Would you rather have Rondo or Sullinger back right now?

[Tr1boy]

Playoff Rondo is what we need, regular season Sully is a plus.

But if next season Sully can produce good rebounding numbers including the playoffs, that's an even bigger plus.

Sully played hard and didn't take a shift off. A fat kid, but with incredible motor. You know what non playoff Rondo did?? Walk up with the ball most of the time and waste valuable seconds off the clock. No wonder guys like Green, Lee were struggling. Everytime they got a pass, it was with 5 seconds left. Or what about Rondo's famous, play bowling with the ball to the midcourt??

why not just get the stupid ball , run up the court, pass the ball like the AB/Lee/Jet/Barbosa did post rondo? It worked wonders

[ChainSmokingLikeDino]

Rondo.  Sully can't win a playoff game (or playoff series) nearly on his own.  Rondo can.

I like Sully a lot, but at some point, talent trumps fit.

when did Rondo win a playoff game on his own?? Is as memorable as Green scoring 43 points a few weeks ago. Unless you win, its not memorable nor significant imo

There's the 2010 game 4 against Cleveland that sent LBJ out of town. His line was 29-18-13. Rondo dominated that game

When did he once dominate like this, this year?? I do remember an assist record he was pursuing, and also remember alot of pounding the ball making selective passes and gambling on defense. Losing streaks, slumps. He changed the way he played, with less intensity , laziness and cuteness

you know what 2010 rondo did? A man is open, you get the pass. You grab the rebound and you are off to the races for a fast break layup. On defense still gambled but tried much harder. Where did all this go this year?

- Rondo was not the only reason for the losing streak earlier in the season and it's funny how it's always pinned solely on him when clearly this team is inconsistent, hence the 5 game losing streak that just ended.

If they both were healthy, I would want BOTH back. Sully is important, but he's not proven when the performance matters the most (playoffs).

It was him. Why can't you see it still?? Its not even relating to two or three players making it hard to pint point the issue. With rondo we were 23-20, barely in the playoffs, and without him suddenly like 15-6? 

Suddenly the guys gelled and Terry, Green , Lee got better? Sully got better? When in reality sully got more passes and a chance to contribute. On offense the ball was moving, the energy was there, the defense was tight (little gambling , bc rondo was like the only one doing it) and we were winning and rarely losing. It was bc of Rondo and it makes sense bc he was suppose to be the star of the team and had the ball like 70 percent of the time

with rondo we were 20-23
before the 5 game skid (which I attribute to a banged up KG) we were 16-7...now we're like...17-11 I think. I lost count.

I'm sure with 2008 we win. I know we are a better team with Rondo, but the blue collar version, not this Gilber Arenas version

God, I agree with this so much. Smh.

I don't know who this "Gilber Arenas" is, but sure, sounds great to me.

I honestly can't believe the ludicrous things I am reading. It is like a whole group of people mainlined WEEI and ESPN First Take straight into their veins and let their fingers run wild on the internet. This is why no one reads Zach Lowe but people love Skip Bayless. Why Bill Simmons is thought to know anything about basketball. Why the Plaschke's and Paige's, everyone knows their names, but people actually thinking about basketball, not broadcasts, haven't made inroads yet to the popular discourse. Thank god it is changing because this b....s... is getting way old.

Half of the comments on this blog are laughable. This fan base can be so bi-polar.

yeah especially the ones from chainsmokinglikedino. Probably chain smoking as we speak. And not cigs either

85 to 90 percent of your points have been disproved by multiple people, yet you are the on clinging to them like a ratty old binky. The remaining 10 are vague, subjective pronouncements grandly divorced from reality.

You claim Sullinger showed some grand improvement when Rondo went down yet he played one game and 4 minutes after Rondo's injury.

You can persist with your stubbornly held points but when they are all shown to be incorrect, by actual evidence, I honestly don't know how you expect people to take what you say seriously.

Swipe at me all you like but your throw some ludicrous junk at the wall and hope some of it sticks shtick is persuading no one. The Skip Bayless style of rhetoric only works because there is a lowest common denominator that knows no better than to find dung sparkling like diamonds.

[ChainSmokingLikeDino]

Playoff Rondo is what we need, regular season Sully is a plus.

But if next season Sully can produce good rebounding numbers including the playoffs, that's an even bigger plus.

