effectively.  He's obviously quite raw with lots of areas for improvement. 
Noel is not the type of player to be able to pad his offensive stats by being on a bad team.  I think he'll perform better once he starts playing with Embiid. 

On the other hand Smart doesn't seem to have improved much over the season.  I want to see him driving the lane, posting up smaller guards, working on a floater, etc.  At this point I'm concerned that Smart's ceiling may be modest.

I'm not sure what Smart you've been watching, but he's improved quite a bit over the season, especially over the last dozen games or so. He's been driving the ball much more lately and looking good doing it, but his floater just hasn't developed yet.
Recovering Joe Skeptic, but inching towards a relapse.

Re: He can shoot!!!
« Reply #39 on: March 20, 2015, 11:30:39 PM »

Offline LarBrd33

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He's not even in the top 400 in field goal percentage.  This would be like calling Isaiah Thomas a rim protector after he got a single block. 

Marcus Smart is an exceptional defender. His offensive game is garbage slow-cooked in a crock pot for 24 hours until the garbage is literally falling off the bone.  Maybe it improves.

What is your issue?

Or, as I suspect, do you feel the need to troll all the time. It gets very old reading garbage posts like this, from someone who is clearly more intelligent than what he wrote.

No Smart is not Kobe Bryant on offense, but he certainly isn't "garbage".

What a complete joke.
No issue.  Just feel it's good to temper your enthusiasm when the guy is literally one of the worst offensive players in the league so far this year (400+ players with higher FG%).  We all hope Smart turns the corner and suddenly becomes an offensive weapon, but who knows what might happen.  We're 4 years into Ricky Rubio's career and he still can't shoot.  Rubio's dreadful rookie offensive numbers were superior to Marcus Smart

Rookie Rubio (21 years old): 10.6 points, 8.2 assists, 4.2 rebounds, 2.2 steals, 36%/34%/80%
Rookie Smart (21 years old):  7.9 points, 3.3 assists, 3.5 rebounds, 1.4 steals, 36%/34%/65%

So about as bad as Rubio, but with worse free throw shooting.

Sure, maybe Smart gets it together.  Judging by the careers of Rubio and Rondo, I'm certainly not holding my breathe... despite Smart's one big game. Even with that big game, Smart is shooting 33% this month.   I'll hope for the best, but I'm certainly not overreacting to a fluke game where Smart hits 7 three pointers.  Smart's an impact defensive player, though.  He's going to have a career.  It's just not clear yet if his career will be limited to defensive role player.

Context is kind of important in these comparisons...

Smart is shooting two more 3's per game with two less total shots per game than Rubio, so OF COURSE his shooting percentage is going to be  skewed. 60% of Smart's shots are 3's; whereas, only 24% of Rubio's shots were 3's.  You can question his shot selection, sure, but it's ridiculous and illogical to present those two as an analogy and not mention the context it's in.

Also, Rubio played 8 more minutes per game, which would definitely affect his higher numbers across the board than Smart.

Furthermore, below are Noel's numbers for the season:

Nerlens Noel (20 years old):  9.3 points, 1.9 blocks, 7.8 rebounds, 1.8 steals, 45%/0%/61%

For someone that's been riding and praising Noel so hard, I don't see that much difference offensively between Smart and Noel, and Smart is on a MUCH better team. His 45 fg% looks nice compared to Smart's 36 fg%, until you factor in that Noel shoots the vast majority of his shots in the paint with only a couple of shots outside of the paint each game. With Noel shooting 75% of his shots in the paint and Marcus shooting 60% of his shots from 3, that distance between the two is hardly impressive given the context.

You clearly give the benefit of the doubt to other teams' players while routinely criticizing ours to a fault. Like I said, criticize his shot selection all you want (which I still hold was probably a ploy by Stevens early in the season to make his shot better), but it's illogical to post two players' numbers as an analogy when their situations and shot charts were much different. That's a false analogy.

If you fail to see the difference between having an elite defensive big and an elite defensive guard, I can't help ya.

At this rate it would take at least two Marcus smarts to trade for a Nerlens Noel.

