James Harden Traded To Rockets. REACTION!!! (merged)

[Who]

I keep bringing up his name, but I though OKC was another good potential landing spot for Paul Milsap. And I'd have to think Utah would've been more than willing to try to make that work with a few extra pieces

There was a good point made in another trade talking about Millsap being a bad matchup against the Lakers size and length with Pau Gasol and Dwight Howard.

I think Oklahoma are better off going in a different direction with their big men.

I thought Favors or Kanter would have been very interesting targets to pursue. Big men with legitimate size who could've provided a low post presence (to balance Westbrook/Durant) for the next 10 years for OKC.

[StartOrien]

I keep bringing up his name, but I though OKC was another good potential landing spot for Paul Milsap. And I'd have to think Utah would've been more than willing to try to make that work with a few extra pieces

There was a good point made in another trade talking about Millsap being a bad matchup against the Lakers size and length with Pau Gasol and Dwight Howard.

I think Oklahoma are better off going in a different direction with their big men.

I thought Favors or Kanter would have been very interesting targets to pursue. Big men with legitimate size who could've provided a low post presence (to balance Westbrook/Durant) for the next 10 years for OKC.

Why? Isn't the best way to beat LA by pulling Howard and Gasol out of the paint and forcing Kobe or Nash to get continuously embarrassed by Westbrook?

An Ibaka-Milsap combination could cause nightmares for LA's defense.

[celtsfan84]

...maybe to move Thabo to backup sf and give him like 12 mins a game there and try to save Durant's legs a little.

Save Durant's legs? What is he 23 years old? I don't think the Thunder have to worry about resting Durant and his legs any time in the next 7-8 years.

The guy played till the finals and then played in the Olympics. Helping him stay fresh is important and keeping him from getting hurt is too. Just cause Doc plays 35 year olds 44 minutes a night doesn't mean he should

He's 23 years old!!!!!

MJ was playing 39 MPG until he was 37 and still dominating.

The elite(best 2-3 players in the league at any given time) play 38-40 MPG when they are young(especially if they are that good and just 23 years old) because they can and because you want them to. Getting tired at that is isn't a problem. Getting them rest isn't a problem.

Its kind of nonsensical to think you have to be getting Durant rest time when he is in his prime at 23 years old.

The Thunder are a very good team that will win a lot of games comfortably. If you want to pound a kid's knees to dust unnecessarily go right ahead.  Hey how old is Oden? 23ish? 25?  How old was Amare and Kenyon Martin when they missed the whole year with microfracture surgery? Eric Maynor missed the whole season with a snapped ACL and Derrick Rose and Rubio are having some knee trouble right now.  It's ok to reduce exposure to injury and overuse. It's ok.

You can't game plan around injury prevention. Its inviting disaster to strike if you do.

Taking a 23 year old superstar and resting him to prevent injury is an invitation for injury to happen. Never be afraid of an injury when it hasn't happened yet.

I'd like to second this post and also point out that eja seems to be arguing against his whole point.

For instance, you state that Durant should be rested because he has a chance to tear an ACL or need microfracture because of overuse.  Then you point out guys like Eric Maynor, who tore his ACL.  It is worth mention that Maynor tore his ACL playing only 15 minutes per game, 9 games into the season.

The point being, for a serious injury to occur to a young professional athlete like Durant, it would have to be because of a pre-existing condition (like Oden's bad knees, which Durant doesn't have) or because of some freak accident (which could happen 1 minute into a game, or 10 games into a season, not because of overuse).

In other words, you are using a remedy to solve a problem that doesn't exist.  If Durant gets a serious injury, it won't be due to fatigue.  It will be some freak accident that resting him won't prevent, much like Maynor.  Unless your solution is to never play him a single minute, at which point his likelihood of serious injury drops dramatically, but so do your chances of winning.

Do you recommend playing him less minutes than they played Maynor?  After all, as you pointed out, Maynor tore his ACL at a young age (while playing only 15 minutes per game).

[Who]

I keep bringing up his name, but I though OKC was another good potential landing spot for Paul Milsap. And I'd have to think Utah would've been more than willing to try to make that work with a few extra pieces

There was a good point made in another trade talking about Millsap being a bad matchup against the Lakers size and length with Pau Gasol and Dwight Howard.

