Another reason why Rondo is better than Chris Paul

[celtsfan84]

Enough with the excuses for Chris Paul.  He left NO to go to a team with more talent so he can contend and he couldn't even go one step further.  Is Blake Griffin, Jamal Crawford, Chauncey Billups, Grant Hill, DeAndre Jordan, Lamar Odom, Eric Bledsoe, Matt Barnes not enough help?  The team that Rondo carried to the ECF was way less talented.  After a hobbled KG, Pierce and Ray we had the likes of Dooling and Pietrus.

It's hard to tell if this is a sarcastic post or if you actually think all/any of those Clippers players are worthwhile.  I'll guess sarcastic.

[Yogi]

Enough with the excuses for Chris Paul.  He left NO to go to a team with more talent so he can contend and he couldn't even go one step further.  Is Blake Griffin, Jamal Crawford, Chauncey Billups, Grant Hill, DeAndre Jordan, Lamar Odom, Eric Bledsoe, Matt Barnes not enough help?  The team that Rondo carried to the ECF was way less talented.  After a hobbled KG, Pierce and Ray we had the likes of Dooling and Pietrus.

It's hard to tell if this is a sarcastic post or if you actually think all/any of those Clippers players are worthwhile.  I'll guess sarcastic.

Are you kidding me?  Blake Griffin is a Rookie of the year and two time All-Star.  Chauncey Billups is a finals MVP and multiple time all-star.  Younger than Ray Allen was with Rondo.  Jamal Crawford was second this year in Sixth man of the year.  Lamar Odom was sixth man of the year and all star two years ago.  Grant Hill is as great a veteran as you can ask for.  Eric Bledsoe is one of the brightest up and coming players in the league.  DeAndre Jordan is getting 10 mil a year, and lead the league in FG%.  Matt Barnes dropped 30-10 in their elimination game.  That is not a typo. 

[BballTim]

That's the problem--Rondo's never 'lead' the team in the Chris Paul/LeBron James/Allen Iverson/post-Westbrook injury Kevin Durant/James Harden fashion.

Of course he has. People just underrate him because he doesn't score a lot of points every game, because people are stupid enough to think scoring is the only way to lead a team in basketball.

Think about it this way. Lebron scores 24.5 points per game, plus 6.8 assists (which is another 13 points per game). So Lebron generates approximately 37 points per game for his team's offense.

Rondo only scores 13 or 14 points per game, but also gets 11 or 12 assists. So he is generating approximately 35 to 36 points per game for the C's offense.

A) nice job not quite calling me stupid. That's clever, right there.


I'll give you a great stat for what we're trying to look at: Usage rate. Since you're not stupid, I'm not going to bother explaining usage rate to you, but I will say that it's a much better indicator of being a first option than assists + points.

Here you go:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=1&p1=rondora01&y1=2012&p2=jamesle01&y2=2013&p3=hardeja01&y3=2013&p4=paulch01&y4=2013&p5=rosede01&y5=2012#advanced::none


If KG and Pierce retire in this off season and Rondo comes back healthy from his ACL tear, we'll see how far he can take the team as it's undisputed best player.

  Usage is a better stat for what you're trying to look at but you're completely missing his point. In the 2012 playoffs Rondo scored or assisted almost as many total points per game as LeBron, and the highest percentage of his team's points of anyone in that postseason. You're saying scoring points is the only measure of how much offense a player creates. That's not really true.

  This year we had 6 playoff games and we scored 31 or less in a half 4 times. I don't think that happened at all last year with Rondo playing. Also, look at what happened to KG's offense in this year's playoffs compared to last year's. It's not that he can't shoot anymore, it's that the player that assisted half his baskets in last year's playoffs was wearing a suit to the games.

[BballTim]

Enough with the excuses for Chris Paul.  He left NO to go to a team with more talent so he can contend and he couldn't even go one step further.  Is Blake Griffin, Jamal Crawford, Chauncey Billups, Grant Hill, DeAndre Jordan, Lamar Odom, Eric Bledsoe, Matt Barnes not enough help?  The team that Rondo carried to the ECF was way less talented.  After a hobbled KG, Pierce and Ray we had the likes of Dooling and Pietrus.

It's hard to tell if this is a sarcastic post or if you actually think all/any of those Clippers players are worthwhile.  I'll guess sarcastic.

  During the "trade Rondo" frenzy that popped up after the CP3 rumors his detractors had a few threads where they were listing the franchise players in the nba (obviously not including Rondo). Every single list that I saw had Chris Paul, every single list that I saw had Blake Griffin. Put them together and what do you get? Not much, apparently.

