Kings are putting together a package for Rondo

[Tr1boy]

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nba-rumors-sacramento-kings-reportedly-trying-trade-rajon-174100584--nba.html

So for rondo and say wallace you get thomas, mclemore, thornton, thompson and 2 firsts?

If this rumor is true, i cant see danny not going through with it. Its a big overpay

[Tr1boy]

http://boston.cbslocal.com/2013/12/17/donny-marshall-rajon-rando-part-of-trade-brewing-between-celtics-kings/

There are denials but not in donny marshalls eyes. Unless he wants to lose his job(Lose his credibility), i dont think he would say/write what he did.
 
Who to believe?

[Jailan34]

http://boston.cbslocal.com/2013/12/17/donny-marshall-rajon-rando-part-of-trade-brewing-between-celtics-kings/

There are denials but not in donny marshalls eyes. Unless he wants to lose his job(Lose his credibility), i dont think he would say/write what he did.
 
Who to believe?

That's a good point, I haven't seen or heard much about Marshall for a while, so is he trying to remain become relevant by throwing this out there. Because by saying its pretty much a "done deal" hes hitching his wagon to the validity of this rumor.

[ScoobyDoo]

I said this earlier in this post and I'll say it again - this deal actually makes a lot of sense for both teams. But I also believed the KG/Pierce to Jersey made sesne from the beginning as well.

Think about it:

Kings:

1. Lots of lottery picks over the years - where has it gotten them?

2. Center / Shooter / Pass first point

3. Get that and fill in the Gaps from there.

4. Rondo's a leader - he's been there - it's exactly what the Kings need.

5. I think Cousins and Rondo being unable to co-exist is way over-rated - especially when Rondo starts making Cousins life about 200% easier in the pick and roll.

They can use mid level and other moves at PF and off guard.

For the Celtics:

1. Have Brad Stevens teams ever been point guard dominant?

2. Sullinger looks really good in the block and Green is a slasher - how effective would a dead eye 3 point shooter be for that mix.

3. If you get Sac's pick this year and you still have your own, you could probably trade up for a Marcus Smart type point if you wanted.

4. Add a solid defensive center...

5. McLemore is 21, came out as a freshman - I'd be hesitant to label him a bust.

6. You can trade Thornton and Thompson in a year or two.

Center (Draft, or someone like Asik) / Faverani / Iverson
Sully / Olynyk (both around 22)
Green
Mclemore (21)
Marcus Smart or Exum (21

The deal really hinges on your evaluation of Mclemore and what you think his ceiling is. If that's an all star off guard and you can get Sac's 1st round pick this year as well - you have to do this trade.

I'm not saying I'd do the trade but I think it has more legs than people are giving it credit for.

   

[kozlodoev]

http://boston.cbslocal.com/2013/12/17/donny-marshall-rajon-rando-part-of-trade-brewing-between-celtics-kings/

There are denials but not in donny marshalls eyes. Unless he wants to lose his job(Lose his credibility), i dont think he would say/write what he did.
 
Who to believe?

That's a good point, I haven't seen or heard much about Marshall for a while, so is he trying to remain become relevant by throwing this out there. Because by saying its pretty much a "done deal" hes hitching his wagon to the validity of this rumor.

"There's a huge deal in the mix"... what does that even mean?! "It's a done deal... at some point"... He's worse than a fortune-teller, they at least know how to make it sound more intriguing.

I'll believe the deli guy before I believe Donny Marshall. I don't think he has any reliable sources within the organization, and his fascination with form over substance has always been his doom as a basketball analyst.

[Jailan34]

http://boston.cbslocal.com/2013/12/17/donny-marshall-rajon-rando-part-of-trade-brewing-between-celtics-kings/

There are denials but not in donny marshalls eyes. Unless he wants to lose his job(Lose his credibility), i dont think he would say/write what he did.
 
Who to believe?

That's a good point, I haven't seen or heard much about Marshall for a while, so is he trying to remain become relevant by throwing this out there. Because by saying its pretty much a "done deal" hes hitching his wagon to the validity of this rumor.

"There's a huge deal in the mix"... what does that even mean?! "It's a done deal... at some point"... He's worse than a fortune-teller, they at least know how to make it sound more intriguing.

I'll believe the deli guy before I believe Donny Marshall. I don't think he has any reliable sources within the organization, and his fascination with form over substance has always been his doom as a basketball analyst.

Too bad too, because that's a haul for the celtics

[nickagneta]

I'll believe Rondo is being traded when I hear it from the mouth of Danny Ainge or Brad Stevens. Donny Marshal and the Latino Post hold no credibility in my eyes when it comes to Rondo rumors.

And I seriously doubt Rondo would be traded just as a way of accumulating more draft picks and dumping Wallace's contract because that is what it amounts to. There comes a point when you could have too many picks and be too young. When everyone knows you have to trade those picks because you can't have 13 of your 15 players be 1st round draft picks all drafted in a three year period, they will tend to bring in players that are a lot less valuable.

