2012 CB Draft (4)Celtics Vs (5)Wizards First Round Matchup

[Kane3387]

Kane, i need some convincing myself here:

I'm still kind of stuck on this JR SMith, Rip Hamilton battle...I feel like this matchup could be the x-factor.

I like what Rip did towards the end of the season with Chicago, but I just don't like his fit here.

Convince me he's not a liability and tell me why JR Smith isn't going to have his way in this series with a 34 year old superhero-wannabee trying to keep up with him (AND Lou Williams!!) for over 30 minutes a night.

No one can stop this, all jokes aside Rip cant stop him.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0dPh3cqbow
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWMWEWtJKKU

Anyone has highlights. Lol basically the looks he will get off playing with my big three.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYsJVYiHwjo

Lol your BIG 3 have no floor spacing i dont see how he will get those "looks"

He provides the spacing... you know b/c the defense is concerned about the big 3... The point is that the defense is giving him those looks b/c they are defending the Big 3.

Lol we are not concerned about your BIG 3 Gasol and Gortat will handle Marc and Griffin, Wallace will help out Curry with Westbrook from time to time, Westbrook for the entire season had to take 20 shots to score 23 points and Westbrook doesnt shoot well from downtown

What is you evidence? Or do you just know?

[ronaldo943]

Kane, i need some convincing myself here:

I'm still kind of stuck on this JR SMith, Rip Hamilton battle...I feel like this matchup could be the x-factor.

I like what Rip did towards the end of the season with Chicago, but I just don't like his fit here.

Convince me he's not a liability and tell me why JR Smith isn't going to have his way in this series with a 34 year old superhero-wannabee trying to keep up with him (AND Lou Williams!!) for over 30 minutes a night.

No one can stop this, all jokes aside Rip cant stop him.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0dPh3cqbow
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWMWEWtJKKU

Anyone has highlights. Lol basically the looks he will get off playing with my big three.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYsJVYiHwjo

Lol your BIG 3 have no floor spacing i dont see how he will get those "looks"

He provides the spacing... you know b/c the defense is concerned about the big 3... The point is that the defense is giving him those looks b/c they are defending the Big 3.

Lol we are not concerned about your BIG 3 Gasol and Gortat will handle Marc and Griffin, Wallace will help out Curry with Westbrook from time to time, Westbrook for the entire season had to take 20 shots to score 23 points and Westbrook doesnt shoot well from downtown

What is you evidence? Or do you just know?

My evidence is that Griffin cant shoot and Westbrook is not a good shooter, and Marc is decent but not as good as his brother. Pau is also a better passer then Marc.

[Kane3387]

Kane, i need some convincing myself here:

I'm still kind of stuck on this JR SMith, Rip Hamilton battle...I feel like this matchup could be the x-factor.

I like what Rip did towards the end of the season with Chicago, but I just don't like his fit here.

Convince me he's not a liability and tell me why JR Smith isn't going to have his way in this series with a 34 year old superhero-wannabee trying to keep up with him (AND Lou Williams!!) for over 30 minutes a night.

No one can stop this, all jokes aside Rip cant stop him.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0dPh3cqbow
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWMWEWtJKKU

Anyone has highlights. Lol basically the looks he will get off playing with my big three.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYsJVYiHwjo

Lol your BIG 3 have no floor spacing i dont see how he will get those "looks"

He provides the spacing... you know b/c the defense is concerned about the big 3... The point is that the defense is giving him those looks b/c they are defending the Big 3.

Lol we are not concerned about your BIG 3 Gasol and Gortat will handle Marc and Griffin, Wallace will help out Curry with Westbrook from time to time, Westbrook for the entire season had to take 20 shots to score 23 points and Westbrook doesnt shoot well from downtown

What is you evidence? Or do you just know?

My evidence is that Griffin cant shoot and Westbrook is not a good shooter, and Marc is decent but not as good as his brother. Pau is also a better passer then Marc.

