why does Doc act like he is doing Celtics a favor

[dark_lord]

smh @ myself for reading this thread, lol

[nickagneta]

Of course it is my personal feeling, that does not make it wrong does it?

No, you can dislike Doc all you want. But when you manufacture imaginary situations about a business relationship based on your personal feeling, simply to vilify a person you don't like, then what you do is create a false image of reality.

By the way, what you describe the 5 year contract not really being a five year contract would be an illusory contract. Basically, the Celtics are bound to a five year contract and Doc is  not because he can leave at anytime he wants with no repercussions. The Celtics get nothing in return for committing to Doc for 5 years, not even the public perception that they have a coach's commitment for 5 years.

What the Celtics get out of such a contract is the services of Doc Rivers for as long as he decides he wants to coach this team, which is no more or less than they would have gotten if it was strictly a five year commitment. Doc could still resign any time he wants and not take any more money from the Celtics.

Also, the Celtics can terminate the contract any time they want. Firing a coach is always within the rights of any team, so they have the same rights as Doc to get out of the contract, only they would have to pay Doc.

If after being here as long as he has and enduring the best of the best seasons and the worst of the worst seasons, if the public perception isn't that Doc is 100% committed to this team, I don't know what to tell you. My guess here is you are in the humungously small sample of people that feel that there is a perception that Doc isn't committed to the organization. You have the right to feel that way. People feel like the USA didn't go to the moon and that the US government blew up the World Trade Center as well. They have that right. It doesn't make them right, but they can feel that way and look at things that way if they wish. Same goes for your opinion on this matter.

It just seems to me that many here love Doc more than they love the Celtics.

Actually what I think is happening here is that the vast majority of people, even a bunch that have had problems with Doc and his coaching, are taking you to task for your opinion because it is so far out there and interjecting some emotion into the situation that just doesn't appear to exist. People who both like and dislike Doc are bringing this matter to your attention. I think that speaks volumes about just how far from reality your opinion might be.

So basically the Cs are bound to the 5 years of paying Doc, but Doc can walk at anytime without repercussion - contract of illusion. We really do not have a contract.

Two things are quite telling in this post. The first is that you think a simple question vilifies the coach, and second none of you have given the name of another coach that puts his organization through this in the middle of a contract.

No, its the way you phrased the question that vilified the coach. Introducing emotion and assuming arrogance and entitlement on Doc's part in putting out the question is what vilified him, not the question itself. If you asked, "why does Doc get to decide whether he is coming back or not when he has a 5 year contract", is a simple question. Stating "why does Doc act like he is doing Celtics a favor" is vilification.

Also, something you seem to be missing is that if the Celtics fire Doc, then since they are terminating the contract they have to pay Doc the full contract. If Doc walks, he gives up what is left on the contract. He does not receive that money. Its a reciprocal situation on both parts in that regard.

Lastly, if Doc wasn't here, I would want, Jeff Van Gundy, since his defensive system is extremely close to Doc's(they are both Pat Riley disciples). I wouldn't mind having Pops here, but that is not happening. I think Rick Carlisle would make for a good replacement. I also think Kevin McHale would be a good fit here as well.

Other than that, I am not sure the Celtics are getting as good a coach or a better coach than Doc but are taking a step backwards. And even with McHale, I think they are taking a step backwards, but I think McHale and Ainge would work well together, which I believe will be very important in getting a new coach, unless ownership decides to move on from both Ainge and Doc simultaneously.

[Tgro]

It just seems to me that many here love Doc more than they love the Celtics.

Wow, that comment just took the whole cake. Even those of us that love having Doc Rivers as coach would move on if Doc left. It's not the Boston Doc Rivers we cheer for. It's the Boston Celtics.

People are on both sides as far as wanting Doc to be our coach. Some hate him being our coach and some like him being our coach but I doubt any of us would leave being Boston Celtics fans if Doc quit the team.

 

 

[CelticConcourse]

Ogaju, do you really think any of us here are on this forum solely because we like Doc as a coach?

I think we're here because we like the Celtics.

[Celtics18]

Has Doc Rivers said at any point this season or this off-season that he was considering not coaching the Celtics next year? 

[BballTim]

of course not. Doc is free to walk away from the contract but he will then be in breach of the legal obligation and will have to pay damages unless the Cs waive their right to collect.