[kozlodoev]

http://boston.cbslocal.com/2013/12/17/donny-marshall-rajon-rando-part-of-trade-brewing-between-celtics-kings/

There are denials but not in donny marshalls eyes. Unless he wants to lose his job(Lose his credibility), i dont think he would say/write what he did.
 
Who to believe?

That's a good point, I haven't seen or heard much about Marshall for a while, so is he trying to remain become relevant by throwing this out there. Because by saying its pretty much a "done deal" hes hitching his wagon to the validity of this rumor.

"There's a huge deal in the mix"... what does that even mean?! "It's a done deal... at some point"... He's worse than a fortune-teller, they at least know how to make it sound more intriguing.

I'll believe the deli guy before I believe Donny Marshall. I don't think he has any reliable sources within the organization, and his fascination with form over substance has always been his doom as a basketball analyst.

Too bad too, because that's a haul for the celtics

Judging by how the Kings are hauling it, it's not that big of a haul. A 5'9 PG, an erratic malcontent, and Ben McLemore. For Rondo?! Color me unimpressed.

[Eddie20]

http://boston.cbslocal.com/2013/12/17/donny-marshall-rajon-rando-part-of-trade-brewing-between-celtics-kings/

There are denials but not in donny marshalls eyes. Unless he wants to lose his job(Lose his credibility), i dont think he would say/write what he did.
 
Who to believe?

That's a good point, I haven't seen or heard much about Marshall for a while, so is he trying to remain become relevant by throwing this out there. Because by saying its pretty much a "done deal" hes hitching his wagon to the validity of this rumor.

"There's a huge deal in the mix"... what does that even mean?! "It's a done deal... at some point"... He's worse than a fortune-teller, they at least know how to make it sound more intriguing.

I'll believe the deli guy before I believe Donny Marshall. I don't think he has any reliable sources within the organization, and his fascination with form over substance has always been his doom as a basketball analyst.

Too bad too, because that's a haul for the celtics

Judging by how the Kings are hauling it, it's not that big of a haul. A 5'9 PG, an erratic malcontent, and Ben McLemore. For Rondo?! Color me unimpressed.

You forgot two important things. The picks (2 1st rd picks according to reports) and the dumping of the Wallace deal.

You mentioned Thomas' height, but is he getting the job done? Worst case scenario he's a JJ Barea type off the bench. McLemore is VERY talented. Still only 20. He has a ton of upside.

[Jailan34]

http://boston.cbslocal.com/2013/12/17/donny-marshall-rajon-rando-part-of-trade-brewing-between-celtics-kings/

There are denials but not in donny marshalls eyes. Unless he wants to lose his job(Lose his credibility), i dont think he would say/write what he did.
 
Who to believe?

That's a good point, I haven't seen or heard much about Marshall for a while, so is he trying to remain become relevant by throwing this out there. Because by saying its pretty much a "done deal" hes hitching his wagon to the validity of this rumor.

"There's a huge deal in the mix"... what does that even mean?! "It's a done deal... at some point"... He's worse than a fortune-teller, they at least know how to make it sound more intriguing.

I'll believe the deli guy before I believe Donny Marshall. I don't think he has any reliable sources within the organization, and his fascination with form over substance has always been his doom as a basketball analyst.

Too bad too, because that's a haul for the celtics

Judging by how the Kings are hauling it, it's not that big of a haul. A 5'9 PG, an erratic malcontent, and Ben McLemore. For Rondo?! Color me unimpressed.

I'm not sure how the picks work out but Thomas is having a great year and Ben McLemore has shown some nice flashes. He also serves as a great backup for when Avery leaves/traded. Although I don't do the deal without the picks.

I don't like giving up Rondo, and I have no knowledge of his contract demands for the future, but if he wants over 14 mil per year for 5 I'd trade him immediately.

If Ainge does a deal similar to this I'd have to assume its because he doesn't believe he can re-sign Rondo for a reasonable price. Which is too bad, hes currently my second favorite player.

[Jailan34]

http://boston.cbslocal.com/2013/12/17/donny-marshall-rajon-rando-part-of-trade-brewing-between-celtics-kings/

There are denials but not in donny marshalls eyes. Unless he wants to lose his job(Lose his credibility), i dont think he would say/write what he did.
 
Who to believe?

That's a good point, I haven't seen or heard much about Marshall for a while, so is he trying to remain become relevant by throwing this out there. Because by saying its pretty much a "done deal" hes hitching his wagon to the validity of this rumor.

"There's a huge deal in the mix"... what does that even mean?! "It's a done deal... at some point"... He's worse than a fortune-teller, they at least know how to make it sound more intriguing.

I'll believe the deli guy before I believe Donny Marshall. I don't think he has any reliable sources within the organization, and his fascination with form over substance has always been his doom as a basketball analyst.

Too bad too, because that's a haul for the celtics

Judging by how the Kings are hauling it, it's not that big of a haul. A 5'9 PG, an erratic malcontent, and Ben McLemore. For Rondo?! Color me unimpressed.