So it's really just your opinion. I have given a number of examples of how I plan on using the pick and roll, transition, etc. for how I plan to score. That is your rebuttal?

Griffin still averaged 20+ in the regular season and over 19 in the playoffs. Russ was an absolute monster in the playoffs. Both these guys bring more to the table then shooting.

According to Pau's fg% numbers in his last 4 playoff series (all below 45%) he can't shoot either.

If you wanna tell me how you plan to execute a game plan then I am all for it. I suggest you focus on that and defend your position with some hard evidence. Instead of attacking me for how I take this game too seriously or by saying things like that guy can't shoot.

[ronaldo943]

Griffin cant shoot, he shoots terrible from the free throw line, he average below 7 rebounds in the playoffs

Westbrook get 23 points in 20 shots he is awful from downtown, i have put his stats like a 100 times so i dont feel like putting them agan but if you want i will.

Marc also grabbed under 7 rebounds a game, Pau got 9.5 rebounds a game in the playoffs and he was playing next to Bynum.

Question for you:
With the game on the line, you are down by three who takes the shot?

[Kane3387]

Griffin cant shoot, he shoots terrible from the free throw line, he average below 7 rebounds in the playoffs

Lol come on. This was his first year in the playoffs, man. He is about to turn 24 and he played a lot of center because Deandre was taken off the court. (21 mpg against Memphis)Thus he was going up against both ZBo and his new boy Marc Gasol alone. That number is skewed because he averaged 6.4.

Against the Spurs. Griffin played less Center and averaged 8 rebs a game. Jordan played 25 mpg this series and it helped.

Griffin will almost never play Center for me, so I think your numbers are exaggerated.

Westbrook get 23 points in 20 shots he is awful from downtown, i have put his stats like a 100 times so i dont feel like putting them agan but if you want i will.

Luckily Russ is only playing against your guards and not the entire league. he will be playing Steph Curry post ankle issues. He shoots the ball well in this matchup.

His numbers against him last year are below.

Game 1
Westbrook - 28 points, 11 assts, 7 stls, 6 rebs, and .500 fg%
Curry - 15 points, 6 assays, 2 stls, 2 rebs, and .375 fg%

Game 2
Westbrook - 31 points, 7 assts, 2 stls, 1 rebs, and .571 fg%
Curry - 16 points, 10 assts, 2 stls, 7 rebs, and .777 fg%

Game 3
Westbrook - 18 points, 3 assts, 3 stls, 3 rebs, and .583 fg%
Curry - 11 points, 4 assts, 0 stls, 2 rebs, and .307 fg%

Westbrook left game 3 with an injury in the third qtr.

Curry can't guard him. None of your players can.

Marc also grabbed under 7 rebounds a game, Pau got 9.5 rebounds a game in the playoffs and he was playing next to Bynum.

Ok well Marc averaged 4 more points in the playoffs last year then Pau did. And he is still trending upwards at 27. Pau at 33 has peaked.

Question for you:
With the game on the line, you are down by three who takes the shot?

The open man.

[ronaldo943]

Griffin cant shoot, he shoots terrible from the free throw line, he average below 7 rebounds in the playoffs

Lol come on. This was his first year in the playoffs, man. He is about to turn 24 and he played a lot of center because Deandre was taken off the court. (21 mpg against Memphis)Thus he was going up against both ZBo and his new boy Marc Gasol alone. That number is skewed because he averaged 6.4.

Against the Spurs. Griffin played less Center and averaged 8 rebs a game. Jordan played 25 mpg this series and it helped.

Griffin will almost never play Center for me, so I think your numbers are exaggerated.

Westbrook get 23 points in 20 shots he is awful from downtown, i have put his stats like a 100 times so i dont feel like putting them agan but if you want i will.

Luckily Russ is only playing against your guards and not the entire league. he will be playing Steph Curry post ankle issues.

His numbers against him last year are below.

