Phili is way ahead of us on the rebuild

[aingeforthree]

Way ahead of the rebuild ?

Nothing is guaranteed whether you're the first pick or 25th pick. They have two high picks in Noel & Embiid that have to prove they can play with the big boys. Don't care where they were drafted, nothing is a given. Plus, they both have to overcome big time injuries. Big man injuries are no joke.

Then you have to wait for Saric.

7 draft picks from this draft. With Embiid & Saric out, how many of the 7 picks will even start next year ? How many will make the team ? You couldn't trade any of those picks or package two or three for a starter or even fringe starter ?

Way ahead of the rebuild ? We will never know until 3/4 years down the road.

[hpantazo]

In another thread on the blog regarding Noel, people are considering offering Sully or KO plus one of the Nets picks for Noel. So that's 2 of our assets for one of Phili's, which is the lesser of their two big men. Imagine what the asking price would be for Embiid. They are ahead of us on collecting valuable assets for sure.

  They aren't, because that Nets pick represents one of our 7-8 over the next 4 years (plus the option to switch a pick) compared to Philly's 2-3. In effect we could acquire their 2nd best asset without putting a huge dent in our stockpile.

Doesn't matter how you try to spin it, your statement doesn't add up. It's simple math, 2 assets is greater than 1 asset.

Ignoring the specifics of the discussion to point out that this is a dangerous idea to use as a blanked fact.

ignoring half my argument in order to make a general statement to support one's own opinion is offensive and a poor response to a discussion.

I'm not purporting any opinion (and I largely agree with you), just pointing out that two assets are not always more valuable than one asset.

fair enough

[Chris22]

Who gives a rat's ass about Philly?

[D.o.s.]

Who gives a rat's ass about Philly?

There are a handful of posters that think we should've totally salted the fields, like the 76ers did, after trading KG and Pierce. It's only natural that they come up as a rebuilding comparison.

[BballTim]

In another thread on the blog regarding Noel, people are considering offering Sully or KO plus one of the Nets picks for Noel. So that's 2 of our assets for one of Phili's, which is the lesser of their two big men. Imagine what the asking price would be for Embiid. They are ahead of us on collecting valuable assets for sure.

  They aren't, because that Nets pick represents one of our 7-8 over the next 4 years (plus the option to switch a pick) compared to Philly's 2-3. In effect we could acquire their 2nd best asset without putting a huge dent in our stockpile.

Doesn't matter how you try to spin it, your statement doesn't add up. It's simple math, 2 assets is greater than 1 asset. Amazing how you managed to ignore the Sullinger/KO part of the proposed trade. Basically our young players are so inferior in value that we have to include a valuable 1st round pick along with them to even have a chance to acquire one of their young players, who is also not the most valuable (Embiid) and not the one who just won rookie of the year (MCW).

  My statement adds up just fine. Philly has better current young assets than we do, we have a significant advantage in future assets. Try as you might, you won't be able to spin that one away.

As for this supposed huge stockpile of picks, it's already diminishing and will be very depleted by this time next year. They have an expiration date, and there is no clear value to them. If we are lucky, one or two picks might turn into a Noel type of player. Most likely some will turn into Fab Melos or JR Giddens or Jujuan Johnsons if we don't manage to trade them.

  For starters you don't know what a "Noel type of player" is. To claim otherwise is nonsense. And that was probably the most realistic part of that paragraph. How exactly do you think our stockpile of future picks is diminishing? Is there some sort of expiration date on them, where we lose our 2018 picks if we don't use them by 2016 or so? How depleted will they be after this year? If you just ignore next year and just look at our "diminished and depleted" stockpile over 2016-2018 Philly will have 2 1st rounders and we'll have 5 and the right to swap another one.

[mgent]

I think you misunderstand my point.

Is it impossible for Boston to become a contender ?  Of course not.  Is it possible Ainge has some further moves up his sleeve?  Absolutely.  Is it possible Marcus smart reaches his Eric Bledsoe ceiling ?  No doubt.  Could embiid and Noel both bust ?  Maybe.

