Gortat?

[Celtics18]

the time to trade for Gortat came and went. It was last season when we could have had him for Bradley and he could have helped Pierce and KG out. No use for him now, he's too old for this team

I disagree.  The guy just turned thirty.  He could be a nice piece to a playoff team next year that had a good mix of veterans with youth.

I wouldn't hate something like this:

Rondo/FA/Pressey
Smart/Bradley/Johnson
Green/Warren/Wallace
Olynyk/Sullinger/Anthony
Gortat/Faverani/Iverson

To me, that's a "have your cake and eat it too" team.  That team should be good enough to make the playoffs, but it still has plenty of upside, representing a positive outlook for the future. 

Plus, we still have those future Clippers and Nets picks.

I dont see that team making the playoffs even in a weak Eastern Conference.

I'm a Gortat fan but unless we land a big fish number one to add to Rondo and Green, Gortat would only keep us in mediocrity.

But, mediocrity could well land us in the playoffs. 

[D.o.s.]

the time to trade for Gortat came and went. It was last season when we could have had him for Bradley and he could have helped Pierce and KG out. No use for him now, he's too old for this team

I disagree.  The guy just turned thirty.  He could be a nice piece to a playoff team next year that had a good mix of veterans with youth.

I wouldn't hate something like this:

Rondo/FA/Pressey
Smart/Bradley/Johnson
Green/Warren/Wallace
Olynyk/Sullinger/Anthony
Gortat/Faverani/Iverson

To me, that's a "have your cake and eat it too" team.  That team should be good enough to make the playoffs, but it still has plenty of upside, representing a positive outlook for the future. 

Plus, we still have those future Clippers and Nets picks.

I dont see that team making the playoffs even in a weak Eastern Conference.

I'm a Gortat fan but unless we land a big fish number one to add to Rondo and Green, Gortat would only keep us in mediocrity.

But, mediocrity could well land us in the playoffs.

I think, for a lot of people, "mediocrity" is a series of first- and second-round playoff exits.

[Celtics18]

the time to trade for Gortat came and went. It was last season when we could have had him for Bradley and he could have helped Pierce and KG out. No use for him now, he's too old for this team

I disagree.  The guy just turned thirty.  He could be a nice piece to a playoff team next year that had a good mix of veterans with youth.

I wouldn't hate something like this:

Rondo/FA/Pressey
Smart/Bradley/Johnson
Green/Warren/Wallace
Olynyk/Sullinger/Anthony
Gortat/Faverani/Iverson

To me, that's a "have your cake and eat it too" team.  That team should be good enough to make the playoffs, but it still has plenty of upside, representing a positive outlook for the future. 

Plus, we still have those future Clippers and Nets picks.

I dont see that team making the playoffs even in a weak Eastern Conference.

I'm a Gortat fan but unless we land a big fish number one to add to Rondo and Green, Gortat would only keep us in mediocrity.

But, mediocrity could well land us in the playoffs.

I think, for a lot of people, "mediocrity" is a series of first- and second-round playoff exits.

I also think a lot of people think that a first or second round playoff exit somehow dooms the team to first or second round exits forever with no chance for improvement.

I've never bought in to that myth. 

[Mr October]

the time to trade for Gortat came and went. It was last season when we could have had him for Bradley and he could have helped Pierce and KG out. No use for him now, he's too old for this team

bingo, we were all for it then, but NOT NOW.

Why is now not a good time?

It appears that most folks want to save assets, cap space, etc and use them to get a core all star player or 2 to build around. Then use what's left to acquire the role players.

I sort of agree with that logic. But i also think we need to return to winning sooner if the Celtics want to keep Rondo, and advertise itself as a winning destination for another big free agent in 2015 or 2016.

If Rondo is traded for young pieces this summer, then Ainge is signaling a drastic youth movement that could keep the Celtics in the lottery for the next couple of years.

If the Celtics stay the course with Rondo, i might be interested in Gortat at the right price. If he or any other elite role player is signed at the right price, they should be trade-able when needed.

