Anyone else cringe watching Olynk play D?

[danglertx]

I don't get the defense talk about KO.  Its like I'm watching a different guy than most of the people on this board.  He plays exceptional help defense and always aware of cutters going through the lane.  He played great denial defense against the Memphis bigs who are considered two of the best in the game.  ZBo scored once on Kelly in the paint, well he is incredibly good down low and can score on anyone.  Gasol knocked down a couple of long jumpers, also acceptable.  Other than that those two did nothing against KO and in fact it looked like ZBo was getting frustrated with his teammates when KO was denying him the ball down low and then sagging waaaay off him when he got it outside.

Zeller and Bass certainly didn't fair any better against those two. 

Last night KO wasn't getting beaten against West and Hibbert.  Overall the big man defense around the board was solid against those two and the bench bigs did nothing against KO.   I don't get what the expectations are for KO.  Is he supposed to stone PGs out on the perimeter after picks?  Look at what we did to Vucevic putting him in that position.  They had to take him out of the game he was getting killed so badly, same with Hibbert.

Its like people on this board expect KO to be a shot blocker who can cover PGs 20ft from the basket, erase everyone else's mistakes, lock down the massive centers in the game on the block, oh and dominate the boards.  Tall task for a guy in his second year who was never known as a defensive guy anyway.

If I were going to criticize KO it wouldn't be for his defense, which nobody gives him credit for all the really good plays he makes, it would be for turning down open threes like the wide open corner three Pressey got him last night and then KO ended up having to force up a much harder top of the key three as the shot clock wound down.

I don't see defense as a problem for him and I think the numbers would show that. 

[fairweatherfan]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

TP dangler, I feel similarly except I can relate to KO looking like a lousy player.  But once I started paying attention to what he was actually doing and not how he looked when he was doing it, I noticed he was consistently playing smart, solid basketball, wasn't getting burned much on D and was often playing good help D.  And the stats back it up, and the coaches seem to feel the same.   Still plenty of room for improvement though, especially with aggression on both ends. 

But I think we've just been spoiled with KG all those years.  We won't see another big man defender like him for quite a while, because he's an all-timer at it.

[Snakehead]

Why has Olynyk become the designated whipping boy of this team? 

Mike

Because he's the weakest link now. Also he falls a lot.

Stevens sure seems to like that weakest link a lot.  Our team plays better when he's on the court.

His defense is solid.  He plays hard and that is working well right now for all of our bigs.  Giving a good effort is a lot of the battle.  He doesn't block shots but he's still 7 feet tall.  He hasn't been giving up scoring to some really good post players that they've played lately either.

[KeepRondo]

Why has Olynyk become the designated whipping boy of this team? 

Mike

Because Rondo got traded and Sullinger got injured.

You know I hate relying on stats but I'm curious what the numbers show since Sullinger went down. Are we better on D without him?

Also, you know by my screen name that I'm a huge Rondo fan but I can still say his game has fallen apart this year. Reason I'm saying this is you have to be the biggest Sullinger fan on here and you throughout the season tried to convince people that he played good defense. With Sully now admitting he was out of shape and coasting at times, can you at least admit that you might had been wrong? Forget whatever stats you were using before but the eye test showed a guy who was slow when rotating and slow when cutting off the lane. He also seemed out of position a number of times or lacked the effort to slide over when he should have.

[danglertx]

For instance, I remember one play last night when they had a fast break and KO was the only one back.  He stayed in front of the guy, got his hands up and backed away without reaching.  It slowed whoever it was for Indiana up enough that he was going to have to make an incredibly hard shot over KO but either Kelly or Crowder who chased the play down from behind got the block and Crowder saved it from going out of bounds starting a fast break the other way.

Would Bass have made that play?  Zeller?  Maybe, maybe they go for the block and get called for a foul giving them two free throws and we don't get the fast break going the other way.  Point is, KO doesn't seem to get much credit on these boards for plays like that which turned into a four point swing.  And he does that a lot now.  He doesn't get the blocks but he stands tall, doesn't reach and is making people hit tough shots over him, which sometimes they do.  But he hasn't been giving away those fouls like he used to.

He has also turned into a much more aggressive rebounder since the beginning of the season.  He has been going and getting the ball instead of waiting for it to come to him.  I'd be interested in seeing if his rebounds per are up from earlier in the year since his court time has decreased from very early when he was starting.

Another thing he gets no credit for is his toughness.  People see him getting pushed down and take that as him being weak but he is really p---ing other players off out there with his constant forearms in the back and sides and blocking out every play.  He is turning into our own little Lambeer.  Whiteside was the most obvious, but he also was aggravated ZBo and some others.  Take a game to watch just him on defense without following the ball and I think most casual fans would have a different take on him and his defense.

