Chad Ford has Celtics taking Jabari Parker at #5

[Celtics18]

Rondo's also going to miss games, so while he's the best player of the lot, he won't be the best player on the floor.

I'm going under the (admittedly optimistic) assumption that he's not going to miss more than twenty games at most. 

If he misses close to half the season or more, then I definitely think the top half of the lottery will be a more likely story.

I think Rondo will be rested until he is 110% fit.
I doubt they will take any chances on him.
Top 8 pick here we come 

I think he'll be at a 110% by the first of December.

8th seed, here come!!

Possibly. If we're missing Rondo for 20 games, we're probably looking at something like 5-15.

Even if a bunch of teams hadn't become better in the off season to vie for those last three playoff spots (and they have), that might be too much of a hole for one guy to dig us out of.


Also, I'd like Jabari Parker if only for the fact that he didn't decide to superteam it up in Kentucky.

I think there'll be some stiff competition for those last three playoff spots between us, Detroit, Cleveland, Washington, Toronto, and Atlanta.

All I'm saying is that I think we could well be in the mix, and I'm taking the seemingly minority opinion of rooting for our team to maximize their potential on the court next season, and, hopefully, make a run at the playoffs.   

I know it's a more popular opinion to want to see the team just bag it and shoot for lottery balls.  It seems somewhat ironic to me that rooting for the team to win games feels like taking the subversive stance.

I think that the Wizards swung and MISSED with Otto Porter.  His summer league numbers were TERRIBLE!!!!!   Are you serious about Toronto?  Come on buddy.  We SHOULD be better than the Raptors!!  The Cavs should be improved, but there are a LOT of NEW pieces that will have to gel for them to greatly improve.  They also have a few redundant pieces.  I have already given my opinion of Josh and Brandon's b-ball IQ's.  Once again, a LOT of NEW pieces that have to gel for the Pistons.  I am NOT saying that we do NOT have a LOT of new pieces, but I like our coach over all the others mentioned in that group!!

Smitty77

Unfortunately, I agree about Porter.  I'm hoping that he can eventually turn into a solid pro, but I don't think he'll be a major factor in his rookie season. 

I do think Toronto has some talent with a starting lineup of Lowry, DeRozan, Gay, Amir Johnson, and Valanciunas.  Solid, but they don't exactly blow you away as an elite level team. 

The biggest question mark in Cleveland is obviously Bynum.  I wouldn't count on him to be healthy and motivated if I were a Cavs fan. 

The Pistons look the most improved on paper with Monroe and Drummond a year older and the additions of Smith and Jennings.  I'm not in love with Jennings either, but I do think he's an improvement over the Pistons' previous Brandon.

We'll see.  In the end, I'm saying that I do think we are a playoff team.  I just don't think we are a shoo-in.

[bleedGREENdon]

Rondo's also going to miss games, so while he's the best player of the lot, he won't be the best player on the floor.

I'm going under the (admittedly optimistic) assumption that he's not going to miss more than twenty games at most. 

If he misses close to half the season or more, then I definitely think the top half of the lottery will be a more likely story.

I think Rondo will be rested until he is 110% fit.
I doubt they will take any chances on him.
Top 8 pick here we come 

I think he'll be at a 110% by the first of December.

8th seed, here come!!

Possibly. If we're missing Rondo for 20 games, we're probably looking at something like 5-15.

Even if a bunch of teams hadn't become better in the off season to vie for those last three playoff spots (and they have), that might be too much of a hole for one guy to dig us out of.


Also, I'd like Jabari Parker if only for the fact that he didn't decide to superteam it up in Kentucky.

I think there'll be some stiff competition for those last three playoff spots between us, Detroit, Cleveland, Washington, Toronto, and Atlanta.

All I'm saying is that I think we could well be in the mix, and I'm taking the seemingly minority opinion of rooting for our team to maximize their potential on the court next season, and, hopefully, make a run at the playoffs.   

I know it's a more popular opinion to want to see the team just bag it and shoot for lottery balls.  It seems somewhat ironic to me that rooting for the team to win games feels like taking the subversive stance.

I think that the Wizards swung and MISSED with Otto Porter.  His summer league numbers were TERRIBLE!!!!!   Are you serious about Toronto?  Come on buddy.  We SHOULD be better than the Raptors!!  The Cavs should be improved, but there are a LOT of NEW pieces that will have to gel for them to greatly improve.  They also have a few redundant pieces.  I have already given my opinion of Josh and Brandon's b-ball IQ's.  Once again, a LOT of NEW pieces that have to gel for the Pistons.  I am NOT saying that we do NOT have a LOT of new pieces, but I like our coach over all the others mentioned in that group!!

Smitty77

Unfortunately, I agree about Porter.  I'm hoping that he can eventually turn into a solid pro, but I don't think he'll be a major factor in his rookie season. 

I do think Toronto has some talent with a starting lineup of Lowry, DeRozan, Gay, Amir Johnson, and Valanciunas.  Solid, but they don't exactly blow you away as an elite level team. 

The biggest question mark in Cleveland is obviously Bynum.  I wouldn't count on him to be healthy and motivated if I were a Cavs fan. 

The Pistons look the most improved on paper with Monroe and Drummond a year older and the additions of Smith and Jennings.  I'm not in love with Jennings either, but I do think he's an improvement over the Pistons' previous Brandon.

