Horford for Rondo if Dwight Howard wants to play at home

[Moranis]

There is no chance that Atlanta would trade Horford and Teague for Rondo and a 2nd.  None at all.  I mean seriously which team would you rather have

Rondo, Williams, Smith, Gigantic ?, Howard

or

Teague, Williams, Smith, Horford, Howard

Clear no brainer, you take the second team and don't give it a second thought.  I don't even know if Atlanta would trade Horford straight up for Rondo, never the less add in Teague on top of it.

I think the idea behind Atlanta being willing to give up Teague and Smith is that Smith's resigning is contingent on bringing in his best friend Rondo or that Smith is willing to resign at below his market value because he wants to play with Rondo.

Rondo brings in extra value given his relationship with Smith and in making the team significantly more appealing to FA's by having 2 "stars" (Smith hasn't been an all-star yet).

Atlanta doesn't have the leverage here since Smith could walk as a free agent and they are really only getting anything back for him if Smith is interested in a sign and trade or if they convince him to come back. The Celtics on the other hand have all the leverage since they have no real pressing need to move Rondo given his contract and the state of our team.

Atlanta can re-sign Smith if they want.  They haven't wanted to pay him a full max contract, but they could easily re-sign him and Smith would go back there for a full max.  Smith isn't taking a discount just to play with Rondo.  He is going to sign for whomever shows him the money.

Thats exactly my point. Atlanta could resign him if they want to give him a full max contract, but obviously they don't or they wouldn't be shopping him so hard.

I don't think they want to bring Smith back at the max, but if he were willing to take a discount to play with Rondo then they are 2/3 of the way to their own big 3.

I think its entirely possible Smith would take a pay cut to play with Rondo and vice versa. No contending team is going to want to hand over max money to Josh Smith so he can either go elsewhere for max money or he can resign a still very lucrative contract but below market value and play with Rondo.

I think Atlanta only does the deal if Smith resigns at lower than the max, but that doesn't seem too far fetched for me after seeing everyone take a pay cut to go to Miami.

Smith is also buddies with Dwight Howard though and Dwight is the better player and much more likely to lead to a title.  So in your hypothetical, why wouldn't Smith be just as willing to take a pay cut to play with Dwight.  Thus there is no reason for Atlanta to diminish its roster for something it would already have.  Horford + Teague is better than Rondo. 

Atlanta just has no desire to pay Smith max money and frankly they shouldn't.  And Smith just does not seem like the kind of guy that is going to give a big discount to stay in Atlanta no matter who his teammates are.  It just isn't a trade Atlanta will make, especially with Rondo coming off an injury.  Horford's 17/10 plus Teague's 15/7 is just more valuable than Rondo's 11/12.

[indeedproceed]

There is no chance that Atlanta would trade Horford and Teague for Rondo and a 2nd.  None at all.  I mean seriously which team would you rather have

Rondo, Williams, Smith, Gigantic ?, Howard

or

Teague, Williams, Smith, Horford, Howard

Clear no brainer, you take the second team and don't give it a second thought.  I don't even know if Atlanta would trade Horford straight up for Rondo, never the less add in Teague on top of it.

I'd go something with:

Rondo
?/Williams
?
Smith
Howard

I think that's a better team, both to compete with Miami in the long-term, and to maximize their defensive potential.

EDIT: That's not to say that I don't like Horford, just that the combination of Rondo/Smith/Horford is 1 shot creator away from a championship.

[Moranis]

There is no chance that Atlanta would trade Horford and Teague for Rondo and a 2nd.  None at all.  I mean seriously which team would you rather have

Rondo, Williams, Smith, Gigantic ?, Howard

or

Teague, Williams, Smith, Horford, Howard

Clear no brainer, you take the second team and don't give it a second thought.  I don't even know if Atlanta would trade Horford straight up for Rondo, never the less add in Teague on top of it.

I'd go something with:

Rondo
?/Williams
?
Smith
Howard

I think that's a better team, both to compete with Miami in the long-term, and to maximize their defensive potential.

EDIT: That's not to say that I don't like Horford, just that the combination of Rondo/Smith/Horford is 1 shot creator away from a championship.

But they have no ability to get that shot creator with their cap issues.  Horford's 17/10 and Teague's 15/7 are better than Rondo's 11/12 with a team that has Howard and Smith.  That team needs Teague's shooting from the PG position and doesn't need the better play making of Rondo as Horford is a good jump shooter to go along with Dwight's interior play.  The front line of Howard/Horford/Smith would be the best in basketball and Teague is an up and coming PG similar to how Conley was a couple years ago.  If they signed Dwight and re-signed Smith to the team they have in place they would be a real and true threat to Miami.  They still would be with Rondo instead of Horford/Teague, but I think that hurts their depth and takes away the interior advantage they would have on Miami.