[ianboyextreme]

Totally agree. Hes really special in the playoffs. I hope he crosses that over to the regular season as well this coming season.

[bobbyv]

I think Chris Paul is overrated. Rondo is still the best postseason point guard to me.

[celtsfan84]

Enough with the excuses for Chris Paul.  He left NO to go to a team with more talent so he can contend and he couldn't even go one step further.  Is Blake Griffin, Jamal Crawford, Chauncey Billups, Grant Hill, DeAndre Jordan, Lamar Odom, Eric Bledsoe, Matt Barnes not enough help?  The team that Rondo carried to the ECF was way less talented.  After a hobbled KG, Pierce and Ray we had the likes of Dooling and Pietrus.

It's hard to tell if this is a sarcastic post or if you actually think all/any of those Clippers players are worthwhile.  I'll guess sarcastic.

  During the "trade Rondo" frenzy that popped up after the CP3 rumors his detractors had a few threads where they were listing the franchise players in the nba (obviously not including Rondo). Every single list that I saw had Chris Paul, every single list that I saw had Blake Griffin. Put them together and what do you get? Not much, apparently.

Maybe pay more attention to actual basketball games and less attention to hypothetical lists and opinion threads?  Chris Paul isn't to blame for people mistakenly labeling Blake Griffin as a "franchise player".

Here's a question: do you think Blake is a franchise player?  It's not a Rondo question, so you might be at a loss to answer, but please give it an attempt.

[BballTim]

Enough with the excuses for Chris Paul.  He left NO to go to a team with more talent so he can contend and he couldn't even go one step further.  Is Blake Griffin, Jamal Crawford, Chauncey Billups, Grant Hill, DeAndre Jordan, Lamar Odom, Eric Bledsoe, Matt Barnes not enough help?  The team that Rondo carried to the ECF was way less talented.  After a hobbled KG, Pierce and Ray we had the likes of Dooling and Pietrus.

It's hard to tell if this is a sarcastic post or if you actually think all/any of those Clippers players are worthwhile.  I'll guess sarcastic.

  During the "trade Rondo" frenzy that popped up after the CP3 rumors his detractors had a few threads where they were listing the franchise players in the nba (obviously not including Rondo). Every single list that I saw had Chris Paul, every single list that I saw had Blake Griffin. Put them together and what do you get? Not much, apparently.

Maybe pay more attention to actual basketball games and less attention to hypothetical lists and opinion threads?  Chris Paul isn't to blame for people mistakenly labeling Blake Griffin as a "franchise player".

Here's a question: do you think Blake is a franchise player?  It's not a Rondo question, so you might be at a loss to answer, but please give it an attempt.

  Wait, so the guy who feels that Billups and Odom are the Clip's equivalent of KG and PP is going to tell people to pay attention to actual basketball games? Too funny.

[celtsfan84]

Enough with the excuses for Chris Paul.  He left NO to go to a team with more talent so he can contend and he couldn't even go one step further.  Is Blake Griffin, Jamal Crawford, Chauncey Billups, Grant Hill, DeAndre Jordan, Lamar Odom, Eric Bledsoe, Matt Barnes not enough help?  The team that Rondo carried to the ECF was way less talented.  After a hobbled KG, Pierce and Ray we had the likes of Dooling and Pietrus.

It's hard to tell if this is a sarcastic post or if you actually think all/any of those Clippers players are worthwhile.  I'll guess sarcastic.

  During the "trade Rondo" frenzy that popped up after the CP3 rumors his detractors had a few threads where they were listing the franchise players in the nba (obviously not including Rondo). Every single list that I saw had Chris Paul, every single list that I saw had Blake Griffin. Put them together and what do you get? Not much, apparently.

Maybe pay more attention to actual basketball games and less attention to hypothetical lists and opinion threads?  Chris Paul isn't to blame for people mistakenly labeling Blake Griffin as a "franchise player".

Here's a question: do you think Blake is a franchise player?  It's not a Rondo question, so you might be at a loss to answer, but please give it an attempt.

  Wait, so the guy who feels that Billups and Odom are the Clip's equivalent of KG and PP is going to tell people to pay attention to actual basketball games? Too funny.

My point was that the Clips have no equivalent to KG and PP.  Given that Blake barely played in Games 5 and 6 (20 and 14 minutes respectively, with 13 combined points and 8 combined rebounds), who is his equivalent to KG and PP in your mind?