We'll see.  In the end, I'm saying that I do think we are a playoff team.  I just don't think we are a shoo-in.

Those 5 teams mentioned have a better point gaurd then us. Rondo will be out till december. Quote me. Not only that those teams also all have better centers and shooters. I love our cs, but WHY WOULD ANYONE WANT TO MAKE THE POSTSEASON AND BE SWEPT FIRST ROUND. This all anti tank stuff is ridiculous, Theres no way even with a Healthy rondo, Jeff green becomes a 30 ppg scorer and kelly becomes dirk.. we still would not beat the heat first round, nor the pacers, nor the bulls with a healthy drose. I forgot another team, THE NETS. Our bigmen are terrible defensively. Rondo will miss 20 games or so. AB has shown he is not a point gaurd. Dont expect pressey to be a 10 assist pg man his rookie year without having atleast 7 turnovers a game.

If your not rooting for this team to tank you have problems. Im going to love to watch this team this year dont get me wrong. We will be in every game once rondo comes back. Well probably beat a good team or so down the stretch, but im just saying, Those 5 teams mentioned above, will be better then us the first 30 games of the season WITHOUT A DOUBT.

[Smitty77]

Rondo's also going to miss games, so while he's the best player of the lot, he won't be the best player on the floor.

I'm going under the (admittedly optimistic) assumption that he's not going to miss more than twenty games at most. 

If he misses close to half the season or more, then I definitely think the top half of the lottery will be a more likely story.

I think Rondo will be rested until he is 110% fit.
I doubt they will take any chances on him.
Top 8 pick here we come 

I think he'll be at a 110% by the first of December.

8th seed, here come!!

Possibly. If we're missing Rondo for 20 games, we're probably looking at something like 5-15.

Even if a bunch of teams hadn't become better in the off season to vie for those last three playoff spots (and they have), that might be too much of a hole for one guy to dig us out of.


Also, I'd like Jabari Parker if only for the fact that he didn't decide to superteam it up in Kentucky.

I think there'll be some stiff competition for those last three playoff spots between us, Detroit, Cleveland, Washington, Toronto, and Atlanta.

All I'm saying is that I think we could well be in the mix, and I'm taking the seemingly minority opinion of rooting for our team to maximize their potential on the court next season, and, hopefully, make a run at the playoffs.   

I know it's a more popular opinion to want to see the team just bag it and shoot for lottery balls.  It seems somewhat ironic to me that rooting for the team to win games feels like taking the subversive stance.

I think that the Wizards swung and MISSED with Otto Porter.  His summer league numbers were TERRIBLE!!!!!   Are you serious about Toronto?  Come on buddy.  We SHOULD be better than the Raptors!!  The Cavs should be improved, but there are a LOT of NEW pieces that will have to gel for them to greatly improve.  They also have a few redundant pieces.  I have already given my opinion of Josh and Brandon's b-ball IQ's.  Once again, a LOT of NEW pieces that have to gel for the Pistons.  I am NOT saying that we do NOT have a LOT of new pieces, but I like our coach over all the others mentioned in that group!!

Smitty77

Unfortunately, I agree about Porter.  I'm hoping that he can eventually turn into a solid pro, but I don't think he'll be a major factor in his rookie season. 

I do think Toronto has some talent with a starting lineup of Lowry, DeRozan, Gay, Amir Johnson, and Valanciunas.  Solid, but they don't exactly blow you away as an elite level team. 

The biggest question mark in Cleveland is obviously Bynum.  I wouldn't count on him to be healthy and motivated if I were a Cavs fan. 

The Pistons look the most improved on paper with Monroe and Drummond a year older and the additions of Smith and Jennings.  I'm not in love with Jennings either, but I do think he's an improvement over the Pistons' previous Brandon.

We'll see.  In the end, I'm saying that I do think we are a playoff team.  I just don't think we are a shoo-in.

Those 5 teams mentioned have a better point gaurd then us. Rondo will be out till december. Quote me. Not only that those teams also all have better centers and shooters. I love our cs, but WHY WOULD ANYONE WANT TO MAKE THE POSTSEASON AND BE SWEPT FIRST ROUND. This all anti tank stuff is ridiculous, Theres no way even with a Healthy rondo, Jeff green becomes a 30 ppg scorer and kelly becomes dirk.. we still would not beat the heat first round, nor the pacers, nor the bulls with a healthy drose. I forgot another team, THE NETS. Our bigmen are terrible defensively. Rondo will miss 20 games or so. AB has shown he is not a point gaurd. Dont expect pressey to be a 10 assist pg man his rookie year without having atleast 7 turnovers a game.

If your not rooting for this team to tank you have problems. Im going to love to watch this team this year dont get me wrong. We will be in every game once rondo comes back. Well probably beat a good team or so down the stretch, but im just saying, Those 5 teams mentioned above, will be better then us the first 30 games of the season WITHOUT A DOUBT.

You are really underestimating OUR advantages or simply not taking them into account at ALL!!!!!  Our swing men are BETTER and MORE ATHLETIC than just about all (and I would argue all) the five teams mentioned!!  I will put Jeff Green and Gerald Wallace up against anyone they have.  I think you and MANY OTHERS are greatly underestimating how good Gerald very well could be for us next year.  You are also underestimating Brad Stevens.  He WAS the MOST BRILLIANT young college coach in the last 20 years, hands down.  Sure the transition to the pros will be challenging, but I firmly believe that he is young enough to adjust and adapt better than say Rick Pitino did!!!!  I very well could be wrong, but I got to see Gerald play in person quite a bit in Charlotte and he is a well above average defender.  That is NOT debatable!!!  If we become a running team, he can score on the fly.  No, he does NOT have a great outside game that is needed in half court b-ball, BUT I don't see us NOT running this year.

