A Bashing of Bashing Player Bashing

[bballdog384]

Just to be clear, this thread is not at all about bashing people. It's about not bashing fellow Celtics fans. And maybe about bashing players.

[Roy H.]

Sullinger might be a tad overrated in this forum.  There aren't enough threads about his trade value.

Sullinger is everyone's feel good player. Much like Ryan Gomes was in 2006-07. People could disagree about Al because of his inconsistency, they picked favorites and not-favorites in the Bassy-Rondo-West bloodbath at the point. Gerald Green had his fans and people who weren't, but everyone loved Gomes, cuz he always played hard, and was a but of an underdog, plus when he didn't have a good game, there was usually someone who had a worse one.

I think it was a lot clearer before the incident with his girlfriend.  I think a lot of folks soured on Sully due to the allegations, and I can't really fault them for that, despite charges being dropped.  DV is a serious issue, and I can understand not giving Sully the benefit of the doubt.

I sort of hate that the best current Celtic is a jerk, and the best young player has a bit of a black cloud.  It was a lot easier back in the days before the internet, where players had more anonymity and you could fool yourself into thinking these guys were actually heroes.

[PhoSita]

I sort of hate that the best current Celtic is a jerk

I must say that this doesn't really bother me.  He's a jerk, but he's our jerk.  KG is / was kind of a jerk, at least in terms of the over the top on-court trash talking.  From what I've read, Bird was kind of a jerk.  Kobe is an epic jerk.  MJ was the biggest jerk of them all. 

In all cases I think that quality comes from being extremely competitive and having high standards for oneself and ones teammates.  I can get behind that.  I like that a lot better than Jeff Green's apparent "I'm down with whatever" persona.  I also like it much better than the "pretty boy / primadona" attitude you see some of the younger, entitled stars putting on -- Kyrie Irving and Blake Griffin come to mind.


As for the allegations against Sullinger, I have to admit I don't think about it much.  Perhaps it should bother me more.  I try to keep some separation between what happens off-court and what happens on it, but sometimes that attitude can get you into trouble.  The off-court stuff is more important than the on-court stuff in the bigger picture, after all. 

In any case, I enjoy watching Sullinger play.  His post game and rebounding are very refreshing after watching this team lack both for most of the KG era.  I also like that he's a guy who has fire and grit on the court -- he kind of reminds me of Perk in that respect -- but he is generally friendly and jovial off the court.

[indeedproceed]

Sullinger might be a tad overrated in this forum.  There aren't enough threads about his trade value.

Sullinger is everyone's feel good player. Much like Ryan Gomes was in 2006-07. People could disagree about Al because of his inconsistency, they picked favorites and not-favorites in the Bassy-Rondo-West bloodbath at the point. Gerald Green had his fans and people who weren't, but everyone loved Gomes, cuz he always played hard, and was a but of an underdog, plus when he didn't have a good game, there was usually someone who had a worse one.

I think it was a lot clearer before the incident with his girlfriend.  I think a lot of folks soured on Sully due to the allegations, and I can't really fault them for that, despite charges being dropped.  DV is a serious issue, and I can understand not giving Sully the benefit of the doubt.

I sort of hate that the best current Celtic is a jerk, and the best young player has a bit of a black cloud.  It was a lot easier back in the days before the internet, where players had more anonymity and you could fool yourself into thinking these guys were actually heroes.

I personally love that Rondo is a bit of a curmudgeon. Like PS said above, he's our crotchety problem child, and his competitive streak is just about unimpeachable (when the games count anyways). Besides, once we get Jabari, we'll have a Captain America to root for again.

[LilRip]

I chose Rondo, mainly coz expectations for him are much higher than everyone else.

Last season or 2, it would've been Green, but I've come to terms that he is who he is: an inconsistent role player who is good enough to start and can blow up on occasion. Bass and Avery, I don't put much energy in because for me, those guys would be gone if DA had his way. As for the rest of the team, other than KO and Sully, I see them simply as salary filler and thus, am emotionally detached from them.

[timobusa]

Brandon Bass!!!!

Brandon Bash

[sofutomygaha]

I'm sure it was implicit in Jeff's response, but "bashing" posters isn't allowed around here.  Civil and constructive disagreements are welcome. 

As for bashing players...  So long as it's on-topic, criticizing players for their play is fine, and should be expected.  There's nothing disloyal about criticizing a Celtic, even if he's a fan-favorite to others.

Where I think things get tedious is when people use any opportunity they can to bash a player, whether or not it's relevant to the topic at hand.

I'm confused, did you leave this thread open as a place to bash players who bash us for bashing them? Have any of you guys ever been bashed by a Celtic? If so, stories please.

[mmmmm]

I sort of hate that the best current Celtic is a jerk

So... you know the guy personally?  In what way has he been a jerk to you?

Wait - which Celtic are we talking about?

Is Parrish still playing?

[Roy H.]

I sort of hate that the best current Celtic is a jerk

So... you know the guy personally?  In what way has he been a jerk to you?

Wait - which Celtic are we talking about?

Is Parrish still playing?

The dude is a jerk.  He's clashed with many of his teammates and coaches, he's a jerk to the media, he throws water bottles through TVs, he skips games that his coach and GM ask him to be at.  Let's call a spade a spade.

He's an excellent player when he's motivated (which is usually in nationally-televised games, particularly the playoffs).  He's the best player on the team.  He's got a very good basketball IQ, and has amazing court vision.  His personality, though, is deficient.   (Ainge calls him  "an emotional, stubborn kid".  To me, that's a kind way of saying "jerk".