  The great thing about the Celts collecting damages if Doc walked away is that I'd have a good shot at coaching the team next year as no coach with a better resume than mine would ever consider coming to the Celts.

[mmmmm]

OKAY I WILL TRY AGAIN

1. It was announced last year that Doc Rivers and the Boston Celtics entered into a new five year contract for Doc to coach the team. That contracts obligates him to coach the team for 5 years. He is bound to the Celtics for 5 years unless the team agrees to let him go.

2. He violates that contract when he acts as if he does not have an obligation. The statements he makes to the press do not acknowledge that he is bound to coach the Celtics for 5 years if he were to honor his contract.

If hope this answers your questions.

You apparently have no idea how an employment contract works or what it is for.

The contract ensures that so long as Doc provides the services he is contracted for in good faith that the Celtics will pay the agreed sums, as broken into the service and payout periods defined in the contract.

If Doc arbitrarily walks - there most definitely IS a repercussion!  He would not get paid!

If he sticks around- he can still be fired.   If he could show that he was able and willing to provide the services he was contracted for in good faith, then the Celtics would be obligated to still pay out his contract.   If they could show he was not (i.e., he was fired with cause) then they would not.   It is not uncommon for teams and coaches to agreed to a buyout in the middle, when a relationship goes sour.

The details of the contract and federal and state employment laws would cover the details of what constitutes good faith and cause.

Neither Doc nor the Celtics have any particular 'advantage' in this relationship.  It is pure, standard business.

[Boston Garden Leprechaun]

No, I expect him to do his job. Coach the players, teach the young ones, and develop the talent.

In Doc's time he has developed Al Jefferson, Kendrick Perkins, Rajon Rondo, Avery Bradley, Jared Sullinger and a host of other young players. Doc plays young guys with talent. That has been established beyond a doubt.

Don't run our stars into the ground.

This year Doc kept KG's and PP's minutes down and shut them down for long stretches at the end of the year. What else was he supposed to do?

And stop acting like he is being charitable to the organization. Act like you really want to be here for the long term or move to whatever dream job you long for, possibly the Lakers.

Frankly I think it is a slap to the organization that he has to weigh every year if he is coming back. Are there any other teams with this issue with their coach?

Whether you agree with it or not, Doc is widely regarded as one of the top coaches in the game. Good players get perks (e.g., KG's no-trade clause). So do good coaches.

One of the things Doc and Danny have agreed upon, as part of their working relationship, is that Danny gives Doc this freedom. It's a pretty minor thing, to be honest. Doc usually decides what he's going to do in relatively short order.

Danny's cool with it, as, seemingly, is everyone else in the Celtics organization. If this were causing trouble that would be one thing, but it's not.

What's your issue with it then?

yes some, defensively, although rondo is NOT a defensive stalwart in any sense. perk is not a beast. sully is just getting going. too early to judge him. Big al is a great defender? that is one of his weaknesses, DEFENSE! yet you want to credit doc with developing him?doc does not get the most out of his guys offensively nor are his offensive systems very good. we see that with his rebounding and lack of attacking and small ball. sure he said he wanted to attack, but talk is very cheap.; if the team is not listening we need a coach who can get a team to LISTEN!!!!!!

[Ogaju]

OKAY I WILL TRY AGAIN

1. It was announced last year that Doc Rivers and the Boston Celtics entered into a new five year contract for Doc to coach the team. That contracts obligates him to coach the team for 5 years. He is bound to the Celtics for 5 years unless the team agrees to let him go.

2. He violates that contract when he acts as if he does not have an obligation. The statements he makes to the press do not acknowledge that he is bound to coach the Celtics for 5 years if he were to honor his contract.

If hope this answers your questions.

You apparently have no idea how an employment contract works or what it is for.

The contract ensures that so long as Doc provides the services he is contracted for in good faith that the Celtics will pay the agreed sums, as broken into the service and payout periods defined in the contract.

If Doc arbitrarily walks - there most definitely IS a repercussion!  He would not get paid!

If he sticks around- he can still be fired.   If he could show that he was able and willing to provide the services he was contracted for in good faith, then the Celtics would be obligated to still pay out his contract.   If they could show he was not (i.e., he was fired with cause) then they would not.   It is not uncommon for teams and coaches to agreed to a buyout in the middle, when a relationship goes sour.

The details of the contract and federal and state employment laws would cover the details of what constitutes good faith and cause.

