It's all just re-arranging deck chairs...

[Section301]

I realize that we will continue to talk about trades and transactions because that is what we do.  But it's all just so much fiddlin and diddlin.  Trade Rondo or not, trade for Love or not, keep Sully, or KO, or whomever... none of of it matters a whit to the ultimate goal of winning a championship. 

All of these trade ideas that people keep posting are foolishness.  All of the arguing over whether or not the Celtics made the right pick is of no matter.  Bottom line is - teams don't win without a transcendent player.  An elite, for the ages talent.  The Celtics don't have one, and won't have one until they draft him.  Until then, it truly doesn't matter what they do, as much as we would like to believe otherwise. 

No one like that is available via trade right now.  Honestly, seriously, and for true - does anyone really believe Kevin Love is an all time great?   He's good, but he's not on a Bird-Magic-Isiah level.  Nor is he on a LeBron-Duncan-Durant level.  That's the level of good the Celtics need to be a dominant franchise for the next decade.   

Precious few exceptional players become available via free agency either.  Which makes sense, because (by definition) there just aren't that many exceptional players out there.  And most teams will do everything they can to hold on to them.  Yes, LeBron is available, but before that who was the last one?  Shaq to LA was 18 years ago?  It just doesn't happen that often.   

Speaking of which, for all the continuing crap about how the C's have never signed a major free agent, how many MAJOR free agents have been available in the past 20 years (and by major I mean the number 1 guy on a team that made it to the finals.  Yes, that's the line, because anything else is just a participation trophy.  We don't want a competitive team, we want a dominant team.)?  Of those, how many were free agents in a years where the C's actually have cap space to sign them? When you break it down, MOST teams have never signed a major free agent, so why is that an indictment of Boston in particular (and please do not call out David West.  1)He is not a major FA, and 2) he went to the team that offered him more money)? 

But all that said, people will keep debating whether to keep KO or Sully, and how much Rondo is worth on the open market, because we're fans, and we have to talk about something.  And we'll keep asking what Danny's plan is when the only feasible plan he can possibly have is to GET A TRANSCENDENT PLAYER IN THE DRAFT.  Because barring a major act of stupidity by another GM, that's the only way they're going to get the player they need. 

[MBunge]

Bottom line is - teams don't win without a transcendent player.  An elite, for the ages talent.  The Celtics don't have one, and won't have one until they draft him.  Until then, it truly doesn't matter what they do, as much as we would like to believe otherwise. 

No one like that is available via trade right now.  Honestly, seriously, and for true - does anyone really believe Kevin Love is an all time great?   He's good, but he's not on a Bird-Magic-Isiah level.  Nor is he on a LeBron-Duncan-Durant level.

The Pistons won a title without a transcendent player.  The Spurs just won one without any player currently producing at a transcendent level.  And can Love be as good as Dirk Nowitski, 'cause he won a title with Jason Terry and Tyson Chandler as the 2nd and 3rd most important on the roster.

Mike

[hwangjini_1]

by and large i agree with your post. the one major caveat i have is about love. i agree he is a very good player, but, NOT a franchise type player. what he gives you on offense is partly negated by his poor defense, meaning as a total package he is very, very good, but not an elite difference maker in terms of w/l. unlike KG, love is not going to win you a game with his defense.

where i differ in what you posted is that love would not help the celtics become a contender. by himself, no. but, i think ainge is setting the stage for acquiring a superstar either through free agency or a trade. having love, i think, would make it easier for him to woo a star player.

i could be wrong, but i saw the possible acquisition of love as ONE STEP in a longer process.

[Al91]

I generally agree with everything you said but I noticed you left Kobe out, twice.

[Section301]

Bottom line is - teams don't win without a transcendent player.  An elite, for the ages talent.  The Celtics don't have one, and won't have one until they draft him.  Until then, it truly doesn't matter what they do, as much as we would like to believe otherwise. 

No one like that is available via trade right now.  Honestly, seriously, and for true - does anyone really believe Kevin Love is an all time great?   He's good, but he's not on a Bird-Magic-Isiah level.  Nor is he on a LeBron-Duncan-Durant level.

