Chad Ford: Ainge loved Giannis Antetokoumnpo at draft time

[Dog_Lover106]

Ford:

"The Celtics love Jabari (as do most teams) and we've had him as the No. 1 pick for them. But Embiid fits more of a need and has a bigger upside. Ainge has drafted on upside in the past but last year I know he loved Giannis Antetokoumnpo but didn't pull the trigger on him and instead took the much safer Kelly Olynyk. So maybe Ainge isn't quite the gambler we make him out to be."
Ouch.

Ainge said this himself before the draft on WEEI and Austin Ainge and I believe even Danny scouted there. I recall Danny saying he was raw but the most talented player in the draft. Thought that this was old news.

When the trade to move up happened, I was sure it was Antetokoumnpo, but in all my wisdom was screaming "please Shabazz Muhammed". Did not see Olynyk coming.

Really hate when people spew out stats on Giannis. I wanted Shabazz, so I am clearly no genius, but it is so  easy to see the incredible talent this KID has. We certainly could of done worse, but not really an Olynyk fan for the long term. Giannis is a keeper and not much older than Wiggins.

That he mentioned him on EEI before the draft suggests to me he had no intention of taking him. Why would you talk up a guy publicly that you are hoping will be available at your pick?

Given the information we have now, it appears Danny did like him. I heard the actual interview and he was not "talking him up" as you say.

Someone asked (Ordway or Holley I believe) about sleepers and the quality of the draft in general and Danny said something to the effect, "one of the biggest upside players was Antetokoumnpo" and how talented he was.

Doubt that any of this was some international secret and as it turns out Giannis is exactly as Danny said. Raw, but very talented for such a young player. Talked about how he liked Olynyk too. 

Again, if you put the name "Wiggins" on the back of Giannis's jersey and let him run up and down in the Big 12 for Kansas this year, instead of starting for an NBA team, everyone would be saying likely the same thing about him as they are about Wiggins. Athletic, great upside, potential, raw.

Difference is Wiggins is likely top three in a loaded draft and Giannis goes 15th in a average draft. Time will tell, but to ignore this guy's talent or throw out a bunch of stats on a barely 19 year old playing in the NBA is silly IMO.

I like him in a rebuilding context better than Olynyk.

 

[Dog_Lover106]

Ford:

"The Celtics love Jabari (as do most teams) and we've had him as the No. 1 pick for them. But Embiid fits more of a need and has a bigger upside. Ainge has drafted on upside in the past but last year I know he loved Giannis Antetokoumnpo but didn't pull the trigger on him and instead took the much safer Kelly Olynyk. So maybe Ainge isn't quite the gambler we make him out to be."
Ouch.

Ainge said this himself before the draft on WEEI and Austin Ainge and I believe even Danny scouted there. I recall Danny saying he was raw but the most talented player in the draft. Thought that this was old news.

But no one ever believes anything Ainge says before the draft about players he might draft.

Sadly, I believe anything the GM's say.

Still remember Larry Bird saying that in his opinion,  Paul Pierce was the best player in college basketball around 1996-97. Pitino said he thought Raef Lafrentz was. I hate Pitino, but I guess he delivered Pierce after all.

Was surprised to hear Larry say recently, during the Bill Simmons interview, that he thought Red wanted Brad Daugherty and not Len Bias. First that I had heard of that, now nearly 30 years later.    

Agree with the first two paragraphs, but not the Bias thing.

Len Bias worked as a counselor at Auerbach's summer hoop camps in, I believe D.C..

This from an interesting read on the tragedy that was Lenny Bias:

"Lenny had fallen in love with the idea of being a Celtic," Boston coach K.C. Jones would say later. The champions were no less enamored of Bias. Red Auerbach, at whose camp Bias had worked the previous summer, advised him to stay in school and not enter the NBA draft early; Larry Bird so looked forward to playing with him that he promised to show up at rookie camp if Bias were chosen.

http://si.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1064980/index.htm

Just the opposite, as Larry Bird says in a interview with Simmons. I always thought the same about Bias. According to Bird, Daugherty worked with Red's camp as well and Larry says he thinks Red would of gone with Daugherty with the first pick if he had it. Had to dispute coming from the man himself. Great interview BTW.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vcvRJeIZu4

[Dog_Lover106]

Well, here's an old story from 1986 in the New York Times:

For several weeks, Auerbach had been saying that if the Celtics got the first choice, they would select Brad Daughtery, the 6-11 3/4 North Carolina center, who is projected as a forward. The next choice, the Celtics' president mentioned yesterday, would likely be either William Bedford, the 7-foot Memphis State center, or Chris Washburn, the 6-11 North Carolina State center.

