Needs to be said

[Rondo9]

The Eastern Conference has gotten better:

Washington is Better, Cleveland, Charlotte, and those are add ons to contenders that can already beat us: Indiana, Miami, Toronto (which retainer Lowry) Atlanta, Chicago (when D Rose comes back) Detroit is better, with Van Gundy, Orlando has Exum now, and even New York, with Carmelo and the 76ers with Noel are all looking better.

Brooklyn, in losing Pierce, undoubtedly took a step back - but if Lopez can play, and D-Will comes back into form - they too may prove a challenge (I also think Hollins is a huge upgrade over Kidd).

We may well be the absolute worst team in the NBA next year.

The Sixers haven't got that much better, Embiid could be out for the year (judging how they treated Noel.) And Noel needs to prove himself. I think the Celtics may place somewhere in the 9-12 range.

[Sketch5]

The Eastern Conference has gotten better:

Washington is Better, Cleveland, Charlotte, and those are add ons to contenders that can already beat us: Indiana, Miami, Toronto (which retainer Lowry) Atlanta, Chicago (when D Rose comes back) Detroit is better, with Van Gundy, Orlando has Exum now, and even New York, with Carmelo and the 76ers with Noel are all looking better.

Brooklyn, in losing Pierce, undoubtedly took a step back - but if Lopez can play, and D-Will comes back into form - they too may prove a challenge (I also think Hollins is a huge upgrade over Kidd).

We may well be the absolute worst team in the NBA next year.

Urgh. Man it's been a year in a two or 4 year rebuild DA didn't land the big 3 over night. When he took over he had to start from scratch. He's in much better shape now then he was when he first started. I figured at least two years before some thing good would happen. And if the basketball Gods are with us(Red) DA will still have a shot at Love. Which makes this a little easier. But lets looks at some of the teams that you say are better, and see how they got there.

Washington,Charlotte,Toronto,76ers have been bad for many, many years.Lottery after Lottery. 76er are still bad, just have two really good prospects, but who knows if they will stay healthy.

Atlanta has be mediocre for years, can't seem to make the next step.

Detroit on paper looks better, but look at last season and they didn't fare all that well.

Indiana has a long rebuild, but looks to be imploding. They did loose out on Stephenson.

Miami had the Cheat 3, but lost one. But still had some what good talent stay and add a couple mediocre pieces. Of course they stayed good, if Bosh left though it would have been an other story.

Orlando isn't that much better. Mostly because they got GORDON not EXUM. And the Old Gordon they signed, who knows if he has anything left.

Cleveland has crap luck and gets 3 #1's in 4 years, and turns around and regains the best player in the league. No crap they are better right now.

While all these teams are better, except Orlando and 76ers, it took years or buddy buddy team ups to become good.

In two years if it still looks this way, then yeah this thread is necessary. But we have a crap ton of picks. Some very promising young players that could either make our team better by their play, or by their trade for a better team. And some other nice, easy to move pieces.

Wallace is the worst contract we had, but I'm pretty sure some of the unprotected we got in those picks came from taking on his contract. Still early to say if they will be good, but they shouldn't be bad.

Plus we've just started with the FA season, still moves to be had. And the way DA is making some of these moves, could be setting up a move or two this summer or next.

[Rondo9]

I am deeply disappointed with the way the Celtics' last season, off-season, and the next season, projected based on our players, has shaken out, and seems likely to shake out (as the case may be).

We have five player about the right height to play the point guard position:

Rondo, Smart, Thornton, Bradley and Pressey; they in turn either can't shoot, are too short, can't defend, or can't pass.

We have two players with big salaries who I don't expect to see a lot of playing time: Gerald Wallace and Keith Bogans.

Our starting small forward is basically a synonym for "inconsistent," and our two most exciting young players are both deeply flawed power forwards.

There is not one, single, complete player on the roster: no tall point guards who can defend, score and pass; no wing players who can drive, defend, and shoot, and no power forwards who can hit shots all over the court/are amazingly athletic and can defend. No two way centers. No three and D guys.

There are some bright spots: Green is athletic, Rondo has an amazing mind for the game; Zeller has some post, and pick and roll ability, and Olynyk's jumper is improving. And if James Young can shoot, he has the height to be a real asset at his position. But - realistically - this team can't guard 80% of the teams in the NBA right now, and probably won't be able to score on more than half of them. Next year is going to be very, very painful to watch. And after last year... Ouch.