Sully played hard and didn't take a shift off. A fat kid, but with incredible motor. You know what non playoff Rondo did?? Walk up with the ball most of the time and waste valuable seconds off the clock. No wonder guys like Green, Lee were struggling. Everytime they got a pass, it was with 5 seconds left. Or what about Rondo's famous, play bowling with the ball to the midcourt??

why not just get the stupid ball , run up the court, pass the ball like the AB/Lee/Jet/Barbosa did post rondo? It worked wonders

Jesus, you know that when Rondo plays "bowling" the clock doesn't start running until he touches it, hence the opposite of the accusation in the next sentence---i.e. preserving shot clock rather than running it down. You contradict yourself in consecutive sentences.

[kgainez]

you guys get really upset when someone disagrees with you lol

sheesh

[Boris Badenov]

Rajon Rondo is:

1. A veteran with nearly 100 playoff games, including 2 finals and one championship, under his belt;
2. A player who has consistently elevated his game in the postseason, in nearly every aspect of the game;
3. The only clear matchup advantage we have at any position vs. the Heat;
4. Someone who has a proven ability to take over and win a playoff game by himself.

Sullinger is none of those things. He has half a year of NBA experience in which he has proven that when healthy he is a capable NBA big man. He averaged 7 ppg and 7 rpg in 23mpg in his last month of NBA hoops. These are average numbers for a quality backup PF/C. He has not proven that he is a clutch performer, either in the regular season or the playoffs.

Do Rondo's 40 games at the beginning of this year prove that he had regressed? Maybe - but maybe not, we've seen him go through slumps before. And he has always elevated his game in the playoffs. In fact his playoff numbers last year were his best ever by most metrics.

The discussion about whether we were better or worse without Rondo is completely empty. The sample size is too small. Too many other players were moving in and out of the rotation. It is a noisy, apples-to-oranges comparison in which one learns nothing of value.

So, the best evidence we have to go on is the longer history. Rondo's playoff history, and his unique advantages vs. many of the teams we fear most, are facts.

Sullinger has no history. In the absence of any history you have to ask what are the odds that Sully could elevate his game enough to be the best player on the floor for an extended part of or maybe an entire playoff series against one of the best teams in the NBA, as Rondo has done repeatedly. Heck, Sully never even established that he could stay on the floor as a rotation regular - in his last 14 games he fouled out of 6 and had 5 fouls in two others - in 23 minutes per game!

If anyone really thinks that the odds of Sully morphing into someone who could lead the Celtics through an NBA playoff series the way that Rondo has done, well then, you are entitled to that opinion. Just recognize that your opinion is contradicted by nearly all of the facts that we know about these players.

[Tr1boy]

you guys get really upset when someone disagrees with you lol

sheesh

chainsmokinglikedino is especially. Talks about skip bayless nonesense gibber jabber. Doesn't actually provide logic in how the new team is better with Rondo and what proof there is this is true. We went 23-20 and was hanging on for our playoff lives, but you can't talk  bad about Rondo bc he is a playoff performer and the face of the franchise.

[Tr1boy]

Rajon Rondo is:

1. A veteran with nearly 100 playoff games, including 2 finals and one championship, under his belt;
2. A player who has consistently elevated his game in the postseason, in nearly every aspect of the game;
3. The only clear matchup advantage we have at any position vs. the Heat;
4. Someone who has a proven ability to take over and win a playoff game by himself.

Sullinger is none of those things. He has half a year of NBA experience in which he has proven that when healthy he is a capable NBA big man. He averaged 7 ppg and 7 rpg in 23mpg in his last month of NBA hoops. These are average numbers for a quality backup PF/C. He has not proven that he is a clutch performer, either in the regular season or the playoffs.

Do Rondo's 40 games at the beginning of this year prove that he had regressed? Maybe - but maybe not, we've seen him go through slumps before. And he has always elevated his game in the playoffs. In fact his playoff numbers last year were his best ever by most metrics.

The discussion about whether we were better or worse without Rondo is completely empty. The sample size is too small. Too many other players were moving in and out of the rotation. It is a noisy, apples-to-oranges comparison in which one learns nothing of value.

So, the best evidence we have to go on is the longer history. Rondo's playoff history, and his unique advantages vs. many of the teams we fear most, are facts.

