How much would you pay for a player with 2012/13 avgs: 18.6pts, 6.3rebs, 4.8ast

[CelticConcourse]

Depends on his shooting percentage.   I like efficient good shooting players who are not a liability on D.   I realize this is PP in the thread.  I feel  that PP has gave enough to the club to do what he wants but I also have mixed feelings about keeping him.

Among small forwards, he was 12th in field goal percentage, 8th in free throws attempted, 5th in points-per-shot, 4th in points per game, 3rd in assists per game.

[kozlodoev]

Depends on his shooting percentage.   I like efficient good shooting players who are not a liability on D.   I realize this is PP in the thread.  I feel  that PP has gave enough to the club to do what he wants but I also have mixed feelings about keeping him.

Among small forwards, he was 12th in field goal percentage, 8th in free throws attempted, 5th in points-per-shot, 4th in points per game, 3rd in assists per game.

He looked nailed to the ground, and completely fell apart in the playoffs, especially in Game 6. He appears to be hurt all the time, and unlike previous years, it's affecting him quite visibly. Or he's just gotten old.

I'm sure he can be a useful player despite all of this. He just can't carry the team on his back anymore. It's painful to watch him try, really.

Also, Green gave you 20/5/2 in the playoffs. People largely seem to consider him overpaid at his ~9 mil per year, and all of a sudden an ancient Pierce has to be worth 15? Something's gotta give.

[kgainez]

Depends on his shooting percentage.   I like efficient good shooting players who are not a liability on D.   I realize this is PP in the thread.  I feel  that PP has gave enough to the club to do what he wants but I also have mixed feelings about keeping him.

Among small forwards, he was 12th in field goal percentage, 8th in free throws attempted, 5th in points-per-shot, 4th in points per game, 3rd in assists per game.

He looked nailed to the ground, and completely fell apart in the playoffs, especially in Game 6. He appears to be hurt all the time, and unlike previous years, it's affecting him quite visibly. Or he's just gotten old.

I'm sure he can be a useful player despite all of this. He just can't carry the team on his back anymore. It's painful to watch him try, really.

Also, Green gave you 20/5/2 in the playoffs. People largely seem to consider him overpaid at his ~9 mil per year, and all of a sudden an ancient Pierce has to be worth 15? Something's gotta give.

you get a TP!

[CelticConcourse]

Depends on his shooting percentage.   I like efficient good shooting players who are not a liability on D.   I realize this is PP in the thread.  I feel  that PP has gave enough to the club to do what he wants but I also have mixed feelings about keeping him.

Among small forwards, he was 12th in field goal percentage, 8th in free throws attempted, 5th in points-per-shot, 4th in points per game, 3rd in assists per game.

He looked nailed to the ground, and completely fell apart in the playoffs, especially in Game 6. He appears to be hurt all the time, and unlike previous years, it's affecting him quite visibly. Or he's just gotten old.

I'm sure he can be a useful player despite all of this. He just can't carry the team on his back anymore. It's painful to watch him try, really.

Also, Green gave you 20/5/2 in the playoffs. People largely seem to consider him overpaid at his ~9 mil per year, and all of a sudden an ancient Pierce has to be worth 15? Something's gotta give.

People largely seem to be wrong. If Jeff is "overpaid" at ~9 mil per year, many teams would gladly overpay for him.

[Celtics18]

I'd pay him roughly $15,333,334.00.  Not a penny more than that, though. 

[blink]

He's definitely not worth 15 million. Unfortunately he's just a little too past his prime to be the number one option on a contender.
15 million is Lebron James, Dwight Howard, Derrick Rose money. Maybe back in 2007-2010 but this post season has just shown we are going no where with him as our number one option and taking up 15 million of our 50 million in capspace.

You can pay him 15 million and bring him back to bow out of the first or second round again or we can wipe the slate clean.

The whole argument about Pierce is that he's paid so much, and he's still a great player, but he's just not good enough to lead us to a championship, playing 15 million kind of minutes. People need to realize how poor he's become on the defensive end in the last 2 years. We even resorted to putting our power forward on the rival SF's that are in the same pay bracket as our SF! There's a reason why Danny put a 5 million buyout on the tail end of Pierces deal, so we could move him on if he hit the veteran decline. Rondo going down was just too much of a burden for Pierce to handle at his age.

