If you controlled 10 Trillion dollars

[D.o.s.]

 Interesting D O S, could you eloborate on this point here,   

  "Enable each country to establish a citizen's income"

I could, but I think I'd rather let Bertrand Russell do it:

the plan we are advocating amounts essentially to this: that a certain small income, sufficient for necessaries, should be secured to all, whether they work or not, and that a larger income – as much larger as might be warranted by the total amount of commodities produced – should be given to those who are willing to engage in some work which the community recognizes as useful…When education is finished, no one should be compelled to work, and those who choose not to work should receive a bare livelihood and be left completely free.”

sadly I knew several girls growing up that thought Welfare was for just that purpose and couldn't wait to collect.  Even planned to get knocked up so that they'd boost their income   

Right, and that's a misuse of a social safety net, which is kind of a different point of a basic income--which should be an unconditional amount appropriated for basic level of living necessities (food, shelter, etc)... You could go a long way towards making that happen with a portion of 10 trillion dollars.

Don't want to hijack the thread, but, what happens if everyone thought this way, and decided to "collect"?  Where's the money come from, the magic money tree?  For that matter, who'd need money anyways, nobody would be doing anything.  Better be able to hunt your own food and build your own shelter.

I'm game to discuss it if you are, although since you brought up the "magic money tree" it should be pointed out that this is a thread about controlling 10 Trillion dollars.


I think you underestimate the power of commodity fetishization. There's nothing stopping you from working to afford those courtside Celtic's tickets, Corvette/Jag/Auto of choice... there's simply an amount allocated to each citizen regardless of whether they work or not--so you get the "basic necessity" income on top of whatever you do for money.


There have actually been a couple real, actual studies done on the idea that've shown that the "disincentive to work" criticism could be pretty groundless as far as this particular idea is concerned, but we're just talking in big picture ideas in a big picture ideas thread.

I'd be willing to discuss, but if you truly feel it is acceptable to give people who CHOOSE not to work and contribute absolutely nothing to society a cut of my hard earned money, well, there really isn't anything to discuss.

I've never shied away from helping those that truly cannot help themselves, but helping the disinterested is beyond the pale.

To me the bolded is an association that follows some biases that, while not necessarily wrong or incorrect, tend to occlude what the idea actually proposes and what some people tend to think of when the idea is suggested.

But, uh, maybe we should take it to PM's to avoid cluttering the thread for everyone else?

[D.o.s.]

For anyone who's interested in the idea of a basic income, there was a great article from Business Insider about it today:

http://www.slate.com/blogs/business_insider/2013/11/17/american_basic_income_an_end_to_poverty.html

(the slate link is where I saw it republished).

[SHAQATTACK]

First thing I d do,  is pay off all those sorry ex Net contracts for the Celtics .  Payoff  the players that suck to just leave ....clear bench .....hire al new players

[slamtheking]

On a personal level, I'd buy all the tickets for all the Laker home games for a season, especially Jack Nicholson's seats.  I'd let them play in a completely empty arena every home game.  I also use the tickets for toilet paper and then deliver them to Jack with a note saying "I know you miss your crappy Lakers so here's something that'll take their place"

Why don't you just buy the Staples Center and make them play in the newly re-dubbed Clippers Center?

while that is a thought, I think it'd be more demoralizing if their own arena was completely empty.  I think piping in the sound of crickets chirping would be a nice touch as well as some booing and derogatory jeers played over the PA every time the Lakers score.

[LooseCannon]

On a personal level, I'd buy all the tickets for all the Laker home games for a season, especially Jack Nicholson's seats.  I'd let them play in a completely empty arena every home game.  I also use the tickets for toilet paper and then deliver them to Jack with a note saying "I know you miss your crappy Lakers so here's something that'll take their place"

Why don't you just buy the Staples Center and make them play in the newly re-dubbed Clippers Center?

while that is a thought, I think it'd be more demoralizing if their own arena was completely empty.  I think piping in the sound of crickets chirping would be a nice touch as well as some booing and derogatory jeers played over the PA every time the Lakers score.

Well, it's not like you'd have the money to do both....

[Eja117]

For anyone who's interested in the idea of a basic income, there was a great article from Business Insider about it today:

http://www.slate.com/blogs/business_insider/2013/11/17/american_basic_income_an_end_to_poverty.html

(the slate link is where I saw it republished).

Do that and see what happens instantly to the price of a gallon of milk

[Redz]

Find 9,000 of my favorite philanthropic cause and give them each a million dollars.  Keep the other trillion.  Bequeath the rest to my family and a few other favored ideas that could operate in perpetuity after my death.

Let's see. 9,000 x 1,000,000 is 9,000,000,000, which i think is 9 billion. So if you are keeping 1,000,000,000,000 then you still have 8,991,000,000,000 left to do stuff with.

Sweet!  Too many zeroes 

[D.o.s.]