The Pistons won a title without a transcendent player.  The Spurs just won one without any player currently producing at a transcendent level.  And can Love be as good as Dirk Nowitski, 'cause he won a title with Jason Terry and Tyson Chandler as the 2nd and 3rd most important on the roster.

Mike

Dominant.  Dominant.  I don't want a one - off, we already had one of those.  I want a decade plus of being in the conversation for the finals.  Anything less is just....rearranging deck chairs.  We were talking about the "window" closing on the KG Celtics before they even played a game.

[Waew]

you're going to disagree, but i think Playoff Rondo (not to be confused with regular season rondo) is an all-time great. pair him with Kevin Love and another piece and he will shine.

[Section301]

by and large i agree with your post. the one major caveat i have is about love. i agree he is a very good player, but, NOT a franchise type player. what he gives you on offense is partly negated by his poor defense, meaning as a total package he is very, very good, but not an elite difference maker in terms of w/l. unlike KG, love is not going to win you a game with his defense.

where i differ in what you posted is that love would not help the celtics become a contender. by himself, no. but, i think ainge is setting the stage for acquiring a superstar either through free agency or a trade. having love, i think, would make it easier for him to woo a star player.

i could be wrong, but i saw the possible acquisition of love as ONE STEP in a longer process.

But...the odds of getting SUPERSTAR through free agency or a trade is so very slim.  And by the time we get someone who is already a superstar, they've hit (and possibly passed) their prime.  Biggest two free agents this year are LeBron and Melo.  Melo just turned 30.  LeBron is 30 in December.  That's one year younger than Paul Pierce at the start of the season before the 2008 championship, and we were already talking about the window closing...

[Sketch5]

Wow. A bit much don't you think. It's what sports fans do, come up with ideas bounce them off of each other and crap on them at times. It's what radio and TV show hosts do, they just get payed to do it.

As in drafting a Transcendent player, I'm pretty sure we won in '08 with out one. I don't count KG since he was on the down side. We rarely had the best player on the floor. Had to go threw Lebron and Kobe. But we did have the best team.

The Spurs did the same this year, non of their guys are a Lebron, or KD any more, yet they did it. Dirk was the only guy, over 30, and didn't have an other Superstar next to him, unlike Lebron, or KD.

So while Love isn't this Transcendent player you think we are going to draft, I do think he's a guy who can help. He's the offensive threat we are missing, and a guy who with Rondo could help bring in an other FA in 2015 or 2016.

I think the Spurs and Mavs have shown this day and age, you can have a couple all stars, but not the best player on the floor and still win it. Because of a team concept. Which is what I think DA and Stevens are gearing for.

Whats funny is when you talk about fiddling with Rondo and KO and Sully and say it doesn't matter because it wont lead to a championship is way off. You remember Ricky Davis. When DA brought him in, and then raised his stock, traded it for Wally, and then on draftnight traded Wally and Green for Allen, which lead to KG coming and signing a extension.

Plus its fun to play GM once and a while.

[Section301]

Wow. A bit much don't you think. It's what sports fans do, come up with ideas bounce them off of each other and crap on them at times. It's what radio and TV show hosts do, they just get payed to do it.

As in drafting a Transcendent player, I'm pretty sure we won in '08 with out one. I don't count KG since he was on the down side. We rarely had the best player on the floor. Had to go threw Lebron and Kobe. But we did have the best team.

The Spurs did the same this year, non of their guys are a Lebron, or KD any more, yet they did it. Dirk was the only guy, over 30, and didn't have an other Superstar next to him, unlike Lebron, or KD.

So while Love isn't this Transcendent player you think we are going to draft, I do think he's a guy who can help. He's the offensive threat we are missing, and a guy who with Rondo could help bring in an other FA in 2015 or 2016.

I think the Spurs and Mavs have shown this day and age, you can have a couple all stars, but not the best player on the floor and still win it. Because of a team concept. Which is what I think DA and Stevens are gearing for.

