Hawks owner to sell team because of "racist" email

[Casperian]

As others have said... I'm not sure it's racist.  I mean... Think about this...  I live in Seattle.  There is a massive population of Asian folks out here.  There's a reason why the Seattle Mariners spent money on Iwakuma shortly after Ichiro went to the Yankees.  As someone who attends a lot of games, it's hard not to notice the difference in fanbase when iwakuma is pitching.

Yeah, if you're making a decision that's based on making more money, then the decision is obviously not being based on race.  It's called conducting business, and by definition can't be racist.

I am confused by this.  If you make a business decision to not allow blacks to eat at your restaurant because the whites in the area don't want to eat with blacks, I'd say that is both a business decision and a racist one.   Having prejudicial thoughts, or drawing conclusions based on racial bias are not racist acts.  But using your power as a business owner to scheme to exclude a specific race because they are bad for business is racism defined.   Not sure how you could possibly conclude that making a business decision by definition precludes racism.

There's a whole world of difference between promoting exclusivity and promoting inclusivity.

Nobody tried to get black people out of the arena, they tried to sell more tickets by getting more white people to the games.

[clover]

I'm also curious what it is about Luol Deng the basketball player that equates him to a guy who will sell counterfeit merchandise out of the back of a shop.  What's that even mean, especially when modified by "not in a bad way"?

I've been wondering this too.

The first thing I can think of is maybe he means you hear his name, look at his stats, and you think you're getting an All-NBA strong lockerroom leader,  just a little beneath the LeBron/Durant/Carmelo tier (like a prime Paul Pierce or Danny Granger  maybe), but what you're really getting with Deng is a player who is closer to Jeff Green.

You're looking in the store window and think you're getting a Paul Pierce model player, but what you're really getting is a Jeff Green model player.  He sells himself like an alpha dog All-Star, but he's really a #3 player at best.  But I don't mean that in a bad way, because Jeff Green is a classy guy and a good basketball player.  He's just not going to be the All-NBA veteran leader you think he's going to be.

That would be my guess on how it was meant, something along those lines anyway.

I don't think it had anything to do with his skills.  I think it was solely about character.  Like "deng sells himself as this great team player and locker room guy, but he isn't when you look deeper."

Agreed. And since Deng was born in Africa and lived in Africa in his youth, the argument could be made that Ferry was trying to be culturally sensitive in attributing that character in part to the different cultural mores re: honesty of his home countries (So. Sudan and Egypt). Not saying that's a good approach, just that it is context by which his whole statement could be considered.

The conclusion that Ferry was implying that African-Americans, or all African-Americans, cheat is however wholly unfounded. (Deng is British.)

Well, wait a minute -- Deng is as British as Olajuwon is American.

This tit-bit was in a scouting report, and I don't know how deeply scouting reports dig into player background,  but it is likely that the scouting reports probably dug up some fabrications in the whole Luol Deng story. It is not unusual for the media to write all kinds of feel good story about players from other lands that are often fabricated or exaggerated. The SID departments of the colleges run with these stories and the players lap it up and enjoy the free pub. Maybe scouts went to dig into the background of this player they are about to throw millions on and found the feel good stories weren't true. The author of the assessment in the scouting report should explain exactly what he meant.

My point is that Deng is not American, so a knock on his integrity, or whatever it was, wasn't a knock on an African-American in the specific, let alone as a generalization.

[Bankshot]

Well, as long as the pitchforks are out, J. Michael Gearon, Jr. needs to sell his stake too.

Apparently all black people are African-American's in his mind.

Now THAT's racist.

 

Haha.  I noticed the same thing when I read that email.

I'm also curious what it is about Luol Deng the basketball player that equates him to a guy who will sell counterfeit merchandise out of the back of a shop.  What's that even mean, especially when modified by "not in a bad way"?

I think he's equating African with Nigerian, thinking all Africans are Nigerian.  Nigerian men are thought to be scammers, con men.

[Endless Paradise]

I don't understand why "racist" is in quotes here.

people are divided on whether its racist or not.

People are stupid.

[BballTim]

People are stupid.

  Without reading the rest of the thread, I'll agree with this.

[D.o.s.]

Probably worth pointing out, then, that "persons" can also be stupid.

[Ogaju]

Well, as long as the pitchforks are out, J. Michael Gearon, Jr. needs to sell his stake too.

Apparently all black people are African-American's in his mind.

Now THAT's racist.

 

I think he's equating African with Nigerian, thinking all Africans are Nigerian.  Nigerian men are thought to be scammers, con men.

Yeah that makes it all better now, lets just switch African with Nigerian and problems solved --

Signed,

Hakeem Olajuwon, Emeka Okafor, Michael Olowokandi, Nnamdi Asamoah, BJ Raji, Giannis Adetokunbo, Christian Okoye, Ighodala, etc etc, but you get my point.