Game 1
Westbrook - 28 points, 11 assts, 7 stls, 6 rebs, and .500 fg%
Curry - 15 points, 6 assays, 2 stls, 2 rebs, and .375 fg%

Game 2
Westbrook - 31 points, 7 assts, 2 stls, 1 rebs, and .571 fg%
Curry - 16 points, 10 assts, 2 stls, 7 rebs, and .777 fg%

Game 3
Westbrook - 18 points, 3 assts, 3 stls, 3 rebs, and .583 fg%
Curry - 11 points, 4 assts, 0 stls, 2 rebs, and .307 fg%

Westbrook left game 3 with an injury in the third qtr.

Curry can't guard him. None of your players can.

Marc also grabbed under 7 rebounds a game, Pau got 9.5 rebounds a game in the playoffs and he was playing next to Bynum.

Ok well Marc averaged 4 more points in the playoffs last year then Pau did. And he is still trending upwards at 27. Pau at 33 has peaked.

Question for you:
With the game on the line, you are down by three who takes the shot?

The open man.

Lol i like this the open man, no one is going to be open it will be man to man coverage and you have no one who can shoot the three at a high rate.

Yes Marc did score more than Gasol but he is not playing with Bynum and Kobe.

[Kane3387]

Griffin cant shoot, he shoots terrible from the free throw line, he average below 7 rebounds in the playoffs

Lol come on. This was his first year in the playoffs, man. He is about to turn 24 and he played a lot of center because Deandre was taken off the court. (21 mpg against Memphis)Thus he was going up against both ZBo and his new boy Marc Gasol alone. That number is skewed because he averaged 6.4.

Against the Spurs. Griffin played less Center and averaged 8 rebs a game. Jordan played 25 mpg this series and it helped.

Griffin will almost never play Center for me, so I think your numbers are exaggerated.

Westbrook get 23 points in 20 shots he is awful from downtown, i have put his stats like a 100 times so i dont feel like putting them agan but if you want i will.

Luckily Russ is only playing against your guards and not the entire league. he will be playing Steph Curry post ankle issues.

His numbers against him last year are below.

Game 1
Westbrook - 28 points, 11 assts, 7 stls, 6 rebs, and .500 fg%
Curry - 15 points, 6 assays, 2 stls, 2 rebs, and .375 fg%

Game 2
Westbrook - 31 points, 7 assts, 2 stls, 1 rebs, and .571 fg%
Curry - 16 points, 10 assts, 2 stls, 7 rebs, and .777 fg%

Game 3
Westbrook - 18 points, 3 assts, 3 stls, 3 rebs, and .583 fg%
Curry - 11 points, 4 assts, 0 stls, 2 rebs, and .307 fg%

Westbrook left game 3 with an injury in the third qtr.

Curry can't guard him. None of your players can.

Marc also grabbed under 7 rebounds a game, Pau got 9.5 rebounds a game in the playoffs and he was playing next to Bynum.

Ok well Marc averaged 4 more points in the playoffs last year then Pau did. And he is still trending upwards at 27. Pau at 33 has peaked.

Question for you:
With the game on the line, you are down by three who takes the shot?

The open man.

Lol i like this the open man, no one is going to be open it will be man to man coverage and you have no one who can shoot the three at a high rate.

If that is the case I will go high screen and roll with Blake and Marc setting a double pick. Blake Rolls and Marc pops. Then Russ reacts to the defense.

Shoot if the defense goes under or switches and drops off, drive if they come over the top or switch too slowly or the big closes out on the switch, lob to Griff if they trap Russ and he goes to Blake's side, or kick to Marc if he goes to Marc's side and they trap. I mean it's basketball with three incredibly talented players. That's why everyone wants a big three. It creates a lot of options.

Yes Marc did score more than Gasol but he is not playing with Bynum and Kobe

Yeah I forgot that Blake and Russ were scrubs. I mean it's not like they're perennial All-Stars or anything.

