This proves it: rondo was the best player on this team

[bopna]

It was a fluke we ever "played better without him"

It would have been a fluke if Pierce and Garnett played great, and we were still losing. The problem is not Rondo, the problem is the production of those two guys fell off a cliff over the last three months or so. Oh well, time to start over.

RONDO is fantastic at getting PP and KG to their sweet spots, their production declined without him. But there os also some truth to yoir assumption..i mean PP is just brutally missing his open 3s right now...i mean even with rondo if your gonna miss those then there would be nothing RR can do about it.

[scaryjerry]

It was a fluke we ever "played better without him"

It would have been a fluke if Pierce and Garnett played great, and we were still losing. The problem is not Rondo, the problem is the production of those two guys fell off a cliff over the last three months or so. Oh well, time to start over.

Them falling off a cliff is directly related to not having rondo, having to expend to much energy and carry more of a load to make up for the loss of rondo, etc.

They were coasting letting rondo carry them to the playoffs, kg was barely playing, doc was tinkering and he went down and they had to flip that switch and rally too soon...now they're burnt out and have legit no one who can even step up like rondo always did on the playoffs with his own play and making everyone better and now we're looking at the first time being swept in the era showing little to no heart. Not a coincidence. Same team with kg out and rondo in would not go out like this. Rajon is actually capable of having epic playoff performances.

[Vermont Green]

First, I do not believe that the Celtics are better without Rondo but to say that somehow this series proves that Rondo is better than say KG, just isn't logical.

The Celtics were playing great without Rondo for what, 40 games or something like that.  It was not because Rondo was out but because KG was playing great.  Then KG got hurt and the team did a nose dive.  Now KG is playing but not 100%.  KG is a much more significant barameter than Rondo, that is very clear if you look at it objectively.

I am not sure we could beat the Knicks even with KG 100%, they are playing very well and Carmelo is dominating.  I also feel it is very doubtful that we beat the Knicks even with Rondo and a gimpy KG, but I can't prove that any more than the reverse argument can be proved.

[sed522002]

It was a fluke we ever "played better without him"

It would have been a fluke if Pierce and Garnett played great, and we were still losing. The problem is not Rondo, the problem is the production of those two guys fell off a cliff over the last three months or so. Oh well, time to start over.

RONDO is fantastic at getting PP and KG to their sweet spots, their production declined without him. But there os also some truth to yoir assumption..i mean PP is just brutally missing his open 3s right now...i mean even with rondo if your gonna miss those then there would be nothing RR can do about it.

You're right..That's why blaming the 20-23 record on Rondo was crazy....They were missing shots like that then too.. I think that had some influence on their earlier record. nothing u can do when they miss WIDE OPEN, UNCONTESTED SHOTS and layups

[CoachBo]

It was a fluke we ever "played better without him"

It would have been a fluke if Pierce and Garnett played great, and we were still losing. The problem is not Rondo, the problem is the production of those two guys fell off a cliff over the last three months or so. Oh well, time to start over.

yes....this is the cold hard facts.......age finally caught up with KG , PP ,  RAy too, .    no one cheats Father Time

that's why the old stars like Ray run and jump on team with young studs .....in hopes of winning again

without young star level talent,  the C's will become bottom feeders

Precisely.

Plus the fact that this team never, ever fit together properly. It was misconstructed from the beginning.

If Pierce and Garnett don't retire in the off-season, the best route to a rebuild remains trading Rondo.

[CoachBo]

First, I do not believe that the Celtics are better without Rondo but to say that somehow this series proves that Rondo is better than say KG, just isn't logical.

The Celtics were playing great without Rondo for what, 40 games or something like that.  It was not because Rondo was out but because KG was playing great.  Then KG got hurt and the team did a nose dive.  Now KG is playing but not 100%.  KG is a much more significant barameter than Rondo, that is very clear if you look at it objectively.

I am not sure we could beat the Knicks even with KG 100%, they are playing very well and Carmelo is dominating.  I also feel it is very doubtful that we beat the Knicks even with Rondo and a gimpy KG, but I can't prove that any more than the reverse argument can be proved.

Objectively being the key issue on this blog.

The fact is, we are not as good as the Knicks. We weren't when the season started; we aren't now.

The off-season rebuild of this roster failed.

[celtics2]

mercifully the Knick's will end this season next game. Rondo will be no use to a rebuilding team.

[krook]

It was a fluke we ever "played better without him"

It would have been a fluke if Pierce and Garnett played great, and we were still losing. The problem is not Rondo, the problem is the production of those two guys fell off a cliff over the last three months or so. Oh well, time to start over.

yes....this is the cold hard facts.......age finally caught up with KG , PP ,  RAy too, .    no one cheats Father Time

that's why the old stars like Ray run and jump on team with young studs .....in hopes of winning again

without young star level talent,  the C's will become bottom feeders

Precisely.

