Author Topic: Which young SG and which young Center should we pursue this off season?  (Read 8728 times)

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Offline RJ87

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At SG:
Hayward is way overrated around here, and Utah will most likely pay him more than he is worth to retain him. Stephenson is a solid player, but he has a bad attitude, and I think he will also get a way bigger contract than he is worth this offseason.
I would love for Ainge to weasel his way into a Klay Thompson trade, but I don't see the Warriors letting him go any time soon....not for any less than a king's ransom anyways.

Considering the rather bare Free Agent crop at the SG position this yr, I'd prefer to just re-sign Bradley somewhere between 6 & 8 mill per yr. I would much rather have Bradley than Hayward, and he will probably come cheaper than Hayward too.

If you you think Hayward overrated, then how paying AB between $6m and $8m a year not a drastic overpayment? Hayward is the better overall player, IMO - yes, his shooting percentages took a dive this season as he was forced to be the #1 option. Even so, he's the superior ballhandler/facilator, a better rebounder, and a more natural scorer. Bradley's one advantage is defense, but AB's defense took a step back this year. I think his reputation as an elite defender kept him from getting criticism in that area. And then there's the issue of durability.

At Center: Of the 3 centers you mentioned, I would most like to pursue Sanders. Asik is not worth giving up the assets Morey will most likely ask for in return...especially when he is due that absurd $15mill contact this yr, and then can leave in Free Agency to the highest bidder next offseason.

Keep in mind that although Asik is slated to be paid $15m next season, his cap hit is actually $8.2m. With some finagling to get away from the hard cap, we can possible use the trade exception from the Paul Pierce/KG trade to add him depending on what type of pick we give up.
2021 Houston Rockets
PG: Kyrie Irving/Patty Mills/Jalen Brunson
SG: OG Anunoby/Norman Powell/Matisse Thybulle
SF: Gordon Hayward/Demar Derozan
PF: Giannis Antetokounmpo/Robert Covington
C: Kristaps Porzingis/Bobby Portis/James Wiseman

Offline RRNoLookPass

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At SG:
Hayward is way overrated around here, and Utah will most likely pay him more than he is worth to retain him. Stephenson is a solid player, but he has a bad attitude, and I think he will also get a way bigger contract than he is worth this offseason.
I would love for Ainge to weasel his way into a Klay Thompson trade, but I don't see the Warriors letting him go any time soon....not for any less than a king's ransom anyways.

Considering the rather bare Free Agent crop at the SG position this yr, I'd prefer to just re-sign Bradley somewhere between 6 & 8 mill per yr. I would much rather have Bradley than Hayward, and he will probably come cheaper than Hayward too.

If you you think Hayward overrated, then how paying AB between $6m and $8m a year not a drastic overpayment? Hayward is the better overall player, IMO - yes, his shooting percentages took a dive this season as he was forced to be the #1 option. Even so, he's the superior ballhandler/facilator, a better rebounder, and a more natural scorer. Bradley's one advantage is defense, but AB's defense took a step back this year. I think his reputation as an elite defender kept him from getting criticism in that area. And then there's the issue of durability.

At Center: Of the 3 centers you mentioned, I would most like to pursue Sanders. Asik is not worth giving up the assets Morey will most likely ask for in return...especially when he is due that absurd $15mill contact this yr, and then can leave in Free Agency to the highest bidder next offseason.

Keep in mind that although Asik is slated to be paid $15m next season, his cap hit is actually $8.2m. With some finagling to get away from the hard cap, we can possible use the trade exception from the Paul Pierce/KG trade to add him depending on what type of pick we give up.

6 to 8 mill per yr for Bradley is not a drastic overpayment because he is a better all-around player than Hayward. (And he will still probably get paid less than Hayward, which I find comical). But 6 to 8 mill per yr is what Bradley will make, whether it be from the Celtics or from another team...and he is worth every penny.
The "drastic overpayment", as you referred to it, is gonna be when some team foolishly offers Hayward 9-10mill per yr...and Utah or whomever else can keep him for that, as far as I'm concerned.

Hayward is far from being the superior player in comparison to Bradley. Hayward is a better facilitator--that's about it. He is not a very efficient passer though...he turns the ball over quite a bit.
And Hayward only has a *slight* edge over Bradley in the rebounding department...their rebounding numbers per36 are pretty similar.

You can call Hayward "a more natural scorer" all you want to, but I'm not sure how that justifies your argument. Bradley is still the better shooter regardless. Bradley is an excellent mid-range shooter, and he is better from 3p range too. (With the exception of last yr when he came back from double-shoulder surgery).