I think it fits with Red's known biases that he would prefer the talented 7-footer.  Even if he loved Bias, I think it would have been a difficult choice for him to pass up Daugherty if the Celtics had the first pick.

Check out the Larry Bird podcast I posted above. Awesome interview. Long, but well worth the time. Larry is the still man! Totally down to earth guy. Very interesting insight into today's NBA.

[twistedrico14]

I think Danny made the right move with KO, he definitely has a chance to be a special player for a long time in this league. Hopefully with the Celtics!

[D.o.s.]

Ford:

"The Celtics love Jabari (as do most teams) and we've had him as the No. 1 pick for them. But Embiid fits more of a need and has a bigger upside. Ainge has drafted on upside in the past but last year I know he loved Giannis Antetokoumnpo but didn't pull the trigger on him and instead took the much safer Kelly Olynyk. So maybe Ainge isn't quite the gambler we make him out to be."
Ouch.

Ainge said this himself before the draft on WEEI and Austin Ainge and I believe even Danny scouted there. I recall Danny saying he was raw but the most talented player in the draft. Thought that this was old news.

When the trade to move up happened, I was sure it was Antetokoumnpo, but in all my wisdom was screaming "please Shabazz Muhammed". Did not see Olynyk coming.

Really hate when people spew out stats on Giannis. I wanted Shabazz, so I am clearly no genius, but it is so  easy to see the incredible talent this KID has. We certainly could of done worse, but not really an Olynyk fan for the long term. Giannis is a keeper and not much older than Wiggins.

That he mentioned him on EEI before the draft suggests to me he had no intention of taking him. Why would you talk up a guy publicly that you are hoping will be available at your pick?

Given the information we have now, it appears Danny did like him. I heard the actual interview and he was not "talking him up" as you say.

Someone asked (Ordway or Holley I believe) about sleepers and the quality of the draft in general and Danny said something to the effect, "one of the biggest upside players was Antetokoumnpo" and how talented he was.

Doubt that any of this was some international secret and as it turns out Giannis is exactly as Danny said. Raw, but very talented for such a young player. Talked about how he liked Olynyk too. 

Again, if you put the name "Wiggins" on the back of Giannis's jersey and let him run up and down in the Big 12 for Kansas this year, instead of starting for an NBA team, everyone would be saying likely the same thing about him as they are about Wiggins. Athletic, great upside, potential, raw.

Difference is Wiggins is likely top three in a loaded draft and Giannis goes 15th in a average draft. Time will tell, but to ignore this guy's talent or throw out a bunch of stats on a barely 19 year old playing in the NBA is silly IMO.

I like him in a rebuilding context better than Olynyk.

I think the issue with Giannis was the quality of the scouting intel on him until about a month before the draft.

[NikoZea]

I read somewhere that this kid lived in pretty bad poverty. Scary to to think how much the nutrition and training in the NBA will help him grow. 

[Dog_Lover106]

Ford:

"The Celtics love Jabari (as do most teams) and we've had him as the No. 1 pick for them. But Embiid fits more of a need and has a bigger upside. Ainge has drafted on upside in the past but last year I know he loved Giannis Antetokoumnpo but didn't pull the trigger on him and instead took the much safer Kelly Olynyk. So maybe Ainge isn't quite the gambler we make him out to be."
Ouch.

Ainge said this himself before the draft on WEEI and Austin Ainge and I believe even Danny scouted there. I recall Danny saying he was raw but the most talented player in the draft. Thought that this was old news.

When the trade to move up happened, I was sure it was Antetokoumnpo, but in all my wisdom was screaming "please Shabazz Muhammed". Did not see Olynyk coming.

Really hate when people spew out stats on Giannis. I wanted Shabazz, so I am clearly no genius, but it is so  easy to see the incredible talent this KID has. We certainly could of done worse, but not really an Olynyk fan for the long term. Giannis is a keeper and not much older than Wiggins.

That he mentioned him on EEI before the draft suggests to me he had no intention of taking him. Why would you talk up a guy publicly that you are hoping will be available at your pick?

Given the information we have now, it appears Danny did like him. I heard the actual interview and he was not "talking him up" as you say.

Someone asked (Ordway or Holley I believe) about sleepers and the quality of the draft in general and Danny said something to the effect, "one of the biggest upside players was Antetokoumnpo" and how talented he was.