Smitty77

[D.o.s.]

Rondo's also going to miss games, so while he's the best player of the lot, he won't be the best player on the floor.

I'm going under the (admittedly optimistic) assumption that he's not going to miss more than twenty games at most. 

If he misses close to half the season or more, then I definitely think the top half of the lottery will be a more likely story.

I think Rondo will be rested until he is 110% fit.
I doubt they will take any chances on him.
Top 8 pick here we come 

I think he'll be at a 110% by the first of December.

8th seed, here come!!

Possibly. If we're missing Rondo for 20 games, we're probably looking at something like 5-15.

Even if a bunch of teams hadn't become better in the off season to vie for those last three playoff spots (and they have), that might be too much of a hole for one guy to dig us out of.


Also, I'd like Jabari Parker if only for the fact that he didn't decide to superteam it up in Kentucky.

I think there'll be some stiff competition for those last three playoff spots between us, Detroit, Cleveland, Washington, Toronto, and Atlanta.

All I'm saying is that I think we could well be in the mix, and I'm taking the seemingly minority opinion of rooting for our team to maximize their potential on the court next season, and, hopefully, make a run at the playoffs.   

I know it's a more popular opinion to want to see the team just bag it and shoot for lottery balls.  It seems somewhat ironic to me that rooting for the team to win games feels like taking the subversive stance.

I think that the Wizards swung and MISSED with Otto Porter.  His summer league numbers were TERRIBLE!!!!!   Are you serious about Toronto?  Come on buddy.  We SHOULD be better than the Raptors!!  The Cavs should be improved, but there are a LOT of NEW pieces that will have to gel for them to greatly improve.  They also have a few redundant pieces.  I have already given my opinion of Josh and Brandon's b-ball IQ's.  Once again, a LOT of NEW pieces that have to gel for the Pistons.  I am NOT saying that we do NOT have a LOT of new pieces, but I like our coach over all the others mentioned in that group!!

Smitty77

Unfortunately, I agree about Porter.  I'm hoping that he can eventually turn into a solid pro, but I don't think he'll be a major factor in his rookie season. 

I do think Toronto has some talent with a starting lineup of Lowry, DeRozan, Gay, Amir Johnson, and Valanciunas.  Solid, but they don't exactly blow you away as an elite level team. 

The biggest question mark in Cleveland is obviously Bynum.  I wouldn't count on him to be healthy and motivated if I were a Cavs fan. 

The Pistons look the most improved on paper with Monroe and Drummond a year older and the additions of Smith and Jennings.  I'm not in love with Jennings either, but I do think he's an improvement over the Pistons' previous Brandon.

We'll see.  In the end, I'm saying that I do think we are a playoff team.  I just don't think we are a shoo-in.

Those 5 teams mentioned have a better point gaurd then us. Rondo will be out till december. Quote me. Not only that those teams also all have better centers and shooters. I love our cs, but WHY WOULD ANYONE WANT TO MAKE THE POSTSEASON AND BE SWEPT FIRST ROUND. This all anti tank stuff is ridiculous, Theres no way even with a Healthy rondo, Jeff green becomes a 30 ppg scorer and kelly becomes dirk.. we still would not beat the heat first round, nor the pacers, nor the bulls with a healthy drose. I forgot another team, THE NETS. Our bigmen are terrible defensively. Rondo will miss 20 games or so. AB has shown he is not a point gaurd. Dont expect pressey to be a 10 assist pg man his rookie year without having atleast 7 turnovers a game.

If your not rooting for this team to tank you have problems. Im going to love to watch this team this year dont get me wrong. We will be in every game once rondo comes back. Well probably beat a good team or so down the stretch, but im just saying, Those 5 teams mentioned above, will be better then us the first 30 games of the season WITHOUT A DOUBT.

You are really underestimating OUR advantages or simply not taking them into account at ALL!!!!!  Our swing men are BETTER and MORE ATHLETIC than just about all (and I would argue all) the five teams mentioned!!  I will put Jeff Green and Gerald Wallace up against anyone they have.  I think you and MANY OTHERS are greatly underestimating how good Gerald very well could be for us next year.  You are also underestimating Brad Stevens.  He WAS the MOST BRILLIANT young college coach in the last 20 years, hands down.  Sure the transition to the pros will be challenging, but I firmly believe that he is young enough to adjust and adapt better than say Rick Pitino did!!!!  I very well could be wrong, but I got to see Gerald play in person quite a bit in Charlotte and he is a well above average defender.  That is NOT debatable!!!  If we become a running team, he can score on the fly.  No, he does NOT have a great outside game that is needed in half court b-ball, BUT I don't see us NOT running this year.

Smitty77

Interestingly, Stevens's Butler teams played at a very slow pace, so while I think our team suits a running style, there's little evidence that Stevens is going to have them play as such.

[Celtics18]

Rondo's also going to miss games, so while he's the best player of the lot, he won't be the best player on the floor.