You forgot two important things. The picks (2 1st rd picks according to reports) and the dumping of the Wallace deal.

You mentioned Thomas' height, but is he getting the job done? Worst case scenario he's a JJ Barea type off the bench. McLemore is VERY talented. Still only 20. He has a ton of upside.

Agree on Thomas' height. People are so quick to defend an undersized AB as a starting SG on a champ team, but then put down Thomas( or shorter players like him) for his height.

[tstorey_97]

My guess is Rondo would not be dealt until he is playing again.

That, should Ainge be planning to move Rondo, he would package him for a top big not guards and picks as he already has seven guards and 9 picks.

The specifics of this deal seem plausible, in that I assume a media doood didn't just eff around with the "trade machine" after deciding the kings are "one Rondo away" from contention. My guess is smoke suggests fire, but, can't Ainge not only do better...doesn't he have to do better?

Ainge has a relatively crowded back court already, but, does he?

Crawford has this year.
Bradley is asking for a chunk of cap space.
Pressey is only a threat to back up now.
Lee is under contract.
Bogans and Brooks have combined for 80 minutes this year.

This creates the Jordan Crawford/Thomas era? Bombs away...I guess.

The rest of the guys are "guys" defeating trade a "star for a star" theory. It would certainly beef up the Celtic's raft of "complementary" players...looking for a star to compliment? "Good play, Mr. Star!"

Finally, draft picks. Ainge already has enough draft picks to start a fantasy league, two more? What if we go into the 2016 season with three guys under contract and nine draft picks? I always assumed the object in professional sports was to win games not just acquire future assets.

[kozlodoev]

Agree on Thomas' height. People are so quick to defend an undersized AB as a starting SG on a champ team, but then put down Thomas( or shorter players like him) for his height.

There's a reason between a 6'3 guard who can be matched at either G spot defensively, and a 5'9 basketball player. Bradley is likely to be outsized by 2 inches on average, even if he guards SG all the time. Thomas will be outsized by 3 inches on a good day.

Is he getting the job done? I've got no idea. The Kings are a horrible offensive and worse defensive team, and Thomas and McLemore are perhaps 40% of that effort. I'm not trading Rondo for that and a couple of picks down the road.

We have enough picks, and the chance that even a top pick will yield a player better than Rondo is not great (yes, I do realize Rondo's not perfect, is injured, and is perhaps patently unfit to be the centerpiece of a championship team).

[Eddie20]

Agree on Thomas' height. People are so quick to defend an undersized AB as a starting SG on a champ team, but then put down Thomas( or shorter players like him) for his height.

There's a reason between a 6'3 guard who can be matched at either G spot defensively, and a 5'9 basketball player. Bradley is likely to be outsized by 2 inches on average, even if he guards SG all the time. Thomas will be outsized by 3 inches on a good day.

Is he getting the job done? I've got no idea. The Kings are a horrible offensive and worse defensive team, and Thomas and McLemore are perhaps 40% of that effort. I'm not trading Rondo for that and a couple of picks down the road.

We have enough picks, and the chance that even a top pick will yield a player better than Rondo is not great (yes, I do realize Rondo's not perfect, is injured, and is perhaps patently unfit to be the centerpiece of a championship team).

If another team is going to alter their offense just to post up Thomas then be my guest. Conversely, often times these shorter players have grown so accustomed to getting posted throughout their life that they are actually much better post defenders then you would expect. I would be curious to statistically know Thomas' ability to defend the post if anyone has access to it via Synergy.

We can never have enough picks. These picks are chips and you never have enough of them. So don't think of them as Pick A = Draft pick A, but more along the lines of Pick A = Player A. For example, the Pelicans were able to acquire Holiday because of draft picks. We acquired Allen, which led to KG accepting a deal to Boston, because we had the # 5 pick. I don't expect Ainge to use and draft every pick we have, but rather use some of them in later trades to solidify our roster. Potentially having 11 1st rd picks in the next 5 years is a blessing not a curse.


Edit:

I found this which talks about Thomas' D...

Despite his short stature, Thomas is able to stay in front of his man thanks to his low center of gravity and quickness. He's also very strong for his size. According to MySynergySports, Thomas does very well in two specific areas of defense: Isolation and Post-up. In Isolation, he allowed just 0.7 points per possession and 33.3% shooting. His post-up numbers are even more impressive, given that he's a player that seemingly should be taken advantage of in the post. Yet he allows just 0.69 points per possession and 34.8% shooting on Post-Ups.

[vjcsmoke]

I think this deal centers on what you think Mclemore's upside is as a player.  If you think he could be a star SG, and that Thomas would be a good backup point, and the 1sts project to be in the lottery, well that's not bad but not great.

Thornton and Thompson are throw-ins to make the salaries fit for Wallace.

Honestly I'd probably do the trade if it went Cousins + Mclemore + the Kings 2014 1st (unprotected).  But I doubt they will give up Cousins.

Then I'd go about trading Bradly/Lee/Crawford and trying to land a real PG.