You seem to be agreeing that CP3 has been saddled with lesser players.  I agree with your statement.

Who is a better coach, Doc Rivers or Vinny Del Negro, bonus question.  Actual answers preferred over sarcastically avoiding the question and fawning over Rondo.

[bobbyv]

Enough with the excuses for Chris Paul.  He left NO to go to a team with more talent so he can contend and he couldn't even go one step further.  Is Blake Griffin, Jamal Crawford, Chauncey Billups, Grant Hill, DeAndre Jordan, Lamar Odom, Eric Bledsoe, Matt Barnes not enough help?  The team that Rondo carried to the ECF was way less talented.  After a hobbled KG, Pierce and Ray we had the likes of Dooling and Pietrus.

It's hard to tell if this is a sarcastic post or if you actually think all/any of those Clippers players are worthwhile.  I'll guess sarcastic.

  During the "trade Rondo" frenzy that popped up after the CP3 rumors his detractors had a few threads where they were listing the franchise players in the nba (obviously not including Rondo). Every single list that I saw had Chris Paul, every single list that I saw had Blake Griffin. Put them together and what do you get? Not much, apparently.

Maybe pay more attention to actual basketball games and less attention to hypothetical lists and opinion threads?  Chris Paul isn't to blame for people mistakenly labeling Blake Griffin as a "franchise player".

Here's a question: do you think Blake is a franchise player?  It's not a Rondo question, so you might be at a loss to answer, but please give it an attempt.

  Wait, so the guy who feels that Billups and Odom are the Clip's equivalent of KG and PP is going to tell people to pay attention to actual basketball games? Too funny.

My point was that the Clips have no equivalent to KG and PP.  Given that Blake barely played in Games 5 and 6 (20 and 14 minutes respectively, with 13 combined points and 8 combined rebounds), who is his equivalent to KG and PP in your mind?

You seem to be agreeing that CP3 has been saddled with lesser players.  I agree with your statement.

Who is a better coach, Doc Rivers or Vinny Del Negro, bonus question.  Actual answers preferred over sarcastically avoiding the question and fawning over Rondo.

CP3 had a better team this year and last year overall. I don't want to hear the excuses. Go look at the scrubs we had last year in the playoffs.

[The Rondo Show]

How many times has all these supposedly better than Rondo pointguards taken their teams to their conference finals not yet to the finals, not yet win the title?  None.  Rondo's done all of that.  He's won us numerous games in the postseason and has single handely taken us really far in the playoffs.  He was just as important as the big three ever was and maybe even more.  This year, we saw how the team was in the postseason without him.  It was very shocking to see a very hot Clippers team get bounced in the first round.  How many times has a team led by Rondo being a first rounder?

To me, this argument should've been killed long time ago.  Rondo is the best pointguard in the league.  He's got the records and the title to prove it.  There shouldn't even be an argument about that at this point.

Build the team around him.  Why would you even think about trading such a talent, one that grew up under KG?

without CP3 clippers are nothing, all clippers players are carried by cp3

without rondo bass wilcox avery pierce sucks big time

bass bad jump shots = rondo assist
wilcox alley oop = rondo assist
pierce turnovers = rondo hogging the ball less turnovers
bradley cut through the basket = rondo assist

rondo useless
bass pick n' pop
rondo shaq duo = super crazy tandem

terry sucks, not utilize by doc
shavlik a pick n' roll defense guy
bass pick n' pop and kg pick n' pop?

rondo holds the ball (floor vision) ray allen circles, find opening, hit 3's
same as terry role which is not working anymore

rondo good floor general with super good floor court vision + a pick n' roll big man + terry on jump shots
doc is lost on his players

 

In Samuel Jackson's voice "English mother****a do you speak it?"

That's one of the most confusing post I've ever read.  But I think I get what you're saying

Hahahaha that's funny

[BballTim]

Enough with the excuses for Chris Paul.  He left NO to go to a team with more talent so he can contend and he couldn't even go one step further.  Is Blake Griffin, Jamal Crawford, Chauncey Billups, Grant Hill, DeAndre Jordan, Lamar Odom, Eric Bledsoe, Matt Barnes not enough help?  The team that Rondo carried to the ECF was way less talented.  After a hobbled KG, Pierce and Ray we had the likes of Dooling and Pietrus.

It's hard to tell if this is a sarcastic post or if you actually think all/any of those Clippers players are worthwhile.  I'll guess sarcastic.