But right now if you were to project Philly's future vs Boston's, it's a no contest.  We have a veteran former all-star PG possibly on the way out.  We have a solid asset in Marcus smart.  Beyond that we have role player talent and some picks that nobody can confidently project.

Philly, on the other hand, has a player the most project will be an elite defensive big (Noel), a player most project has transcendent superstar potential (embiid), a young PG who is coming off a rookie of the year season,  and a foreign prospect that people rave about (Saric)... Plus a trajectory that makes them seem like a lock to bottom out again next year ... Plus several other picks that nobody can confidently project.

Anything can happen. But right now I think most reasonable NBA fans would rather have Philly's assets than Boston's assets.  Pose the question on a neutral forum and see for yourself. 

Does it make me a bad person that I admit Philly has a better projected future?  Nope. Tanking was the right move. Marcus smart should be a nice piece.  I'd rather have him than not have him. That doesn't change the fact that Philly has more pieces on the board right now.

And.... it always comes back to the "two birds in the hand is worth one in the bush" crap.

You can project which guys will play better than Rondo, Green, and Sully all you want, but you seem to have forgotten that your comparing a team on paper to an actual team.

And as far as who has the assets in the future, that's obviously debatable.  I don't know why you're trying to refer to your opinion as "fact."

[ederson]

Well ... since most project something ,then it must be true....

Rondo will never recover from his injury but Noel and Embii who have yet to play a single minute will recover fully and will be all stars. And of course smart will be a bust.

Rondo and Sully are proven NBA players. KO and AB are decent bench players.
What does Phi have ?MCW and .. hopes.

[LilRip]

I wouldn't say "ahead". Philly is just taking a riskier route, which is worthy of praise as well IMO. So in terms of upside, i do think Philly has a higher ceiling than us, but at the same time, they have a lower floor. And since the point of contention are generally unproven commodities, then just like beauty, it's all in the eye of the beholder.

I guarantee though that if Philly drafted Smart and we were able to draft Embiid at 6, and we got Saric at 17 and they got Young at 10, and we got Noel at 13 (instead of KO), we'd think a lot more highly of them. Now, we point to the Nets picks, which we're all hoping will eventually be high/lottery picks though, given the willingness to spend of Brooklyn mgmt, it seems unlikely.

[BballTim]

Well ... since most project something ,then it must be true....

Rondo will never recover from his injury but Noel and Embii who have yet to play a single minute will recover fully and will be all stars. And of course smart will be a bust.

  The thing about that is if you reversed the picks Philly would still have a much better future than us because the pro-Philly arguments would switch from "Smart might be good but Embiid will be a franchise player" to "Smart will be a star and Embiid might never recover from his injuries".

[ederson]

Regardless of team and sport one thing is always present

The player who didn t play would have been better than the one who played and the other teams pick better players

[D.o.s.]

Regardless of team and sport one thing is always present

The player who didn t play would have been better than the one who played and the other teams pick better players

It's probably worth pointing out that there is a difference in how a 29 year old player has his game affected by an ACL tear, compared to someone who's a decade younger, give or take.

[ederson]

I agree.Every human recovers differently. Rondo's age is disadvantage Embiid/Noel's height and weight will be also a disadvantage.


I may be wrong but i can think more tall players never recovering than guards

[BballTim]

Regardless of team and sport one thing is always present

The player who didn t play would have been better than the one who played and the other teams pick better players

It's probably worth pointing out that there is a difference in how a 29 year old player has his game affected by an ACL tear, compared to someone who's a decade younger, give or take.

  In a statistical sense there is. That doesn't mean one particular player will recover more than another base solely on age. You'd also have to consider that, from what I read, Noel's game is predicated on his athleticism while we've already seen that Rondo's best skill (passing) was unaffected by his injury.

[LooseCannon]

The Celtics are in a better position for a quick rebuild.  The 76ers are in a better position for a long-term rebuild.

Boston has an easier path towards putting a playoff team on the floor that might contend within a season or two.  The 76ers are more likely to have a young player who will develop into a franchise cornerstone, but that will take a few years.

[Finkelskyhook]

They're drafting guys who won't play at all and they're ahead of us?

Really?