Is Tony Parker the Best PG in the League?

[nickagneta]

Not sure there's a PG I'd rather have in the playoffs than Parker.

Skillset-wise, he's top 5 (not even sure top 3) but the kid really seems to step it up come playoff time.

He's certainly the most successful.  If I had to pick any point guard to lead my team in a playoff series, it would be Parker.

Yeah, Parker, like Rondo, is a beast of a PG in the playoffs. They both really raise their games under the microscope of the playoffs whereas players like CP3, Westbrook, Rose and Williams pretty much play at the level they always play at or play slightly worse come playoff time.

To me, I think its because both are such great half court floor generals which is the style of offense played for the most part in the playoffs. As guys who run offenses in the half court I think they are the best. Then CP3 and Williams. Then the next level is the guys that are outstanding PGs but their half court offenses revolve around them scoring like Irving, Rose, Westbrook, Curry, etc.

[CelticConcourse]

He's certainly the most successful.  If I had to pick any point guard to lead my team in a playoff series, it would be Parker.

I don't get that.

[Roy H.]

He's certainly the most successful.  If I had to pick any point guard to lead my team in a playoff series, it would be Parker.

I don't get that.

What's not to get?  How many other PGs are there playing who have three rings, four Finals appearances, and a Finals MVP?

[Tr1boy]

He is the best pg in the league. Clutch

[Boris Badenov]

He's certainly the most successful.  If I had to pick any point guard to lead my team in a playoff series, it would be Parker.

I don't get that.

I think the idea is that while someone like Rose *might* be better in terms of leading his team to a Finals victory, with Parker you *know* he can do it.

The downside risk with Parker is as close to zero as it can be.

I agree with the argument.

[hpantazo]

He's certainly the most successful.  If I had to pick any point guard to lead my team in a playoff series, it would be Parker.

I don't get that.

What's not to get?  How many other PGs are there playing who have three rings, four Finals appearances, and a Finals MVP?

Exactly. Parker is the most established PG in the league by far in terms of leading a team to a title. There is no argument there.

[CelticConcourse]

He's certainly the most successful.  If I had to pick any point guard to lead my team in a playoff series, it would be Parker.

I don't get that.

What's not to get?  How many other PGs are there playing who have three rings, four Finals appearances, and a Finals MVP?

Facts:

In Tony Parker's first Finals appearance, in two of his games he scored less than 5 points, shooting 38.6% on the series. In one of his games, he shot 1-for-12.

In Tony Parker's second Finals appearance, he had just as many fouls as assists (playing PG). His turnovers+fouls was more than his assists+rebounds.

In Tony Parker's third Finals appearance, he had one less total turnover than total assists. However, he shot 56.8% for the series, which was fantastic (24.5ppg). Being picky, he shot just 52.7% from the foul line which is, mind you, worse than Rondo has shot in all but one series of his playoffs career (15 total)! Not so clutch.

How good is he?? One Finals MVP is fantastic, but it's not like he led his team to the finals four times or anything. He wasn't the best player around every series, and he definitely isn't near "the best pg in the league" in my opinion.

I'll take Rondo, who has led the Playoffs in assists for four of the past five seasons, has the third most triple-doubles in NBA playoffs history (at age 27). It's established that he rises to the occasion, and is a top-5 Playoffs player in the league when healthy.

I'll take 17/12/7/2.4 over 23/7/4/1.2 any month of the year, and twice in June. Rondo>Parker

[Roy H.]

He's certainly the most successful.  If I had to pick any point guard to lead my team in a playoff series, it would be Parker.

I don't get that.

What's not to get?  How many other PGs are there playing who have three rings, four Finals appearances, and a Finals MVP?

Facts:

In Tony Parker's first Finals appearance, in two of his games he scored less than 5 points, shooting 38.6% on the series. In one of his games, he shot 1-for-12.

In Tony Parker's second Finals appearance, he had just as many fouls as assists (playing PG). His turnovers+fouls was more than his assists+rebounds.