I think Oklahoma are better off going in a different direction with their big men.

I thought Favors or Kanter would have been very interesting targets to pursue. Big men with legitimate size who could've provided a low post presence (to balance Westbrook/Durant) for the next 10 years for OKC.

Why? Isn't the best way to beat LA by pulling Howard and Gasol out of the paint and forcing Kobe or Nash to get continuously embarrassed by Westbrook?

I wouldn't consider Millsap to be that type of player.

The majority of his shots come inside the paint or close to the basket. He has a good jump-shot but not a lethal one. Lacks three point range. More of an 18-20 foot jump shooter. With Gasol's length, he can recover well on Millsap's jumper and I would bet LA is happier seeing Millsap hoist up 10+ jumpers a night than Westbrook (or Millsap) doing damage in the paint. Plus, Millsap is not a credible man-to-man defender on either opposing big man.

I think that is a matchup that is firmly in LA's favour.

Edit

An Ibaka-Milsap combination could cause nightmares for LA's defense.

I don't think Ibaka can defend Dwight Howard either. Ibaka still struggles too much against physical size/power. So I think both of OKC's bigs struggle with their matchups from a defensive standpoint.

Plus, while Ibaka is a good stand-still shooter, he is not a prolific one. I am confident Dwight Howard will still be able to roam very effectively off of Ibaka. Oh, stand still shooter as well, not a pick and pop threat. Again, easier to help off of.

I think Ibaka still has a lot to prove before that is a workable option for Oklahoma. Maybe he'll be up to the task in the future.

[Who]

Why? Isn't the best way to beat LA by pulling Howard and Gasol out of the paint and forcing Kobe or Nash to get continuously embarrassed by Westbrook?

I think Bargnani would be a very good weapon against LA.

Bargnani has the size, length and strength + post defense to be a credible defender against either Pau Gasol or Dwight Howard. Offensively, Bargnani is a major threat on the pick and pop and has legitimate three point range on his jumper.

[StartOrien]

I keep bringing up his name, but I though OKC was another good potential landing spot for Paul Milsap. And I'd have to think Utah would've been more than willing to try to make that work with a few extra pieces

There was a good point made in another trade talking about Millsap being a bad matchup against the Lakers size and length with Pau Gasol and Dwight Howard.

I think Oklahoma are better off going in a different direction with their big men.

I thought Favors or Kanter would have been very interesting targets to pursue. Big men with legitimate size who could've provided a low post presence (to balance Westbrook/Durant) for the next 10 years for OKC.

Why? Isn't the best way to beat LA by pulling Howard and Gasol out of the paint and forcing Kobe or Nash to get continuously embarrassed by Westbrook?

I wouldn't consider Millsap to be that type of player.

The majority of his shots come inside the paint or close to the basket. He has a good jump-shot but not a lethal one. Lacks three point range. More of an 18-20 foot jump shooter. With Gasol's length, he can recover well on Millsap's jumper and I would bet LA is happier seeing Millsap hoist up 10+ jumpers a night than Westbrook (or Millsap) doing damage in the paint. Plus, Millsap is not a credible man-to-man defender on either opposing big man.

I think that is a matchup that is firmly in LA's favour.

I don't have access to any advanced stats sites, nor will I pretend to know what to do there if I did - but my perception of Milsap is much different. I think he's got a great mid range game (I know he hit a few 3's in that crazy game against Miami, but I agree that the 3 point shot really isn't his range).

And while he certainly isn't a great defender, at least he has some size to him so he wouldn't get pushed around too much.

[StartOrien]

Why? Isn't the best way to beat LA by pulling Howard and Gasol out of the paint and forcing Kobe or Nash to get continuously embarrassed by Westbrook?

I think Bargnani would be a very good weapon against LA.

Bargnani has the size, length and strength + post defense to be a credible defender against either Pau Gasol or Dwight Howard. Offensively, Bargnani is a major threat on the pick and pop and has legitimate three point range on his jumper.

Ya, but he get beaten pretty bad on the other side of the ball by Gasol and OKC gets obliterated on the boards.

You want to take those guys away from the basket, but you also need the personnel who can grab a board or two. Something Bargnani is clearly incapable of.

