Would Doc leaving be on Par with Ray?

[CelticG1]

You can't really compare players and coaches in this regard. Players contracts are bound by the rules on the NBA CBA and hence, if a player just wants to not play for a team, he has options to get out of town with, like retiring(Rasheed Wallace), forcing a trade(Carmelo Anthony), coming to an agreement with the team to get out of the contract(Darko ng(Allen Iverson) and hope the team doesn't sue him over services not rendered.

Coaches are not bound by the NBA CBA. They have personal contracts with the teams and it is common practice, if a coach wants to not coach a team anymore, to let them go. it happens all the time(Larry Brown). If Doc leaves he is no different than a whole bunch of other coaches that just leave their teams for front office jobs or other coaching positions or to take a break and go into broadcasting. Seldom do coaches ever reach the end of their contracts. They are usually fired or they leave before their contract ends. And that is another difference. Coaches can be fired, players can't.

I guess Doc would just be a big fat liar then 

Talking about how coaches always talk about loyalty and he thought it was time to show it. Unless you want to spin it around somehow and say "Well he didnt swear to god that he wouldnt leave!"

At least Ray was a free agent, was demoted the season prior and had almost been traded multiple times on his last couple years of playing ever.

I mean i thought that was a bisch league move but Doc forcing his way out seems kind of phil jacksony. Its just slimey.

Aimge and the organization wants him to stay with his current contract and Doc is forcing his hand.

Is that really what Larry brown did or other coaches have done numerous times?

[Casperian]

I think it´s exactly the same, and I couldn´t blame either of them.

[nickagneta]

Is that really what Larry brown did or other coaches have done numerous times?

Yup...happens all the time.

[CelticG1]

Is that really what Larry brown did or other coaches have done numerous times?

Yup...happens all the time.

Ok so long as you agree that Doc was feeding everyone a ton of bs when he signed that contract (among many other times) and agree that Its an extremely bush league move than that makes sense.

I don't really fet the Larry brown refernce. The pistons were ticked that Larry Brown was pulling a Doc Rivers so they let him go?

Yeah I understand that happens. It usually involves prtty big time Edited.  Profanity and masked profanity are against forum rules and may result in discipline.s tho such as brown.

When Kevin Love starts to pull a Dwight howard and forces his way out I'm not gonna say "well it happens all the time" I'm gonna call him what he is

[CelticG1]

Free agents leave all the time!! Its just like Ray Allen!! How could anyone be mad about that??

[nickagneta]

Is that really what Larry brown did or other coaches have done numerous times?

Yup...happens all the time.

Ok so long as you agree that Doc was feeding everyone a ton of bs when he signed that contract (among many other times) and agree that Its an extremely bush league move than that makes sense.

I don't really fet the Larry brown refernce. The pistons were ticked that Larry Brown was pulling a Doc Rivers so they let him go?

Yeah I understand that happens. It usually involves prtty big time ****s tho such as brown.

When Kevin Love starts to pull a Dwight howard and forces his way out I'm not gonna say "well it happens all the time" I'm gonna call him what he is

Coaches say what they have to say because they have to say it. GMs lie publicly all the time because they have to not to show their hands.

Doesn't bother me at all. And honestly, if a team can fire a coach any time they want, I have no problem with the reciprocal.

Never really bother me that Ray left either. Business is business and what has happened with Ray and MIGHT(lets stress that word) happen with Doc is just normal stuff for business in the NBA.

[scaryjerry]

Worse.

Ray Allen was a free agent who was continually tossed around in potential trades.

Doc has 3 years left on his deal and is the highest paid coach in the NBA and the franchise stuck with him through rough years and rewarded him with a roster that carried his averageness to a title

[dark_lord]

It's not on par, but its equally annoying.

OP is right, it feels like he's held the team hostage with his lack of decision.

It's a simple Yes or No question.

isn't it possible that it is not a yes or no question?  maybe his decisive factor of whether to stay or not is dictated on what Ainge's plan is (what is pierces situation, what direction is the team going, etc).  it is quite possible that ainge is the one responsible for how long the wait is for doc's decision.

[CelticG1]

It's not on par, but its equally annoying.

OP is right, it feels like he's held the team hostage with his lack of decision.

It's a simple Yes or No question.

isn't it possible that it is not a yes or no question?  maybe his decisive factor of whether to stay or not is dictated on what Ainge's plan is (what is pierces situation, what direction is the team going, etc).  it is quite possible that ainge is the one responsible for how long the wait is for doc's decision.

I think if Doc wants ainge to do what he wants that's keeping him hostage.

If he's waiting to see what ainge does maybe its not keeping them hosrage but certainly probably affecting ainges decision making a bit which in turn affects the team.

Ainge now is trying to figure out a team and now has to decide if he wants to gear it to what doc wants, what ainge hinself thinks is best and everything in between.

Its just not a good situation

[CelticG1]

Is that really what Larry brown did or other coaches have done numerous times?