Sullinger has no history. In the absence of any history you have to ask what are the odds that Sully could elevate his game enough to be the best player on the floor for an extended part of or maybe an entire playoff series against one of the best teams in the NBA, as Rondo has done repeatedly. Heck, Sully never even established that he could stay on the floor as a rotation regular - in his last 14 games he fouled out of 6 and had 5 fouls in two others - in 23 minutes per game!

If anyone really thinks that the odds of Sully morphing into someone who could lead the Celtics through an NBA playoff series the way that Rondo has done, well then, you are entitled to that opinion. Just recognize that your opinion is contradicted by nearly all of the facts that we know about these players.

again hanging onto playoff rondo glory. Did rondo slump alot in 2008-2010 regular season? If i remember , he was actually playing his butt off every game, working with the big three. Those year teams rarely had a night off and were top of the east for a reason.

Regarding your sully point, its true. But its pretty impressive if you ask me, when a 1st year player gets to bulldoze his way into the lineup and make as significant impact as he did. His game was expanding the more he played. It is plausable to say, he would of been just as good in the playoffs, if not better. During college , especially sophmore year he was one of the key reasons why Ohio made it to the final four. 

[syfy9]

Would you rather have Derrick Rose or Taj Gibson?

Tony Parker or DeJuan Blair?

Deron Williams or Kris Humphries?

And people say that some of us around her over value Rondo?  C'mon.  I like Sully, but this is insane.

Very different situations. The Celtics are one of the worst rebounding teams in the NBA. They aren't elite and they aren't deep (besides in the guard positions, which only helps Sully's case). DJ White and Randolph aren't playoff caliber role players. Also factor in chemistry.


We are like a car missing a tire. Rondo is like a premier engine, one of the best in the world. Sully is a tire in this case. You can replace the engine with this new premier engine, but a tire is what we need right now. We'll go fast with the premier tire, but the car had already been trucking along as is, even though it was constantly derailed by car injuries. A tire would help the car actually maintain levelness without the evil screeching noise that would/is being made.

[BASS_THUMPER]

Sully

[kgainez]

Rondo messes up the team chemistry...then we're right back to square one.

Then you all would like to say..oh JG/Jet/Bass/whomever disappeared in the playoffs.
 
Right...because Rondo didn't make them apart of the offense.

"If they woulda showed up, we'd have banner 18!!"

 

[Boris Badenov]

Rajon Rondo is:

1. A veteran with nearly 100 playoff games, including 2 finals and one championship, under his belt;
2. A player who has consistently elevated his game in the postseason, in nearly every aspect of the game;
3. The only clear matchup advantage we have at any position vs. the Heat;
4. Someone who has a proven ability to take over and win a playoff game by himself.

Sullinger is none of those things. He has half a year of NBA experience in which he has proven that when healthy he is a capable NBA big man. He averaged 7 ppg and 7 rpg in 23mpg in his last month of NBA hoops. These are average numbers for a quality backup PF/C. He has not proven that he is a clutch performer, either in the regular season or the playoffs.

Do Rondo's 40 games at the beginning of this year prove that he had regressed? Maybe - but maybe not, we've seen him go through slumps before. And he has always elevated his game in the playoffs. In fact his playoff numbers last year were his best ever by most metrics.

The discussion about whether we were better or worse without Rondo is completely empty. The sample size is too small. Too many other players were moving in and out of the rotation. It is a noisy, apples-to-oranges comparison in which one learns nothing of value.

So, the best evidence we have to go on is the longer history. Rondo's playoff history, and his unique advantages vs. many of the teams we fear most, are facts.

Sullinger has no history. In the absence of any history you have to ask what are the odds that Sully could elevate his game enough to be the best player on the floor for an extended part of or maybe an entire playoff series against one of the best teams in the NBA, as Rondo has done repeatedly. Heck, Sully never even established that he could stay on the floor as a rotation regular - in his last 14 games he fouled out of 6 and had 5 fouls in two others - in 23 minutes per game!

If anyone really thinks that the odds of Sully morphing into someone who could lead the Celtics through an NBA playoff series the way that Rondo has done, well then, you are entitled to that opinion. Just recognize that your opinion is contradicted by nearly all of the facts that we know about these players.

again hanging onto playoff rondo glory. Did rondo slump alot in 2008-2010 regular season? If i remember , he was actually playing his butt off every game, working with the big three. Those year teams rarely had a night off and were top of the east for a reason.