Neither Doc nor the Celtics have any particular 'advantage' in this relationship.  It is pure, standard business.

I know exactly how employment contracts work, and I have already acknowledged that Doc would not get paid if he walked, in fact I said he could be sued if he did  not complete the contract. Doc is definitely acting from a position of advantage. He knows he can breach the contract and not get sued because suing him would be bad business for Celtics.

[thirstyboots18]

I believe that he could be blocked from working as a coach for the duration of his contract, unless an agreeable settlement was made by Doc or by the other team, either in cash or personnel.  Not sure about it, though.

[mmmmm]

OKAY I WILL TRY AGAIN

1. It was announced last year that Doc Rivers and the Boston Celtics entered into a new five year contract for Doc to coach the team. That contracts obligates him to coach the team for 5 years. He is bound to the Celtics for 5 years unless the team agrees to let him go.

2. He violates that contract when he acts as if he does not have an obligation. The statements he makes to the press do not acknowledge that he is bound to coach the Celtics for 5 years if he were to honor his contract.

If hope this answers your questions.

You apparently have no idea how an employment contract works or what it is for.

The contract ensures that so long as Doc provides the services he is contracted for in good faith that the Celtics will pay the agreed sums, as broken into the service and payout periods defined in the contract.

If Doc arbitrarily walks - there most definitely IS a repercussion!  He would not get paid!

If he sticks around- he can still be fired.   If he could show that he was able and willing to provide the services he was contracted for in good faith, then the Celtics would be obligated to still pay out his contract.   If they could show he was not (i.e., he was fired with cause) then they would not.   It is not uncommon for teams and coaches to agreed to a buyout in the middle, when a relationship goes sour.

The details of the contract and federal and state employment laws would cover the details of what constitutes good faith and cause.

Neither Doc nor the Celtics have any particular 'advantage' in this relationship.  It is pure, standard business.

I know exactly how employment contracts work, and I have already acknowledged that Doc would not get paid if he walked, in fact I said he could be sued if he did  not complete the contract. Doc is definitely acting from a position of advantage. He knows he can breach the contract and not get sued because suing him would be bad business for Celtics.

No.  You are totally making crap up.

Doc could only be sued (successfully) if the C's showed he caused inordinate damages by not working for them.   Otherwise, the ordinary 'damage' of him not working is already factored in to the contract in the form of the money he would not get paid.

He would not get sued for not coming back because that's an insane notion - there is nothing to sue about (unless they paid him in advance).   You don't get sued for not working.  You just don't get paid.

The only 'Doc walks away' scenario where a 'lawsuit' would enter would be if Doc attempted to get hired on by another team while still under the umbrella of the contract.   He would not be allowed to do that.   Of course, no team would attempt to HIRE him while he was still under active contract.   Its a total fantasy proposition.

You really have absolutely nothing here.

This thread was entertaining.  But it's also completely stupid and baseless.

All we are left with is that you apparently don't like Doc.

Whatever.

[Clench123]

Wow...6 pages of whole bunch of people feeding a giant troll

[kgainez]

by coaching. Is there any other team in the league that has to wonder whether its coach (under contract) is coming back?

i haven't read this entire thread but I'd like to chime in

and I'll say that I agree

but for me, it's not just a Doc Rivers thing. It's a Doc/KG/PP thing. It's not as much as he's doing us a favor as he's doing a favor to KG and PP. It's like the 3 of them are playing for each other and not the rest of the organization and THAT's what I don't like. The whole 'I stay if he stays' attitude is sophomoric to me. Make your own decision...and if you don't like the situation you're in minus the other 2 make suggestions to change it.

[LooseCannon]

by coaching. Is there any other team in the league that has to wonder whether its coach (under contract) is coming back?

i haven't read this entire thread but I'd like to chime in

and I'll say that I agree

but for me, it's not just a Doc Rivers thing. It's a Doc/KG/PP thing. It's not as much as he's doing us a favor as he's doing a favor to KG and PP. It's like the 3 of them are playing for each other and not the rest of the organization and THAT's what I don't like. The whole 'I stay if he stays' attitude is sophomoric to me. Make your own decision...and if you don't like the situation you're in minus the other 2 make suggestions to change it.

How do you feel about Popovich saying he'll retire when Tim Duncan does?

[CoachBo]

This thread elevates the level of inexplicable Doc Rivers hate on this board to a new level.