But I'll go by the numbers and take the more efficient SG any day, over someone's personal opinion that Hayward is "a more natural scorer" than Bradley. Not to mention Bradley actually plays on both sides of the ball, unlike Hayward who isn't much of a defender.

You can blame Hayward's decreased efficiency this yr on him becoming the #1 option, but the fact of the matter is, his overall FG% has gone down every season since his rookie yr. And people tend to forget, that Bradley was often the #1 option on offense for the Celts this yr as well, but he still managed to post his best offensive numbers yet.

And yes, I am well aware of the fact that Asik's cap hit is $8.3 mill this yr, just like Lin's contract is. But that doesn't mean the Celtics owners are going to want to shell out the ridiculous $15mill to pay him for 1yr.

I would rather take a flyer on Sanders. He will be well worth his contract if he can return to the form he was in last yr.
« Last Edit: May 05, 2014, 08:21:42 PM by RRNoLookPass »

Offline TheTruthFot18

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FA class is average at best especially at those spots. I want (realistically) Gortat cheap (~9/10 mil) and Afflalo (7-9 mil).

Rondo - $13, PP $1
AA $8, CJ $1
Green $10, Gwall $10
Sully $2, KO $2
Gortat $10, JA $3

$60 + bench ( $ 2-3 mil). Trade Bass for those fillers or to a playoff team for a pick?

My two cents. Tipsy from my honeymoon in St. Maarten  ;D
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Offline McHales Pits

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My two cents. Tipsy from my honeymoon in St. Maarten  ;D

On your honeymoon and you're scoping out CB? Get off the computer, get another drink in hand, and get lucky!!!
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Offline RJ87

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At SG:
Hayward is way overrated around here, and Utah will most likely pay him more than he is worth to retain him. Stephenson is a solid player, but he has a bad attitude, and I think he will also get a way bigger contract than he is worth this offseason.
I would love for Ainge to weasel his way into a Klay Thompson trade, but I don't see the Warriors letting him go any time soon....not for any less than a king's ransom anyways.

Considering the rather bare Free Agent crop at the SG position this yr, I'd prefer to just re-sign Bradley somewhere between 6 & 8 mill per yr. I would much rather have Bradley than Hayward, and he will probably come cheaper than Hayward too.

If you you think Hayward overrated, then how paying AB between $6m and $8m a year not a drastic overpayment? Hayward is the better overall player, IMO - yes, his shooting percentages took a dive this season as he was forced to be the #1 option. Even so, he's the superior ballhandler/facilator, a better rebounder, and a more natural scorer. Bradley's one advantage is defense, but AB's defense took a step back this year. I think his reputation as an elite defender kept him from getting criticism in that area. And then there's the issue of durability.

At Center: Of the 3 centers you mentioned, I would most like to pursue Sanders. Asik is not worth giving up the assets Morey will most likely ask for in return...especially when he is due that absurd $15mill contact this yr, and then can leave in Free Agency to the highest bidder next offseason.

Keep in mind that although Asik is slated to be paid $15m next season, his cap hit is actually $8.2m. With some finagling to get away from the hard cap, we can possible use the trade exception from the Paul Pierce/KG trade to add him depending on what type of pick we give up.

6 to 8 mill per yr for Bradley is not a drastic overpayment because he is a better all-around player than Hayward. (And he will still probably get paid less than Hayward, which I find comical). But 6 to 8 mill per yr is what Bradley will make, whether it be from the Celtics or from another team...and he is worth every penny.
The "drastic overpayment", as you referred to it, is gonna be when some team foolishly offers Hayward 9-10mill per yr...and Utah or whomever else can keep him for that, as far as I'm concerned.

Hayward is far from being the superior player in comparison to Bradley. Hayward is a better facilitator--that's about it. He is not a very efficient passer though...he turns the ball over quite a bit.
And Hayward only has a *slight* edge over Bradley in the rebounding department...their rebounding numbers per36 are pretty similar.

You can call Hayward "a more natural scorer" all you want to, but I'm not sure how that justifies your argument. Bradley is still the better shooter regardless. Bradley is an excellent mid-range shooter, and he is better from 3p range too. (With the exception of last yr when he came back from double-shoulder surgery).

But I'll go by the numbers and take the more efficient SG any day, over someone's personal opinion that Hayward is "a more natural scorer" than Bradley. Not to mention Bradley actually plays on both sides of the ball, unlike Hayward who isn't much of a defender.