Regarding your sully point, its true. But its pretty impressive if you ask me, when a 1st year player gets to bulldoze his way into the lineup and make as significant impact as he did. His game was expanding the more he played. It is plausable to say, he would of been just as good in the playoffs, if not better. During college , especially sophmore year he was one of the key reasons why Ohio made it to the final four.

Rondo has had slumps before. Remember the post-Perkins slump? Or his mini-slump in 2010? Heck, the second half of his sophomore year at Kentucky was a slump, he broke double figures in scoring twice in his last 12 games - which is one of the reasons he fell in the draft.

And his performance in the first half of this year was, for one thing, pretty good on many levels. He did have that assist streak, and while he got criticism for it, it was still a 37 game streak matched only by Stockton and Magic in league history. He was leading the league in assists by a large margin. He had five triple-doubles, including four in January and two in his last two games before the injury.

I mean, even during this supposed slump he was doing things on the court that Sully has never even approached.

And while I was concerned, like a lot of other people, that he wasn't doing as much to make the team better as he could be doing, there were a lot of other moving parts and new players on the team. Lee was playing terribly. Terry was playing poorly. Sully hadn't started to make an impact yet. Bradley was out. Bass was slumping. Green was playing much worse than he is now. You just can't learn anything conclusive from the team's record before and after the Rondo injury - or about his effect on those other players. Maybe Rondo had something to do with it, or some of it, but maybe not.

[go11celtics]

Rajon Rondo is:

1. A veteran with nearly 100 playoff games, including 2 finals and one championship, under his belt;
2. A player who has consistently elevated his game in the postseason, in nearly every aspect of the game;
3. The only clear matchup advantage we have at any position vs. the Heat;
4. Someone who has a proven ability to take over and win a playoff game by himself.

Sullinger is none of those things. He has half a year of NBA experience in which he has proven that when healthy he is a capable NBA big man. He averaged 7 ppg and 7 rpg in 23mpg in his last month of NBA hoops. These are average numbers for a quality backup PF/C. He has not proven that he is a clutch performer, either in the regular season or the playoffs.

Do Rondo's 40 games at the beginning of this year prove that he had regressed? Maybe - but maybe not, we've seen him go through slumps before. And he has always elevated his game in the playoffs. In fact his playoff numbers last year were his best ever by most metrics.

The discussion about whether we were better or worse without Rondo is completely empty. The sample size is too small. Too many other players were moving in and out of the rotation. It is a noisy, apples-to-oranges comparison in which one learns nothing of value.

So, the best evidence we have to go on is the longer history. Rondo's playoff history, and his unique advantages vs. many of the teams we fear most, are facts.

Sullinger has no history. In the absence of any history you have to ask what are the odds that Sully could elevate his game enough to be the best player on the floor for an extended part of or maybe an entire playoff series against one of the best teams in the NBA, as Rondo has done repeatedly. Heck, Sully never even established that he could stay on the floor as a rotation regular - in his last 14 games he fouled out of 6 and had 5 fouls in two others - in 23 minutes per game!

If anyone really thinks that the odds of Sully morphing into someone who could lead the Celtics through an NBA playoff series the way that Rondo has done, well then, you are entitled to that opinion. Just recognize that your opinion is contradicted by nearly all of the facts that we know about these players.

again hanging onto playoff rondo glory. Did rondo slump alot in 2008-2010 regular season? If i remember , he was actually playing his butt off every game, working with the big three. Those year teams rarely had a night off and were top of the east for a reason.

Regarding your sully point, its true. But its pretty impressive if you ask me, when a 1st year player gets to bulldoze his way into the lineup and make as significant impact as he did. His game was expanding the more he played. It is plausable to say, he would of been just as good in the playoffs, if not better. During college , especially sophmore year he was one of the key reasons why Ohio made it to the final four.

You say we hang on to playoff glory, then quote results from 2008-2010 that are inaccurate. We went through major slumps every year after 2008, and then turn it up in the playoffs. They were not playing their butts off when I went to see them lose to New Jersey ( i believe) at home. Literally even expert wrote them off, then they went to game 7 of the nba finals. Your memory needs to be refreshed my friend

[Tr1boy]

Rajon Rondo is:

1. A veteran with nearly 100 playoff games, including 2 finals and one championship, under his belt;
2. A player who has consistently elevated his game in the postseason, in nearly every aspect of the game;
3. The only clear matchup advantage we have at any position vs. the Heat;
4. Someone who has a proven ability to take over and win a playoff game by himself.