I'm not h8r8ing on Smart. He's a solid defensive guard who might have potential.  At the moment, he's a ghastly offensive player.   A thread hyping his shooting ability when there are 400+ guys shooting better seems silly.

You can build a championship team around an offensively inept defensive big.   When's the last team to win a title because their bricklaying point guard was wicked good at picking off passes?   You're comparing a juicy steak to edamame beans.    I like them both, but you probably aren't building a meal around the edamame beans.

And fwiw, it might be insulting to young Nerlens to compare his ceiling to someone like Ben Wallace.   You watching him lately?  Averaging 17 points, 9 boards, 2 blocks and 2 steals over his past 5 games on 57% shooting and 75% from the line.   Kid might have potential as a two-way player.  23 points, 14 rebounds, 5 steals and 3 blocks tonight. I shall not be apologizing for being 1st on the Nerlens bandwagon. 
« Last Edit: March 20, 2015, 11:46:31 PM by LarBrd33 »

Re: He can shoot!!!
« Reply #40 on: March 20, 2015, 11:41:08 PM »

Offline mr. dee

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Well, he just shot Bonner in the nuts ;D

Re: He can shoot!!!
« Reply #41 on: March 20, 2015, 11:48:37 PM »

Offline jpotter33

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He's not even in the top 400 in field goal percentage.  This would be like calling Isaiah Thomas a rim protector after he got a single block. 

Marcus Smart is an exceptional defender. His offensive game is garbage slow-cooked in a crock pot for 24 hours until the garbage is literally falling off the bone.  Maybe it improves.

What is your issue?

Or, as I suspect, do you feel the need to troll all the time. It gets very old reading garbage posts like this, from someone who is clearly more intelligent than what he wrote.

No Smart is not Kobe Bryant on offense, but he certainly isn't "garbage".

What a complete joke.
No issue.  Just feel it's good to temper your enthusiasm when the guy is literally one of the worst offensive players in the league so far this year (400+ players with higher FG%).  We all hope Smart turns the corner and suddenly becomes an offensive weapon, but who knows what might happen.  We're 4 years into Ricky Rubio's career and he still can't shoot.  Rubio's dreadful rookie offensive numbers were superior to Marcus Smart

Rookie Rubio (21 years old): 10.6 points, 8.2 assists, 4.2 rebounds, 2.2 steals, 36%/34%/80%
Rookie Smart (21 years old):  7.9 points, 3.3 assists, 3.5 rebounds, 1.4 steals, 36%/34%/65%

So about as bad as Rubio, but with worse free throw shooting.

Sure, maybe Smart gets it together.  Judging by the careers of Rubio and Rondo, I'm certainly not holding my breathe... despite Smart's one big game. Even with that big game, Smart is shooting 33% this month.   I'll hope for the best, but I'm certainly not overreacting to a fluke game where Smart hits 7 three pointers.  Smart's an impact defensive player, though.  He's going to have a career.  It's just not clear yet if his career will be limited to defensive role player.

Context is kind of important in these comparisons...

Smart is shooting two more 3's per game with two less total shots per game than Rubio, so OF COURSE his shooting percentage is going to be  skewed. 60% of Smart's shots are 3's; whereas, only 24% of Rubio's shots were 3's.  You can question his shot selection, sure, but it's ridiculous and illogical to present those two as an analogy and not mention the context it's in.

Also, Rubio played 8 more minutes per game, which would definitely affect his higher numbers across the board than Smart.

Furthermore, below are Noel's numbers for the season:

Nerlens Noel (20 years old):  9.3 points, 1.9 blocks, 7.8 rebounds, 1.8 steals, 45%/0%/61%

For someone that's been riding and praising Noel so hard, I don't see that much difference offensively between Smart and Noel, and Smart is on a MUCH better team. His 45 fg% looks nice compared to Smart's 36 fg%, until you factor in that Noel shoots the vast majority of his shots in the paint with only a couple of shots outside of the paint each game. With Noel shooting 75% of his shots in the paint and Marcus shooting 60% of his shots from 3, that distance between the two is hardly impressive given the context.