I'm going under the (admittedly optimistic) assumption that he's not going to miss more than twenty games at most. 

If he misses close to half the season or more, then I definitely think the top half of the lottery will be a more likely story.

I think Rondo will be rested until he is 110% fit.
I doubt they will take any chances on him.
Top 8 pick here we come 

I think he'll be at a 110% by the first of December.

8th seed, here come!!

Possibly. If we're missing Rondo for 20 games, we're probably looking at something like 5-15.

Even if a bunch of teams hadn't become better in the off season to vie for those last three playoff spots (and they have), that might be too much of a hole for one guy to dig us out of.


Also, I'd like Jabari Parker if only for the fact that he didn't decide to superteam it up in Kentucky.

I think there'll be some stiff competition for those last three playoff spots between us, Detroit, Cleveland, Washington, Toronto, and Atlanta.

All I'm saying is that I think we could well be in the mix, and I'm taking the seemingly minority opinion of rooting for our team to maximize their potential on the court next season, and, hopefully, make a run at the playoffs.   

I know it's a more popular opinion to want to see the team just bag it and shoot for lottery balls.  It seems somewhat ironic to me that rooting for the team to win games feels like taking the subversive stance.

I think that the Wizards swung and MISSED with Otto Porter.  His summer league numbers were TERRIBLE!!!!!   Are you serious about Toronto?  Come on buddy.  We SHOULD be better than the Raptors!!  The Cavs should be improved, but there are a LOT of NEW pieces that will have to gel for them to greatly improve.  They also have a few redundant pieces.  I have already given my opinion of Josh and Brandon's b-ball IQ's.  Once again, a LOT of NEW pieces that have to gel for the Pistons.  I am NOT saying that we do NOT have a LOT of new pieces, but I like our coach over all the others mentioned in that group!!

Smitty77

Unfortunately, I agree about Porter.  I'm hoping that he can eventually turn into a solid pro, but I don't think he'll be a major factor in his rookie season. 

I do think Toronto has some talent with a starting lineup of Lowry, DeRozan, Gay, Amir Johnson, and Valanciunas.  Solid, but they don't exactly blow you away as an elite level team. 

The biggest question mark in Cleveland is obviously Bynum.  I wouldn't count on him to be healthy and motivated if I were a Cavs fan. 

The Pistons look the most improved on paper with Monroe and Drummond a year older and the additions of Smith and Jennings.  I'm not in love with Jennings either, but I do think he's an improvement over the Pistons' previous Brandon.

We'll see.  In the end, I'm saying that I do think we are a playoff team.  I just don't think we are a shoo-in.

Those 5 teams mentioned have a better point gaurd then us. Rondo will be out till december. Quote me. Not only that those teams also all have better centers and shooters. I love our cs, but WHY WOULD ANYONE WANT TO MAKE THE POSTSEASON AND BE SWEPT FIRST ROUND. This all anti tank stuff is ridiculous, Theres no way even with a Healthy rondo, Jeff green becomes a 30 ppg scorer and kelly becomes dirk.. we still would not beat the heat first round, nor the pacers, nor the bulls with a healthy drose. I forgot another team, THE NETS. Our bigmen are terrible defensively. Rondo will miss 20 games or so. AB has shown he is not a point gaurd. Dont expect pressey to be a 10 assist pg man his rookie year without having atleast 7 turnovers a game.

If your not rooting for this team to tank you have problems. Im going to love to watch this team this year dont get me wrong. We will be in every game once rondo comes back. Well probably beat a good team or so down the stretch, but im just saying, Those 5 teams mentioned above, will be better then us the first 30 games of the season WITHOUT A DOUBT.

You are really underestimating OUR advantages or simply not taking them into account at ALL!!!!!  Our swing men are BETTER and MORE ATHLETIC than just about all (and I would argue all) the five teams mentioned!!  I will put Jeff Green and Gerald Wallace up against anyone they have.  I think you and MANY OTHERS are greatly underestimating how good Gerald very well could be for us next year.  You are also underestimating Brad Stevens.  He WAS the MOST BRILLIANT young college coach in the last 20 years, hands down.  Sure the transition to the pros will be challenging, but I firmly believe that he is young enough to adjust and adapt better than say Rick Pitino did!!!!  I very well could be wrong, but I got to see Gerald play in person quite a bit in Charlotte and he is a well above average defender.  That is NOT debatable!!!  If we become a running team, he can score on the fly.  No, he does NOT have a great outside game that is needed in half court b-ball, BUT I don't see us NOT running this year.

Smitty77

Interestingly, Stevens's Butler teams played at a very slow pace, so while I think our team suits a running style, there's little evidence that Stevens is going to have them play as such.

Brad Stevens strikes me as the type of coach who is going to be flexible enough to adapt his team's playing style to fit the personnel and the situation.

[D.o.s.]

I agree, but I do think it's interesting that people assume that he's going to have the team raise the tempo when none of his teams to this point have done so.

Granted, his coaching resume is pretty minimal (as far as looking for data to mine).

[Celtics18]

I agree, but I do think it's interesting that people assume that he's going to have the team raise the tempo when none of his teams to this point have done so.

Granted, his coaching resume is pretty minimal (as far as looking for data to mine).

I re-iterate that I'm not basing this belief on Stevens' past, but on the fact that I think that the current personnel of the Celtics is suited to a more up-tempo style than we've been used to seeing. 