[ronaldo943]

Griffin cant shoot, he shoots terrible from the free throw line, he average below 7 rebounds in the playoffs

Lol come on. This was his first year in the playoffs, man. He is about to turn 24 and he played a lot of center because Deandre was taken off the court. (21 mpg against Memphis)Thus he was going up against both ZBo and his new boy Marc Gasol alone. That number is skewed because he averaged 6.4.

Against the Spurs. Griffin played less Center and averaged 8 rebs a game. Jordan played 25 mpg this series and it helped.

Griffin will almost never play Center for me, so I think your numbers are exaggerated.

Westbrook get 23 points in 20 shots he is awful from downtown, i have put his stats like a 100 times so i dont feel like putting them agan but if you want i will.

Luckily Russ is only playing against your guards and not the entire league. he will be playing Steph Curry post ankle issues.

His numbers against him last year are below.

Game 1
Westbrook - 28 points, 11 assts, 7 stls, 6 rebs, and .500 fg%
Curry - 15 points, 6 assays, 2 stls, 2 rebs, and .375 fg%

Game 2
Westbrook - 31 points, 7 assts, 2 stls, 1 rebs, and .571 fg%
Curry - 16 points, 10 assts, 2 stls, 7 rebs, and .777 fg%

Game 3
Westbrook - 18 points, 3 assts, 3 stls, 3 rebs, and .583 fg%
Curry - 11 points, 4 assts, 0 stls, 2 rebs, and .307 fg%

Westbrook left game 3 with an injury in the third qtr.

Curry can't guard him. None of your players can.

Marc also grabbed under 7 rebounds a game, Pau got 9.5 rebounds a game in the playoffs and he was playing next to Bynum.

Ok well Marc averaged 4 more points in the playoffs last year then Pau did. And he is still trending upwards at 27. Pau at 33 has peaked.

Question for you:
With the game on the line, you are down by three who takes the shot?

The open man.

Lol i like this the open man, no one is going to be open it will be man to man coverage and you have no one who can shoot the three at a high rate.

If that is the case I will go high screen and roll with Blake and Marc setting a double pick. Blake Rolls and Marc pops. Then Russ reacts to the defense.

Shoot if the defense goes under or switches and drops off, drive if they come over the top or switch too slowly or the big closes out on the switch, lob to Griff if they trap Russ and he goes to Blake's side, or kick to Marc if he goes to Marc's side and they trap. I mean it's basketball with three incredibly talented players. That's why everyone wants a big three. It creates a lot of options.

Yes Marc did score more than Gasol but he is not playing with Bynum and Kobe

Yeah I forgot that Blake and Russ were scrubs. I mean it's not like they're perennial All-Stars or anything.

Oh okay so most likely Westbrook will shoot the 3 and for his career he has shot under .300 for 3s i dont have a problem with that.

You are ingenious, i meant Marc with the Grizzlies and i would take Bynum and Kobe over Blake and Russ any day of the week, Bynum is better than Blake and Kobe is clutch

[KCattheStripe]

[jgod213]

Kane, i need some convincing myself here:

I'm still kind of stuck on this JR SMith, Rip Hamilton battle...I feel like this matchup could be the x-factor.

I like what Rip did towards the end of the season with Chicago, but I just don't like his fit here.

Convince me he's not a liability and tell me why JR Smith isn't going to have his way in this series with a 34 year old superhero-wannabee trying to keep up for nearly 30 minutes a night.

First off when looking at their team, I think it is in my best interest if Smith is trying take advantage of his matchup. Smith will score on Rip some, but how efficiently?

Smith averaged 12 ppg last season on eleven shots. In the post season he averaged 12 ppg on FIFTEEN shots.

The guy is the definition of a low scoring volume scorer. And an inefficient one. I have the feeling that every time he has Hamilton on him he will think, "This dude can't guard me" and try to score. With his shooting percentages I will take that over what I feel are better options in Gortat, Pau, and Curry.