Whats funny is when you talk about fiddling with Rondo and KO and Sully and say it doesn't matter because it wont lead to a championship is way off. You remember Ricky Davis. When DA brought him in, and then raised his stock, traded it for Wally, and then on draftnight traded Wally and Green for Allen, which lead to KG coming and signing a extension.

Plus its fun to play GM once and a while.

I agree it's what we do.  That's why I said "that is what we do." 

Dominant.  Dominant.  All these "team concept" examples are one-shot deals.  We've already had our one shot, now I want our dynasty.  As in the joke about the old bull and the young bull, if you want to run down and get one, that's fine.  I want to walk down and get 'em all...

[hwangjini_1]

by and large i agree with your post. the one major caveat i have is about love. i agree he is a very good player, but, NOT a franchise type player. what he gives you on offense is partly negated by his poor defense, meaning as a total package he is very, very good, but not an elite difference maker in terms of w/l. unlike KG, love is not going to win you a game with his defense.

where i differ in what you posted is that love would not help the celtics become a contender. by himself, no. but, i think ainge is setting the stage for acquiring a superstar either through free agency or a trade. having love, i think, would make it easier for him to woo a star player.

i could be wrong, but i saw the possible acquisition of love as ONE STEP in a longer process.

But...the odds of getting SUPERSTAR through free agency or a trade is so very slim.  And by the time we get someone who is already a superstar, they've hit (and possibly passed) their prime.  Biggest two free agents this year are LeBron and Melo.  Melo just turned 30.  LeBron is 30 in December.  That's one year younger than Paul Pierce at the start of the season before the 2008 championship, and we were already talking about the window closing...

will no one win a championship after lebron and melo? 

yes, the odds a pretty slim. but will some teams have those stars? of course they will. the point is to become one of those teams. the odds are always low since the number of such players is low. but what else can ainge do but arrange everything so as to provide the best odds possible?

solutions exist. proof is that each and every year a champion is crowned.

[Section301]

by and large i agree with your post. the one major caveat i have is about love. i agree he is a very good player, but, NOT a franchise type player. what he gives you on offense is partly negated by his poor defense, meaning as a total package he is very, very good, but not an elite difference maker in terms of w/l. unlike KG, love is not going to win you a game with his defense.

where i differ in what you posted is that love would not help the celtics become a contender. by himself, no. but, i think ainge is setting the stage for acquiring a superstar either through free agency or a trade. having love, i think, would make it easier for him to woo a star player.

i could be wrong, but i saw the possible acquisition of love as ONE STEP in a longer process.

But...the odds of getting SUPERSTAR through free agency or a trade is so very slim.  And by the time we get someone who is already a superstar, they've hit (and possibly passed) their prime.  Biggest two free agents this year are LeBron and Melo.  Melo just turned 30.  LeBron is 30 in December.  That's one year younger than Paul Pierce at the start of the season before the 2008 championship, and we were already talking about the window closing...

will no one win a championship after lebron and melo? 

yes, the odds a pretty slim. but will some teams have those stars? of course they will. the point is to become one of those teams. the odds are always low since the number of such players is low. but what else can ainge do but arrange everything so as to provide the best odds possible?

solutions exist. proof is that each and every year a champion is crowned.

Will they win after Lebron and Melo? Yes.  They'll win with a transcendent player that they probably get through the draft

And I agree, the point is to become one of those teams.  I'm simply saying that expecting to become one of those teams and create a dynasty via trades or free agency is a pretty forlorn hope. 

[More Banners]

As in drafting a Transcendent player, I'm pretty sure we won in '08 with out one. I don't count KG since he was on the down side. We rarely had the best player on the floor. Had to go threw Lebron and Kobe. But we did have the best team.

Paul Pierce, c. 2008, was able to go mano-a-mano with Lebron, shot for shot, to 40+ points, and win.

[Section301]

I generally agree with everything you said but I noticed you left Kobe out, twice.

Kobe was never the best player on any of his championship teams.

[Chris22]

Rome wasn't built in a day, and the summer is not over yet.

[Future Celtics Owner]

Some people on here are completely satisfied with just competing. They just want to be apart of the playoff experience, even if it is a first round exit. To me thats crazy.