[LooseCannon]

Thats exactly my point. Atlanta could resign him if they want to give him a full max contract, but obviously they don't or they wouldn't be shopping him so hard.

Reportedly, the Hawks offered him a three-year extension worth over $45 million, which is the maximum length extension they are allowed to offer, but Smith turned it down because he wanted to be able to sign a longer, bigger deal as a free agent.  Atlanta is concerned that Smith's feelings are sufficiently hurt that he will pull a Ray Allen and go somewhere else because he feels disrespected and it sounds like Smith's idea of respect is a team being willing to hand over a ton of money without hesitation.

[connor]

There is no chance that Atlanta would trade Horford and Teague for Rondo and a 2nd.  None at all.  I mean seriously which team would you rather have

Rondo, Williams, Smith, Gigantic ?, Howard

or

Teague, Williams, Smith, Horford, Howard

Clear no brainer, you take the second team and don't give it a second thought.  I don't even know if Atlanta would trade Horford straight up for Rondo, never the less add in Teague on top of it.

I think the idea behind Atlanta being willing to give up Teague and Smith is that Smith's resigning is contingent on bringing in his best friend Rondo or that Smith is willing to resign at below his market value because he wants to play with Rondo.

Rondo brings in extra value given his relationship with Smith and in making the team significantly more appealing to FA's by having 2 "stars" (Smith hasn't been an all-star yet).

Atlanta doesn't have the leverage here since Smith could walk as a free agent and they are really only getting anything back for him if Smith is interested in a sign and trade or if they convince him to come back. The Celtics on the other hand have all the leverage since they have no real pressing need to move Rondo given his contract and the state of our team.

Atlanta can re-sign Smith if they want.  They haven't wanted to pay him a full max contract, but they could easily re-sign him and Smith would go back there for a full max.  Smith isn't taking a discount just to play with Rondo.  He is going to sign for whomever shows him the money.

Thats exactly my point. Atlanta could resign him if they want to give him a full max contract, but obviously they don't or they wouldn't be shopping him so hard.

I don't think they want to bring Smith back at the max, but if he were willing to take a discount to play with Rondo then they are 2/3 of the way to their own big 3.

I think its entirely possible Smith would take a pay cut to play with Rondo and vice versa. No contending team is going to want to hand over max money to Josh Smith so he can either go elsewhere for max money or he can resign a still very lucrative contract but below market value and play with Rondo.

I think Atlanta only does the deal if Smith resigns at lower than the max, but that doesn't seem too far fetched for me after seeing everyone take a pay cut to go to Miami.

Smith is also buddies with Dwight Howard though and Dwight is the better player and much more likely to lead to a title.  So in your hypothetical, why wouldn't Smith be just as willing to take a pay cut to play with Dwight.  Thus there is no reason for Atlanta to diminish its roster for something it would already have.  Horford + Teague is better than Rondo. 

Atlanta just has no desire to pay Smith max money and frankly they shouldn't.  And Smith just does not seem like the kind of guy that is going to give a big discount to stay in Atlanta no matter who his teammates are.  It just isn't a trade Atlanta will make, especially with Rondo coming off an injury.  Horford's 17/10 plus Teague's 15/7 is just more valuable than Rondo's 11/12.

I have to strongly disagree with you about Howard being a much better player than Rondo and more likely to lead a team to the title. I think his reputation has taken a huge step back after the Laker's debacle of a season.

I'm not saying Smith wouldn't take a pay cut to play with Dwight, nor am I saying that Smith would take a pay cut to play with Rondo.

What I'm saying is that IF Smith was so inclined because his relationship with Rondo is so strong (I know nothing about him a Dwight's) THEN Atlanta might consider the Horford and Teague for Rondo swap.

Rondo for Horford and Teague isn't fair value for Atlanta, but if bringing in Rondo is the way they can get Smith to stay for good money then they probably strongly consider it, especially if that means Howard could join up too.

Previously you said you would prefer a lineup of:
Teague, Williams, Smith, Horford and Howard

And I completely agree. But if Smith chooses to walk and Atlanta doesn't get anything in return their lineup is:

Teague, Williams, gigantic ?, Horford and Howard.