  During the "trade Rondo" frenzy that popped up after the CP3 rumors his detractors had a few threads where they were listing the franchise players in the nba (obviously not including Rondo). Every single list that I saw had Chris Paul, every single list that I saw had Blake Griffin. Put them together and what do you get? Not much, apparently.

Maybe pay more attention to actual basketball games and less attention to hypothetical lists and opinion threads?  Chris Paul isn't to blame for people mistakenly labeling Blake Griffin as a "franchise player".

Here's a question: do you think Blake is a franchise player?  It's not a Rondo question, so you might be at a loss to answer, but please give it an attempt.

  Wait, so the guy who feels that Billups and Odom are the Clip's equivalent of KG and PP is going to tell people to pay attention to actual basketball games? Too funny.

My point was that the Clips have no equivalent to KG and PP.  Given that Blake barely played in Games 5 and 6 (20 and 14 minutes respectively, with 13 combined points and 8 combined rebounds), who is his equivalent to KG and PP in your mind?

You seem to be agreeing that CP3 has been saddled with lesser players.  I agree with your statement.

Who is a better coach, Doc Rivers or Vinny Del Negro, bonus question.  Actual answers preferred over sarcastically avoiding the question and fawning over Rondo.

  I'm not fawning over Rondo anymore than you are over Paul. You're trying to act like the last 2 games are the only ones that matter, before that the Clips were 2-2 with a team they took 7 games to get past last year, so not much of a change there. Doc's probably a better coach than Vinnie, but he's also a better coach than Woodson and probably Spoelstra as well.

  It's pretty nonsensical to accuse someone of fawning over a player when you absolutely worship the ground CP walks on and have no qualms about coming up with a laundry list of excuses for his entire career.

[celtsfan84]

Enough with the excuses for Chris Paul.  He left NO to go to a team with more talent so he can contend and he couldn't even go one step further.  Is Blake Griffin, Jamal Crawford, Chauncey Billups, Grant Hill, DeAndre Jordan, Lamar Odom, Eric Bledsoe, Matt Barnes not enough help?  The team that Rondo carried to the ECF was way less talented.  After a hobbled KG, Pierce and Ray we had the likes of Dooling and Pietrus.

It's hard to tell if this is a sarcastic post or if you actually think all/any of those Clippers players are worthwhile.  I'll guess sarcastic.

  During the "trade Rondo" frenzy that popped up after the CP3 rumors his detractors had a few threads where they were listing the franchise players in the nba (obviously not including Rondo). Every single list that I saw had Chris Paul, every single list that I saw had Blake Griffin. Put them together and what do you get? Not much, apparently.

Maybe pay more attention to actual basketball games and less attention to hypothetical lists and opinion threads?  Chris Paul isn't to blame for people mistakenly labeling Blake Griffin as a "franchise player".

Here's a question: do you think Blake is a franchise player?  It's not a Rondo question, so you might be at a loss to answer, but please give it an attempt.

  Wait, so the guy who feels that Billups and Odom are the Clip's equivalent of KG and PP is going to tell people to pay attention to actual basketball games? Too funny.

My point was that the Clips have no equivalent to KG and PP.  Given that Blake barely played in Games 5 and 6 (20 and 14 minutes respectively, with 13 combined points and 8 combined rebounds), who is his equivalent to KG and PP in your mind?

You seem to be agreeing that CP3 has been saddled with lesser players.  I agree with your statement.

Who is a better coach, Doc Rivers or Vinny Del Negro, bonus question.  Actual answers preferred over sarcastically avoiding the question and fawning over Rondo.

  I'm not fawning over Rondo anymore than you are over Paul. You're trying to act like the last 2 games are the only ones that matter, before that the Clips were 2-2 with a team they took 7 games to get past last year, so not much of a change there. Doc's probably a better coach than Vinnie, but he's also a better coach than Woodson and probably Spoelstra as well.

  It's pretty nonsensical to accuse someone of fawning over a player when you absolutely worship the ground CP walks on and have no qualms about coming up with a laundry list of excuses for his entire career.

No laundry list necessary, his entire career will see him inducted into the Hall of Fame.  I just happen to realize that there is a lot more to team success than the play of one individual player, like KG in Minnesota, Ray in Seattle, and many others.

I'd also say your Rondo fawning is pretty infamous on this board.  I'm not the first (or last) guy to point it out.

Anyway, there's a Western Conference playoff game on right now that I plan on watching (maybe you should do the same?)  Agree to disagree, I guess.