As for defense Smith is horrible. Here is what Hollinger said about him.

Synergy rated Smith as the worst defender in the league last season. I don't think he was that bad, but he certainly wasn't good. While Smith has the size and physical skills to defend well, he's inattentive, takes bad gambles and doesn't play hard. He ranked eighth at his position in steals per minute, but only by taking a lot of low-risk gambles that saw him beaten repeatedly. His improved rebounding last season (sixth among shooting guards) may be a sign that he's putting a bit more effort into the defensive end, but relative to every other player in the league he still has a long way to go.

Smith did improve a bit with his Drtg going to 100. His Ortg was 104 which happened to be Rip's Drtg. So make you want out of that.

Fact is Smith is not a dependable player. He shoots you out of games and rarely into them. He had to accept a one yr. 2 million dollar deal from NY b/c no one wanted him. He is also more suited to coming off the bench and has never been successful as a starter. He is starting for the Wizards.

I will not focus on scoring with Rip on Smith, but I am confident Smith will slip up and let Rip out of his sights on more then a few occasions as Rip is constantly in motion and running off screens.

Hm, i wasn't aware that Smith was that bad defensively.  I'm not sure that, between Rip's injuries, age, and lack of a passing PG, that this is the best scenario for him, but based off Hollinger's assessment it sounds like Rip should be able to get his v. Smith.

I'm leaning Boston right now but man i wish you had a different option at the 2-guard spot.

[ronaldo943]

Kane, i need some convincing myself here:

I'm still kind of stuck on this JR SMith, Rip Hamilton battle...I feel like this matchup could be the x-factor.

I like what Rip did towards the end of the season with Chicago, but I just don't like his fit here.

Convince me he's not a liability and tell me why JR Smith isn't going to have his way in this series with a 34 year old superhero-wannabee trying to keep up for nearly 30 minutes a night.

First off when looking at their team, I think it is in my best interest if Smith is trying take advantage of his matchup. Smith will score on Rip some, but how efficiently?

Smith averaged 12 ppg last season on eleven shots. In the post season he averaged 12 ppg on FIFTEEN shots.

The guy is the definition of a low scoring volume scorer. And an inefficient one. I have the feeling that every time he has Hamilton on him he will think, "This dude can't guard me" and try to score. With his shooting percentages I will take that over what I feel are better options in Gortat, Pau, and Curry.

As for defense Smith is horrible. Here is what Hollinger said about him.

Synergy rated Smith as the worst defender in the league last season. I don't think he was that bad, but he certainly wasn't good. While Smith has the size and physical skills to defend well, he's inattentive, takes bad gambles and doesn't play hard. He ranked eighth at his position in steals per minute, but only by taking a lot of low-risk gambles that saw him beaten repeatedly. His improved rebounding last season (sixth among shooting guards) may be a sign that he's putting a bit more effort into the defensive end, but relative to every other player in the league he still has a long way to go.

Smith did improve a bit with his Drtg going to 100. His Ortg was 104 which happened to be Rip's Drtg. So make you want out of that.

Fact is Smith is not a dependable player. He shoots you out of games and rarely into them. He had to accept a one yr. 2 million dollar deal from NY b/c no one wanted him. He is also more suited to coming off the bench and has never been successful as a starter. He is starting for the Wizards.

I will not focus on scoring with Rip on Smith, but I am confident Smith will slip up and let Rip out of his sights on more then a few occasions as Rip is constantly in motion and running off screens.

Hm, i wasn't aware that Smith was that bad defensively.  I'm not sure that, between Rip's injuries, age, and lack of a passing PG, that this is the best scenario for him, but based off Hollinger's assessment it sounds like Rip should be able to get his v. Smith.

I'm leaning Boston right now but man i wish you had a different option at the 2-guard spot.

Rip is too slow to keep up with Smith and Williams and Rip really wont be a factor offensively

[Kane3387]

Oh okay so most likely Westbrook will shoot the 3 and for his career he has shot under .300 for 3s i dont have a problem with that.