Id personally just move him on so we can either afford another player with more impact for the same money, or a can lose as many games as possible to better our lottery placement.
Keeping Pierce means we are a mediocre team, and being mediocre just means a repeat of this year or perhaps a 2nd round exit. I love him him but the longer we keep Pierce, the further away we are banner 18.

This is like the 100th time I have said it. Pierce was the number one option because Rondo was down.

WHY DO YOU GUYS KEEP IGNORING THE FACT THAT RONDO WASN'T PLAYING?

If Rondo was playing, he would have been the number one option.

Not just you, but to almost all Celtics fans, seriously, how hard is to remember that Rajon Rondo was not playing? Someone had to take the number one option and take on the leadership and if you would have anyone other than Pierce take the leadership of the team, you are either too delusional or don't know what you are talking about.

No one's ignoring that fact, I think you're ignoring that Rondo is not the number one scoring option. When has Rondo ever been the number one scoring option?
Pierce's defense has become horrible- he can't guard elite small forwards anymore. He's great but he is not a number one option at 15 million and that's why we must move on.
You're delusional if you think we are getting anywhere near another championship with Paul Pierce taking up 15 million of a 49 million salary cap.
Please read all posts before spouting off on a tangent. You seem to do it a lot and it's annoying as hell. Put some thought and insight into yourposts instead of going off on emotional tangents all the time it's getting old.
Give us your grand plan for winning a championship with Paul Pierce on the roster for 15 million a season. Be my guest.

well said chambers.
paul pierce is looking worse each year. the top 50 paid guys in the league are arguably the top 50 players.  if jeff green gets almost 9 mil, bass gets 7 mil and rondo gets 11, i think paul should get no more than 10.

15 is for a guy in his prime coming off a solid 2nd rd exit or conf finals.
they say u make ur money in the playoffs. if that's the case, PP needs to be paid whatever JET is being paid. cuz clearly....smh...

Yes, Paul Pierce is looking less like the Pierce we know each year, but even this year, if you look at his numbers, they are still better than most of the people on that list of highest paid players.

But I think what the folks on the cut/waive/amnesty pierce bandwagon are forgetting is that doing any of those does not bring you $15 million under the cap and then you magically get a player of pierce caliber in return.  Best case scenario, you would end up with 8-10 million to spend, but who is available that you would spend that on that could replace what pierce brings.  Not any first option players, I will tell you that.  So to me, bringing pierce back is a no brainer.

The only way you might get fair value for him, and reap the full benefits of his 15 million salary is by trade so you explore that, but only if it truly nets you something of value in return.

Either way, none of those scenarios are going to make you a better team next year, so why not ride it out with Pierce (as 2nd or 3rd option) and then use the cap space you get when he comes off the books next year.

For the most part, no star player is going to be "worth" his final year on his final contract of his career similar to the fact that they were probably "worth" more during the first three years of their rookie contract. I don't think you can really get hung up on that and besides pierce is still worth a good portion of it even if you think the 15 mill is high.

TP.  I really agree with this.  The whole issue is more complicated that 'is PP worth $15 million next year?'.  If you could sign a free agent to the C's and you had 15 million to give for a player of his age and abilities I doubt you spend that money on 2013 PP.  Mainly because we aren't a legitimate contender for a title next year. 

If we just let him go we don't have his full salary available to find his replacement and it will be hard to get a matching value to the team.  So it ends up being a tough call for trading him to a real contender (not us next year) that he can help push over the top for next year, and us getting less talent / leadership in return.  Plus the issues of history w/ the Celtics.  To me it is actually not a real black and white easy call to make for DA.  Lets hope he looks into his crystal ball and does the right thing.

[vjcsmoke]

I have absolutely no problem with bringing Pierce and KG back...I also have no problem with moving on from both. Tough to make a decision when we don't know the current options.

That being said, I'd much rather root for PP and KG until the wheels fall completely off then root for a lotto team and hope we get lucky.

So would we rather enter the playoffs again next year only to be bounced out in the first round or should Ainge seriously consider a rebuild/overhaul of this team?