If thats the case then why wouldn't Atlanta consider:

Rondo, Williams, Smith, gigantic ? and Howard

I choose the latter despite the horrendous FT%s that would result.

[Moranis]

There is no chance that Atlanta would trade Horford and Teague for Rondo and a 2nd.  None at all.  I mean seriously which team would you rather have

Rondo, Williams, Smith, Gigantic ?, Howard

or

Teague, Williams, Smith, Horford, Howard

Clear no brainer, you take the second team and don't give it a second thought.  I don't even know if Atlanta would trade Horford straight up for Rondo, never the less add in Teague on top of it.

I think the idea behind Atlanta being willing to give up Teague and Smith is that Smith's resigning is contingent on bringing in his best friend Rondo or that Smith is willing to resign at below his market value because he wants to play with Rondo.

Rondo brings in extra value given his relationship with Smith and in making the team significantly more appealing to FA's by having 2 "stars" (Smith hasn't been an all-star yet).

Atlanta doesn't have the leverage here since Smith could walk as a free agent and they are really only getting anything back for him if Smith is interested in a sign and trade or if they convince him to come back. The Celtics on the other hand have all the leverage since they have no real pressing need to move Rondo given his contract and the state of our team.

Atlanta can re-sign Smith if they want.  They haven't wanted to pay him a full max contract, but they could easily re-sign him and Smith would go back there for a full max.  Smith isn't taking a discount just to play with Rondo.  He is going to sign for whomever shows him the money.

Thats exactly my point. Atlanta could resign him if they want to give him a full max contract, but obviously they don't or they wouldn't be shopping him so hard.

I don't think they want to bring Smith back at the max, but if he were willing to take a discount to play with Rondo then they are 2/3 of the way to their own big 3.

I think its entirely possible Smith would take a pay cut to play with Rondo and vice versa. No contending team is going to want to hand over max money to Josh Smith so he can either go elsewhere for max money or he can resign a still very lucrative contract but below market value and play with Rondo.

I think Atlanta only does the deal if Smith resigns at lower than the max, but that doesn't seem too far fetched for me after seeing everyone take a pay cut to go to Miami.

Smith is also buddies with Dwight Howard though and Dwight is the better player and much more likely to lead to a title.  So in your hypothetical, why wouldn't Smith be just as willing to take a pay cut to play with Dwight.  Thus there is no reason for Atlanta to diminish its roster for something it would already have.  Horford + Teague is better than Rondo. 

Atlanta just has no desire to pay Smith max money and frankly they shouldn't.  And Smith just does not seem like the kind of guy that is going to give a big discount to stay in Atlanta no matter who his teammates are.  It just isn't a trade Atlanta will make, especially with Rondo coming off an injury.  Horford's 17/10 plus Teague's 15/7 is just more valuable than Rondo's 11/12.

I have to strongly disagree with you about Howard being a much better player than Rondo and more likely to lead a team to the title. I think his reputation has taken a huge step back after the Laker's debacle of a season.

I'm not saying Smith wouldn't take a pay cut to play with Dwight, nor am I saying that Smith would take a pay cut to play with Rondo.

What I'm saying is that IF Smith was so inclined because his relationship with Rondo is so strong (I know nothing about him a Dwight's) THEN Atlanta might consider the Horford and Teague for Rondo swap.

Rondo for Horford and Teague isn't fair value for Atlanta, but if bringing in Rondo is the way they can get Smith to stay for good money then they probably strongly consider it, especially if that means Howard could join up too.

Previously you said you would prefer a lineup of:
Teague, Williams, Smith, Horford and Howard

And I completely agree. But if Smith chooses to walk and Atlanta doesn't get anything in return their lineup is:

Teague, Williams, gigantic ?, Horford and Howard.

If thats the case then why wouldn't Atlanta consider:

Rondo, Williams, Smith, gigantic ? and Howard

I choose the latter despite the horrendous FT%s that would result.

probably agree with you, but I think the team with Horford/Teague is a much more diverse team than the one with Rondo/Smith so I would actually consider it.  I also think Horford is better than Smith and while Teague is not as good as Rondo, his much better shooting and floor spacing would help open things up for Howard and Horford down low.

[connor]

probably agree with you, but I think the team with Horford/Teague is a much more diverse team than the one with Rondo/Smith so I would actually consider it.  I also think Horford is better than Smith and while Teague is not as good as Rondo, his much better shooting and floor spacing would help open things up for Howard and Horford down low.