You talk about our youth as if they're fully developed.  Even a guy like Sullinger is still only 22 years of age, and only has a year and a half under his belt.

No tall point guards on the roster who can defend ?  You have an all star point guard, what's the problem here ?  You just drafted one of the best defending Point Guards in college basketball.  He's 20, btw.

You need to be patient and let the process play out.  The only thing you need to know is this :

Boston's youth:

Smart
Bradley
Olynyk
Sullinger
Young

Boston's picks:

Boston's own picks
Brooklyn's 2016, 2017 (right to swap with Nets), 2018
2015 Clippers First Round Pick
2015 76ers First Round Pick (or two 2nds)
2016 Cavs First Round Pick (Top 10 protected in 16', 17', or 18'. Unprotected in 19')

Boston's expirings:

Joel Anthony
Keith Bogans
Brandon Bass
Marcus Thornton

You're setup to completely overhaul this thing and get back to the playoffs in a hurry.  Have some patience and let it unfold.  No end in sight ?  Please.  Gimme a break.

Really, when do you see the end? Do you see the end next year? Will that be the year we draft the franchise savior? No? How about 2016? No end in sight means - literally - what it says. I do not see a route for the Celtics to get back into contention. Even if we mortgage all of these assets for Love; is there a demonstrable difference, besides R. Rondo, in Boston's surrounding Roster and Minnesota's? Granter Rubio is a bit of a turd - but Pekovic is better than any center or forward on our roster. Does Love, Rondo, Olynyk, Green and Avery Bradley win you the EC?

No. Way.

There are literally five teams who are better, maybe more.

There is no end in sight. You know someone is pulling your chain when they tell you to trust in the fearless leader. Is Danny Ainge a genius? No! He has clearly whiffed on a number of picks. ...no one is perfect, and I don't blame him for trying - but betting on a "pick" is betting on some 19 year old kid. Why would a free agent want to play here? To experience the simmering tension of Gerald Wallace not getting playing time? To watch Olynyk get smoked on defense? To wonder which Jeff Green is going to show up on any given night?

Look - our best player - and it's not close, Rondo - is flawed. He is simply not a good enough shooter. He is a sub-30% 3p shooter, and has never - NEVER - shot better than 70% from the FT line, league AVERAGE is 75%+. Anyway - his greatest strengths are minimized with this team, as we are not really that athletic, and aren't great shooters.

Where is this end in sight? You tell me. But don't resort to that condescending "we have a super hero" garbage argument. Rah rah. I'm a fan also - that's why I care about it. If we have a super hero, tell me why he's a super hero. What has Brad Stevens done in the NBA again that leads you to feel so confident in him?

Rondo is a four time all star who turned in spectacular playoff performances, despite his flaws. His teammates love him and other players like Love, Kobe and Carmelo enjoy him. Anige is considered by many analysts to be one of the best GM's in the league. He makes smart decisions and is always on the hunt to make the team better. The Celtics also have promising players who aren't superstars, but could be very good players or trade chips to help acquire one. Brad Stevens was touted as the best coach prospect and considering that he help lead Butler to numerous winning seasons, I'm confident he'll adjust in the NBA. Finally Boston is NOT Memphis, Charlotte and Miluakee. Go to their blogsites and read the comments. They keep saying how player X could go to L.A, NY or Boston. Players will play for Boston especially if they're winning and have cap space. The Celtics have plenty of options, all that's left is the perfect opportunity to strike.

[Surferdad]

I can feel that. Most of the points are valid. But it's only year two of a rebuild. Danny has expiring contracts, lots of young players, big $ off books in 2 years, and a boat load of future picks already. Rondo is also still a top 15/20 player that is a big piece. This has been a much faster process of rebuilding compared to the WalkerPierce team, dismantle and rebuild.

Right exactly, because Ainge is under no pressure to win now.  I knew even when it was happening that the Walker/Pierce teams were put together to make the team competitive, not to truly rebuild.  Remember the Tony Delk/Rodney Rodgers trade?  We all knew it was a desperate attempt to be competitive that year, not to set the team up for a future championship.

Things are different now, but we must be patient.  The assets are there and seem to still be growing.  C's just got a $4.3 TPE and a 2nd round pick from the Wizards, to add to a 1st rounder and a decent center from the Cavs for basically nothing. Nine first round picks.  NINE.  It is literally impossible to use all of them because they would have to be signed along with any other current players to keep.  So deals are coming, just wait and see.