It's not just about paying Pierce.  It's about building a championship contender and the long term picture.

[PhoSita]

For a guy who's gonna be 36 and has been in the league since 1998?

An expiring contract, a decent but not great young prospect, and maybe a mid to late 1st round pick, assuming the guy I'm getting doesn't have multiple years left on his deal.

[bcgenuis]

Pierece should be restructured from a 1 year 15million to 2 year 20 million + Team option for 3rd year at 10 million or 2 million buyout.


What do the Celtics need.

1. Starting Center

2. A tall (6'4+) shooting guard that can score 15 ppg and is a 3 pt threat.

3. need a new Alpha Dog and need PP and KG to take on secondary roles - meaning 20- 25 mpg.  Those 2 cannot carry the team to the promised land. Would prefer them to come off the bench for those 20-25 minutes.  This will allow them to play "easier" minutes against bench  players and be more productive.

4. Closeout - Rondo, Pierce@2, Green@3, KG@4, FA center@5.

5. If cannot get FA center would look to sign/trade Bass/Lee/Twill etc... to get that.

Lineup

Rondo
F/A SG 15ppg 3 pt threat
Green
Sullinger
Starting Center (Kaman/Blatche)

Bench

Terry
Bradley/Lee
Pierce/T Will
KG/Bass
Melo/Randolph

[SHAQATTACK]

Pierce an't worth the money anymore...he shots flat footed .....no arc (bad back ?)  , what ever he played awful when we needed him most.

He needs to take a BACKSeat   and ride the bench as a sub or  be traded.....

I can't handle the turnovers from him any more...it like picking the pocket of my grandmother.

[Yogi]

1.  Pierce's contract cannot be restructured.  That can only happen if there is either a player option or a team option, but neither of those exist. 

2.  If Pierce is amnestied, we would have a couple of million in cap space to sign a free agent.  We would also have the full MLE and the bi-annual.  The choice is not Pierce or 15 million in cap space, it is Pierce or one MLE player plus a couple of 2 mil a year players. 

3.  If Pierce is bought out for 5 million, we would have no cap space left but we would have the MLE and Bi-annual.  We would NOT be able to re-sign Paul for next season. 

4.  The only way Pierce can be used to get talent that is even remotely close to what Paul brings right now would be to trade him.  According to Danny there are no packages being offered that is worth trading Paul for.

[bcgenuis]

Pierce does have a team option.  Team can elect instead of buying him out to pay him 20 million over 2 years. lowering the cap hit by 5 mill for 2014.

[Yogi]

Pierce does have a team option.  Team can elect instead of buying him out to pay him 20 million over 2 years. lowering the cap hit by 5 mill for 2014.

This is incorrect.  The team has no option on Pierce's contract.  However the contract has a 5 million dollar buyout.  The team can either pay him the full contract, exercise the buyout which means he won't be a Celtic next year, or trade the contract. 

[SHAQATTACK]

can not   have pierce on the court standing flat footed ,  weak passes, weak shots,  poor dribbling form,   and no handle on the ball.

What ever is wrong....his neck, back, whatever needs fixing.....can't fix it he needs to go or retire.

Fab Melo is more useful than Pierce when he is hurt.

[Yogi]

can not   have pierce on the court standing flat footed ,  weak passes, weak shots,  poor dribbling form,   and no handle on the ball.

What ever is wrong....his neck, back, whatever needs fixing.....can't fix it he needs to go or retire.

Fab Melo is more useful than Pierce when he is hurt.

Ok Pierce was asked to do too much without Rondo but please stop with the exaggerations.  Look at the title of the thread for the numbers he put up last season.  Please tell me how many players in the League put up better numbers than than before pulling out the Fab Melo card. 

Here is a comparison to the League MVP who is a decade younger...

Paul Pierce per 36:
20p 7r 5a 1.6 s+b 3 turnovers

MVP:
25.5p 7r, 7.5a, 2.6 s+b 3 turnovers

The difference per 36 min between Pierce and Lebron is 5.5p, 2.5a, 1 s+b with MVP having much better FG%, slightly better 3FG% and worse FT%.  Paul Pierce is much, much closer to Lebron James, the undisputed best player in the planet than to Fab Melo.