Horford and Teague is much more diverse, but as an owner you really can't pass up the opportunity to put together 3 stars the likes of Rondo, Smith and Howard. That team is definitely competitive in the playoffs and is selling tickets (which Atlanta has struggled to do) and jerseys.

From a basketball point of view Teague and Horford might be better fits together, but they just don't have the same draw as Smith and Rondo from a business perspective. Thats why I kept stressing the possibility of Smith coming in under the max because they are going to need whatever money they can put together to get shooters to put on the floor with a Rondo, Smith, Howard trio if they want to be successful.

[Meadowlark_Scal]

Giving up Rondo makes no sense at all to me....he is the guard most other teams fear..haven't we seen enough this year of how we cannot move the ball without him....and he has so much more to develop into...want him to invent more new passes to use against us...?

[KGs Knee]

Here's what I don't understand.

Why are supposed Celtics fans proposing trade after trade that has the other team getting the better end of the deal, and in the process, has the Celtics essentially facilitating the next title contender?

Shouldn't the goal be to make the Celtics better, not give away our best players for the chance to be a suck-ass team.

[LooseCannon]

Here's what I don't understand.

Why are supposed Celtics fans proposing trade after trade that has the other team getting the better end of the deal, and in the process, has the Celtics essentially facilitating the next title contender?

Shouldn't the goal be to make the Celtics better, not give away our best players for the chance to be a suck-ass team.

Some people believe in tanking for the 2014 draft.

[KGs Knee]

Here's what I don't understand.

Why are supposed Celtics fans proposing trade after trade that has the other team getting the better end of the deal, and in the process, has the Celtics essentially facilitating the next title contender?

Shouldn't the goal be to make the Celtics better, not give away our best players for the chance to be a suck-ass team.

Some people believe in tanking for the 2014 draft.

Well, if you really want to tank properly see the 90's Spurs on how to do it.  Sit your best player for the entire year, then land a bonafied superstar in the draft, followed by bringing back your injured player to complement your new superstar.

Certainly you don't trade your best player, there's no need.

[Moranis]

Here's what I don't understand.

Why are supposed Celtics fans proposing trade after trade that has the other team getting the better end of the deal, and in the process, has the Celtics essentially facilitating the next title contender?

Shouldn't the goal be to make the Celtics better, not give away our best players for the chance to be a suck-ass team.

Some people believe in tanking for the 2014 draft.

Um, Teague + Horford is better than Rondo and would make Boston a better team next year.  That is not a tank trade at all.

[D.o.s.]

Here's what I don't understand.

Why are supposed Celtics fans proposing trade after trade that has the other team getting the better end of the deal, and in the process, has the Celtics essentially facilitating the next title contender?

Shouldn't the goal be to make the Celtics better, not give away our best players for the chance to be a suck-ass team.

Some people believe in tanking for the 2014 draft.

Well, if you really want to tank properly see the 90's Spurs on how to do it.  Sit your best player for the entire year, then land a bonafied superstar in the draft, followed by bringing back your injured player to complement your new superstar.

Certainly you don't trade your best player, there's no need.

So Thibs totally dropped the ball by keeping Chicago competitive. I knew it!

[Greenback]

I doubt that the Hawks would be goofy enough to trade Horford for Rondo

[Geo123]

If Dwight Howard wants to play for his home town team, and wants to play with buddy Josh Smith, this trade might work.

Boston trades Rajon Rondo and a 2nd.
ATL trades Al Horford and Jeff Teague.

Why ATL - Smith gets to play with his HS and AAU pals, and both players would benefit greatly from Rondo setting them up at the rim.  All the Hawks would have to do is plug in shooters at the 2 and the 3, to make up for their Big 3's lack of shooting, and they'd have a great squad. Jenkins will be in his second year, and can fill it up, and Lou Williams can score.  They could re-up Korver or go with ATL pal and FA Anthony Morrow.  RR, Smith and D-Ho be an amazing defensive grouping. ATL would be strong at the two positions, C and PG, where the Heat are weak, and if their wings were competent, could give Miami trouble in a playoff series. 

Why Boston - This moves allow the Cs to extend the KG era a couple of years.  Horford would be perfect next to Garnett - brawny enough to muck things up, and skilled enough to play in the post and out on the floor. Teague is a competent floor general who can shoot the basketball and isn't afraid of the big moment. If the Cs could add another shooter, like  FAs Redick or Morrow, they'd have a balanced squad that would be a tough playoff out.         

You're crazy if you think the Hawks would trade Horford and Teague for Rondo.  Teague averaged 15 and 7 last year so they probably wouldn't even want Rondo coming off injury...