All that said, I tend to agree that the current team (assuming no further off-season moves) is going to be bad, perhaps epic-bad.  But hey, that could lead to a great pick next year so even more assets are coming.

Don't worry, be happy.

[MBunge]

I wonder if the initial poster actually watched or paid attention to any Celtics games last season.  With all the youth, injuries and lack of any legitimate center, this team was regularly competitive night in and night out.  It was frustrating watching them blow lead after lead but at least they were good enough to get those leads.

Throw in the ridiculous number of draft picks Boston has over the next 4 years, the expiring contacts this coming season and the cap space Ainge will have next offseason even after resigning Rondo and there are fewer teams that have a greater chance to improve.

Mike

[cltc5]

Thus far, the last 15 months or so have been very dissapointng in that we;ve watched good players get swooped up and our team has stood flat footed and collected assets.  I have a feeling thats wht we'll have on the florr next year...assets.  Within the next 12 months there needs to be some real fireworks, or Danny can take his GM skills and shove them up his assets.

[jaketwice]

Thus far, the last 15 months or so have been very dissapointng in that we;ve watched good players get swooped up and our team has stood flat footed and collected assets.  I have a feeling thats wht we'll have on the florr next year...assets.  Within the next 12 months there needs to be some real fireworks, or Danny can take his GM skills and shove them up his assets.

LOL!!! TP!

[cltc5]

I am deeply disappointed with the way the Celtics' last season, off-season, and the next season, projected based on our players, has shaken out, and seems likely to shake out (as the case may be).

We have five player about the right height to play the point guard position:

Rondo, Smart, Thornton, Bradley and Pressey; they in turn either can't shoot, are too short, can't defend, or can't pass.

We have two players with big salaries who I don't expect to see a lot of playing time: Gerald Wallace and Keith Bogans.

Our starting small forward is basically a synonym for "inconsistent," and our two most exciting young players are both deeply flawed power forwards.

There is not one, single, complete player on the roster: no tall point guards who can defend, score and pass; no wing players who can drive, defend, and shoot, and no power forwards who can hit shots all over the court/are amazingly athletic and can defend. No two way centers. No three and D guys.

There are some bright spots: Green is athletic, Rondo has an amazing mind for the game; Zeller has some post, and pick and roll ability, and Olynyk's jumper is improving. And if James Young can shoot, he has the height to be a real asset at his position. But - realistically - this team can't guard 80% of the teams in the NBA right now, and probably won't be able to score on more than half of them. Next year is going to be very, very painful to watch. And after last year... Ouch.

You talk about our youth as if they're fully developed.  Even a guy like Sullinger is still only 22 years of age, and only has a year and a half under his belt.

No tall point guards on the roster who can defend ?  You have an all star point guard, what's the problem here ?  You just drafted one of the best defending Point Guards in college basketball.  He's 20, btw.

You need to be patient and let the process play out.  The only thing you need to know is this :

Boston's youth:

Smart
Bradley
Olynyk
Sullinger
Young

Boston's picks:

Boston's own picks
Brooklyn's 2016, 2017 (right to swap with Nets), 2018
2015 Clippers First Round Pick
2015 76ers First Round Pick (or two 2nds)
2016 Cavs First Round Pick (Top 10 protected in 16', 17', or 18'. Unprotected in 19')

Boston's expirings:

Joel Anthony
Keith Bogans
Brandon Bass
Marcus Thornton

You're setup to completely overhaul this thing and get back to the playoffs in a hurry.  Have some patience and let it unfold.  No end in sight ?  Please.  Gimme a break.

Really, when do you see the end? Do you see the end next year? Will that be the year we draft the franchise savior? No? How about 2016? No end in sight means - literally - what it says. I do not see a route for the Celtics to get back into contention. Even if we mortgage all of these assets for Love; is there a demonstrable difference, besides R. Rondo, in Boston's surrounding Roster and Minnesota's? Granter Rubio is a bit of a turd - but Pekovic is better than any center or forward on our roster. Does Love, Rondo, Olynyk, Green and Avery Bradley win you the EC?

No. Way.

There are literally five teams who are better, maybe more.

There is no end in sight. You know someone is pulling your chain when they tell you to trust in the fearless leader. Is Danny Ainge a genius? No! He has clearly whiffed on a number of picks. ...no one is perfect, and I don't blame him for trying - but betting on a "pick" is betting on some 19 year old kid. Why would a free agent want to play here? To experience the simmering tension of Gerald Wallace not getting playing time? To watch Olynyk get smoked on defense? To wonder which Jeff Green is going to show up on any given night?