Plus the fact that this team never, ever fit together properly. It was misconstructed from the beginning.

If Pierce and Garnett don't retire in the off-season, the best route to a rebuild remains trading Rondo.

really? seriously? bass wilcox are at there best on offense when rondo was around...even bradley pierce is missing jump shots...we need rondo for that...

rondo was in..bass and wilcox and terry are awful
rondo is out, they are still awful, trade them not rondo
but terry is unlikely for his age and that contract...
bass and wilcox are likeable trade assets to me

[BballTim]

It was a fluke we ever "played better without him"

It would have been a fluke if Pierce and Garnett played great, and we were still losing. The problem is not Rondo, the problem is the production of those two guys fell off a cliff over the last three months or so. Oh well, time to start over.

  There's been virtually no change to Paul's stats lately, they're about the same as they were earlier in the year and not much different from last year's numbers. KG missed a lot of minutes at the end of the season but he was pretty close to as effective as ever on a per minute basis.

[BballTim]

First, I do not believe that the Celtics are better without Rondo but to say that somehow this series proves that Rondo is better than say KG, just isn't logical.

The Celtics were playing great without Rondo for what, 40 games or something like that.  It was not because Rondo was out but because KG was playing great.  Then KG got hurt and the team did a nose dive.  Now KG is playing but not 100%.  KG is a much more significant barameter than Rondo, that is very clear if you look at it objectively.

I am not sure we could beat the Knicks even with KG 100%, they are playing very well and Carmelo is dominating.  I also feel it is very doubtful that we beat the Knicks even with Rondo and a gimpy KG, but I can't prove that any more than the reverse argument can be proved.

  We got to the finals in 2010 with a healthy Rondo and a gimpy KG. It's not that far-fetched. I can see the argument that KG's more valuable than Rondo but he's clearly not better. Rondo dominates playoffs games on a fairly regular basis. Do you honestly think KG's capable of that?

[BballTim]

First, I do not believe that the Celtics are better without Rondo but to say that somehow this series proves that Rondo is better than say KG, just isn't logical.

The Celtics were playing great without Rondo for what, 40 games or something like that.  It was not because Rondo was out but because KG was playing great.  Then KG got hurt and the team did a nose dive.  Now KG is playing but not 100%.  KG is a much more significant barameter than Rondo, that is very clear if you look at it objectively.

I am not sure we could beat the Knicks even with KG 100%, they are playing very well and Carmelo is dominating.  I also feel it is very doubtful that we beat the Knicks even with Rondo and a gimpy KG, but I can't prove that any more than the reverse argument can be proved.

Objectively being the key issue on this blog.

The fact is, we are not as good as the Knicks. We weren't when the season started; we aren't now.

The off-season rebuild of this roster failed.

  The roster isn't a problem. Look at last year's playoffs and this this year's playoffs, the drop off in our offense (which plenty of people correctly predicted) has been dramatic enough that it's easy to claim we'd be better than the Knicks with Rondo.

  We're missing the player who scored or assisted a higher percentage of his team's points in last year's playoffs than any other player in the league. Acting like our abysmal offense is somehow unrelated to his absence isn't objective, it's living in deep denial.

[EJPLAYA]

I am not sure many disagree with the thought that Rondo is the best "player" on this team. KG an PP are better in their prime by a wide margin, however at this stage in their careers they are definitely not as good. The argument however is whether or not he is the right player to build this team around for the future. My argument is no due to his very limited offensive game and lack of effort defensively. I don't think that PG's can be the star attraction and win a championship. Especially when they aren't good offensive players. There are a couple exceptions out there historically like Isaiah Thomas, however he was a great offensive talent and a better player than Rondo by a large margin. Rondo would have made us a little better in this series, however we weren't going to get out of the first round with him. The Knicks are a lot better team than we are.

[BballTim]

Rondo would have made us a little better in this series, however we weren't going to get out of the first round with him. The Knicks are a lot better team than we are.

  We could easily be leading this series with Rondo playing. Our offense isn't a little worse than it was in last year's playoffs, it's dramatically worse.

[ScottHow]

Just try to remember how many wide open 18 footers kg has taken in this series, how many open 15 footers for bass, or even how many easy fastbreak layups our team has/trailer 3's for Pierce.

Rondo makes all those open looks happen. Right now everything we get is contested.

[zimbo]

Acting like our abysmal offense is somehow unrelated to his absence isn't objective, it's living in deep denial.

Pretty much.