Doubt that any of this was some international secret and as it turns out Giannis is exactly as Danny said. Raw, but very talented for such a young player. Talked about how he liked Olynyk too. 

Again, if you put the name "Wiggins" on the back of Giannis's jersey and let him run up and down in the Big 12 for Kansas this year, instead of starting for an NBA team, everyone would be saying likely the same thing about him as they are about Wiggins. Athletic, great upside, potential, raw.

Difference is Wiggins is likely top three in a loaded draft and Giannis goes 15th in a average draft. Time will tell, but to ignore this guy's talent or throw out a bunch of stats on a barely 19 year old playing in the NBA is silly IMO.

I like him in a rebuilding context better than Olynyk.

I think the issue with Giannis was the quality of the scouting intel on him until about a month before the draft.

Actually, Austin Ainge visited Giannis's team in Athens on January 29th, 2013. Danny than went to scout him in Europe on April 6th, 2013.

Hate to be down on Olynyk and I am very happy with his offensive to date. Just seems physically over matched with strength and lateral quickness in the NBA. Hopefully this improves.

Beyond Antetokoumnpo and perhaps Tony Snell there was garbage after pick 15, so we certainly could of done worse. 

[vjcsmoke]

It was either Giannis or Olynyk.  Danny was on record as being very high on Giannis, calling him the next Pippen.  IMO, Ainge went for the size.  And actually we needed additional size pretty badly. 

It's hard to find a skilled 7 footer.  KO doesn't have the personality to become a 'goto guy' imo, but he could settle into a good stretch 4 with great passing ability to move the ball when he's not open.

I think Giannis will be more of an impact player.  But it's hard to turn down the potential upside of a skilled true 7 foot tall big.

Ainge had a tough decision.  I probably would have gone with Giannis because I read all sorts of things about him and I felt his ceiling was really high before the draft.  But KO might be the 'complementary piece' we need down the road and Giannis might end up just being a Gerald Green type - all kinds of upside but never puts it together.

Of course of Giannis makes Ainge look as bad the time the Celtics didn't take Tony Parker well... that would suck big time.

http://www.bloguin.com/crossoverchronicles/2013-articles/march/that-time-tony-parker-was-almost-a-celtic.html

[obnoxiousmime]

It was either Giannis or Olynyk.  Danny was on record as being very high on Giannis, calling him the next Pippen.  IMO, Ainge went for the size.  And actually we needed additional size pretty badly. 

It's hard to find a skilled 7 footer.  KO doesn't have the personality to become a 'goto guy' imo, but he could settle into a good stretch 4 with great passing ability to move the ball when he's not open.

I think Giannis will be more of an impact player.  But it's hard to turn down the potential upside of a skilled true 7 foot tall big.

Ainge had a tough decision.  I probably would have gone with Giannis because I read all sorts of things about him and I felt his ceiling was really high before the draft.  But KO might be the 'complementary piece' we need down the road and Giannis might end up just being a Gerald Green type - all kinds of upside but never puts it together.

Of course of Giannis makes Ainge look as bad the time the Celtics didn't take Tony Parker well... that would suck big time.

http://www.bloguin.com/crossoverchronicles/2013-articles/march/that-time-tony-parker-was-almost-a-celtic.html

Of course Giannis grew another two inches after the draft so he's close to Olynyk in height now (though obviously much lighter).

I don't think we can use Gerald Green as an example of an athletic failure anymore, unless you're just talking his Celtics years. He could always shoot and he's created a nice career for himself. Unfortunately just too immature to put it together while in Boston.

Man, don't bring up Tony Parker, that one still hurts... Why the hell were they still listening to Red at that point? I mean, it's nice to have respect for the guy but he shouldn't be making decisions on draft picks at that point. They were desperate for a PG that year. Even taking the other highest-rated PG on the board Jamaal Tinsley would have at least gotten them a guy with a modestly successful NBA career.

It was almost like they thought, "well we have so many picks this year, why don't we just let Red pick the last one. Poor guy should still feel involved despite his title being honorary."

[Celtics4ever]

Why the hell were they still listening to Red at that point? I mean, it's nice to have respect for the guy but he shouldn't be making decisions on draft picks at that point

They still listened to Red because he was a basketball savant.   Every body get's the draft wrong sometimes though even Red as it is a crapshoot.

[moiso]

Ford:

"The Celtics love Jabari (as do most teams) and we've had him as the No. 1 pick for them. But Embiid fits more of a need and has a bigger upside. Ainge has drafted on upside in the past but last year I know he loved Giannis Antetokoumnpo but didn't pull the trigger on him and instead took the much safer Kelly Olynyk. So maybe Ainge isn't quite the gambler we make him out to be."
Ouch.