You are ingenious, i meant Marc with the Grizzlies and i would take Bynum and Kobe over Blake and Russ any day of the week, Bynum is better than Blake and Kobe is clutch

No this takes place inside the three point line and between the free throw line. Westbrook is very capable from this distance.

There was a point in time when Westbrook pulling up for a mid-range jumper allowed the defense to breathe a sign of relief. Now he's an above average mid-range shooter and unless he has an off night, defenses are often in a lose-lose situation. Of point guards that shot at least three shots from 16-23 feet a game this season, the only players that shot a better percentage than Westbrook, who finished at 43%, were Jose Calderon, Chris Paul, Luke Ridnour and Steve Nash. Westbrook still lacks much of a game between 5-15 feet but since he's either getting to the rim or shooting the mid-range jumper whenever he pleases, that's not much of a deficiency.

http://www.silverscreenandroll.com/2012/5/13/3017391/lakers-thunder-preview-same-speed-more-weapons

[Kane3387]

Rip is too slow to keep up with Smith and Williams and Rip really wont be a factor offensively

I can live with those guys shooting over your better players.

[ronaldo943]

Oh okay so most likely Westbrook will shoot the 3 and for his career he has shot under .300 for 3s i dont have a problem with that.

You are ingenious, i meant Marc with the Grizzlies and i would take Bynum and Kobe over Blake and Russ any day of the week, Bynum is better than Blake and Kobe is clutch

No this takes place inside the three point line and between the free throw line. Westbrook is very capable from this distance.

There was a point in time when Westbrook pulling up for a mid-range jumper allowed the defense to breathe a sign of relief. Now he's an above average mid-range shooter and unless he has an off night, defenses are often in a lose-lose situation. Of point guards that shot at least three shots from 16-23 feet a game this season, the only players that shot a better percentage than Westbrook, who finished at 43%, were Jose Calderon, Chris Paul, Luke Ridnour and Steve Nash. Westbrook still lacks much of a game between 5-15 feet but since he's either getting to the rim or shooting the mid-range jumper whenever he pleases, that's not much of a deficiency.

http://www.silverscreenandroll.com/2012/5/13/3017391/lakers-thunder-preview-same-speed-more-weapons

So you are down by 3 with the game on the line and you take a 2 and lose?

[Kane3387]

Oh okay so most likely Westbrook will shoot the 3 and for his career he has shot under .300 for 3s i dont have a problem with that.

You are ingenious, i meant Marc with the Grizzlies and i would take Bynum and Kobe over Blake and Russ any day of the week, Bynum is better than Blake and Kobe is clutch

No this takes place inside the three point line and between the free throw line. Westbrook is very capable from this distance.

There was a point in time when Westbrook pulling up for a mid-range jumper allowed the defense to breathe a sign of relief. Now he's an above average mid-range shooter and unless he has an off night, defenses are often in a lose-lose situation. Of point guards that shot at least three shots from 16-23 feet a game this season, the only players that shot a better percentage than Westbrook, who finished at 43%, were Jose Calderon, Chris Paul, Luke Ridnour and Steve Nash. Westbrook still lacks much of a game between 5-15 feet but since he's either getting to the rim or shooting the mid-range jumper whenever he pleases, that's not much of a deficiency.

http://www.silverscreenandroll.com/2012/5/13/3017391/lakers-thunder-preview-same-speed-more-weapons

So you are down by 3 with the game on the line and you take a 2 and lose?

Obviously we run a different play for a three pointer. I think at that point I just hit the open man. Westbrook has shown he can hit big time threes in the TD Garden  He likes it there.

If he can do this to Rondo you can guess what he does to Curry. The three is near the end of the video and there was no Kevin Durant in this game. Enjoy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2Eh6fKfkKg

Also here is more proof for your pudding. All very big 3 pointers.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xeuAY2IrBQ