In Tony Parker's third Finals appearance, he had one less total turnover than total assists. However, he shot 56.8% for the series, which was fantastic (24.5ppg). Being picky, he shot just 52.7% from the foul line which is, mind you, worse than Rondo has shot in all but one series of his playoffs career (15 total)! Not so clutch.

You're going to cherry pick stats of Parker's, while ignoring Rondo's Finals appearances?

In his first Finals, Rondo scored eight or fewer points in four out of six games.  He only had double digit assists in one game, and had four or fewer assists in three games.  He shot 40% or worse (including games where he shot 25% and 14%) in four out of six games.

In his second Finals, Rondo shot below 47% six times, including two games of 33% shooting.  He only reached 10 assists in two out of seven games.  He shot 26.3% on FTs for the series, which is much worse than the 52.7% you criticized Parker for so vehemently.

It seems kind of odd, to criticize Parker for something that he has done far better than Rondo.

[hpantazo]

He's certainly the most successful.  If I had to pick any point guard to lead my team in a playoff series, it would be Parker.

I don't get that.

What's not to get?  How many other PGs are there playing who have three rings, four Finals appearances, and a Finals MVP?

Facts:

In Tony Parker's first Finals appearance, in two of his games he scored less than 5 points, shooting 38.6% on the series. In one of his games, he shot 1-for-12.

In Tony Parker's second Finals appearance, he had just as many fouls as assists (playing PG). His turnovers+fouls was more than his assists+rebounds.

In Tony Parker's third Finals appearance, he had one less total turnover than total assists. However, he shot 56.8% for the series, which was fantastic (24.5ppg). Being picky, he shot just 52.7% from the foul line which is, mind you, worse than Rondo has shot in all but one series of his playoffs career (15 total)! Not so clutch.

You're going to cherry pick stats of Parker's, while ignoring Rondo's Finals appearances?

In his first Finals, Rondo scored eight or fewer points in four out of six games.  He only had double digit assists in one game, and had four or fewer assists in three games.  He shot 40% or worse (including games where he shot 25% and 14%) in four out of six games.

In his second Finals, Rondo shot below 47% six times, including two games of 33% shooting.  He only reached 10 assists in two out of seven games.  He shot 26.3% on FTs for the series, which is much worse than the 52.7% you criticized Parker for so vehemently.

It seems kind of odd, to criticize Parker for something that he has done far better than Rondo.

Exactly. Thanks for saving me some typing Roy.

[nickagneta]

He's certainly the most successful.  If I had to pick any point guard to lead my team in a playoff series, it would be Parker.

I don't get that.

What's not to get?  How many other PGs are there playing who have three rings, four Finals appearances, and a Finals MVP?

Facts:

In Tony Parker's first Finals appearance, in two of his games he scored less than 5 points, shooting 38.6% on the series. In one of his games, he shot 1-for-12.

In Tony Parker's second Finals appearance, he had just as many fouls as assists (playing PG). His turnovers+fouls was more than his assists+rebounds.

In Tony Parker's third Finals appearance, he had one less total turnover than total assists. However, he shot 56.8% for the series, which was fantastic (24.5ppg). Being picky, he shot just 52.7% from the foul line which is, mind you, worse than Rondo has shot in all but one series of his playoffs career (15 total)! Not so clutch.

You're going to cherry pick stats of Parker's, while ignoring Rondo's Finals appearances?

In his first Finals, Rondo scored eight or fewer points in four out of six games.  He only had double digit assists in one game, and had four or fewer assists in three games.  He shot 40% or worse (including games where he shot 25% and 14%) in four out of six games.

In his second Finals, Rondo shot below 47% six times, including two games of 33% shooting.  He only reached 10 assists in two out of seven games.  He shot 26.3% on FTs for the series, which is much worse than the 52.7% you criticized Parker for so vehemently.

It seems kind of odd, to criticize Parker for something that he has done far better than Rondo.

I love stats that are cherry picked.

With Miami's biggest weakness being guarding excellent PGs and Cs that Parker should shine as I can't see Miami having Lebron guard Parker leaving Chalmers, Norris or someone else to guard Leonard or Duncan or Splitter. Parker could be a two time Finals MVP in that case and then that is the end of this discussion.