This is Stevens' first NBA coaching job, and I don't think he's the type who is going to come in with a hard line, "this is how my team's play, and we'll fit whatever roster I have to that style" type of guy. 

I see him more as a guy who is going to analyze his current situation and attempt to find a plan that he thinks will work for that situation. 

It'll be very interesting to see what our team looks like next year, not just from a roster standpoint, but also from a style of play standpoint.  I'm rooting for up-tempo, but if coach Stevens can implement more of a half court game that works for this team, I'll be for that, too. 

I can't really see him being against getting out in transition when the opportunities are there, though.  We'll see. 

[Celtics18]

Rondo's also going to miss games, so while he's the best player of the lot, he won't be the best player on the floor.

I'm going under the (admittedly optimistic) assumption that he's not going to miss more than twenty games at most. 

If he misses close to half the season or more, then I definitely think the top half of the lottery will be a more likely story.

I think Rondo will be rested until he is 110% fit.
I doubt they will take any chances on him.
Top 8 pick here we come 

I think he'll be at a 110% by the first of December.

8th seed, here come!!

Possibly. If we're missing Rondo for 20 games, we're probably looking at something like 5-15.

Even if a bunch of teams hadn't become better in the off season to vie for those last three playoff spots (and they have), that might be too much of a hole for one guy to dig us out of.


Also, I'd like Jabari Parker if only for the fact that he didn't decide to superteam it up in Kentucky.

I think there'll be some stiff competition for those last three playoff spots between us, Detroit, Cleveland, Washington, Toronto, and Atlanta.

All I'm saying is that I think we could well be in the mix, and I'm taking the seemingly minority opinion of rooting for our team to maximize their potential on the court next season, and, hopefully, make a run at the playoffs.   

I know it's a more popular opinion to want to see the team just bag it and shoot for lottery balls.  It seems somewhat ironic to me that rooting for the team to win games feels like taking the subversive stance.

I think that the Wizards swung and MISSED with Otto Porter.  His summer league numbers were TERRIBLE!!!!!   Are you serious about Toronto?  Come on buddy.  We SHOULD be better than the Raptors!!  The Cavs should be improved, but there are a LOT of NEW pieces that will have to gel for them to greatly improve.  They also have a few redundant pieces.  I have already given my opinion of Josh and Brandon's b-ball IQ's.  Once again, a LOT of NEW pieces that have to gel for the Pistons.  I am NOT saying that we do NOT have a LOT of new pieces, but I like our coach over all the others mentioned in that group!!

Smitty77

Unfortunately, I agree about Porter.  I'm hoping that he can eventually turn into a solid pro, but I don't think he'll be a major factor in his rookie season. 

I do think Toronto has some talent with a starting lineup of Lowry, DeRozan, Gay, Amir Johnson, and Valanciunas.  Solid, but they don't exactly blow you away as an elite level team. 

The biggest question mark in Cleveland is obviously Bynum.  I wouldn't count on him to be healthy and motivated if I were a Cavs fan. 

The Pistons look the most improved on paper with Monroe and Drummond a year older and the additions of Smith and Jennings.  I'm not in love with Jennings either, but I do think he's an improvement over the Pistons' previous Brandon.

We'll see.  In the end, I'm saying that I do think we are a playoff team.  I just don't think we are a shoo-in.

Those 5 teams mentioned have a better point gaurd then us. Rondo will be out till december. Quote me. Not only that those teams also all have better centers and shooters. I love our cs, but WHY WOULD ANYONE WANT TO MAKE THE POSTSEASON AND BE SWEPT FIRST ROUND. This all anti tank stuff is ridiculous, Theres no way even with a Healthy rondo, Jeff green becomes a 30 ppg scorer and kelly becomes dirk.. we still would not beat the heat first round, nor the pacers, nor the bulls with a healthy drose. I forgot another team, THE NETS. Our bigmen are terrible defensively. Rondo will miss 20 games or so. AB has shown he is not a point gaurd. Dont expect pressey to be a 10 assist pg man his rookie year without having atleast 7 turnovers a game.

If your not rooting for this team to tank you have problems. Im going to love to watch this team this year dont get me wrong. We will be in every game once rondo comes back. Well probably beat a good team or so down the stretch, but im just saying, Those 5 teams mentioned above, will be better then us the first 30 games of the season WITHOUT A DOUBT.

I don't think the teams we are talking about all have better shooters than us.  Take Toronto, for example.  Both Derozan and Gay are actually worse than Bradley and Green, respectively, from long range for their careers.  Their presumed front line of Amir Johnson and Valanciunas aren't shooters.  They do have Steve Novak off the bench.  We'll see how much of a difference maker he ends up being. 

Detroit certainly doesn't look like a very good perimeter shooting team either.  They have Chauncey, but at 36 years of age, we'll see how much he can contribute next year.  Datome could end up playing a role for them as a shooter, but, again, I see him as a limited minute guy in his rookie year. 

I agree that those teams all look like they have better centers than us, but, although center is one of the five most important positions in basketball, I wouldn't base my entire analysis of a team on just that one position. 

I'm not saying that I think we are a shoo-in for the playoffs.  As a matter of fact, I would say that we are somewhat of a long shot.  I think that 35 wins is a realistic goal to shoot for.  Any less than that, and I would be disappointed.  I also think that if the team overachieves just a little bit, we could reach somewhere in the low 40s and be a playoff team.