You can blame Hayward's decreased efficiency this yr on him becoming the #1 option, but the fact of the matter is, his overall FG% has gone down every season since his rookie yr. And people tend to forget, that Bradley was often the #1 option on offense for the Celts this yr as well, but he still managed to post his best offensive numbers yet.

And yes, I am well aware of the fact that Asik's cap hit is $8.3 mill this yr, just like Lin's contract is. But that doesn't mean the Celtics owners are going to want to shell out the ridiculous $15mill to pay him for 1yr.

I would rather take a flyer on Sanders. He will be well worth his contract if he can return to the form he was in last yr.

I'm sorry, I just don't see how paying up to $8m for an undersized, streak shooting, defensive specializing 2-guard (although he can only defend PG's and smaller SG's so even his only elite skill comes with limitations) who can't even get to the league average in PER as being a smart investment.

You don't have to agree with me about Hayward but in all honesty, if a team is foolish enough to offer Avery that kind of money I hope we walk away. I don't think he's worth more than the MLE.
2021 Houston Rockets
PG: Kyrie Irving/Patty Mills/Jalen Brunson
SG: OG Anunoby/Norman Powell/Matisse Thybulle
SF: Gordon Hayward/Demar Derozan
PF: Giannis Antetokounmpo/Robert Covington
C: Kristaps Porzingis/Bobby Portis/James Wiseman

Offline LatterDayCelticsfan

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Lets go absurdly left field and bring back Nnenad Kristic at the 5. Will a three year 36 million partially guaranteed deal (year 2 and 3) do it? Re-sign Bradley at MLE level money and if the lottery smiles on up grab either Exum or Wiggins, and if not, oh well.  Then just cut all the unguaranteeds that ain't called Chris Johnson...and yes I did just run off a tangent 
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Offline MSceltic

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One thing that I always look at when comparing Bradley's numbers to any SG or player on another team is the fact that rondo can boost anyone's numbers. Hayward had to dominate possession for a large chunk of the season because Burke was hurt, I think he or any of these SG's besides maybe Stephenson would thrive with rondo as a facilitator. I know I'm biased cause I have fallen for the idea of the Hayward/Stevens reunion but it's something to think about. Is Avery improving tremendously or benefiting from a healthy Rondo?

Offline RRNoLookPass

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One thing that I always look at when comparing Bradley's numbers to any SG or player on another team is the fact that rondo can boost anyone's numbers. Hayward had to dominate possession for a large chunk of the season because Burke was hurt, I think he or any of these SG's besides maybe Stephenson would thrive with rondo as a facilitator. I know I'm biased cause I have fallen for the idea of the Hayward/Stevens reunion but it's something to think about. Is Avery improving tremendously or benefiting from a healthy Rondo?

Rondo played what, 30 games this yr? I think Rondo & Bradley certainly play well together, but you can't really say Rondo is the only reason Bradley improved this yr. And I personally think 8mill per yr is on the very high end of what Bradley might be offer with a short term contract, but I would be happy to see the team bring him back at a 6mill per yr long term contract.

Offline greenhead85

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At the SG/SF spot, I want us to acquire (1)Gordon Hayward who could really space the floor and take big shots and (2) Evan Turner who could play well on both positions. We could offer AB and picks.

At the 5, either Gortat (undeniably a banger and a force in the middle on on whoever is challenging at the middle) or Spencer Hawes (who could also bang inside and has good midrange J).
« Last Edit: May 06, 2014, 09:30:55 AM by greenhead85 »

Offline pearljammer10

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At the SG/SF spot, I want us to acquire (1)Gordon Hayward who could really space the floor and take big shots and (2) Evan Turner who could play well on both positions. We could offer AB and picks.

At the 5, either Gortat (undeniably a banger and a force in the middle on on whoever is challenging at the middle) or Spencer Hawes (who could also bang inside and has good midrange J).

Yuck.

Offline pearljammer10

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I'll break my want choices into unrealistic for us but may possibly be available for some teams, realistic and good fit, and wild card.

SG:

1. I think Klay Thompson would be my unrealistic number one option to fill the slot at this point. Doesn't need the ball in his hands can come off screens much like Ray and hit the three and outside shots at a high clip to space the floor.