EDIT: Sure is nice to talk basketball again.

[Vermont Green]

I hope that this isn't repeating something that was already said but I see Joe Johnson all over again with Harden getting a max deal.  Good player but won't take Houston to the promised land and more than JJ took Atlanta there.

I think OKC did the right thing and will be as good in the short term and better for it in the long term.  This doesn't mean that I think Houston did the wrong thing, it isn't bad for them and I can see why they did it.

[LooseCannon]

The justification for OKC trading Harden is the same justification for Boston trading Perkins.  The only difference is that Ainge had to wait for Perk to be healthy before he could trade him.

[Boris Badenov]

So the Rockets basically turned Rafer Alston, Tracy McGrady and Carl Landry (who they got for a 2nd round pick) into James Harden.

Wow.

[Eja117]

...maybe to move Thabo to backup sf and give him like 12 mins a game there and try to save Durant's legs a little.

Save Durant's legs? What is he 23 years old? I don't think the Thunder have to worry about resting Durant and his legs any time in the next 7-8 years.

The guy played till the finals and then played in the Olympics. Helping him stay fresh is important and keeping him from getting hurt is too. Just cause Doc plays 35 year olds 44 minutes a night doesn't mean he should

He's 23 years old!!!!!

MJ was playing 39 MPG until he was 37 and still dominating.

The elite(best 2-3 players in the league at any given time) play 38-40 MPG when they are young(especially if they are that good and just 23 years old) because they can and because you want them to. Getting tired at that is isn't a problem. Getting them rest isn't a problem.

Its kind of nonsensical to think you have to be getting Durant rest time when he is in his prime at 23 years old.

The Thunder are a very good team that will win a lot of games comfortably. If you want to pound a kid's knees to dust unnecessarily go right ahead.  Hey how old is Oden? 23ish? 25?  How old was Amare and Kenyon Martin when they missed the whole year with microfracture surgery? Eric Maynor missed the whole season with a snapped ACL and Derrick Rose and Rubio are having some knee trouble right now.  It's ok to reduce exposure to injury and overuse. It's ok.

You can't game plan around injury prevention. Its inviting disaster to strike if you do.

Taking a 23 year old superstar and resting him to prevent injury is an invitation for injury to happen. Never be afraid of an injury when it hasn't happened yet.

I'd like to second this post and also point out that eja seems to be arguing against his whole point.

For instance, you state that Durant should be rested because he has a chance to tear an ACL or need microfracture because of overuse.  Then you point out guys like Eric Maynor, who tore his ACL.  It is worth mention that Maynor tore his ACL playing only 15 minutes per game, 9 games into the season.

The point being, for a serious injury to occur to a young professional athlete like Durant, it would have to be because of a pre-existing condition (like Oden's bad knees, which Durant doesn't have) or because of some freak accident (which could happen 1 minute into a game, or 10 games into a season, not because of overuse).

In other words, you are using a remedy to solve a problem that doesn't exist.  If Durant gets a serious injury, it won't be due to fatigue.  It will be some freak accident that resting him won't prevent, much like Maynor.  Unless your solution is to never play him a single minute, at which point his likelihood of serious injury drops dramatically, but so do your chances of winning.

Do you recommend playing him less minutes than they played Maynor?  After all, as you pointed out, Maynor tore his ACL at a young age (while playing only 15 minutes per game).

Let me get this straight. You're saying that the Thunder are leading a game comfortably. At this point it's a bad idea to sit Durant because that is inviting disaster? So if only they had played Maynor a lot more minutes he wouldn't have gotten hurt? 

[apc]

and poor Jajuan Johnson gets cut by the Rockets...
I feel bad for the guy.
He could do pretty well in Europe, or maybe China.

[letsgoblue86]

and poor Jajuan Johnson gets cut by the Rockets...
I feel bad for the guy.
He could do pretty well in Europe, or maybe China.

Any other team, he probably makes the roster.  The Rockets have like 5 power forwards on their roster.

[LooseCannon]

Chris, who just got cut by the T-Wolves, is probably the more interesting ex-Celtic Johnson.

[TripleOT]

JJJ isn't an NBA player, as Houston learned rather quickly. Him being cut should tip the Brooks/JJJ debate Marshon's way for most reasonably thinking fans.