Sullinger is none of those things. He has half a year of NBA experience in which he has proven that when healthy he is a capable NBA big man. He averaged 7 ppg and 7 rpg in 23mpg in his last month of NBA hoops. These are average numbers for a quality backup PF/C. He has not proven that he is a clutch performer, either in the regular season or the playoffs.

Do Rondo's 40 games at the beginning of this year prove that he had regressed? Maybe - but maybe not, we've seen him go through slumps before. And he has always elevated his game in the playoffs. In fact his playoff numbers last year were his best ever by most metrics.

The discussion about whether we were better or worse without Rondo is completely empty. The sample size is too small. Too many other players were moving in and out of the rotation. It is a noisy, apples-to-oranges comparison in which one learns nothing of value.

So, the best evidence we have to go on is the longer history. Rondo's playoff history, and his unique advantages vs. many of the teams we fear most, are facts.

Sullinger has no history. In the absence of any history you have to ask what are the odds that Sully could elevate his game enough to be the best player on the floor for an extended part of or maybe an entire playoff series against one of the best teams in the NBA, as Rondo has done repeatedly. Heck, Sully never even established that he could stay on the floor as a rotation regular - in his last 14 games he fouled out of 6 and had 5 fouls in two others - in 23 minutes per game!

If anyone really thinks that the odds of Sully morphing into someone who could lead the Celtics through an NBA playoff series the way that Rondo has done, well then, you are entitled to that opinion. Just recognize that your opinion is contradicted by nearly all of the facts that we know about these players.

again hanging onto playoff rondo glory. Did rondo slump alot in 2008-2010 regular season? If i remember , he was actually playing his butt off every game, working with the big three. Those year teams rarely had a night off and were top of the east for a reason.

Regarding your sully point, its true. But its pretty impressive if you ask me, when a 1st year player gets to bulldoze his way into the lineup and make as significant impact as he did. His game was expanding the more he played. It is plausable to say, he would of been just as good in the playoffs, if not better. During college , especially sophmore year he was one of the key reasons why Ohio made it to the final four.

You say we hang on to playoff glory, then quote results from 2008-2010 that are inaccurate. We went through major slumps every year after 2008, and then turn it up in the playoffs. They were not playing their butts off when I went to see them lose to New Jersey ( i believe) at home. Literally even expert wrote them off, then they went to game 7 of the nba finals. Your memory needs to be refreshed my friend

My memory is clear. You need a refresher. They won 50 plus games and still obtained home court adv. Slumps or no slumps they played hard.

The celts were never a team that relied on talent alone, vs sharing the ball, always rotating properly on defense, etc.

Maybe you were unlucky to see a game where they had a night off.  But in general that was not the way they played. Rondo didn't play like that consistently.

And why would it be a shocker if a 4th seeded team went to the finals?? I don't remember the experts being surprised like they were last year when we made the ECF. We still had the talent plus won it all only two years ago

[Tr1boy]

i think the misconception here is slumps vs playing hard and the right way.

I don't care if Rondo went on slumps. Thats the last thing he went on alot earlier this year. He was putting up the stats. But the "playing hard, playing right" was not there.

If he played hard this year and was slumping, i wouldn't be so hard on him. I bet if he played hard/right and slumped, we would probably win more anyways

its incredible that a Rondo who was not the leader nor even in the top three in assist from 2008-2010 was part of a team that was more successful than a team of this year where he was the #1 assist guy. Back then, when a guy was free he passed it. The ball was moving around beautifully. Rondo usually ran the ball up the court. When a shot went up he would go after the rebound.  He was setting picks and doing all kinds of other activities. I guess now he thinks he is too good to do these little but important things

Anyways i will halt on the Rondo bashing bc i do have a smidge of optimism that after his injury, watching games and the team winning that next year he will change his ways back to his old self. But for now, using this seasons history/stats/team chemistry, i would choose Sully

[Lightskinsmurf]

you guys get really upset when someone disagrees with you lol

sheesh

chainsmokinglikedino is especially. Talks about skip bayless nonesense gibber jabber. Doesn't actually provide logic in how the new team is better with Rondo and what proof there is this is true. We went 23-20 and was hanging on for our playoff lives, but you can't talk  bad about Rondo bc he is a playoff performer and the face of the franchise.

We were 20-23 not 23-20. Sorry but you keep saying the wrong record and its annoying me lol. Carry on as you were tho.