2. Afflalo - And I think he might be available so he would be my realistic option to throw into the mix. Had a career year last year, is on a good contract the next couple years, plays well on offense showed he could space the floor and is also an above average defender. I think him and Rondo would work nicely together in the back court. Even if his numbers fall off from this year he would still be a good consistent option.

3. Get Melo and move Jeff Green to the 2. I still think Green at the 2 slot would be an interesting match up problem for other teams and with Melo at the 3 it could work. Melo can handle the ball when needed and the matchup advantages in this situation would be greatly in our favor. Long, big, and athletic team.

My ultimate centers would be Gasol or Jordan depending who our PF was but I dont think any of those options are realistic. So....

1. My unrealistic yet possibly obtainable rim protector - Noah. If Rose has another set back and the Bulls can't net Melo, they might look to sell high on Noah. However he is perfect for Thibs system and I really dont see why the would move him. However, putting him alongside an offensive juggernaut PF would be a perfect situation in green.

2. Gotta be Asik. I think Danny will make some calls again and I could see him in Green next year. He would be a very good fit for us.

3. Roy Hibbert - Something is going on in the Indy locker room and I don't think Hibbert will be wanted in there anymore for some reason. Its certainly a wild card possibility but if the Pacers sell low and he benefits from a change of scenery, I think he would be a great rim protector in Beantown.

Offline PhoSita

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If Danny could acquire Afflalo and Asik without giving up any draft picks for this year, I think that'd be a really good route. 

No long term financial commitment to either (yet), but they'd make the team considerably better next season.
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Offline greenhead85

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At the SG/SF spot, I want us to acquire (1)Gordon Hayward who could really space the floor and take big shots and (2) Evan Turner who could play well on both positions. We could offer AB and picks.

At the 5, either Gortat (undeniably a banger and a force in the middle on on whoever is challenging at the middle) or Spencer Hawes (who could also bang inside and has good midrange J).

Yuck.

Turner played so well against us while he was with the Sixers. We almost couldnt find an answer against him when his game was on. He is currently not just in the right system. Him playing at SG or SF along with Rajon and Hayward or Green gives the team a tall and talented rotation on both positions.

Offline Yoki_IsTheName

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I'm going a little off topic, but somewhat still related.

These two are not really young but there are two solid folks that I've been clamoring for years that we should have.

Both are unrestricted Free Agents this summer.

C - Jason Smith (28)

He's solid all around. 7 footer with mid range game and a solid rebounder/shot blocker combo. Has played well before he went down with injuries.

SG - Brandon Rush (28)

A dude who can play defense and make threes. Had limited time in Utah after coming back from injuries, but has shown in Golden State he can be a really good bench mob player.

Thee guys along won't put us on the top. But they can come in cheap, and be part of a solid, young veteran bench unit who can do multiple things, and be solid in the starting lineup in case injuries occur (heck I think Smith can be a solid starter if not for him being injured).
2019 CStrong Historical Draft 2000s OKC Thunder.
PG: Jrue Holiday / Isaiah Thomas / Larry Hughes
SG: Paul George / Aaron McKie / Bradley Beal
SF: Paul Pierce / Tayshaun Prince / Brian Scalabrine
PF: LaMarcus Aldridge / Shareef Abdur-Raheem / Ben Simmons
C: Jermaine O'neal / Ben Wallace

Offline PhoSita

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I'm going a little off topic, but somewhat still related.

These two are not really young but there are two solid folks that I've been clamoring for years that we should have.

Both are unrestricted Free Agents this summer.

C - Jason Smith (28)

He's solid all around. 7 footer with mid range game and a solid rebounder/shot blocker combo. Has played well before he went down with injuries.

SG - Brandon Rush (28)

A dude who can play defense and make threes. Had limited time in Utah after coming back from injuries, but has shown in Golden State he can be a really good bench mob player.

Thee guys along won't put us on the top. But they can come in cheap, and be part of a solid, young veteran bench unit who can do multiple things, and be solid in the starting lineup in case injuries occur (heck I think Smith can be a solid starter if not for him being injured).

Both are players that I like.  Jason Smith is kind of like a center version of Brandon Bass, in that his main offensive weapon is a deadly midrange jumper.  I think he could fit well with Rondo.

I'm not sure if it makes sense to go after Brandon Rush so long as Green and Wallace are still here, and I'm not sure if Brandon Rush is even better than Chris Johnson at this point.  He didn't really play much this season, and when he did he wasn't very good.

I think both players could be options to look at depending on how the roster shakes out this off-season.  There could be needs at backup center and backup wing that could be addressed cheaply with those players.
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