You clearly give the benefit of the doubt to other teams' players while routinely criticizing ours to a fault. Like I said, criticize his shot selection all you want (which I still hold was probably a ploy by Stevens early in the season to make his shot better), but it's illogical to post two players' numbers as an analogy when their situations and shot charts were much different. That's a false analogy.

If you fail to see the difference between having an elite defensive big and an elite defensive guard, I can't help ya.

At this rate it would take at least two Marcus smarts to trade for a Nerlens Noel.

I'm not h8r8ing on Smart. He's a solid defensive guard who might have potential.  At the moment, he's a ghastly offensive player.   A thread hyping his shooting ability when there are 400+ guys shooting better seems silly.

Ive seen offensively inept defensive bigs end up the key player in a championship.   When's the last team to win a title because their bricklaying point guard was wicked good at picking off passes?   You're comparing a juicy steak to edamame beans.    I like them both, but you probably aren't building a meal around the edamame beans.

No no no, let's not confuse what we've said here. I'm not talking about their defensive abilities, because obviously a big guy will be more beneficial defensively than a perimeter player.

You almost categorically write off Smart's offensive potential, but in other threads you've hyped Noel as being a possible great two-way player with offensive potential still when there's not even a substantial difference between the two's offensive statistics. That's what I'm arguing. You don't give our guys the benefit of the doubt as you give other teams' players.
Recovering Joe Skeptic, but inching towards a relapse.

Re: He can shoot!!!
« Reply #42 on: March 21, 2015, 12:59:39 AM »

Offline LarBrd33

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jpotter, I think in most of my posts about Noel, I hype him exclusively based on his elite defensive ability.   I recognize that he's showing some movement on the offensive end, but I'm mainly seeing him as a guy who looks like he'll project to be a dominant defensive big.  All my "hype" is based on that.   A 20 year old guy who is averaging 13 points, 10 rebounds, 2.5 blocks and 2.5 steals since the all-star break.  He's advanced defensive statistics are unprecedented for a guy his age.   That's why I say Philly has a potential "franchise player" in him.

I'm not discounting Marcus' defensive ability.  His defense looks fantastic.   I'm also not outright claiming he's hopeless long-term on the offensive end.  It's not unthinkable that he'd make a leap at some point.   

All I'm saying is that RIGHT NOW, Smart is a dreadful offensive player.  This thread is an overreaction to a single game where he had 7 three pointers. 

I'm also saying that elite defensive big >>>>> elite defensive guard.   

Elite defensive bigs can dominate a basketball game.   I don't think that's something an elite defensive guard can do.  Ben Wallace was a franchise player in spite of his offensive ineptitude.   Defensive guards are nice to have, but there's no guard equivalent to a Ben Wallace leading a team to a championship with his defense. 
« Last Edit: March 21, 2015, 01:04:43 AM by LarBrd33 »

Re: He can shoot!!!
« Reply #43 on: March 21, 2015, 01:04:40 AM »

Offline guava_wrench

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One thing for sure, a defense only big like Chandler gets paid a lot more than defense only guards. It isn't even close.

Re: He can shoot!!!
« Reply #44 on: March 21, 2015, 01:07:07 AM »

Offline LarBrd33

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One thing for sure, a defense only big like Chandler gets paid a lot more than defense only guards. It isn't even close.
Which makes sense.  Beyond having an elite scorer, historically the most important factor to a championship team is an elite defensive big.   Some would argue that it is THE most important factor.   Ask any stat-head about the impact Ben Wallace made on the Pistons title team.  A one-way player who was about as dominant a presence as a basketball player can be.

It's possible for an elite defensive big to be your team's best player.  Isn't Bill Russell a classic example of that?  Over his career he averaged 15 points on 44% shooting and 56% from the free throw line.  Is anyone doubting who fueled that dynasty? 

There's really no example of an offensively inept guard dominating a game (consistently) with his defense.   Championships aren't generally won, because a point guard was wicked good at playing the passing lanes.   Smart may indeed have a future as an offensive player, but there's also a chance he pans out as a defensive role player whose greatest impact is felt in games where he slows down better guards. 
« Last Edit: March 21, 2015, 01:12:28 AM by LarBrd33 »