The question becomes what is the right price for Gortat? I think it is well below 10 million per year. Maybe closer to 8. At that point I think the Wizards resign him at 42 over 4 years.

First lets see what happens on draft day. Then let's see if the Celtics can make a splashier move. Then if there is still a hole at center i would try to find someone serviceable who might take a 1 or 2 year deal.

Celtics18, what kind of contract are you thinking about when considering Gortat?

[D.o.s.]

But, mediocrity could well land us in the playoffs.

I think, for a lot of people, "mediocrity" is a series of first- and second-round playoff exits.

I also think a lot of people think that a first or second round playoff exit somehow dooms the team to first or second round exits forever with no chance for improvement.

I've never bought in to that myth.

Agreed.

[PhoSita]

I like Gortat a lot, but for one thing, I'm not sure he's the defensive anchor we need.  Second, I think signing / acquiring him would only make sense if it's in conjunction with another move to add a high level scorer to the team.

Rondo + Bradley + Green + Sullinger + Gortat is probably a playoff team in the East, but is it better than Washington this season?  In my opinion, no, it's not.


However, if Danny packages Sullinger and other assets for Kevin Love, or the Celtics get lucky and draft Wiggins or Parker, then committing to a player like Gortat would make some more sense.  Gortat is not as good defensively as Asik, but he's a better scorer, and would provide that lineup with some nice offensive balance.

Basically, as I've been saying a lot lately, so much comes down to whether the long term plan is to try to keep Rondo, or else trade him for assets this summer.  And that may come down to where the Celtics' pick falls in the lottery, and what sort of trades are available on draft day.

what kind of contract are you thinking about when considering Gortat?

Any conversation about Gortat's next contract has to start in the 4 years / 40-45 million range, I think.

He's 30, which drives his price down a bit, but he's remained reasonably healthy throughout his career, and has a game that should age okay.

Maybe that's too high for a role player who is already 30, but centers get overpaid in this league.

[Celtics18]

the time to trade for Gortat came and went. It was last season when we could have had him for Bradley and he could have helped Pierce and KG out. No use for him now, he's too old for this team

bingo, we were all for it then, but NOT NOW.

Why is now not a good time?

It appears that most folks want to save assets, cap space, etc and use them to get a core all star player or 2 to build around. Then use what's left to acquire the role players.

I sort of agree with that logic. But i also think we need to return to winning sooner if the Celtics want to keep Rondo, and advertise itself as a winning destination for another big free agent in 2015 or 2016.

If Rondo is traded for young pieces this summer, then Ainge is signaling a drastic youth movement that could keep the Celtics in the lottery for the next couple of years.

If the Celtics stay the course with Rondo, i might be interested in Gortat at the right price. If he or any other elite role player is signed at the right price, they should be trade-able when needed.

The question becomes what is the right price for Gortat? I think it is well below 10 million per year. Maybe closer to 8. At that point I think the Wizards resign him at 42 over 4 years.

First lets see what happens on draft day. Then let's see if the Celtics can make a splashier move. Then if there is still a hole at center i would try to find someone serviceable who might take a 1 or 2 year deal.

Celtics18, what kind of contract are you thinking about when considering Gortat?

I don't think he's gotten for less than $10mill. a year. 

[Mr October]

Gortat might not be affordable anyway with this year's cap space.

If the celtics keep their 2 picks, they might only have about 8 million to work with. Resigning Avery Bradley will come out of that 8 million.

[Celtics18]

Gortat might not be affordable anyway with this year's cap space.

If the celtics keep their 2 picks, they might only have about 8 million to work with. Resigning Avery Bradley will come out of that 8 million.

The whole point was somehow working some kind of sign and trade using our TPE.  I'm still not sure exactly how it works, but (just because I'm an optimist) I think it can be worked out. 

[Mr October]

Gortat might not be affordable anyway with this year's cap space.

If the celtics keep their 2 picks, they might only have about 8 million to work with. Resigning Avery Bradley will come out of that 8 million.

The whole point was somehow working some kind of sign and trade using our TPE.  I'm still not sure exactly how it works, but (just because I'm an optimist) I think it can be worked out.