For anyone who's interested in the idea of a basic income, there was a great article from Business Insider about it today:

http://www.slate.com/blogs/business_insider/2013/11/17/american_basic_income_an_end_to_poverty.html

(the slate link is where I saw it republished).

Do that and see what happens instantly to the price of a gallon of milk

That's the only issue that I can see arising where the solution isn't readily apparent--the same way our current VP helped promote a $10,000 raise in student aide to attend college, and the colleges responded by raising tuition.

Then again, I'm not an economist, and this is a thread about hypothetically controlling 10 trillion dollars...

So I'd buy all of the cows and keep milk prices low, too.

[slamtheking]

On a personal level, I'd buy all the tickets for all the Laker home games for a season, especially Jack Nicholson's seats.  I'd let them play in a completely empty arena every home game.  I also use the tickets for toilet paper and then deliver them to Jack with a note saying "I know you miss your crappy Lakers so here's something that'll take their place"

Why don't you just buy the Staples Center and make them play in the newly re-dubbed Clippers Center?

while that is a thought, I think it'd be more demoralizing if their own arena was completely empty.  I think piping in the sound of crickets chirping would be a nice touch as well as some booing and derogatory jeers played over the PA every time the Lakers score.

Well, it's not like you'd have the money to do both....

well that IS true.  guess I could have my cake and eat it too 

[DesertDweller]

I would invest 5 trillion in Gold, the only thing that will ever be worth anything in the end and I would use the rest to buy a huge preserve to free all animals from the shelters and with the money I had invested in Gold I would seek out people that really deserved a helping hand.

yeah, I think I could live with that!!!

[Celtics18]

For anyone who's interested in the idea of a basic income, there was a great article from Business Insider about it today:

http://www.slate.com/blogs/business_insider/2013/11/17/american_basic_income_an_end_to_poverty.html

(the slate link is where I saw it republished).

Do that and see what happens instantly to the price of a gallon of milk

What would happen to the price of a gallon of milk?  And why?

[TitleMaster]

Do that and see what happens instantly to the price of a gallon of milk

What would happen to the price of a gallon of milk?  And why?

I think that the price of the basic food stuffs has already been affected by the number of ppl on food stamps, now over 43 million, as well as govt subsidies on biofuels.

[Eja117]

For anyone who's interested in the idea of a basic income, there was a great article from Business Insider about it today:

http://www.slate.com/blogs/business_insider/2013/11/17/american_basic_income_an_end_to_poverty.html

(the slate link is where I saw it republished).

Do that and see what happens instantly to the price of a gallon of milk

What would happen to the price of a gallon of milk?  And why?

Giving out a truck load of cash causes inflation. If you force everyone above the poverty line market forces will raise the line. The government has no ability whatsoever at this point in time to stop borrowing money. No way on Earth a thing like this would be paid for. This is essentially trying to print money. You'll see inflation before it even goes into effect, and then we will have a larger government for nothing. There are no easy tricks to keep poor people from being poor. Not communism. Not printing money. Not this.  When you read things that say "Everyone would be above the poverty line"...well there you go. It's like MA Senator Warren trying to get us to believe that if McDs and other restaurants just raise their prices by 4 cents a meal they could pay all their employees $15/hr.....by raising prices .000001% you can raise wages 40%.  It would be nice, but in the real world....

[Kiorrik]

What would happen if you'd use that money to pay off national debts? Or is that a drop on a hotplate?

[Celtics18]

For anyone who's interested in the idea of a basic income, there was a great article from Business Insider about it today:

http://www.slate.com/blogs/business_insider/2013/11/17/american_basic_income_an_end_to_poverty.html

(the slate link is where I saw it republished).

Do that and see what happens instantly to the price of a gallon of milk

What would happen to the price of a gallon of milk?  And why?

Giving out a truck load of cash causes inflation. If you force everyone above the poverty line market forces will raise the line. The government has no ability whatsoever at this point in time to stop borrowing money. No way on Earth a thing like this would be paid for. This is essentially trying to print money. You'll see inflation before it even goes into effect, and then we will have a larger government for nothing. There are no easy tricks to keep poor people from being poor. Not communism. Not printing money. Not this.  When you read things that say "Everyone would be above the poverty line"...well there you go. It's like MA Senator Warren trying to get us to believe that if McDs and other restaurants just raise their prices by 4 cents a meal they could pay all their employees $15/hr.....by raising prices .000001% you can raise wages 40%.  It would be nice, but in the real world....

I'm no economist, but you are going to have to explain the bolded part a little better to get me to believe that this is a fact.  Don't we already have some regulations on inflation?  You'd have to regulate how much businesses could raise their prices.  The way I see it, the government giving everybody a "citizen check" would in and of it self help businesses make more money.  There would be no need for prices to go up . . . other than pure greed, I guess. 

I have no problem with pure, unadulterated greed being regulated against.

As to McDonalds, of course they could afford to pay everyone $15/hr. and they wouldn't even have to raise the price of hamburgers.