Look - our best player - and it's not close, Rondo - is flawed. He is simply not a good enough shooter. He is a sub-30% 3p shooter, and has never - NEVER - shot better than 70% from the FT line, league AVERAGE is 75%+. Anyway - his greatest strengths are minimized with this team, as we are not really that athletic, and aren't great shooters.

Where is this end in sight? You tell me. But don't resort to that condescending "we have a super hero" garbage argument. Rah rah. I'm a fan also - that's why I care about it. If we have a super hero, tell me why he's a super hero. What has Brad Stevens done in the NBA again that leads you to feel so confident in him?

+1000

[NorthernLightning]

this thread is something else 

[Rondo9]

this thread is something else 

This is what they get for believing into Wyc's "fireworks" speech despite he and Danny warning them to temper their excitement.

[Nerf DPOY]

this thread is something else 

This is what they get for believing into Wyc's "fireworks" speech despite he and Danny warning them to temper their excitement.

You just don't understand the mindset of long suffering fans who haven't seen their team in even an Eastern Conference final game 7 in over two years.

[cometboy]

some people need to chill.

2007 was a wonderful experience, but it was a fluke. It would have been nice to replicate it this year, but not likely to happen.

we have a better team than last year, depending on what happens between now and the season. I will be shocked if we don't win more games next year.

Without any more changes,  other than paring down to 15 players, I predict we win 35 - 40 games next year.

Not great, but progress. Without any fireworks, that's the best we can expect, and I'm ok with that. Anything worth waiting for, is worth waiting for.

"it's supposed to be hard. The hard is what makes it great"

CB

[BballTim]

I am deeply disappointed with the way the Celtics' last season, off-season, and the next season, projected based on our players, has shaken out, and seems likely to shake out (as the case may be).

We have five player about the right height to play the point guard position:

Rondo, Smart, Thornton, Bradley and Pressey; they in turn either can't shoot, are too short, can't defend, or can't pass.

We have two players with big salaries who I don't expect to see a lot of playing time: Gerald Wallace and Keith Bogans.

Our starting small forward is basically a synonym for "inconsistent," and our two most exciting young players are both deeply flawed power forwards.

There is not one, single, complete player on the roster: no tall point guards who can defend, score and pass; no wing players who can drive, defend, and shoot, and no power forwards who can hit shots all over the court/are amazingly athletic and can defend. No two way centers. No three and D guys.

There are some bright spots: Green is athletic, Rondo has an amazing mind for the game; Zeller has some post, and pick and roll ability, and Olynyk's jumper is improving. And if James Young can shoot, he has the height to be a real asset at his position. But - realistically - this team can't guard 80% of the teams in the NBA right now, and probably won't be able to score on more than half of them. Next year is going to be very, very painful to watch. And after last year... Ouch.

You talk about our youth as if they're fully developed.  Even a guy like Sullinger is still only 22 years of age, and only has a year and a half under his belt.

No tall point guards on the roster who can defend ?  You have an all star point guard, what's the problem here ?  You just drafted one of the best defending Point Guards in college basketball.  He's 20, btw.

You need to be patient and let the process play out.  The only thing you need to know is this :

Boston's youth:

Smart
Bradley
Olynyk
Sullinger
Young

Boston's picks:

Boston's own picks
Brooklyn's 2016, 2017 (right to swap with Nets), 2018
2015 Clippers First Round Pick
2015 76ers First Round Pick (or two 2nds)
2016 Cavs First Round Pick (Top 10 protected in 16', 17', or 18'. Unprotected in 19')

Boston's expirings:

Joel Anthony
Keith Bogans
Brandon Bass
Marcus Thornton

You're setup to completely overhaul this thing and get back to the playoffs in a hurry.  Have some patience and let it unfold.  No end in sight ?  Please.  Gimme a break.

Really, when do you see the end? Do you see the end next year? Will that be the year we draft the franchise savior? No? How about 2016? No end in sight means - literally - what it says.

  No end in sight literally means what it says, In this case, it means you can't see any future moves and you have no idea when any future moves will happen. How you could expect to see the end under those conditions is beyond me.

[Future Celtics Owner]

I actually really enjoy the rebuilding process...always have. And I do not know of any team that has the long term health of the celtics. Its only been one year.

[knuckleballer]

I actually really enjoy the rebuilding process...always have. And I do not know of any team that has the long term health of the celtics. Its only been one year.

I do too as long as there is a plan.  I like seeing the young guys develop.