Absolutely. We need to kick all the good tires. We might need to think outside the box a little when it comes to the center position. There are only about 20 good centers in the NBA, and maybe 10 of them qualify as rim protectors. Meanwhile there are 30 teams. Getting our hands on a Marc Gasol, Joakim Noah might not happen. I consider Gortat as part of that next tier of centers which includes Asik, Pekovic, Valanciunas (rising), Chandler (declining), etc.

[tarheelsxxiii]

Waste of money, imo. I wouldn't like spending his current $7 mil as a second string, despite the market. In general, seems like the best option for getting a solid to great big (due to their market value) is thru the draft. Or, you go to plan B and play small ball. I don't see as much value in second tier bigs as others do - maybe I"m just biased or my perspective is skewed, though

[cltc5]

the time to trade for Gortat came and went. It was last season when we could have had him for Bradley and he could have helped Pierce and KG out. No use for him now, he's too old for this team

agreed.  Same for nene and andray blatche.  Danny could nabbed either one of those guys to help pierce and kg out but didn't.  Dannys non moves were really head scratching, let's hope it was all part of a bigger vision.  I guess it didn't help we had a coach that refused to play any new aquisitions either.

[PhoSita]

Waste of money, imo. I wouldn't like spending his current $7 mil as a second string, despite the market. In general, seems like the best option for getting a solid to great big (due to their market value) is thru the draft. Or, you go to plan B and play small ball. I don't see as much value in second tier bigs as others do - maybe I"m just biased or my perspective is skewed, though

It's hard to find examples of teams that are having a lot of success right now with mediocre players at the 5.  OKC is the only example that springs to mind, and they have Durant.  There's a lot of value in the stability you gain from having even a solid but unremarkable option like Samuel Dalembert or Robin Lopez at that position.

[gpap]

Waste of money, imo. I wouldn't like spending his current $7 mil as a second string, despite the market. In general, seems like the best option for getting a solid to great big (due to their market value) is thru the draft. Or, you go to plan B and play small ball. I don't see as much value in second tier bigs as others do - maybe I"m just biased or my perspective is skewed, though

1.) Even if the Celts draft a center in the draft, he's going to need at least 2-3 years to turn into a good player

2.)I think it's time to put the "small ball" ideas to rest. They don't work. You need rebounding and size just as badly as any other attribute needed to have a successful basketball team.

This "notion" of having guys that are 6'8 play the center is a disaster.

To the original poster, I would love to pick up Gortat.

Even acquiring a halfway decent center is 10 times better than either not having a center at all or one that is going to need years to develop.

[Mr October]

Waste of money, imo. I wouldn't like spending his current $7 mil as a second string, despite the market. In general, seems like the best option for getting a solid to great big (due to their market value) is thru the draft. Or, you go to plan B and play small ball. I don't see as much value in second tier bigs as others do - maybe I"m just biased or my perspective is skewed, though

It's hard to find examples of teams that are having a lot of success right now with mediocre players at the 5.  OKC is the only example that springs to mind, and they have Durant.  There's a lot of value in the stability you gain from having even a solid but unremarkable option like Samuel Dalembert or Robin Lopez at that position.

Teams are having success with a range of talent at the center position. The wizards with Gortat just bumped off the Noah led Bulls. The Perkins Thunder are an even match with the Gasol Grizzlies. Sub all star DeAndre Jordan is dominating the Bogut-less small ball Warriors.

The Pero Antic Hawks have the Hibbert Pacers on the ropes. The Dalembert Mavs are tied with the Duncan Spurs. The Valanciunas Raptors are tied with the KG nets. The Robin Lopez Blazers have the Howard Rockets on the ropes. And of course the Heat are so talented that they can get away with playing Bosh as a center.

Today's top centers guarantee you nothing. Mediocre centers are having a ton of success. If anything, this years playoffs give power to the low to mid tier centers. Team success is coming from overall team talent.

The other common thread is that unless you have Lebron James, you need at least some sort of center in order to succeed. ...even if that center is a floor spacer like Antic.