A final thing, he always closes out to a shooter hard with his hands up.  He doesn't block the shots but a 7ft guy running at you with his hands up is going to cause some missed shots.  And sometimes he keeps going, like last night and you get an easy leak out transition basket like last night against Indy.

This all probably makes me sound like I think he is a DPOY candidate which I obviously don't.  He doesn't have the quickness, quick leaping, or length to change games defensively but DeAndre Jordon can't pull opposing bigs out of the paint either, so it is a give and take, which is what makes basketball such an intriguing game to me.

[DarkAzcura]

If you think Olynyk is bad, you don't understand basketball and how the game is played on the offensive side of the ball. Plain and simple at this point. The Olynyk hate is getting ridiculous. You have people spouting misinformation about him now (expecting turnovers or bricked shots even though he is by far our most efficient big man). Just means some of you aren't paying any attention whatsoever.

I cringe at seeing Olynyk play period. His defense is nonexistent, and on offense I expect either a turnover or a bricked shot. I have been saying for a long time, and will continue doing so - discard sunk costs. For as long as there are naive idiots that believe in Olynyk's potential or see him as a net positive player - trade him, for anything. Preferably, package him on a draft day with our pick and Clippers' pick to move higher up.

You aren't paying attention to the game then, or you simply don't understand basketball. Who is really the naive idiot when you expect a person shooting ~49% to brick shots every time he shoots? 

[KeepRondo]

Most teams would want a 7 footer who can come off the bench and go off from three. It would be a bad move to give up on Olynyk.

[fairweatherfan]

Another thing he gets no credit for is his toughness.  People see him getting pushed down and take that as him being weak but he is really p---ing other players off out there with his constant forearms in the back and sides and blocking out every play.  He is turning into our own little Lambeer.  Whiteside was the most obvious, but he also was aggravated ZBo and some others.  Take a game to watch just him on defense without following the ball and I think most casual fans would have a different take on him and his defense.

This is something I've noticed too, I'm glad you pointed it out.  People take the frustration and cheap shots he gets as evidence of his weakness, but it's actually evidence that he's successfully irritating those guys with his play.  Guys don't usually get ticked off at opponents that let them score at will.

Honestly, I think most of the excessive Olynyk criticism (there's plenty of room for criticizing actual flaws like lack of aggression with shooting, some continued problems with fouling, and mediocre rebounding) boils down to optics - he doesn't look like a conventional good player looks out there.

[oldtype]

A lot of it just boils down to him being large, white, and awkward-looking.

[Ogaju]

I cringe when he gives up open shot after open shot.

[rocknrollforyoursoul]

Based on what I've seen, I like Olynyk—as a player and as a person. Sure he has his flaws on the court, but there are things he does pretty well. He stretches the floor, and is a really good passer. And it's only his second year; I'm sure he's still going to learn and improve a lot. He also seems like a really good teammate, a fun guy to be around, someone the coaches and other players like and appreciate.

[kozlodoev]

Why has Olynyk become the designated whipping boy of this team? 

Mike

Because Rondo got traded and Sullinger got injured.

You know I hate relying on stats but I'm curious what the numbers show since Sullinger went down.

Well, our outside shooting efficiency certainly improved a lot

[kozlodoev]

I cringe when he give up open shot after open shot.

He does that a lot. But not before he fakes the open air

[2short]

I think KO being a bad defensive player has now hit the rank celtic myth column.  Anyone know that James Posey is the greatest defensive player ever?  etc etc
KO has greatly improved his defense this year, I'd say he had a better year defensively than Sully.  Sure he can't out muscle the true centers but he knows how to play, works very well at help team defense and alters the game on offense.  Granted it would like to take some of Bradley and Thomas' kobe shot chucking and place some of it into Kelly.   But all in all I think its good.

[Smitty77]

Last couple of games its been painful watching Olynk play defence.  He doesn't seem to have any instincts for that part of the game.  When he gets aggressive he just over runs his spots and runs into his man.   Not sure what to make of him.   If he's not making and taking shots he seems to be a major liability.   I hope he shakes of the rust and somehow learns to be just and adequate defender..   

Think that is a reach though...

Here is our plus/minus with him on the floor the last three games:

+10 Memphis
+15 Orlando
+9 Indy.

These are FACTS.  These are NOT based one what you want to see, but what is actually occurring on the court!

I am THRILLED to have him back!!!!!  Welcome back Kelly.  I will continue to defend you from these factually baseless attacks:-)

I am NOT saying that he is an all-World NBA defender, but he is VERY SMART (perhaps one of the smartest centers in league) and plays slightly above average team defense.  Yes, his one-on-one defense is still below average, but I do think he can become at least an average individual defender.  But, he is a VERY EFFICIENT scores for a 7-footer (once again, one of the best in the league, especially from long range)!!!

Smitty77 (member of the KO Fan Club:-)))))