I'm not rooting for this team to tank, so I guess I have problems.   If rooting for my team to win is going to be considered going against the grain (I find that so oddly ironic, based on what I've always believed about rooting for sports teams), then I don't mind going against the grain. 

[Yogi]

The number one advantage the Celtic have over the other teams trying to make the playoffs is winning culture.  KG, Paul, Ray, Doc and Danny instilled a certain philosophy in Rondo, Bradley, Lee, Green and Sullinger that is sorely missing from teams like Cleveland, Detroit and Washington.  They play smart, unselfish, defense-first basketball that values winning over everything.

I've seen people ask "What is the value in making the playoffs if you are expected to lose in the first round?"  A fair question. 

A first (or second) round loss is only a bad thing if your team maxes out at that level in the future.  That is not the case with the Celtics.

- Rondo, Green, Lee, Bass and Humphries are still in their prime and will continue to be there for at least two more years. 
- Bradley, Sullinger, Olynyk, Pressey, Crawford, Faverani and Iverson will all improve over the next 7-8 years. 
- We have 9 first round picks and cap space over the next 5 years to keep improving the team.

Miami, Indiana, Chicago, Houston, Memphis, Golden State, Memphis, Brooklyn all went from first/second round exits to contender by adding to their young team, not by tanking.

Playoff teams attract quality players, not lottery teams.  People want to trade for Love/Aldridge types of player who are unhappy with their teams for not winning.  Why would these players sign an extension with a bad team in Boston if they wouldn't do it in their current cities?  Dwight Howard chose Houston (first round exit) over large markets and lottery teams because he knows that he will have a chance to compete for a championship there.  Lottery teams have to settle for overpaying Al Jefferson and Josh Smith. 

Historically, lottery teams are stuck there for several years.  Statistically, tanking simply does not work.

http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/40055/does-tanking-even-work
http://wagesofwins.com/2012/04/02/why-tanking-doesnt-work-in-the-nba/

- If we are very fortunate there MIGHT be a franchise player in a given draft. 
- A deal with the devil might mean there are 2 or 3 franchise players.
- We would need a top 5 pick to even have a hope of landing such a player.  Philly, Phoenix, Utah, Sacramento, Orlando, Milwaukee, Charlotte etc. are our competition and there is not an all star in that bunch.
- Even if we land a top 5 pick, we would have to avoid traps like Beasley, Milicic, Marvin Williams, Derrick Williams, Kwame Brown etc. 
- Even if we land a good player we would have to avoid misfortunes like Greg Oden, Len Bias, Penny Hardaway, Shaun Livingston etc. 
- And if against all odds we land a franchise player, we have to rinse and repeat until we get lucky enough times to have a contender or risk our original stud leaving in free agency like Lebron, Howard and Paul.

I only have one question left.  Why in the world would anyone want to tank?

[bucknersrevenge]

Rondo's also going to miss games, so while he's the best player of the lot, he won't be the best player on the floor.

I'm going under the (admittedly optimistic) assumption that he's not going to miss more than twenty games at most. 

If he misses close to half the season or more, then I definitely think the top half of the lottery will be a more likely story.

I think Rondo will be rested until he is 110% fit.
I doubt they will take any chances on him.
Top 8 pick here we come 

I think he'll be at a 110% by the first of December.

8th seed, here come!!

Possibly. If we're missing Rondo for 20 games, we're probably looking at something like 5-15.

Even if a bunch of teams hadn't become better in the off season to vie for those last three playoff spots (and they have), that might be too much of a hole for one guy to dig us out of.


Also, I'd like Jabari Parker if only for the fact that he didn't decide to superteam it up in Kentucky.

I think there'll be some stiff competition for those last three playoff spots between us, Detroit, Cleveland, Washington, Toronto, and Atlanta.

All I'm saying is that I think we could well be in the mix, and I'm taking the seemingly minority opinion of rooting for our team to maximize their potential on the court next season, and, hopefully, make a run at the playoffs.   

I know it's a more popular opinion to want to see the team just bag it and shoot for lottery balls.  It seems somewhat ironic to me that rooting for the team to win games feels like taking the subversive stance.

I think that the Wizards swung and MISSED with Otto Porter.  His summer league numbers were TERRIBLE!!!!!   Are you serious about Toronto?  Come on buddy.  We SHOULD be better than the Raptors!!  The Cavs should be improved, but there are a LOT of NEW pieces that will have to gel for them to greatly improve.  They also have a few redundant pieces.  I have already given my opinion of Josh and Brandon's b-ball IQ's.  Once again, a LOT of NEW pieces that have to gel for the Pistons.  I am NOT saying that we do NOT have a LOT of new pieces, but I like our coach over all the others mentioned in that group!!

Smitty77

Unfortunately, I agree about Porter.  I'm hoping that he can eventually turn into a solid pro, but I don't think he'll be a major factor in his rookie season. 

I do think Toronto has some talent with a starting lineup of Lowry, DeRozan, Gay, Amir Johnson, and Valanciunas.  Solid, but they don't exactly blow you away as an elite level team. 

The biggest question mark in Cleveland is obviously Bynum.  I wouldn't count on him to be healthy and motivated if I were a Cavs fan. 