[BballTim]

Enough with the excuses for Chris Paul.  He left NO to go to a team with more talent so he can contend and he couldn't even go one step further.  Is Blake Griffin, Jamal Crawford, Chauncey Billups, Grant Hill, DeAndre Jordan, Lamar Odom, Eric Bledsoe, Matt Barnes not enough help?  The team that Rondo carried to the ECF was way less talented.  After a hobbled KG, Pierce and Ray we had the likes of Dooling and Pietrus.

It's hard to tell if this is a sarcastic post or if you actually think all/any of those Clippers players are worthwhile.  I'll guess sarcastic.

  During the "trade Rondo" frenzy that popped up after the CP3 rumors his detractors had a few threads where they were listing the franchise players in the nba (obviously not including Rondo). Every single list that I saw had Chris Paul, every single list that I saw had Blake Griffin. Put them together and what do you get? Not much, apparently.

Maybe pay more attention to actual basketball games and less attention to hypothetical lists and opinion threads?  Chris Paul isn't to blame for people mistakenly labeling Blake Griffin as a "franchise player".

Here's a question: do you think Blake is a franchise player?  It's not a Rondo question, so you might be at a loss to answer, but please give it an attempt.

  Wait, so the guy who feels that Billups and Odom are the Clip's equivalent of KG and PP is going to tell people to pay attention to actual basketball games? Too funny.

My point was that the Clips have no equivalent to KG and PP.  Given that Blake barely played in Games 5 and 6 (20 and 14 minutes respectively, with 13 combined points and 8 combined rebounds), who is his equivalent to KG and PP in your mind?

You seem to be agreeing that CP3 has been saddled with lesser players.  I agree with your statement.

Who is a better coach, Doc Rivers or Vinny Del Negro, bonus question.  Actual answers preferred over sarcastically avoiding the question and fawning over Rondo.

  I'm not fawning over Rondo anymore than you are over Paul. You're trying to act like the last 2 games are the only ones that matter, before that the Clips were 2-2 with a team they took 7 games to get past last year, so not much of a change there. Doc's probably a better coach than Vinnie, but he's also a better coach than Woodson and probably Spoelstra as well.

  It's pretty nonsensical to accuse someone of fawning over a player when you absolutely worship the ground CP walks on and have no qualms about coming up with a laundry list of excuses for his entire career.

No laundry list necessary, his entire career will see him inducted into the Hall of Fame.  I just happen to realize that there is a lot more to team success than the play of one individual player, like KG in Minnesota, Ray in Seattle, and many others.

  Just like Rondo's career is likely to see him in the HOF. And pretty much everyone knows that there's more to team success than the play of one individual player.

I'd also say your Rondo fawning is pretty infamous on this board.  I'm not the first (or last) guy to point it out.

  It's not that you don't fawn over CP3, it's just that nobody knows who you are. I never see you post anything other than sniping at some of my posts. It's true that my "Rondo fawning" is pointed out a lot,  it's generally a sign I'm winning the debate.

[CelticConcourse]

How many times has all these supposedly better than Rondo pointguards taken their teams to their conference finals not yet to the finals, not yet win the title?  None.  Rondo's done all of that.  He's won us numerous games in the postseason and has single handely taken us really far in the playoffs.  He was just as important as the big three ever was and maybe even more.  This year, we saw how the team was in the postseason without him.  It was very shocking to see a very hot Clippers team get bounced in the first round.  How many times has a team led by Rondo being a first rounder?

To me, this argument should've been killed long time ago.  Rondo is the best pointguard in the league.  He's got the records and the title to prove it.  There shouldn't even be an argument about that at this point.

Build the team around him.  Why would you even think about trading such a talent, one that grew up under KG?

without CP3 clippers are nothing, all clippers players are carried by cp3

without rondo bass wilcox avery pierce sucks big time

bass bad jump shots = rondo assist
wilcox alley oop = rondo assist
pierce turnovers = rondo hogging the ball less turnovers
bradley cut through the basket = rondo assist

rondo useless
bass pick n' pop
rondo shaq duo = super crazy tandem

terry sucks, not utilize by doc
shavlik a pick n' roll defense guy
bass pick n' pop and kg pick n' pop?

rondo holds the ball (floor vision) ray allen circles, find opening, hit 3's
same as terry role which is not working anymore

rondo good floor general with super good floor court vision + a pick n' roll big man + terry on jump shots
doc is lost on his players

 

In Samuel Jackson's voice "English mother****a do you speak it?"

That's one of the most confusing post I've ever read.  But I think I get what you're saying

Every. Single. Time.