[2short]

Not sure there's a PG I'd rather have in the playoffs than Parker.

Skillset-wise, he's top 5 (not even sure top 3) but the kid really seems to step it up come playoff time.

He's certainly the most successful.  If I had to pick any point guard to lead my team in a playoff series, it would be Parker.

Yeah, Parker, like Rondo, is a beast of a PG in the playoffs. They both really raise their games under the microscope of the playoffs whereas players like CP3, Westbrook, Rose and Williams pretty much play at the level they always play at or play slightly worse come playoff time.

To me, I think its because both are such great half court floor generals which is the style of offense played for the most part in the playoffs. As guys who run offenses in the half court I think they are the best. Then CP3 and Williams. Then the next level is the guys that are outstanding PGs but their half court offenses revolve around them scoring like Irving, Rose, Westbrook, Curry, etc.

Yes this both guys will put up whatever stat the TEAM needs, Chris Paul and Williams just don't seem to have in terms of leading a group.   Knock rondo all you can but his playoff numbers are all time great levels.   I feel rondo Parker and rose can raise any part of their game to affect the team in a payoff win situation

[CelticConcourse]

He's certainly the most successful.  If I had to pick any point guard to lead my team in a playoff series, it would be Parker.

I don't get that.

What's not to get?  How many other PGs are there playing who have three rings, four Finals appearances, and a Finals MVP?

Facts:

In Tony Parker's first Finals appearance, in two of his games he scored less than 5 points, shooting 38.6% on the series. In one of his games, he shot 1-for-12.

In Tony Parker's second Finals appearance, he had just as many fouls as assists (playing PG). His turnovers+fouls was more than his assists+rebounds.

In Tony Parker's third Finals appearance, he had one less total turnover than total assists. However, he shot 56.8% for the series, which was fantastic (24.5ppg). Being picky, he shot just 52.7% from the foul line which is, mind you, worse than Rondo has shot in all but one series of his playoffs career (15 total)! Not so clutch.

You're going to cherry pick stats of Parker's, while ignoring Rondo's Finals appearances?

In his first Finals, Rondo scored eight or fewer points in four out of six games.  He only had double digit assists in one game, and had four or fewer assists in three games.  He shot 40% or worse (including games where he shot 25% and 14%) in four out of six games.

In his second Finals, Rondo shot below 47% six times, including two games of 33% shooting.  He only reached 10 assists in two out of seven games.  He shot 26.3% on FTs for the series, which is much worse than the 52.7% you criticized Parker for so vehemently.

It seems kind of odd, to criticize Parker for something that he has done far better than Rondo.

First off, I'll say that Rondo is the more versatile player, and by looking at the past 3 Playoffs:
Versatility Index
Tony Parker: 8.8 (23), 7.1 (38), 8.8 (16)
Rajon Rondo: 12.8 (2), 9.4 (6), 10.5 (7)

Then we'll compare actual Playoffs stats.
2008-09
Tony Parker: 29/7/4/1 (5 games)
Rajon Rondo: 17/10/10/3 (14 games)

2009-10
Tony Parker: 17/5/4/1 (10 games)
Rajon Rondo: 16/9/6/2 (24 games)

2010-11
Tony Parker: 20/5/3/1 (6 games)
Rajon Rondo: 14/10/5/1 (9 games)

2011-12
Tony Parker: 20/7/4/1 (14 games)
Rajon Rondo: 17/12/7/2 (19 games)

Obviously, you'll notice that these stats can all be flawed, especially given Parker's small sample sizes. However, you'll notice that even as Rondo plays more games, he keeps up his production; getting to the Finals requires playing more games than in a trip to the (E/W)CSF. I decided to underestimate both players' assists in a way that makes each assist count as two points created. Comparing the points each PG created for his team... (points+assists*2)

Parker: 43, 27, 30, 34
Rondo: 37, 34, 34, 41
Rondo creates more points for his team.

Might as well look at assists totals, right?

Parker: 7, 5, 5, 7
Rondo: 10, 9, 10, 12
Rondo gets more assists than Parker

Then, we'll take a look at rebounds...