The Pistons look the most improved on paper with Monroe and Drummond a year older and the additions of Smith and Jennings.  I'm not in love with Jennings either, but I do think he's an improvement over the Pistons' previous Brandon.

We'll see.  In the end, I'm saying that I do think we are a playoff team.  I just don't think we are a shoo-in.

Those 5 teams mentioned have a better point gaurd then us. Rondo will be out till december. Quote me. Not only that those teams also all have better centers and shooters. I love our cs, but WHY WOULD ANYONE WANT TO MAKE THE POSTSEASON AND BE SWEPT FIRST ROUND. This all anti tank stuff is ridiculous, Theres no way even with a Healthy rondo, Jeff green becomes a 30 ppg scorer and kelly becomes dirk.. we still would not beat the heat first round, nor the pacers, nor the bulls with a healthy drose. I forgot another team, THE NETS. Our bigmen are terrible defensively. Rondo will miss 20 games or so. AB has shown he is not a point gaurd. Dont expect pressey to be a 10 assist pg man his rookie year without having atleast 7 turnovers a game.

If your not rooting for this team to tank you have problems. Im going to love to watch this team this year dont get me wrong. We will be in every game once rondo comes back. Well probably beat a good team or so down the stretch, but im just saying, Those 5 teams mentioned above, will be better then us the first 30 games of the season WITHOUT A DOUBT.

You are really underestimating OUR advantages or simply not taking them into account at ALL!!!!!  Our swing men are BETTER and MORE ATHLETIC than just about all (and I would argue all) the five teams mentioned!!  I will put Jeff Green and Gerald Wallace up against anyone they have.  I think you and MANY OTHERS are greatly underestimating how good Gerald very well could be for us next year.  You are also underestimating Brad Stevens.  He WAS the MOST BRILLIANT young college coach in the last 20 years, hands down.  Sure the transition to the pros will be challenging, but I firmly believe that he is young enough to adjust and adapt better than say Rick Pitino did!!!!  I very well could be wrong, but I got to see Gerald play in person quite a bit in Charlotte and he is a well above average defender.  That is NOT debatable!!!  If we become a running team, he can score on the fly.  No, he does NOT have a great outside game that is needed in half court b-ball, BUT I don't see us NOT running this year.

Smitty77

Interestingly, Stevens's Butler teams played at a very slow pace, so while I think our team suits a running style, there's little evidence that Stevens is going to have them play as such.

Actually there is. In an interview with CSNNE.com(which I haven't the time to locate right now) Stevens said he lets the personnel he has dictate his team's philosophy. Where Doc has a system in mind he wants to run and tells Danny to get players to fit his system, Stevens organically designs his system and adapts it to his personnel and makes adjustments as his personnel changes. So you can throw out what he did at Butler because that has nothing to do with his roster here.

In the same interview his assessment of the team was that he sees a lot of players capable of doing things in transition at a high level and guys capable of playing in space. This team is gonna run. It has the horses to do it. The only thing that would prevent us from running would be not reinforcing the mindset to do it regularly. Doc never did this because his system suggested he shouldn't. But this is a new day and a new roster.

[Celtics18]

The number one advantage the Celtic have over the other teams trying to make the playoffs is winning culture.  KG, Paul, Ray, Doc and Danny instilled a certain philosophy in Rondo, Bradley, Lee, Green and Sullinger that is sorely missing from teams like Cleveland, Detroit and Washington.  They play smart, unselfish, defense-first basketball that values winning over everything.

I've seen people ask "What is the value in making the playoffs if you are expected to lose in the first round?"  A fair question. 

A first (or second) round loss is only a bad thing if your team maxes out at that level in the future.  That is not the case with the Celtics.

- Rondo, Green, Lee, Bass and Humphries are still in their prime and will continue to be there for at least two more years. 
- Bradley, Sullinger, Olynyk, Pressey, Crawford, Faverani and Iverson will all improve over the next 7-8 years. 
- We have 9 first round picks and cap space over the next 5 years to keep improving the team.

Miami, Indiana, Chicago, Houston, Memphis, Golden State, Memphis, Brooklyn all went from first/second round exits to contender by adding to their young team, not by tanking.

Playoff teams attract quality players, not lottery teams.  People want to trade for Love/Aldridge types of player who are unhappy with their teams for not winning.  Why would these players sign an extension with a bad team in Boston if they wouldn't do it in their current cities?  Dwight Howard chose Houston (first round exit) over large markets and lottery teams because he knows that he will have a chance to compete for a championship there.  Lottery teams have to settle for overpaying Al Jefferson and Josh Smith. 

Historically, lottery teams are stuck there for several years.  Statistically, tanking simply does not work.

http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/40055/does-tanking-even-work
http://wagesofwins.com/2012/04/02/why-tanking-doesnt-work-in-the-nba/

- If we are very fortunate there MIGHT be a franchise player in a given draft. 
- A deal with the devil might mean there are 2 or 3 franchise players.
- We would need a top 5 pick to even have a hope of landing such a player.  Philly, Phoenix, Utah, Sacramento, Orlando, Milwaukee, Charlotte etc. are our competition and there is not an all star in that bunch.
- Even if we land a top 5 pick, we would have to avoid traps like Beasley, Milicic, Marvin Williams, Derrick Williams, Kwame Brown etc. 
- Even if we land a good player we would have to avoid misfortunes like Greg Oden, Len Bias, Penny Hardaway, Shaun Livingston etc. 
- And if against all odds we land a franchise player, we have to rinse and repeat until we get lucky enough times to have a contender or risk our original stud leaving in free agency like Lebron, Howard and Paul.