Yup...happens all the time.

Ok so long as you agree that Doc was feeding everyone a ton of bs when he signed that contract (among many other times) and agree that Its an extremely bush league move than that makes sense.

I don't really fet the Larry brown refernce. The pistons were ticked that Larry Brown was pulling a Doc Rivers so they let him go?

Yeah I understand that happens. It usually involves prtty big time ****s tho such as brown.

When Kevin Love starts to pull a Dwight howard and forces his way out I'm not gonna say "well it happens all the time" I'm gonna call him what he is

Coaches say what they have to say because they have to say it. GMs lie publicly all the time because they have to not to show their hands.

Doesn't bother me at all. And honestly, if a team can fire a coach any time they want, I have no problem with the reciprocal.

Never really bother me that Ray left either. Business is business and what has happened with Ray and MIGHT(lets stress that word) happen with Doc is just normal stuff for business in the NBA.

That's fine if it doesn't bother you. Some people weren't bothered by Lebrons "decision" or Howard forcing himself out of Orlando etc.

That stuff bugs me, especially when it comes from Doc. Much like Ray they both are looked at as some of the classiest guys the NBA has. I just think IF Doc does this and Ray leaving were both slimey moves that would leave a bad taste in my mouth.

Nothing crazy or unforgiveable but definitely believed them when they spoke more than others but oh well

[CelticG1]

If Doc stays I'm not about to give him a round of applause either. He clearly doesn't want to be here and if he stays its a good chance that everything else fell apart including being denied permission to speak to teams. That or he got what he wanted here.

In any case I can't wait to hear him really speak after everything goes down. Although apparently I will have to take it with spoon fulls of salt

[papa shuttlesworth]

Worse.

Ray Allen was a free agent who was continually tossed around in potential trades.

Doc has 3 years left on his deal and is the highest paid coach in the NBA and the franchise stuck with him through rough years and rewarded him with a roster that carried his averageness to a title

I agree with this (although I think Doc is better than average).

Ray's decision was hurtful to fans who can not understand why anyone would not want to play for their team, but he was a free agent and could do whatever he wanted.

Doc signed a long term contract knowing what he was in store for and now is contemplating breaking the deal halfway into it.

To burn Ray in effigy and give Doc a pass is a HUGE double standard.

[wiley]

Don't understand why people assume this is a case of Doc leaving Danny and the Celtics in the lurch.  There very easily, as always happens in the workplace, be some small amount of friction in Doc and Danny's relationship.  Perhaps Danny has intimated subtly that he'd like to do things a  little differently for example, focus more on offense for example, or a million other little things that can lead to two parties deciding to part ways amicably.  People getting in a huff over this is odd.  There are ALWAYS reasons for things of this nature happening.

I don't get the Doc leaving us at the altar angle.  Just calm down and wait for the books to come out in the future.  All will be clear and known down the road.

[CelticG1]

Don't understand why people assume this is a case of Doc leaving Danny and the Celtics in the lurch.  There very easily, as always happens in the workplace, be some small amount of friction in Doc and Danny's relationship.  Perhaps Danny has intimated subtly that he'd like to do things a  little differently for example, focus more on offense for example, or a million other little things that can lead to two parties deciding to part ways amicably.  People getting in a huff over this is odd.  There are ALWAYS reasons for things of this nature happening.

I don't get the Doc leaving us at the altar angle.  Just calm down and wait for the books to come out in the future.  All will be clear and known down the road.

Your just presenting a theory with absolutely no basis.

Allbibhave heard is that there has rarely been friction between the 2 and that its a great working relationship.

Now you have Danny refusing teams away from talking to Doc while Doc is "interested" in other places.

I don't see how you think this seems like it could be an amicible split

[Tgro]

Hasn't nothing actually happened yet. So this crucifixion is a bit overblown at this point.

Some people have Doc as being a betrayer whether he stays OR goes. Some people will not say a kind word about him no matter how this turns out. It's a predisposition thing. If you didn't like Doc already, this just makes the worst come out because now it looks justified. If you do like Doc, you're a bit more willing to see how this all turns out before passing harsh judgment.

I think Ray opened a lot of eyes. He left for half the money and went to the enemy and at this point he is 2 wins away from another ring. It's almost like it exposed chinks in the Celtics armor.

A year later, nothing is settled. KG and PP may not be back and Doc is taking a rather troubling hiatus from saying he's got all his chips in with the Celtics. Could it be this is all posturing by all sides involved? I will say this, the decline of the Celtics was predicted and expected for a long time. Even about 3 years ago and it gave us 1 more Finals appearance and a 7th game loss from another. Now age and injuries caught up and the Celtics were mediocre all season. The whole time the fanbase yelled get rid of no talent Doc!

This seems an awful lot like a case of be careful what you wish for. We could be looking at next season with No KG, No PP and No Doc and be on the verge of a 5 year or more stint as the next Bobcats contender. It will almost serve us right.