Ainge said this himself before the draft on WEEI and Austin Ainge and I believe even Danny scouted there. I recall Danny saying he was raw but the most talented player in the draft. Thought that this was old news.

When the trade to move up happened, I was sure it was Antetokoumnpo, but in all my wisdom was screaming "please Shabazz Muhammed". Did not see Olynyk coming.

Really hate when people spew out stats on Giannis. I wanted Shabazz, so I am clearly no genius, but it is so  easy to see the incredible talent this KID has. We certainly could of done worse, but not really an Olynyk fan for the long term. Giannis is a keeper and not much older than Wiggins.

That he mentioned him on EEI before the draft suggests to me he had no intention of taking him. Why would you talk up a guy publicly that you are hoping will be available at your pick?

Given the information we have now, it appears Danny did like him. I heard the actual interview and he was not "talking him up" as you say.

Someone asked (Ordway or Holley I believe) about sleepers and the quality of the draft in general and Danny said something to the effect, "one of the biggest upside players was Antetokoumnpo" and how talented he was.

Doubt that any of this was some international secret and as it turns out Giannis is exactly as Danny said. Raw, but very talented for such a young player. Talked about how he liked Olynyk too. 

Again, if you put the name "Wiggins" on the back of Giannis's jersey and let him run up and down in the Big 12 for Kansas this year, instead of starting for an NBA team, everyone would be saying likely the same thing about him as they are about Wiggins. Athletic, great upside, potential, raw.

Difference is Wiggins is likely top three in a loaded draft and Giannis goes 15th in a average draft. Time will tell, but to ignore this guy's talent or throw out a bunch of stats on a barely 19 year old playing in the NBA is silly IMO.

I like him in a rebuilding context better than Olynyk.

I think the issue with Giannis was the quality of the scouting intel on him until about a month before the draft.

Actually, Austin Ainge visited Giannis's team in Athens on January 29th, 2013. Danny than went to scout him in Europe on April 6th, 2013.

Hate to be down on Olynyk and I am very happy with his offensive to date. Just seems physically over matched with strength and lateral quickness in the NBA. Hopefully this improves.

Beyond Antetokoumnpo and perhaps Tony Snell there was garbage after pick 15, so we certainly could of done worse.

It's still sometimes difficult to judge players when they are playing a different style of ball against different kinds of players.

Olynyk reminds me a little of Jeff Green in terms of attitude and softness/passiveness at times.  Sometimes it looks like he gets knocked around because he is too nonchalant rather than too weak.  I hope when he gets more confidence he can play a little more aggressively and with a little bit of anger.  He is super skilled but sometimes it looks like he thinks he is still shooting around by himself in his driveway, rather than competing with great athletes.

[Moranis]

Imo reason DA with olynyk

1) need size due to loss of kg
2) we already have jeff green/wallace- no spot for Giannis
3) ko stats were off the charts. Mystery surrounding Giannis
4) 2014 draft = weak in pf/c prospects. But strong in SF

Giannis has been ok. But u cant say much better than ko. Defensive upside def higher

at the time of the draft KG was still on the roster and Wallace was not.

[Mr Green]

It was either Giannis or Olynyk.  Danny was on record as being very high on Giannis, calling him the next Pippen.  IMO, Ainge went for the size.  And actually we needed additional size pretty badly. 

It's hard to find a skilled 7 footer.  KO doesn't have the personality to become a 'goto guy' imo, but he could settle into a good stretch 4 with great passing ability to move the ball when he's not open.

I think Giannis will be more of an impact player.  But it's hard to turn down the potential upside of a skilled true 7 foot tall big.

Ainge had a tough decision.  I probably would have gone with Giannis because I read all sorts of things about him and I felt his ceiling was really high before the draft.  But KO might be the 'complementary piece' we need down the road and Giannis might end up just being a Gerald Green type - all kinds of upside but never puts it together.

Of course of Giannis makes Ainge look as bad the time the Celtics didn't take Tony Parker well... that would suck big time.

http://www.bloguin.com/crossoverchronicles/2013-articles/march/that-time-tony-parker-was-almost-a-celtic.html

Danny took a chance on an athletic foreign 7 footer with low hoops IQ in the 2012 draft. Fab Melo ended up being a waste of time. Danny wasn't going to get burned two years in a row, so he just went for the safer bet in 2013.