I only have one question left.  Why in the world would anyone want to tank?

Giveth.

[bucknersrevenge]

duplicate

[Smitty77]

Rondo's also going to miss games, so while he's the best player of the lot, he won't be the best player on the floor.

I'm going under the (admittedly optimistic) assumption that he's not going to miss more than twenty games at most. 

If he misses close to half the season or more, then I definitely think the top half of the lottery will be a more likely story.

I think Rondo will be rested until he is 110% fit.
I doubt they will take any chances on him.
Top 8 pick here we come 

I think he'll be at a 110% by the first of December.

8th seed, here come!!

Possibly. If we're missing Rondo for 20 games, we're probably looking at something like 5-15.

Even if a bunch of teams hadn't become better in the off season to vie for those last three playoff spots (and they have), that might be too much of a hole for one guy to dig us out of.


Also, I'd like Jabari Parker if only for the fact that he didn't decide to superteam it up in Kentucky.

I think there'll be some stiff competition for those last three playoff spots between us, Detroit, Cleveland, Washington, Toronto, and Atlanta.

All I'm saying is that I think we could well be in the mix, and I'm taking the seemingly minority opinion of rooting for our team to maximize their potential on the court next season, and, hopefully, make a run at the playoffs.   

I know it's a more popular opinion to want to see the team just bag it and shoot for lottery balls.  It seems somewhat ironic to me that rooting for the team to win games feels like taking the subversive stance.

I think that the Wizards swung and MISSED with Otto Porter.  His summer league numbers were TERRIBLE!!!!!   Are you serious about Toronto?  Come on buddy.  We SHOULD be better than the Raptors!!  The Cavs should be improved, but there are a LOT of NEW pieces that will have to gel for them to greatly improve.  They also have a few redundant pieces.  I have already given my opinion of Josh and Brandon's b-ball IQ's.  Once again, a LOT of NEW pieces that have to gel for the Pistons.  I am NOT saying that we do NOT have a LOT of new pieces, but I like our coach over all the others mentioned in that group!!

Smitty77

Unfortunately, I agree about Porter.  I'm hoping that he can eventually turn into a solid pro, but I don't think he'll be a major factor in his rookie season. 

I do think Toronto has some talent with a starting lineup of Lowry, DeRozan, Gay, Amir Johnson, and Valanciunas.  Solid, but they don't exactly blow you away as an elite level team. 

The biggest question mark in Cleveland is obviously Bynum.  I wouldn't count on him to be healthy and motivated if I were a Cavs fan. 

The Pistons look the most improved on paper with Monroe and Drummond a year older and the additions of Smith and Jennings.  I'm not in love with Jennings either, but I do think he's an improvement over the Pistons' previous Brandon.

We'll see.  In the end, I'm saying that I do think we are a playoff team.  I just don't think we are a shoo-in.

Those 5 teams mentioned have a better point gaurd then us. Rondo will be out till december. Quote me. Not only that those teams also all have better centers and shooters. I love our cs, but WHY WOULD ANYONE WANT TO MAKE THE POSTSEASON AND BE SWEPT FIRST ROUND. This all anti tank stuff is ridiculous, Theres no way even with a Healthy rondo, Jeff green becomes a 30 ppg scorer and kelly becomes dirk.. we still would not beat the heat first round, nor the pacers, nor the bulls with a healthy drose. I forgot another team, THE NETS. Our bigmen are terrible defensively. Rondo will miss 20 games or so. AB has shown he is not a point gaurd. Dont expect pressey to be a 10 assist pg man his rookie year without having atleast 7 turnovers a game.

If your not rooting for this team to tank you have problems. Im going to love to watch this team this year dont get me wrong. We will be in every game once rondo comes back. Well probably beat a good team or so down the stretch, but im just saying, Those 5 teams mentioned above, will be better then us the first 30 games of the season WITHOUT A DOUBT.

You are really underestimating OUR advantages or simply not taking them into account at ALL!!!!!  Our swing men are BETTER and MORE ATHLETIC than just about all (and I would argue all) the five teams mentioned!!  I will put Jeff Green and Gerald Wallace up against anyone they have.  I think you and MANY OTHERS are greatly underestimating how good Gerald very well could be for us next year.  You are also underestimating Brad Stevens.  He WAS the MOST BRILLIANT young college coach in the last 20 years, hands down.  Sure the transition to the pros will be challenging, but I firmly believe that he is young enough to adjust and adapt better than say Rick Pitino did!!!!  I very well could be wrong, but I got to see Gerald play in person quite a bit in Charlotte and he is a well above average defender.  That is NOT debatable!!!  If we become a running team, he can score on the fly.  No, he does NOT have a great outside game that is needed in half court b-ball, BUT I don't see us NOT running this year.

Smitty77

Interestingly, Stevens's Butler teams played at a very slow pace, so while I think our team suits a running style, there's little evidence that Stevens is going to have them play as such.

I will take this Butler philosophy in Beantown ANY day of the year baby!!!

http://www.forbes.com/sites/jasonbelzer/2013/02/07/why-butler-basketball-holds-the-key-to-organizational-success/

Smitty77