How do you label an entire country of over 100 million people. It is thought like this that leads to actionable discrimination.


Haha.  I noticed the same thing when I read that email.

I'm also curious what it is about Luol Deng the basketball player that equates him to a guy who will sell counterfeit merchandise out of the back of a shop.  What's that even mean, especially when modified by "not in a bad way"?

[saltlover]

I don't understand why "racist" is in quotes here.

people are divided on whether its racist or not.

People are stupid.

Since the threads got merged, I want to point out that my comment was regarding Danny Ferry's comments about "African" and  having stuff to sell you illegally in back, and not about the Hawks owner's email.

Ferry's comments were racist, plain and simple.

[fairweatherfan]

I don't understand why "racist" is in quotes here.

people are divided on whether its racist or not.

People are stupid.

Compared to what?

[nickagneta]

Been observing the Atlanta ownership and management comments and the fall out and I can not in any way find that both comments((audience too black, Deng a little African) are anything other than racist. I also can not help but think there is a strain of racism that runs in the front office that would make such comments allowable in any business sense.

If Levenson wanted a group of society buying tickets to Hawks games, he could have used socio-economic terms and just mentioned wanting to get higher income people buying tickets so that they then would spend more on the peripherals that exist at the game. There was no need to bring race into the situation,

Same applies with Ferry. If Ferry wanted to present Deng as a dishonest individual who presents a false face to the public and is a bad guy behind the scenes, he could have just phrased it as I just did and attacked Deng's personality and not his race.

Levenson did the right thing and decided to sell his shares and leave. Now Ferry has to go as well. I really do not buy Ferry just read what he did from a scouting report. To read such a thing on a conference call without first reviewing it and editing it is absurd for a man in control of a multi-million dollar business. So either Ferry said this racist thing because he wanted to or we have to assume he is just a poor businessman with bad business practices that made a mistake. Either way, racial comment meant or gross mistake, both, in my mind, are events that warrant his discharge.

[Endless Paradise]

I don't understand why "racist" is in quotes here.

people are divided on whether its racist or not.

People are stupid.

Since the threads got merged, I want to point out that my comment was regarding Danny Ferry's comments about "African" and  having stuff to sell you illegally in back, and not about the Hawks owner's email.

Ferry's comments were racist, plain and simple.

I'm aware and I agree entirely.

[D.o.s.]

Hey if Michael Jordan is caught on tape saying horridly racist things about white people what do you suppose will happen?

Hypothetically, I'd say it depends on whether or not he leaks them himself and then sells the team, or if this is the icing on the cake of 30 years of documented incidents of racist behavior that comes to a head during the league's most popular segment, the playoffs.

It's a cute bit of false equivalence, though.

[Endless Paradise]

Hey if Michael Jordan is caught on tape saying horridly racist things about white people what do you suppose will happen?

Are you actually genuinely wondering or is this merely stupid "this is only a problem because a white person said it and no one would bat an eye if a minority said it" rhetoric that I've already seen others spout elsewhere?  As though that's somehow a defense against what Ferry did.

[Ogaju]

Been observing the Atlanta ownership and management comments and the fall out and I can not in any way find that both comments((audience too black, Deng a little African) are anything other than racist. I also can not help but think there is a strain of racism that runs in the front office that would make such comments allowable in any business sense.

If Levenson wanted a group of society buying tickets to Hawks games, he could have used socio-economic terms and just mentioned wanting to get higher income people buying tickets so that they then would spend more on the peripherals that exist at the game. There was no need to bring race into the situation,

Same applies with Ferry. If Ferry wanted to present Deng as a dishonest individual who presents a false face to the public and is a bad guy behind the scenes, he could have just phrased it as I just did and attacked Deng's personality and not his race.

Levenson did the right thing and decided to sell his shares and leave. Now Ferry has to go as well. I really do not buy Ferry just read what he did from a scouting report. To read such a thing on a conference call without first reviewing it and editing it is absurd for a man in control of a multi-million dollar business. So either Ferry said this racist thing because he wanted to or we have to assume he is just a poor businessman with bad business practices that made a mistake. Either way, racial comment meant or gross mistake, both, in my mind, are events that warrant his discharge.

This + 1..... TP

[Eja117]

Hey if Michael Jordan is caught on tape saying horridly racist things about white people what do you suppose will happen?

Are you actually genuinely wondering or is this merely stupid "this is only a problem because a white person said it and no one would bat an eye if a minority said it" rhetoric that I've already seen others spout elsewhere?  As though that's somehow a defense against what Ferry did.

While I do believe double standards exist I haven't heard that rhetoric.  I do wonder what would happen.  I don't see players threatening to boycott MJ or coaches to walk out on him, but that's just my guess.