Parker: 4, 4, 3, 4
Rondo: 10, 6, 5, 7
Rondo gets more rebounds, even in larger sample sizes

Then, we'll take a look at steals...

Parker: 1, 1, 1, 1
Rondo: 3, 2, 1, 2
Rondo gets more steals, even in larger sample sizes

Then, we'll take a look at Defensive Rating...

Parker: 112, 113, 108, 107, 101
Rondo: 103, 103, 102, 106, 99
Rondo is a better defender than Parker

But who's better at handling the ball?! We'll take a look at assist% n' turnover%...

Parker: 47/15, 30/11, 28/15, 32/14
Rondo: 41/13, 41/16, 42/21, 54/18
(this is useless, we actually have to find the quotient)
Parker: 3.1, 2.7, 1.9, 2.3
Rondo: 2.2, 2.6, 2.0, 3.0
Rondo is getting better and better than Parker

But Parker is a way better shooter than Rondo, right?!
eFG%

Parker: 56.0, 48.1, 46.8, 46.9
Rondo: 43.0, 47.7, 47.7, 48.2
Looks like they're heading in opposite directions to me... Rondo even "out-percentaged" Parker last season

And to cap it all off, we'll check out the win shares:

Parker: 0.5, 0.3, 0.3, 1.4
Rondo: 1.6, 2.7, 0.7, 2.6
Rondo wins more games than Parker.

I hate to say it, but the comparison is almost laughable. Rondo is better.

[Moranis]

Not sure there's a PG I'd rather have in the playoffs than Parker.

Skillset-wise, he's top 5 (not even sure top 3) but the kid really seems to step it up come playoff time.

He's certainly the most successful.  If I had to pick any point guard to lead my team in a playoff series, it would be Parker.

Yeah, Parker, like Rondo, is a beast of a PG in the playoffs. They both really raise their games under the microscope of the playoffs whereas players like CP3, Westbrook, Rose and Williams pretty much play at the level they always play at or play slightly worse come playoff time.

To me, I think its because both are such great half court floor generals which is the style of offense played for the most part in the playoffs. As guys who run offenses in the half court I think they are the best. Then CP3 and Williams. Then the next level is the guys that are outstanding PGs but their half court offenses revolve around them scoring like Irving, Rose, Westbrook, Curry, etc.

Paul actually ups almost all of his numbers in the playoffs.  I think the criticism of him is mostly because his teams generally don't advance that far, but then again he mostly plays on poor teams except for him (the Clippers are obviously better than his Hornets teams, but are still a very flawed team overall).

[Roy H.]

Then we'll compare actual Playoffs stats.

Parker's playoffs this year are just ignored, huh?

23 points, 7 assists, and a 12-2 record seems relevant.

[Moranis]

Not sure there's a PG I'd rather have in the playoffs than Parker.

Skillset-wise, he's top 5 (not even sure top 3) but the kid really seems to step it up come playoff time.

He's certainly the most successful.  If I had to pick any point guard to lead my team in a playoff series, it would be Parker.

Yeah, Parker, like Rondo, is a beast of a PG in the playoffs. They both really raise their games under the microscope of the playoffs whereas players like CP3, Westbrook, Rose and Williams pretty much play at the level they always play at or play slightly worse come playoff time.

To me, I think its because both are such great half court floor generals which is the style of offense played for the most part in the playoffs. As guys who run offenses in the half court I think they are the best. Then CP3 and Williams. Then the next level is the guys that are outstanding PGs but their half court offenses revolve around them scoring like Irving, Rose, Westbrook, Curry, etc.

Yes this both guys will put up whatever stat the TEAM needs, Chris Paul and Williams just don't seem to have in terms of leading a group.   Knock rondo all you can but his playoff numbers are all time great levels.   I feel rondo Parker and rose can raise any part of their game to affect the team in a payoff win situation

Chris Paul has better career playoff numbers than Rajon Rondo in virtually every single statistic (Rondo only beats Paul in rebounds at 6 to 5, turnovers 2.8 to 3, and fouls 2.5 to 2.7).