[BballTim]

I sort of hate that the best current Celtic is a jerk

So... you know the guy personally?  In what way has he been a jerk to you?

Wait - which Celtic are we talking about?

Is Parrish still playing?

The dude is a jerk.  He's clashed with many of his teammates and coaches, he's a jerk to the media, he throws water bottles through TVs, he skips games that his coach and GM ask him to be at.  Let's call a spade a spade.

He's an excellent player when he's motivated (which is usually in nationally-televised games, particularly the playoffs).  He's the best player on the team.  He's got a very good basketball IQ, and has amazing court vision.  His personality, though, is deficient.   (Ainge calls him  "an emotional, stubborn kid".  To me, that's a kind way of saying "jerk".

   He's got a prickly personality, he plays big in big games and seems to be thought of as a good leader and good teammate by almost everybody not named Ray Allen. He's very competitive and do pretty much anything he can to help his team win. If you keep a laundry list of similar offenses almost any star player commits over the course of their careers he probably seems fairly reasonable.

[Ogaju]

who is Ray Allen?

[mmmmm]

I sort of hate that the best current Celtic is a jerk

So... you know the guy personally?  In what way has he been a jerk to you?

Wait - which Celtic are we talking about?

Is Parrish still playing?

The dude is a jerk.  He's clashed with many of his teammates and coaches, he's a jerk to the media, he throws water bottles through TVs, he skips games that his coach and GM ask him to be at.  Let's call a spade a spade.

He's an excellent player when he's motivated (which is usually in nationally-televised games, particularly the playoffs).  He's the best player on the team.  He's got a very good basketball IQ, and has amazing court vision.  His personality, though, is deficient.   (Ainge calls him  "an emotional, stubborn kid".  To me, that's a kind way of saying "jerk".

So, if I understand you correctly, the answers are:  You don't know him personally and he's never been a jerk to you.

[indeedproceed]

I sort of hate that the best current Celtic is a jerk

So... you know the guy personally?  In what way has he been a jerk to you?

Wait - which Celtic are we talking about?

Is Parrish still playing?

The dude is a jerk.  He's clashed with many of his teammates and coaches, he's a jerk to the media, he throws water bottles through TVs, he skips games that his coach and GM ask him to be at.  Let's call a spade a spade.

He's an excellent player when he's motivated (which is usually in nationally-televised games, particularly the playoffs).  He's the best player on the team.  He's got a very good basketball IQ, and has amazing court vision.  His personality, though, is deficient.   (Ainge calls him  "an emotional, stubborn kid".  To me, that's a kind way of saying "jerk".

So, if I understand you correctly, the answers are:  You don't know him personally and he's never been a jerk to you.

I don't think you understand him correctly. It's pretty much impossible to argue that Rondo is petulant with the media, has clashed with coaches and teammates, and overall isn't the most easy guy to work with, that is unless you are holding the threshold for judgement to only positive stories and personal interaction. Roy wants to call him a jerk based on that, and doesn't really enjoy the schtick. Me personally, I like it. Lots of good players have had grumpy dispositions, and me personally, I enjoy his 'heel' act with the press, and don't read too much into the negative stories. Roy doesn't seem to share that view, and he's entitled to his opinion as much as you or I are. Basically you're saying, 'I don't know him, I can't judge him', and that's okay too, but it is just one viewpoint.

[CelticsWest714]

-Olynyk... he is soft
-Sullinger because I couldnt slide my debit card under his shoes when he jumps
-Green settles for jumpers when we all know he can drive and leap
-Bradley is an undersized defensive minded sg with a midrange jumper as a weapon
-Hump, hard to hate a hustler that gives it his all (the coordinated mark madsen)
-Bass is just bass, plays some and disappears on some
-Rondos still working on his game, still favors his robocop leg
-Phil the Agony.. Undersized pg with speed and some vision, but lacking any scoring ability
-Bayless because he doesnt use wax on his head
-Johnson plays like a pirate with a hook on his right hand.. Hustler though
-Bogans.. Umadbro?

Its a love/hate thing this season, i try not to attatch myself to anyone in particular.. Go Celtics!

[mmmmm]

I sort of hate that the best current Celtic is a jerk

So... you know the guy personally?  In what way has he been a jerk to you?

Wait - which Celtic are we talking about?

Is Parrish still playing?

The dude is a jerk.  He's clashed with many of his teammates and coaches, he's a jerk to the media, he throws water bottles through TVs, he skips games that his coach and GM ask him to be at.  Let's call a spade a spade.

He's an excellent player when he's motivated (which is usually in nationally-televised games, particularly the playoffs).  He's the best player on the team.  He's got a very good basketball IQ, and has amazing court vision.  His personality, though, is deficient.   (Ainge calls him  "an emotional, stubborn kid".  To me, that's a kind way of saying "jerk".

So, if I understand you correctly, the answers are:  You don't know him personally and he's never been a jerk to you.

I don't think you understand him correctly.

The point of my very specific questions were to make sure I understand him correctly.  I'm pretty sure I do now.

Basically you're saying, 'I don't know him, I can't judge him', and that's okay too, but it is just one viewpoint.

Yep.  I never claimed or expect it isn't.

Just like the assertion that he "is" a jerk is really, just one viewpoint.   Stated as if fact, of course.  Because, you know.  Internetz.